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(Columbia Journalsim Review)   A review of Rathergate concludes everyone involved, bloggers and mainstream media, was an idiot   (cjr.org) divider line 514
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15901 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Jan 2005 at 8:31 PM   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2005-01-04 09:47:46 PM
It never crossed your mind that nobody has been able to produce a single typewriter capable of writing those "memos"?
 
2005-01-04 09:48:05 PM
No, but my point in this analogy would be that both apples and oranges are fruit.

So you admit that your 'point' (and I use the term loosely) rests on gross oversimplification and broad overgeneralization?
 
2005-01-04 09:48:18 PM
American Napalm: 2. BUSH IS GOD'S PRESIDENT


Confirming my theory that if God does exist, he is either a moron or a comedian.
 
2005-01-04 09:48:30 PM
Rockdrummer:

2005-01-04 09:42:31 PM Rockdrummer

"In others news, Bush went AWOL from a war he supported and avoided punishment thanks to political allies. "

Uhm, there's no evidence of that, ergo the necessity to forge memos.

Your level of veracity must be that of unsubstantiated rumor.




So why has the Bush admin never come out and said: "President Bush served his entire time in the Alabama Air National Guard with high distinction"?

I may be biased, but the fact that they do not deny the allegations but the proof, makes me think its true.
 
2005-01-04 09:49:01 PM
Wow, the first time I have ever been two minutes and six seconds late with the semen. :)
 
2005-01-04 09:49:17 PM
But it was ok for Clinton to dode the draft and send people off to die to distract the public from his lying under oath?

Refresh my memory. When did Clinton send people off to die? My memory might be foggy, but I don't recall going to war on false pretenses during the Clinton administration, and I don't recall any American soldiers dying in a combat situation.
 
2005-01-04 09:49:34 PM
It never crossed your mind that nobody has been able to produce a single typewriter capable of writing those "memos"?

The CIA is hiding them at Area 51 'cause the Skull and Bones society told 'em too.
 
2005-01-04 09:49:35 PM
Why does every scandal since Nixon end up having a "gate" suffix? As far as I know, a gate is a noun meaning an opening in a fence, not an adjective meaning scandalous. The name of the damned hotel was the Watergate, and suddenly everything that has the potential of embarrassing someone powerful or famous ends in "gate."

I suppose we're just lucky that the investigation into Clinton's failed real estate dealings wasn't called "Whitewatergate." That could have gotten pretty confusing.

/rant
 
2005-01-04 09:50:12 PM
The ANG said Bush served. They deny he skipped out. What more do you want?
 
2005-01-04 09:50:29 PM
majorhopper: The forgery stuff won't prevent anything on the original from printing except for the secret treasure map on the back.
 
2005-01-04 09:50:32 PM
Just because this thread doesn't have enough images:

 
2005-01-04 09:50:54 PM
http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/articles/roane040908.htm

Bush's military service in question again

Records appear to show that the president failed to fulfill his duty to the Air National Guard

A new examination of payroll records and other documents released by the White House earlier this year appear to confirm critics' assertions that President George W. Bush failed to fulfill his duty to the Air National Guard during the Vietnam War.

Most of the documents, which have been reviewed by U.S. News, and former military and Defense Department personnel, were released last February, when reporters raised new questions about Bush's service during the Vietnam War. After the release, White House spokesman Scott McClellan said he considered the case closed and noted that, "these records I'm holding here clearly document the president fulfilling his duties in the National Guard."

The White House also included a signed memorandum from the man who headed personnel matters for the Guard during Bush's tenure, certifying the administration's position. President Bush had "completed his military obligation in a satisfactory manner," wrote Albert C. Lloyd Jr., a retired Air Force colonel.

A recent examination of the records by U.S. News does not appear to support Lloyd's conclusions. Among the issues identified by the magazine:

- The White House used an inappropriateand less stringent Air Force standard in determining that President Bush fulfilled his National Guard duty.

- Even using this lesser standard, the president did not attend enough drills to complete his obligation to the Guard during his final year of service.

- During the final two years of his service obligation, Bush did not comply with Air Force regulations that impose a time limit on making up missed drills. Instead, he took credit for makeup drills he participated in outside that time frame. Five months of drills missed by the President in 1972 were never made up, contrary to assertions made by the White House.
 
