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(Tech Times)   Mom to lose visitation rights if she doesn't quit her pack and a half habit.   (nandotimes.com) divider line 316
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3623 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Mar 2002 at 12:36 PM (12 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2002-03-26 04:38:32 PM
"I have friends with Asthema that will end up in an emergency room if they get on an elevator with somebody that just stepped out for a smoke. If you smoke, your clothes smell, your hair smells, and it can kill. I get migrains and nasal infections if I'm around it for more than a minute.'

Keep your inhaler close, kid, its a dirty smelly world. Your friends will be a little better when they grow up if they spend more time outside.

PS, just because something smells, it doesn't mean its gonna kill you. No study has ever asserted that the residual odor from smoke, rather than actual second hand smoke, is harmful.
 
2002-03-26 04:39:45 PM
Zchamu wrote:
"Is it OK to make others sick when you know you're doing it?"

Only if you're doing it by posting to Fark.
 
2002-03-26 04:40:00 PM
I remember back in the day when they did commercials about "smoking is glamorous" and they would have all these crazy sounding people saying stuff.. what was one? Let me think.. umm.. A woman that sounded like a man because her throat was shot from smoking.. anyway, we all thought they were hilarious. I have videotape of some parties of people imitating the ads -- and then smoking of course. Also, these videotapes include underage drinking.. oh the horrors!!
 
2002-03-26 04:40:57 PM

For more info on the case, another link:

Article in Rome, NY newspaper

This sheds some more information on our debate. Also, the folks involved will hit the morning talk shows tomorrow, so be ready for more and more "national debate" about this lovely topic.

the New York Post has an opinion piece, too. Here's a quote:

"Julian wrote in his decision that the move was necessary because secondhand smoke exposure "poses a significant health risk to Nicholas, placing him at increased risk for the development of lung cancer, coronary artery disease, asthma, and other pulmonary dysfunction.""


Apparently Mom says she first heard of the complaint from the Judge.

Hmmmm, nothing like airing your dirty laundry in the national press, eh?
 
2002-03-26 04:43:51 PM
If you smell it, then the poison is there. I believe it because I've seen friends carted away in ambulances from it. I believe it because every time I go along with "Oh, it's just one person in the bar" I spend the next week in bed coughing, choking and unable to breath at night.

For any of you that think I'm some sort of whimp, I'll toughen up the day after you take a bath in my phlegm... Just give me a cig and 24 hours, I'll serve it up hot and fresh!
 
2002-03-26 04:45:57 PM
Zchamu, is it okay to intentionally make people sick? I would have to say no to that, which is why I think people who have AIDS or Hepatitis or herpes or every single other VD on the planet should NEVER have sex again.

It doesn't matter if not EVERY single person gets other people sick of course... just make sexual contact illegal since it will make others sick and kill some.

Mind you, they actually have direct evidence supporting the fact that these diseases are transmitted sexually... so far, they do NOT have incontrovertable evidence that second-hand smoke from a distance of more than 5 feet does anything to anyone. Remember, their data is based on less than 5 feet of distance, and direct blowing of smoke at other people.

But again, this whole thing isn't about whether second-hand smoke is awful, bad or indifferent. The kid doesn't like the smell.
 
2002-03-26 04:47:55 PM
Dustin, you're not a wimp. You just lack a constituttion that would allow for your normal functioning in normal environment encountered daily by the largess of humanity.

Oh wait...

That does make you a wimp.
 
2002-03-26 04:49:24 PM
Dustin_00, are you stoned? Pay attention to what you said on your own. You went in the bar while someone was actively smoking.. NOT after there was no smoking going on, and the place was empty of actual smoke. Hello? McFly? You're biatching about the odor, and everyone needs to get over not liking the way things smell.
 
2002-03-26 04:52:26 PM
Dustin: I have friends that will swell up like a balloon and could suffocate if they even get peanut oil on them. Lets outlaw peanuts or any one for that matter who eats them.

Tell your friends to stay in a plastic bubble.
 
2002-03-26 04:53:06 PM
http://www.theonion.com/onion3810/11-year-olds_entire_plan.html
 
2002-03-26 04:55:56 PM
Phlegm Bath.
Mmmmmm.

Buahhahahaha!

OK kids, I'm outta here!
 
2002-03-26 04:56:21 PM
Here's something else for all to chew on. Sure smoking is legal, and everyone should have the right to do whatever they want to their bodies. But think of all the millions (billions?) of taxpayer money spent on the Medicare used to treat smoking-related illnesses. And the rising health insurace costs these days. So in a way, every tax-paying American pays for the consequences of smokers' "rights".

