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(Some Guy)   The Bill Cosby "Pull up your pants and speak English" tour is on. Best material ever   (msnbc.msn.com) divider line 455
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42760 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Dec 2004 at 4:18 PM (9 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2004-12-23 11:32:10 AM
heh. he's turned into such a cotchety old man. but I can't argue much with what he says. Glad he's black though. If he was white he'd be the David Duke of celebrities.
 
2004-12-23 11:37:28 AM
First time I heard him saying this stuff I thought he'd lost his mind. The second time I heard it, he was making more sense. I wish more people in the black community would stand up and say what he's saying.
 
2004-12-23 11:39:12 AM
Cosby is giving people a good dose of reality.
We need more people like him speaking out.
He basically is saying that if your life sucks - look in the mirror, dont blame everyone else.
 
2004-12-23 11:42:28 AM
He lost me after the Jell-O ads.

Actually, he lost me after Bill Cosby: Himself.
 
2004-12-23 11:43:43 AM
He basically is saying that if your life sucks - look in the mirror, dont blame everyone else.

Sage advice regardless of race or circumstance.
 
2004-12-23 11:46:44 AM
At this very moment I'm listening to the eddie muphy speil about his call from Bill Cosby.

Pull up your pants and speak english sounds more like Dennis Leary material then Bill Cosboy though.
 
2004-12-23 11:47:35 AM
*cheers* I think this is such a positive thing, and I think the same can be said to young people of any race. I think it's a great message for the disillusioned.
 
2004-12-23 11:50:10 AM
He basically is saying that if your life sucks - look in the mirror, dont blame everyone else.

From an esoteric point-of-view, yes, you can always think happy thoughts.

But the whole pull-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps American/Republican Dream thing is generally bullshiat. There are forces aligning against all of us, whether we can recognize them or not.
 
2004-12-23 11:52:34 AM
Forces? Dark Forces? Like the Sith?!? you're scaring me man.
 
2004-12-23 11:54:51 AM
smackem yackem - There are forces aligning against all of us, whether we can recognize them or not.

That, IMO, doesn't mean that one shouldn't still try.
 
2004-12-23 12:00:23 PM
smackem yackem: But the whole pull-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps American/Republican Dream thing is generally bullshiat. There are forces aligning against all of us, whether we can recognize them or not.

That's true. However... what DMentia777 said. If the oppressed buy into the media-built "Puff Daddy" dream, making that their goal, rather than, say, becoming an architect, then the power structure wins, and the people lose. I believe that's what this article is trying to say.
 
2004-12-23 12:00:36 PM
Hey, hey hey!
 
2004-12-23 12:01:12 PM
You don't know the power of the Dark Side, StomachMonkey -- it is useless to resist.

America is not a meritocracy, as much as conservatives would like to believe it. We'd all have to be on an equal footing if that were true.

Tell the guy getting sent for another tour in Iraq if forces aren't aligning against him. The guy about to be downsized, the guy about to get robbed, the guy about to get cancer, etc. etc. etc.
 
2004-12-23 12:03:28 PM
And the puddddding pops... Mmmm
 
2004-12-23 12:06:18 PM
bboy - If the oppressed buy into the media-built "Puff Daddy" dream, making that their goal, rather than, say, becoming an architect, then the power structure wins, and the people lose. I believe that's what this article is trying to say.

I can't disagree with you, there. Do you think that's a bad thing? I don't. I think that if one is made aware of the Structure and its influence then one can make choices to avoid its dominance. (Key word here: choices.)
 
2004-12-23 12:07:33 PM
I wish more black leaders would stand up and say this instead of biatching about how the man is keeping them down like those asshats, Sharpton, Jackson, and Farrakhan.
 
2004-12-23 12:11:35 PM
DMentia777: Do you think that's a bad thing? I don't. I think that if one is made aware of the Structure and its influence then one can make choices to avoid its dominance.

No, I don't think it's a bad thing at all. I was agreeing with you. Education, education, education. That's what it's all about.
 
2004-12-23 12:18:54 PM
bboy - I was agreeing with you. Education, education, education. That's what it's all about.

Agreed, agreed. That's at the heart of it all. I'd even go further. More than just education is necessary: education, enlightenment, and challenge.

Even in my white suburban upbringing, I saw a number of bright HS students go to college, get bored, get stoned, and move right back into the confortable white suburban area that they left. Without challenge or enlightenment, an education will just get one a better paycheck.

WITH challenge -- to do more, to be more -- and with enlightenment -- to recognize that there's more beyond the horizon -- I saw students from the same class move up, out and beyond the worlds they were familiar with.

I should stop now. I'm giddy and positive this morning because I get to leave work in less than two hours. Suffice it to say that I agree with ya, bboy, and with the Cos's message.