2005-01-04 09:51:26 PM
"Refresh my memory. When did Clinton send people off to die?"

Mogadishu. Blackhawk down.
 
2005-01-04 09:51:36 PM
So why has the Bush admin never come out and said: "President Bush served his entire time in the Alabama Air National Guard with high distinction"?

Why give a partisan hack job story legs if you don't have to? Welcome to public relations 101.

I may be biased, but the fact that they do not deny the allegations but the proof, makes me think its true.

But you're biased, so that's not saying much.
 
2005-01-04 09:52:29 PM
We dont know whether the memos were forged, authentic, or some combination thereof.

I can't believe anyone still things these documents might be real!
 
2005-01-04 09:52:35 PM
Remfin:

It never crossed your mind that MS Word was DESIGNED and CONFIGURED to look exactly like typewritten memos?

It never crossed your mind that MS Word was DESIGNED and CONFIGURED to be a desktop publishing solution that can do things no typewriter can do (try WordArt, I dare ya!) and was specifically intended NOT to look like a mere friggin' typewriter?

Moran.
 
2005-01-04 09:52:43 PM
All you Bush haters with bumper stickers for "Kerry/Edwards" still on your cars.

Thank you.

You give me something to laugh at when I drive my big, gas sucking SUV, which is black with no bumper stickers.

B/C bumper stickers are for a-holes.

Losers.
 
2005-01-04 09:53:09 PM
 
2005-01-04 09:53:16 PM
Bush's military service in question again

MoveOn - old crap, how many times do you have to do it before you realize it doesn't work?
 
2005-01-04 09:53:25 PM
Rockdrummer

"Refresh my memory. When did Clinton send people off to die?"

Mogadishu. Blackhawk down.


Yeah, and how many soldiers died in Mogadishu versus Iraq?
 
2005-01-04 09:54:26 PM
> Poor impulse control, lack of respect for his office, lack of character....only a partisan hack would let clinton off the hook for damaging the prestige of the Office of President like that.

Yeah, I wonder how many other presidents had affairs while in office? Feigning righteous indignation at this one is just a cover-up for just plain old-fashioned partisan hate.
 
2005-01-04 09:54:33 PM
All you Bush haters with bumper stickers for "Kerry/Edwards" still on your cars.

I saw a moron on the highway today with that sticker on his car. Talk about living in denial! You think the sticker gives them better gas mileage?
 
2005-01-04 09:54:40 PM
I can't believe anyone still things these documents might be real!

Hey, I know people that are sure the Fed hide aliens at Area 51 so it shouldn't come as THAT big a surprise.
 
2005-01-04 09:55:00 PM
LawrencePerson

Here's Little Green Football's analysis of the article, which they call "an inept smear."


Now, there's an objective source.

/sarcasm, duh!
 
2005-01-04 09:55:09 PM
 
2005-01-04 09:55:49 PM
Weaver95:

2005-01-04 09:46:03 PM Weaver95 [TotalFark]

Poor impulse control, lack of respect for his office, lack of character....only a partisan hack would let clinton off the hook for damaging the prestige of the Office of President like that.


What? Presidents are not allowed to get blowjobs? Sex damages the prestige of the presidency how? Just becasue you cant get any dosent mean the president cant. The only person whos business this is is Hillary Clinton, not Kenneth Starr. If anyone made the presidency look rediculous it was the republicans and their tasteless attack on something they had no interest in, other than to discredit clinton.

But it was ok for Clinton to dode the draft and send people off to die to distract the public from his lying under oath?

Clinton sent 150000 americans into harms way? When? And yes, it is ok for clinton have dodged the draft, because he admits to it and is open about it.


You still never answered my question, which was: "Do you really believe that Bush did not go AWOL, and that he served his entire time honorably?"

So, what does Bush have to do with Rathergate again? Still not seeing your point here. I mean, OTHER than your blatantly obvious desire to sidetrack the discussion onto ANY topic OTHER than Rather's liberal bias and the potential effect that had on forming US public opinon over the years.....


Ok, well avoided again. Just to placate you, yes, rather was a tool for not checking his facts. Rather was biased in that report he did.