And to get back on topic, I think the judge did go too far in getting the woman to stop smoking completely. She should just not smoke in the presence of her kid.
 
2002-03-26 05:03:28 PM
Howie, there have been studies (and they're real studies, not tobacco company shams) that show smokers actually cost the government less than non-smokers overall. It's counterintuitive but the explanation is that smokers tend to die young and die quickly. They pay into the system and then keel over before they have a chance to cash out. Non-smokers tend to live long lives, collecting social security (and private pensions), and often live for years with chronic, and expensive, health problems associated with old age. Someone who lives to 90 ends up costing more than they payed in.
 
2002-03-26 05:04:34 PM
The other way around. Smoking creates jobs!

Hey Dustin, checkout this little Seattle air quality stats page.

http://www.nrdc.org/air/pollution/cep/csea.asp

YOU are breathing in POISON! Run Dustin Run! The Air is out to get you too! Wear a mask and rubber gloves! Don't touch dollar bills there are germs on them!
 
43
2002-03-26 05:04:44 PM
happydaddy.....you so rock
 
2002-03-26 05:06:11 PM
BTW Dustin, you should find some less pussier friends. They sound like a real DRAG.
hahahahaha
 
2002-03-26 05:10:54 PM
Hey you want to kill yourself smoking, fine, Knocks 10 off your life, that's ok, they were going to be the bad ones anyway, all shut up in the house with diabietes, heart problems, on and on..., start your kid early so you can make it a double funeral. The biggest factor is no matter how you mumble "Stay away from these kid, they'll kill you" your child sees all, and forms their opinion from your ACTIONS, not your hypocritical appologies (I know their bad for me, I'm trying to quit). If you want your kid not to smoke, don't smoke, or quit and tell them why, otherwise your example will lead to their addiction and death. Thems the facts, justify it as you will.
P.S. Why does it take a smoker 10 mins to describe and run the clerk around for a pack of smokes, heck they all are made out of the some stuff, feed that "they taste different" garbage to each other, the truth is you want to be like everyone else, but different at the same time.
 
2002-03-26 05:11:29 PM
Peanut oil isn't an airborne carcinagen. You don't walk into a room and have some stranger shove a peanut in your mouth. I hate smoke, I walk as far away from it as I can, and still I can't always avoid it. Ever hold your breath and walk, if skilled you can make 30 feet. Frankly its not fair to me to have to spend a large amount of active time avoiding smoke when I walk.
 
2002-03-26 05:14:58 PM
I wouldn't want to drown in peanut oil, though...

I do agree that if she'd just stop smoking anytime the kids are around, that'd probably be sufficient.

The place might still stink, but my dad didn't smell so good most of the time either. Something about beef stew and chili.
 
2002-03-26 05:18:04 PM
Tatarize, do you adamently support the outlawing of all motorized vehicles as well? Or rather, do you biatch about them?
 
2002-03-26 05:21:11 PM
HappyDaddy:

Health problems from smoking come from a person's choice. Health problems form obesity come from genetics... well, debatably. Anyway I don't have any numbers, but those are two fundamentally different situations.

Timefactor:

Good point, I never thought of it that way.
 
2002-03-26 05:24:15 PM
What if it isn't a choice? There are those that argue alcoholism is genetic and that some just can't avoid their fate. Why can't the same be applied to smoking? Heroin addicts, crack addicts, and alcoholics receive a helluva lot more empathy and understanding than nicotine addicts. That's why this is all so hypocritical and ridiculous.
 
2002-03-26 05:30:40 PM
It is if some God dammed smelly, Cholesterol injecting peanuteater brushes his disgusting greasy peanut oil laden hands on my friends arm when he's in an elevator!

That could send my friend to the HOSPITAL!
So if you freakin' peanuteaters wanna die of a high choleterol induced stroke, do it on your time in your own little area. Just don't kill my friend....you disgusting peanuteaters.
 
2002-03-26 05:32:13 PM
Howie must be fat.
 
43
2002-03-26 05:36:47 PM
}{owie...Genetics?
try the fork.

maybe MAYBE 3% of the obese have to deal with genetics...the rest just eat their asses on.
 
2002-03-26 05:38:41 PM
Hey I mock all addicts equally.