/done philosophizing for the day
 
2004-12-23 12:19:56 PM
*confortable = coMfortable
 
2004-12-23 12:24:06 PM
"While the initial salvo was fired months ago, the aftershocks are still being felt. "

Holy get a life people. What is it that happens to certain great comedians/actors that causes them to turn sucky and wimp like? Look at Eddie Murphy; his standups were kick ass and the parts he played in movies very fitting. Now look at what he's done lately. Softie kiddie stuff. Yuck. Cosby went the same way; his old standups were gut wrenching. "The Cosby Show" was his first spiral into "Family Goodness". Then "The Cosby Mysteries" and *prepares for huge barf* "Kids say...". When comedians even appear to be taking this horrible slide, it should be noted and they should be euthanized for the good of the planet.
 
2004-12-23 12:32:37 PM
An interesting thing about this article is that the author interviews several kids who did do as Cosby suggested, essentially pulling themselves out of the pattern of low expectations and fighting to make a better life. And yet those same kids are noting that his message is far from complete, and that much more work in other areas is needed to eliminate what smackem yackem rightly dubs "forces aligning against all of us."

The salient point: "At some point Cosby's crusade either reaches the level of the street...or it will come to be seen as little more than sound and fury signifying nothing more than the power of an outspoken celebrity to get people talking." Either path does good for our society, and yet right now all we're doing is arguing over which path is being formed. I'm just glad that someone as famous and well-spoken as Cosby has indeed "said no to complacency."

The article also does a great job of discussing the interweaving of identity and race with street culture. If you haven't read it yet, I recommend that you do.
 
2004-12-23 12:55:42 PM
eddyatwork:

I wish more black leaders would stand up and say this instead of biatching about how the man is keeping them down like those asshats, Sharpton, Jackson, and Farrakhan.

You might not think so little of Farrakhan if you read up a bit on what he has to say about personal responsibility.
 
2004-12-23 12:57:37 PM
smackem yackem:

But the whole pull-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps American/Republican Dream thing is generally bullshiat.



And as long as you keep telling yourself that, you will continue to be a pathetic, miserable creature that hates his life and want to share his misery...

Keep it to yourself...
 
2004-12-23 01:04:13 PM
Sorry DoctorCal, but as soon as he started with the Masonic stuff I closed it out.
 
2004-12-23 01:44:36 PM
If I wanted to be "a pathetic, miserable creature that hates his life and want(sp) to share his misery", Troll_In_Anson, I'd be a Republican.

There's no reason for you to make a personal attack like that. That which you hate in others is what you hate about yourself, trollmeister.

Merry Christmas.
 
2004-12-23 02:33:21 PM
Cosby's mad because his generation, as well as those older, dealt with real racism, and fought so that younger people wouldn't have to deal with the same shiat. And he's had to sit back and watch the younger generations piss it away.

He's 100% correct in his assertation that the young black man's worst enemy is himself.
 
2004-12-23 02:48:57 PM
smackem yackem:

There's no reason for you to make a personal attack like that

You bring it out in me....You really sound miserable. I can't say that I've seemn make a single positve sounding post since you went TF. Everything has been a negative.


Merry Christmas.

Thanks. Same to you...really.
 
2004-12-23 03:50:30 PM
It's about time somebody had the guts to say what must be said. No one better to say it than Dr. Huckstable.
 
2004-12-23 03:55:04 PM
smackem yackem

But the whole pull-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps American/Republican Dream thing is generally bullshiat. There are forces aligning against all of us, whether we can recognize them or not.

If by "forces" you mean the forces of nothing-is-free-and-you-have-to-work-your-ass-off -if-you-want-to-get-ahead, then yeah... there are forces, indeed.
 
2004-12-23 04:24:44 PM
I admire the bravery of his new work. But he was funny as shiat on some of his older albums. I have cassette dubs - I think one is "Why Is There Air?" and the other is "The Chicken Heart".
 
2004-12-23 04:26:16 PM
The truth hurts. I'm just glad it's a black guy saying it. Can you imagine the outrage if this message came from the "White Devil?"
 
2004-12-23 04:27:16 PM
I tell ya, my respect for Cosby grows everday.
 
2004-12-23 04:27:21 PM
I can't help thinking that if Mr Cosby were white then this thread would have died not long after this post.
 
2004-12-23 04:27:23 PM
I'm with downstairs. Work hard, shut up, and look down on poor people. Well the last parts not needed but it just fits so well.
 
2004-12-23 04:27:26 PM
Seattle down Beavis!
 
2004-12-23 04:28:15 PM
I'm still going to get that Junior Barns
 
2004-12-23 04:28:39 PM
If by "forces" you mean the forces of nothing-is-free-and-you-have-to-work-your-ass-off -if-you-want-to-get-ahead, then yeah... there are forces, indeed.

agreed!
 
