Do you have adblock enabled?
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(CNN)   Another Muslim country moves to stop things before Israel really spanks Palestinians   ( divider line
    More: Cool  
•       •       •

7095 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Mar 2002 at 5:18 PM (15 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»

143 Comments     (+0 »)

Oldest | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | » | Newest | Show all

2002-03-04 05:53:50 PM  
For the first time i'm losing sympathy for Israel's suicide bombing situation. They bomb a refugee camp killing 23 people, murder a pregnant woman's husband and almost kill his father and then they use the same monotonous, teeth-grindingly painful excuse ("We're fighting Palestinian terror, we're a *cough* peace loving [apartheid] state") when militant Palestinians get their revenge.

I definitely don't support the suicide bombers, but who's going to stop them since Palestinian land is basically in a state of anarchy and military oppression.
2002-03-04 05:53:55 PM  
Lets all remember why the US even cares about the mid-east
OIL. The US wants this to end peacefully in order to have someone pump their gas.
2002-03-04 05:53:59 PM  
Muslims (and increasingly, Europeans), use the Palestinian-Israeli conflict as an excuse to hate the US (muslims because their government needs them to hate something more than themselves, and Europeans because they are wetting themselves at the thought of a muslim-arab WWIII + that whole inferiortiy complex). You will care when the next terrorist attack happense against the US.
2002-03-04 05:58:51 PM  
The best thing the US could do is to pump billions into non-fossil fuel energy research. Bring on N-Power, cold fusion, tidal, solar, wind, etc. Let the middle east drown in their own oil. Fark 'em.
2002-03-04 05:58:58 PM  
Both Arafat and Sharon are assholes (or at least give the assholes working underneath them free reign), and both need to be replaced (for stability's sake) with leaders actually committed to peace. We certainly shouldn't be training Isreali pilots or giving them shiny American-made weapons, and Arafat should stop making deals with Iran.

I keep saying that Isreal and Palestine should be dissolved and replaced with a new nation (which for simplicity sake I would call Judea, though I'm sure a more neutral-sounding name could also be picked). Give the Palestinians back their land (which they were illegally forced off of, according to international law), grant them full citizenship, and I'm sure that the more moderate terrorists (something I'd estimate to be about 80% of all the terrorists in that region) would chill out. Kill off the remaining radical 20% with Isreali/Palestinian (combined) Counter-Terrorists squads, the Holy Land is a descent place to live again (if you like your land hot, dry, and worthless).
2002-03-04 06:00:07 PM  
Kilgore40 - I'll be the first to admit that my spelling is terrible, but for god sakes, it's "their" not "they're".
There - vs Here.
Their - Their boobies are hot.
They're - They are!
You're (not your) welcome for the grammer lesson.

I am not saying Palestinians are any more "savage" than the Israelis, but are you going to deny that they have been brainwashed since birth to hate them?!

ClownCollegeGraduate - you never had "sympathy for Israel's suicide bombing situation".
2002-03-04 06:01:39 PM  
Jeezus-Pleasus - YES, that is exactly what the US should do. The fuel cell should be our holy grail.
2002-03-04 06:02:38 PM  
Sounds to me like it is the Israeli occupatian army & the illegal Jewish settlers who are getting spanked.

When will the Israelis end their illegal occupation? How much blood is enough for them? When will their bid daddy the USA fianlly stop vetoing the UN and force them to withdraw, just like Iraq was forced to withdraw from Kuwait?

When will the world stop allowing Jews to mount a racist was against Muslim, Druze and Christian Palestinians because of a 50 year-old guilt trip?
2002-03-04 06:02:48 PM  
Henchman - Yeah, why do people associate oil with the Israel/Palestine when there is none there?!
2002-03-04 06:03:56 PM  

"The Palestinians are incapable of living in peace with the Israelis because they have been brainwashed since childhood (and are too uneducated to "clense their minds"). Even if a peace was made, there would still be terrorists attacking Israel."

"Such savage peoples! Them with they're Core-Ran. We must educate them in the ways of Christianity, which historically is a very peaceful and tolerant religion and has done mush to promote advances in Science!"