I don't care if you're addicted to nicotine or heroin. Unless you are a complete freaking moron you know that the use of either one of them isn't healthy for you. If you're so pathetic that you can't stop despite the fact that you actually know it's not good for you then you deserve to be eliminated from the genepool. I don't care if it's a genetic addiction or if you're just a weak willed little pussygirl without the balls to quit. The genepool would do well without either.

So I'm insensitive because I mock addicts for being as pathetic as they are. Boo-fricken-hoo. Instead of whining about how your feelings are being hurt why don't you grow some balls and kick your habbit. Oh yeah, that's right... you can't.

Buwahahahahahaaaa!

Meanwhile I'll keep investing in tobacco companies and I'll keep dancing on all your graves! Suckers!
 
2002-03-26 05:43:05 PM
First off,I do not smoke,having quit several years ago. I'll also be the first to admit that it is harmful to your health. We gonna have another Civil War though when you or any judge tells me that I can't do something that's perfectly legal in my own home. Semper Fi
 
2002-03-26 05:46:17 PM
The judge isn't telling her she can't smoke in her house.

He is telling her that if she chooses to smoke in her house she cannot force her child to visit her.
 
2002-03-26 05:47:17 PM
Well then I'm fighting for the North.
 
2002-03-26 05:49:02 PM
The Dark One - Maybe you should read up. I smoke, I like to smoke. That does not mean it is right to do around people who do not. "Can I cut a fart in your bed honey, because it makes me feel good'
The fact remains it IS a legal product and IS subsidized by the goverment. I can buy it at the quickie mart, and the won't sell me any good Jamacian (except out by the air pumps)
Think Orwell, baby. Tobacco now, alcohol next, then what?
 
2002-03-26 05:50:41 PM
People should be raised with manners to behave in a proper way around others RATHER than requiring government to pass laws restricting legal behavior. But again, that's just too rational a statement.
 
2002-03-26 05:51:12 PM
Then Peanut Oil!
 
2002-03-26 05:52:37 PM
Well isn't that why all you Americans pack handguns? So you'll be polite to one another?
 
2002-03-26 05:55:51 PM
No, to kill smartass Canucks.
 
2002-03-26 05:58:04 PM
We're all gonna die eventually... I smoke and I intend to take some of you sissy non smoking cry baby pussies with me... As for the kid.. it would be funny if he got hit by a rather large bus to prove that ain't good for you either

Whatcha gonna do about it?

Cheers

Scree
 
2002-03-26 05:58:31 PM
Oh well, what the hell. At least I won't have to pay to get the bullet removed from my ass.
 
2002-03-26 06:01:00 PM
No, you'll just have to wait 3 years for Dr. Retard.
 
2002-03-26 06:01:11 PM
Of course it would be great if we could reference the entire 18 page ruling from Judge Julian. We'll have to wait until CNN or somebody prints it for us (5th district doesn't have the decision on line)

However, as I understand one of the articles stating, both parents have to abide by the rule of not exposing Junior to smoke.

This would also mean, I suspect, that if Junior wanted to start smoking, he would be violating the same court order as long as he was in the same room with himself.

Very, very, un-spiffy.
 
2002-03-26 06:20:42 PM
...and the thread fizzles out and dies.

I have to say that I enjoyed it.
 
2002-03-26 06:44:29 PM
I smoke and don't have kids. When and if I ever do have children I'm either going to quit or at least not smoke around them. Most people I know who smoke and have kids try not to expose them to it.

But that's just me, and a few people I know. Growing-up, both my parents smoked in the house. We did not have a say in the issue. 3 out of 4 of us ("us"=myself and my siblings) smoke or did smoke at one time. 1 brother never smoked at all, and another successfully quit (and he doesn't even have children). My sister smokes very little, and doesn't smoke around her kid at all or indoors (even in her own house). I feel that's enough to dis-prove that "you'll start to smoke/smoke alot because you're exposed to it growing-up". I know I didn't start because my parents smoked, that's for sure.

What's right for me for however I decide to deal with my smoking when and if I have children isn't right for everyone. I would think the mother shouldn't want to smoke around her child. But if she isn't smoking around the kid and it's just because the place "smells like smoke" well tough sh_t, it's gonna smell like smoke. Even if I stepped outside every time I lit up, the smoke odor doesn't just "go away". There's no reason the woman shouldn't be able to smoke in her own home when the child isn't present.

The bottom-line is this, I agree that the child shouldn't have to be exposed to the smoke, but I disagree that a judge and a court order have any right to make these decisions.