2004-12-23 04:29:31 PM
The most insidious form of racism is when it gets internalized, such that anyone within the "race" who works hard and succeeds is a sellout, an Uncle Tom...whatever.

If that's "keepin it real" I want no part of it.
 
2004-12-23 04:30:22 PM
I agree with the "sounds more like dennis leary material" thing, And remember the big comedy deal where he kept saying that line and talking about people using slang and stuff. that, and coffee flavored coffee.

But still, always liked cosby. But he did sell himself out a bit with the whole jello thing.
 
2004-12-23 04:30:54 PM
The Nim Elf: LOL - I get it.

I need to go put my "idiot mittens" on.
 
2004-12-23 04:31:18 PM
FU, Bill Cosby. He is not funny, nor was he ever funny.

I don't think anybody should take advice from someone who cheated on his wife. What a total dick.
 
2004-12-23 04:31:28 PM
While Cosby is pretty bright, he's just a little out of touch. Besides, can you really believe someone after this?
 
2004-12-23 04:33:25 PM
It's cold here.
 
2004-12-23 04:33:28 PM
alcoholic_entropy

First time I heard him saying this stuff I thought he'd lost his mind. The second time I heard it, he was making more sense. I wish more people in the black community would stand up and say what he's saying.

Agreed.
 
2004-12-23 04:34:38 PM
First "To Russle...", then Fat Albert now this.

I for one welcome our new Jello peddling overlord.
 
2004-12-23 04:34:56 PM
When the man is right, the man is right. I just like watching all the PC drones on the Left twitch whenever he talks about this stuff.
 
2004-12-23 04:35:18 PM
That's DR. Cosby, you bimbo

/obscure Doonsbury reference
 
2004-12-23 04:35:58 PM
One of Cosby's speeches

Ladies and gentlemen, I really have to ask you to seriously consider what youve heard, and now this is the end of the evening so to speak. I heard a prize fight manager say to his fellow who was losing badly, David, listen to me. Its not whats hes doing to you. Its what youre not doing. (laughter).

Ladies and gentlemen, these people set, they opened the doors, they gave us the right, and today, ladies and gentlemen, in our cities and public schools we have fifty percent drop out. In our own neighborhood, we have men in prison. No longer is a person embarrassed because theyre pregnant without a husband. (clapping) No longer is a boy considered an embarrassment if he tries to run away from being the father of the unmarried child (clapping)

.

Ladies and gentlemen, the lower economic and lower middle economic people are holding their end in this deal. In the neighborhood that most of us grew up in, parenting is not going on. (clapping) In the old days, you couldnt hooky school because every drawn shade was an eye (laughing). And before your mother got off the bus and to the house, she knew exactly where you had gone, who had gone into the house, and where you got on whatever you had one and where you got it from. Parents dont know that today.

Im talking about these people who cry when their son is standing there in an orange suit. Where were you when he was two? (clapping) Where were you when he was twelve? (clapping) Where were you when he was eighteen, and how come you dont know he had a pistol? (clapping) And where is his father, and why dont you know where he is? And why doesnt the father show up to talk to this boy?



The church is only open on Sunday. And you cant keep asking Jesus to ask doing things for you (clapping). You cant keep asking that God will find a way. God is tired of you (clapping and laughing). God was there when they won all those cases. 50 in a row. Thats where God was because these people were doing something. And God said, Im going to find a way. I wasnt there when God said it Im making this up (laughter). But it sounds like what God would do (laughter).

We cannot blame white people. White people (clapping) .. white people dont live over there. They close up the shop early. The Korean ones still dont know us as wellthey stay open 24 hours (laughter).

Im looking and I see a man named Kenneth Clark. He and his wife MamieKenneths still alive. I have to apologize to him for these people because Kenneth said it straight. He said you have to strengthen yourselvesand weve got to have that black doll. And everybody said it. Julian Bond said it. Dick Gregory said it. All these lawyers said it. And you wouldnt know that anybody had done a damned thing.