I believe that Luvnuriko was making a crude allusion to the fact that the majority of Palistinian children are bombarded with Anti-Israeli/US propaganda and are raised to hate from birth. The fact that a large portion of the Palistinian population doesn't recieve any other information at that age to help them differentiate between the biased information and the truth.
2002-03-04 06:05:08 PM  
ClownCollegeGraduate: I pretty much agree with you. People like to villanize the Palestinians a religious fanatics, yet the most recent site of suicide bombing was full of religious fanatics going on about how they were martyred (Sound Familiar) They had the exact same response to the bombings as Robertson had to 9/11
2002-03-04 06:06:17 PM  

Just like how Israeli children are bombarded with anti-Palestinian propaganda that portrays them as savages and inhumane. It's a vicious circle.
2002-03-04 06:07:39 PM  
Joak - Aww, is your poor wittle bleeding heart offended by the harsh realities of war in Israel and the occupied territories?

What about Africa, you don't care that millions upon millions are forced to flee their homes on a yearly basis!? That they live miserable lives, wasted on AIDS, starvation, and lack of education and oppertunities!? Where the fark are your sensibilities there!?!?!
2002-03-04 06:08:14 PM  
Henchman/Luvnuriko The geo-political players involved with oil use the Israelis and Palestinians as client state pawns. THEY may not have any oil, but those that back them either have it or want it. Rather than duke it out directly, they let these two go at it.

My point (which should have been clear) is that if we don't want to keep involved, we better have an alternative plan for energy...cause oil is going to get a lot of Americans dead.
2002-03-04 06:09:49 PM  
Jeezus-Pleasus:The best thing the US could do is to pump billions into non-fossil fuel energy research.

Yes, but that research would cut into the energy industry's bottom line. Why do that when they can have oil for cheap, then switch to alternative sources when the oil's gone? Human lives lost as a result have no monetary value. For better or worse, corporations have no morality...they are faceless entities run by stockholders who see only a bottom line. I'd like to send a shout out to Enron...WAZZUP?! Yo...
2002-03-04 06:10:56 PM  
War is War, and if you want to give the Palistinians any credit as a nation, then it happens that innocents get killed on both sides!

The US has killed more innocent lives in Afganistan, than all terrorists have killed on or off US soil. No one really makes a big flipping whoopy about that. but in limited fighting in the middle East we are willing to nuke the whole area to stop that fighting.

So many uniformed, geeks - sit in your suburbon little home living for free in your parenst basement, watching Star Trek and quoting the needs of the.... whatever!

Welcome to the real world, outside the US - where people die, and usualy it is American weapons killing them. I don't hate the US, but really anyone thinking that they have the right to judge Isreal or Palastine really needs to wake up and smell the reality!

The US kills innocent people everyday, and chalk it up to acceptable loss everyday, and I am talking about inside and outside the borders!!
2002-03-04 06:12:00 PM  
Jeezus-Pleasus - What exactly is your rational for conneting Israel w/ the US's oil demand? Please spell out the connection for me.
2002-03-04 06:12:17 PM  

What a great hypocrite you've proved to be. You describe Israel brutal occupation and treatment of Palestinians as "harsh realities of war", and then describe the Palestinian militant respones as "omg they're brainwashed by an evil religion, all arabs are farking animals. wipe the farking brainwashed animals out!!!"
2002-03-04 06:12:58 PM  
the isrealies must merge with the palestinians. That way, both sides win. Isreal expands in size, palestinians can go and get an education. I mean, isnt the whole battle over land?
2002-03-04 06:13:01 PM  
By referring to all Palestinians as brainwashed is a common tactic of dehumanizing them. It's equivilent to saying Black people can't live with White people because they're brainwashed to "kill whitey". Has it ever occurred to your that the Palestinians hate the Isrealis because of what they've done to them? I'm sure you'd be pissed of at a guy who bulldozed your house and then shot your kids while they were playing soccer.
2002-03-04 06:15:49 PM  
What no one has anyhting to say about my last post?
2002-03-04 06:16:41 PM  

Average Palistinian Child (and Parents for that matter) = 3rd World

Average Israeli Child = 1st World with all the benefits the average European/American has.