It's very, very, very scary when a court / judge can make rulings on issues like these. Like others mentionned above, the next thing you know we'll see these sorts of rulings based on issues like child obesity or what-have-you.

Mike
 
2002-03-26 07:05:03 PM
The issue isn't that the judge has taken away her right to smoke or even her right to smoke in her house. He has taken away her court appointed privallege to force her son to visit her if she chooses to smoke.

Our actions all have consequences. She's perfectly free to continue smoking whenever and wherever she pleases but there will be consequences if she does. If she smokes in her a non-smoking public building then the consequences of her actions may be a $2000. If she smokes in her home then the consequences of her actions is that she can no longer force her child to visit her.

This isn't to say she can't visit her child. This isn't to say her child can't choose to visit her. She simply can't force her child to sit in the stench of her crap against his will.

This case was not about the mother's rights to smoke. She still has the right to smoke in her house. This case was about the child's right not to be forced to have to sit in his mother's smelly car or smelly house or be subjected to her smoke. As far as I'm concerned the kid has that right.

If the mother wishes to chose her cigarettes over her kid that's her right too.

You smokers are going on about how this is an attack on all your rights to smoke when it is not. This is about upholding a child of a broken home's right to choose wether or not they visit the non-custody parent. The child has stated he does not wish to visit his mother under these circumstances but until now he was forced by a court ordered visitation ruling to visit with his mother against his will. This new ruling has determined that he can't be forced to visit his mother.

Perhaps the cloud of toxic smoke some of you are spewing from your pie-holes has obscured you to the fact that children have rights too.
 
2002-03-26 07:24:14 PM
Ghastly:

They're not confused by their toxic smoke. You're just arguing with a group of people that already decided they don't care about themselves -- so why should the care about you, their children, or anybody else?
 
2002-03-26 07:32:18 PM
Karmic Hoax: People should be raised with manners to behave in a proper way around others RATHER than requiring government to pass laws restricting legal behavior. But again, that's just too rational a statement.

Anarchy, as admirable an ideal it may be, doesn't work. Laws protect the rights of the innocent from being abused.
 
2002-03-26 07:43:16 PM
Great point Ghastly.

People have the right to do most anything, but they don't have the right to avoid the consequences, and some consequences are avoidable, and some are inevitable. If you don't like the results of your actions, quit doing it.

You reap what you sew. Or in this case, you reek what you smoke.
 
2002-03-26 08:09:59 PM
I think that this works shes gotta quit aroudn the kids OR... if the mom wants to smoke let her go outside!
 
2002-03-26 08:26:12 PM
Yes, I biatch about car fumes too. But when I walk I rarely walk passed large amounts of cars, and I don't find the fumes as repulsive. And with the car driving it sorta mixes up the air faster. But hey, apple to oranges defences are fun nowadays you people can't say they don't kill you. Although sometimes people try to say that. We should start another Civil war, all smokers to the south...
 
2002-03-26 08:38:32 PM
It's sow dum dum.

I quit smoking a few months back. The reason I quit was because snot nosed little whining pussy biatches made queer noises and rolled thier eyes whenever I lit a cigarette. I quit because I could no longer smoke in public buildings, spacecraft, gas stations, or blimps. I quit because I was under such constant pressure and made to feel guilty by the Government and citizens of the evil disgusting life form that I was as a smoker.

I quit because it was time to do so. That's all.

I still go to bars and don't gripe about the smoke because you know what? I'm in a God Damned bar! People go to bars to do legal drugs.
How petty and self righteous you are to be so cool and above anyone that simply smokes.
You sound like PETA members and thier holier-than-thou attitudes towards people who eat meat.

This is mainly for Dustin.
 
2002-03-26 08:41:37 PM
I think this story is farkin' funny. I say the kid should not visit his stinking mom. Smokers smell, I'm sorry.
 
2002-03-26 08:49:59 PM
Hey, I don't smoke. Just never took it up.

If I was related to this kid I'd light one last one up in the house and put it out in his f-ucking eye.

I love an ice cold beer after work. I used to go to this one pub all the time but I could not stand all the pissy assed whining from the drinkers about the smokers. Imagine that. "Hey! Please don't smoke around me while I'm drinking myself into an early grave."

Jack-asses everywhere.

We're ALL too ugly to live forever. Die with a smile people.
 
2002-03-26 09:00:29 PM
Would someone (mod) explain why all of my posts were deleted?
 
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