Now, again, do you really believe that Bush served his entire time with the Alabama Air National Guard with honour?
 
2005-01-04 09:55:51 PM
> B/C bumper stickers are for a-holes.

Well, I do agree with that, but so are big, gas sucking SUVs.
 
2005-01-04 09:55:51 PM
There you go, nice and summarized.

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/09/08/bush_fell_short_on_duty_ at_guard/


You guys act like this wasn't an issue until the Dan Rather thing. Did you forget about the 2000 election?
 
2005-01-04 09:55:59 PM
Who cares if he served or didn't serve...because either way, he did it or didn't do it IN TEXAS.

Bush could have shown up early for duty every day and left late every night, but he would have been doing it IN TEXAS.

I hate this debate over whether he showed up or not stateside. The bigger problem is that Chickenhawks like him and the rest of the Administration all got out of active duty.
 
B82
2005-01-04 09:56:28 PM
Jebus, does anyone still care about all that Bush/AWOL crap anymore? By the time Bush would have been ready to fly any Vietnam missions, the military was pulling out of Vietnam as fast as possible anyway. He wasn't needed. Thats why they let him go to Alabama.
 
2005-01-04 09:56:59 PM
Weaver95:

But it was ok for Clinton to dode the draft and send people off to die to distract the public from his lying under oath?


That's editorial, not to mention specious and downright stupid. It didn't distract anyone - half the people didn't give a shiat about lying about sex, and the other half was convinced that Hillary dropped the hammer on Vince Foster.

And Clinton certainly didn't have to resort to the use of FORGED DOCUMENTS to put an end to the massacre in Yugoslavia. He didn't send his Sec'y Of State up in front of the UN waving lies around. He didn't need to - Yugoslavia was indeed a mess, it was obvious to everyone in the world. There was considerable conservative backing for that action too.

Finally, Clinton actually used the US military to achieve a victory - then he got them out.

Don't get fooled again.
 
2005-01-04 09:57:47 PM
Yes. Everybody on all sides of that whole event was an idiot, from Rather on down. I kept out of it. But now that I've commented on it, I'm an idiot, too. But that doesn't forgive the idiocy of others.
 
2005-01-04 09:58:03 PM
Phil Herup:

You give me something to laugh at when I drive my big, gas sucking SUV, which is black with no bumper stickers.

Wow you drive a hummer? Is it true you drive a big car to make up for a small penis? I checked snopes but they are undecided at this point.
 
2005-01-04 09:59:45 PM
BillCosby:
Forgeries of the Mona Lisa exist that can fool Art experts.

again, bush's fault.

lizyrd:
Why does every scandal since Nixon end up having a "gate" suffix?

yep, you guessed it - bush's fault.
 
2005-01-04 09:59:52 PM
Weaver95:

2005-01-04 09:51:36 PM Weaver95 [TotalFark]

So why has the Bush admin never come out and said: "President Bush served his entire time in the Alabama Air National Guard with high distinction"?

Why give a partisan hack job story legs if you don't have to? Welcome to public relations 101.



Oh, i dont know, to lay to rest the concearns of the people you are meant to be representing?

If you see politics as some sort of marketing thing, you are an idiot and a traitor to the human race, at least those parts that believe in democracy.
 
2005-01-04 10:00:19 PM
Now, again, do you really believe that Bush served his entire time with the Alabama Air National Guard with honour?

Still not seeing what this has to do with Rathergate....
 
2005-01-04 10:00:36 PM
How blogs work:

In 1967, there was no such thing as "curlycue" apostrpohe's, meaning the memos are likely fakes

A computer expert tells us that in 1967, there was no such thing as "proportional spacing," meaning the memos must be fakes!


Using a typewriter with proportional spacing and curlycue apostrophes from 1967, we found that they don't line up with the photocopied scanned pdf jpg file that we have. Here is a sample...

etc. etc.
 
2005-01-04 10:01:33 PM
Wow you drive a hummer? Is it true you drive a big car to make up for a small penis? I checked snopes but they are undecided at this point.

That joke's so old it can vote. The real reason people drive Hummers is because they al-Qaeda may very well attack them on the way from Pottery Barn to pick up the twins from soccer practice.

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!