Most Israeli children will grow up in nice homes with Cable/Satalite TV, Internet Access, and the standard amenities that every single person in this chat has taken for granted. This also gives them the means necessary to obtain unbiased information that will allow them to form unbiased opinions, just like you and I. Most Palistinians can't because they don't have the resources necessary to enlighten themselves. This is why you always see Palistinians on either the Left or Rigth in a census and the Israelis are more often moderates.
2002-03-04 06:17:10 PM  
Luvnuriko:What exactly is your rational for conneting Israel w/ the US's oil demand?

What do you think the reason for U.S. involvement in Israel is?

Is it because Israel is a semi-Westernized nation? Hell no...this is a result of our relationship, not a reason for it.

It is for representation in the region. Why? For political and military reasons. Why do we need that? Oil. I'm open to alternative reasons, but no one can ever offer me one that makes a shred of sense.
2002-03-04 06:17:55 PM  
Oooh I forgot...special interests in D.C. ALSO keep us involved with Israel...another example of the whoring of our government.
2002-03-04 06:19:16 PM  
ClownCollegeGraduate - wrong, I freely admit that Palestinian militants are NOT terrorists, that they ARE freedom fighters. Fighting for ones land, and for revenge falls under "harsh realities of war". However, they ARE "brainwashed by an evil religion" whilst "freedom fighting". I do not think all arabs are "farking animals", only palestinian freedom fighters. Your average arab living outside of palestine is probably as well educated as i am...

Kilgore40 - All Palestinians ARE brainwashed AND they hate Israelis for what they've done to them. Why must everything be mutually exclusive to you?
2002-03-04 06:20:23 PM  

Okay, the bulldozing thing happened, but the killing while playing soccor - that happens all the time? Really?

This is a conflict that goes back further than any of you can understand. The US, should leave them alone, along with the rest of the world and let them duke it out.

I mean like I said two posts above, the US has killed a lot of innocents over the years! An in Afganistan alone they have killed more civilians then have lost in American life to terrorists ever - but that is okay, thier poor and should die right?
2002-03-04 06:22:54 PM  
WarmBeer - Thanks for restating the obvious. Now are you going to explain what those "political and military reasons" are? No, you can't because you're just pulling this connection out of your butt ^_~

The US has a military base in Saudi Arabi, but not in Israel, gee, what great supporting evidence for your "we need Israel for oil."

special interests - bingo
2002-03-04 06:23:33 PM  

The Western World is highly dependent on oil from sources either in the Islamic world, or from sources that must transport through the Islamic world. This is particularly true of Europe. During previous wars and boycotts, the Arab nations have shown the resolve to choke off the oil and supply lines to North America and its European allies. Israel is now a forward base of western power through which NATO could project its power into the Middle East and Northern Africa.

Currently, the west is content with building alliances and using other neighboring states for the projection of power against weak opponents. But if an all-out war were to be fought (say against Iraq or Iran), and if the "moderate Arab states" (a diplomatic lie) refused to support these efforts, Israel would be a strong position from which to wage a western-style war.

THAT's why Israel is important to the West.
2002-03-04 06:24:43 PM  
Bycustin: You really didn't say all that much. Although I will make 1 comment:

"The US has killed more innocent lives in Afganistan, than all terrorists have killed on or off US soil. No one really makes a big flipping whoopy about that. but in limited fighting in the middle East we are willing to nuke the whole area to stop that fighting."

BS. People Yes. Innocent civilians nope. I belive they put the Innocent Casualties at between 1500 and 2000. That was a while ago tho and it may have gone up a bit.
2002-03-04 06:26:49 PM  
WarmBeer: Just thought you might like this quote, Sums the reason of our support of Isreal in one sentence.

"I am sorry gentlemen, but I have to answer to hundreds of thousands of people who are expecting the success of Zionism. I don't have thousands of Arabs among my electors."- Harry S. Truman, 1946
2002-03-04 06:29:32 PM  
I have been to Sharm el-Sheikh... no beer or hookers... summit will fail.
2002-03-04 06:31:37 PM  
Jeezus-Pleasus: Absolutely Correct:


They have made themselves the Only ally of a nation that has been fighting wars for the past 50 years. And did so initially to oppose the USSR during the Cold war.

The Israeli Government does an enormous amount Military research for the American Government because it possesses a highly educated population due the Immigration after the collapse of the Former Soviet Union.
2002-03-04 06:34:25 PM  

Definitely before
2002-03-04 06:34:46 PM  
Oh, and by the way, when I say NATO, I mean the US. Because Europe's got no balls and will just sit there in their darkened hovels and cry when the Arabs cut off their oil.

Wah. US unilateralism has provoked this response from OPEC. Wah.

And the Russians laugh...throwing on another log.
2002-03-04 06:35:15 PM  

"Well, every afternoon--you know, you could almost time
it--around 3 or 4, the Palestinian kids, who have nowhere to play, would play--would go out on the dunes and they'd have kites or rag balls and this kind of stuff. And I remember--I heard it the first day. And I speak Arabic, so I'm listening over the loudspeaker to the worst curse words in Arabic, and phrases like, you know, 'All the Palestinians who live in Khan Yunis are dogs,' which is calling an Arab a dog is particularly insulting. And I couldn't--I just couldn't believe what I heard.

And I walked out towards the dunes and they were--the--over the
loudspeaker from an Israeli army Jeep on the other side of the electric fence they were taunting these kids. And these kids started to throw rocks. And most of these kids were 10, 11, 12 years old. And, first of all, the rocks were the size of a fist. They were being hurled towards a Jeep that was armor-plated. I doubt they could even hit the Jeep. And then I watched the soldiers open fire. And it was--I mean, I've seen kids shot in Sarajevo. I mean, snipers would shoot kids in Sarajevo. I've seen death squads kill families in Algeria or El Salvador. But I'd never seen soldiers bait or taunt kids like this and then shoot them for sport. It was--I just--even now, I find it almost inconceivable. And I went back every day, and every day it was the same.

And it became, of course, a subtext to my story where I just, one, you
know, kept interviewing parents and imams as to why they let the kids
go. The answer being that, in essence, they couldn't control them. There was no room in the houses. There are just too many kids. I found that imams were preaching in the mosques, asking the kids not to go, but the problem is that, you know, the funerals became political events. You know, they would carry the bodies of the newest Shaheed through the camp. Hundreds of people would go along behind. They would fire their guns in the air. On the news that's all they talk about are the new martyrs. On the radio it's the same. So the kids are almost indoctrinated into this sort of culture of martyrdom, culture of death.

And it is something that many parents, who, despite, you know, the
rhetoric that we often read about, 'I'm so proud my son died,' I mean, that is something totally handed out for consumption by Western--for Western reporters or outside reporters because sitting around the houses with these people with, you know, the puffy eyes and the 1,000-yard stare, it's clear that these parents are as devastated as any parents would be to lose their child. The militants take over these funerals. They put up their banners. They put up their signs. The bodies become props; a kind of political prop to make a political statement. The parents lose control of their children even in death."- NYT reporter Chris Hedges in an NPR interview.

I'm not saying that Palestinians aren't indoctrinated into hating the Isrealis, but you can't say ALL of them are like that. That's like saying ALL southerners are racist fundies.
2002-03-04 06:35:17 PM  
Jeezus-Pleasus - I disagree. The US already has a military base in Saudi Arabia, and when was the last time Israel was used by the US as a base to attack the Arab nations? Never, not even during the gulf war, which was an all out war against Iraq.

Today, aircraft carriers are the US's base for the projection of power.

I think the US is performing a decade long holding action vis-a-vie the muslim world. US vs. Vietnam, it was hell for us because our technology was almost equal (at least on the ground). US vs. Iraq, Iraq still put up resistance. US vs. Taliban/Al-Q, no contest, you'll note our only casualties have been in ground fighting and using outdated helicopters. Soon the technological gap will grow so much that there will be no US-anyone conflict. The US will simply march in with its energy weapon wielding robots and force immediate surrender. ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US, HAHAHAHAHAHA Crazy theory, n'est pas? ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US, HAHAHAHAHAHA. ^_^
2002-03-04 06:37:44 PM  
take off every zig, for great justice
2002-03-04 06:39:38 PM  
The US will simply march in with its energy weapon wielding robots and force immediate surrender.