 
2005-01-04 10:03:31 PM
If you see politics as some sort of marketing thing, you are an idiot and a traitor to the human race, at least those parts that believe in democracy.

That's all politics is you know - a marketing thing. Except people are selling ideas rather than a new kind of soap or breakfast cereal.

Consequences of living in a 30 second ad spot, 10 second attention span world. You can lament the fact that we've fallen so far down the philosophical ladder or you can accept the realities of the situation and plan accordingly.
 
2005-01-04 10:04:38 PM
nerfball

Why do you keep kidding on the square that people are blaming things on Bush?
 
2005-01-04 10:04:44 PM
Weaver95:

2005-01-04 10:00:19 PM Weaver95 [TotalFark]

Now, again, do you really believe that Bush served his entire time with the Alabama Air National Guard with honour?

Still not seeing what this has to do with Rathergate....
...... so you duck the question again like a complete wuss. Is it that hard to give an answer to my question? Are you not able?
 
2005-01-04 10:04:50 PM
Now that was funny.

Leave it to the Left to get caught trying to use fake documents to make their case and then complain about the people who caught them in the act.

Har har.

 
2005-01-04 10:05:06 PM
I know I am late to the party, but there it is anyway



www.flashbunny.org
 
2005-01-04 10:05:10 PM
Queen Mushroom: That joke's so old it can vote.

Not meant to be a joke. I'm looking for a man with a Hummer but I am unwilling to accept a small penis in return. I was mearly checking to see if he was sponge worthy.
 
2005-01-04 10:05:15 PM
Probably been said 1,000 times already but here comes 1,001:

Hey retard article writer (aka Corey Penis),

BLOGGERS AND MEDIA ARE NOT THE SAME THING!!!

One is intentionally an exercise of free speech and opinion; the other is supposed to be an unbiased conveyor of information. They work on seperate credos and cannot be called to the same standard.
 
2005-01-04 10:06:41 PM
The real reason people drive Hummers is because they al-Qaeda may very well attack them on the way from Pottery Barn to pick up the twins from soccer practice.

Actually, the only reason I won't ever buy a H2 is because I can't mount a .50 cal on the back without terrifying local law enforcement.

I've always wanted my own .50 vehicle mount. I don't know that i'd ever have occasion to use it, but it'd be nice to have the added bit of security.
 
2005-01-04 10:07:11 PM
Weaver95

Still not seeing what this has to do with Rathergate....


That's like not seeing what a stained blue dress had to do with Bill Clinton's libido.
 
2005-01-04 10:07:27 PM
Weaver95:

You can lament the fact that we've fallen so far down the philosophical ladder or you can accept the realities of the situation and plan accordingly.

ok, since this is fark, this has to be bush's fault but i don't follow. can someone explain how 'the fact we've fallen so far down the philosophical ladder' is bush's fault?

/why is everything bush's fault?
 
2005-01-04 10:07:34 PM
This is a good article for the most part, but it's woefully inadequate in one aspect: every time bloggers are mentioned, they're conservative. EVERY SINGLE TIME.

Apparently the author hasn't heard of Eschaton, DailyKos, MyDD, Pandagon, Corrente, First Draft, Oliver Willis, Steve Gilliard, Slacktivist, The Noodle Incident, Legal Fiction, Democratic Underground, Orcinus, Seeing The Forest For The Trees, or any other of the couple thousand liberal blogs that contributed rebuttals to the lies thrown out by the conservabloggers and, yes, the mainstream media.

You'd think a publication about journalism would encourage good reporting.
 
2005-01-04 10:07:48 PM
Weaver95:

2005-01-04 10:03:31 PM Weaver95 [TotalFark]

If you see politics as some sort of marketing thing, you are an idiot and a traitor to the human race, at least those parts that believe in democracy.

That's all politics is you know - a marketing thing. Except people are selling ideas rather than a new kind of soap or breakfast cereal.

Consequences of living in a 30 second ad spot, 10 second attention span world. You can lament the fact that we've fallen so far down the philosophical ladder or you can accept the realities of the situation and plan accordingly.




Well yeah, we all have the choice to manipulate, cheat lie and steal to further our own cause. Dosent make it right.

I for one want to at least try to combat the ignorance and apathy we live with in western countries.
 
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