OK! I concede the point. I keep forgetting about our death robots and orbiting x-ray lasers.

*oil companies wipe brow and go back to pumping Saudi crude*

2002-03-04 06:44:32 PM  

"I disagree. The US already has a military base in Saudi Arabia, and when was the last time Israel was used by the US as a base to attack the Arab nations? Never, not even during the gulf war, which was an all out war against Iraq."

It wasn't necessary to fly missions out of Israel when they have bases in Turkey, Kawait and Saudi Arabia, all of which Border Iraq. If they wanted to Fly out of israel they would have had to Fly over Jordan airspace which means they would have had to obtain permission, etc etc etc. Aircraft Carriers might be the way to go for fast responses but continually flying missions off of carriers during a long military Campaign becomes increadibly expensive. This is why The US has petitioned all of Afghanistans neighboring countries to use thier airspace and are flying missions out of airbases in half of them.
2002-03-04 06:45:58 PM  
Sheesh. I really doubt a free palestinian state would be a great bastion of democracy in the middle east. They enjoy theocracy. That is the gov't most Arabs, and many muslims have chosen.

Israel is a democracy. True, it is a democracy with all the charm of a dispeptic chihuahua, but a democracy no less.

THAT is why the US sides with them.

but if it makes you feel better, it is because the US is evil and wants to kill babies.
2002-03-04 06:46:05 PM  
Luvnuriko: Thanks for restating the obvious. Now are you going to explain what those "political and military reasons" are? No, you can't because you're just pulling this connection out of your butt

If it were possible, you would have just made yourself look dumber. Obviously, reasons in the form of a presence in the region to protect our interests which are based in oil. Yes, we have the same thing through Saudi Arabia. Great. True. Maybe it's lobbying interests keeping us there. So, genius, since I'm pulling stuff out of my butt why do YOU think we stay involved? It's easy to knock down other people's opinion when you can't offer one of your own. Put up or shut up. I'd be just as happy with the latter, though, because I know you post all kinds of shiat EXCEPT an answer to my question.
2002-03-04 06:47:48 PM  
As well, Israel had to be officially neutral in the Gulf War because Arab states wouldn't fight on the same side as Jews against another Arab state.
2002-03-04 06:48:50 PM  
I shouldn't of posted that...he's just going to link it to the war on terrorism or some other BS...
2002-03-04 06:50:55 PM  

That sucked ass for Israel too since Iraq was firing missiles at them all day everyday.
2002-03-04 06:52:17 PM  
43% I agree and by manifesting itself as a true democracy Israel has joined the sphere of influence of the West. It is a Western nation.

All Theocracies suck. (Hear that Jesse Helms?!)
2002-03-04 06:52:20 PM  
Lets move Isreal to the USA. We could give them New Mexico
2002-03-04 06:54:30 PM  
WarmBeer - "If it were possible, you would have just made yourself look dumber." I hit rock bottom a long time ago.

Instead of answering the question, you have reflected it back at me. What is this, tennis? I have already stated that I think we are involved because of lobbies (both Israeli and Defense Industry). However, I do NOT think the oil lobby has anything to do with our support of Israel. In fact, when an Arab backlash against US support for Israel happens, the oil industry will be the first against the wall.

It is easy to knock down other people's opinions, and hard to offer my own. Put I just put up. Now where are your concrete, detailed, reasons for US support of Israel due to oil (which is backwards thinking IMHO).
2002-03-04 06:56:24 PM  
Israel becoming the 51st state might actually stop a lot of the problems. I believe that the US government could handle the situation a lot better and a lot more objectively then the Israeli Government (under Ariel Sharon anyways). Then they would be giving the Israelis all thier cash legitimatly and not a single country would fire missiles at israel again.
2002-03-04 06:56:42 PM  
Argh... fark really needs a spell check option for us illiterates.
2002-03-04 06:56:48 PM  
WarmBeer: Quick! Take the French option!
Displayed 50 of 143 comments

Oldest | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | » | Newest | Show all

This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking

On Twitter

Top Commented
Javascript is required to view headlines in widget.
  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.