50 percent drop out rate, Im telling you, and people in jail, and women having children by five, six different men. Under what excuse, I want somebody to love me, and as soon as you have it, you forget to parent. Grandmother, mother, and great grandmother in the same room, raising children, and the child knows nothing about love or respect of any one of the three of them (clapping). All this child knows is gimme, gimme, gimme. These people want to buy the friendship of a child.and the child couldnt care less. Those of us sitting out here who have gone on to some college or whatever weve done, we still fear our parents (clapping and laughter). And these people are not parenting. Theyre buying things for the kid. $500 sneakers, for what? They wont buy or spend $250 on Hooked on Phonics. (clapping)

A\Kenneth Clark, somewhere in his home in upstate New Yorkjust looking ahead. Thank God, he doesnt know whats going on, thank God. But these people, the ones up here in the balcony fought so hard. Looking at the incarcerated, these are not political criminals. These are people going around stealing Coca Cola. People getting shot in the back of the head over a piece of pound cake! Then we all run out and are outraged, The cops shouldnt have shot him What the hell was he doing with the pound cake in his hand? (laughter and clapping). I wanted a piece of pound cake just as bad as anybody else (laughter) And I looked at it and I had no money. And something called parenting said if get caught with it youre going to embarrass your mother. Not youre going to get your butt kicked. No. Youre going to embarrass your mother. Youre going to embarrass your family.

If knock that girl up, youre going to have to run away because its going to be too embarrassing for your family. In the old days, a girl getting pregnant had to go down South, and then her mother would go down to get her. But the mother had the baby. I said the mother had the baby. The girl didnt have a baby. The mother had the baby in two weeks. (laughter) We are not parenting. Ladies and gentlemen, listen to these people, they are showing you whats wrong. People putting their clothes on backwards. isnt that a sign of something going on wrong? (laughter)



Are you not paying attention, people with their hat on backwards, pants down around the crack. Isnt that a sign of something, or are you waiting for Jesus to pull his pants up (laughter and clapping ). Isnt it a sign of something when shes got her dress all the way up to the crackand got all kinds of needles and things going through her body. What part of Africa did this come from? (laughter). We are not Africans. Those people are not Africans, they dont know a damned thing about Africa. With names like Shaniqua, Shaligua, Mohammed and all that crap and all of them are in jail. (When we give these kinds names to our children, we give them the strength and inspiration in the meaning of those names. Whats the point of giving them strong names if there is not parenting and values backing it up).



Brown Versus the Board of Education is no longer the white persons problem. Weve got to take the neighborhood back (clapping). Weve got to go in there. Just forget telling your child to go to the Peace Corps. Its right around the corner. (laughter) Its standing on the corner. It cant speak English. It doesnt want to speak English. I cant even talk the way these people talk. Why you aint where you is go, ra, I dont know who these people are. And I blamed the kid until I heard the mother talk (laughter). Then I heard the father talk. This is all in the house. You used to talk a certain way on the corner and you got into the house and switched to English. Everybody knows its important to speak English except these knuckleheads. You cant land a plane with why you aint You cant be a doctor with that kind of crap coming out of your mouth. There is no Bible that has that kind of language. Where did these people get the idea that theyre moving ahead on this. Well, they know theyre not, theyre just hanging out in the same place, five or six generations sitting in the projects when youre just supposed to stay there long enough to get a job and move out.

Now look, Im telling you. Its not what theyre doing to us. Its what were not doing. 50 percent drop out. Look, were raising our own ingrown immigrants. These people are fighting hard to be ignorant. Theres no English being spoken, and theyre walking and theyre angry. Oh God, theyre angry and they have pistols and they shoot and they do stupid things. And after they kill somebody, they dont have a plan. Just murder somebody. Boom. Over what? A pizza? And then run to the poor cousins house. They sit there and the cousin says what are you doing here? I just killed somebody, man. What? I just killed somebody, Ive got to stay here. No, you dont. Well, give me some money, Ill go Where are you going? North Carolina. Everybody wanted to go to North Carolina. But the police know where youre going because your cousin has a record.

Five or six different children, same woman, eight, ten different husbands or whatever, pretty soon youre going to have to have DNA cards so you can tell who youre making love to. You dont who this is. It might be your grandmother. (laughter) Im telling you, theyre young enough. Hey, you have a baby when youre twelve. Your baby turns thirteen and has a baby, how old are you? Huh? Grandmother. By the time youre twelve, you could have sex with your grandmother, you keep those numbers coming. Im just predicting.

Im saying Brown Vs. Board of Education. Weve got to hit the streets, ladies and gentlemen. Im winding up, now , no more applause. Im saying, look at the Black Muslims. There are Black Muslims standing on the street corners and they say so forth and so on, and werere laughing at them because they have bean pies and all that, but you dont read Black Muslim gunned down while chastising drug dealer. You dont read that. They dont shoot down Black Muslims. You understand me. Muslims tell you to get out of the neighborhood. When you want to clear your neighborhood out, first thing you do is go get the Black Muslims, bean pies and all (laughter). And your neighborhood is then clear. The police cant do it .

Im telling you Christians, whats wrong with you? Why cant you hit the streets? Why cant you clean it out yourselves? Its our time now, ladies and gentlemen. It is our time (clapping). And Ive got good news for you. Its not about money. Its about you doing something ordinarily that we doget in somebody elses business. Its time for you to not accept the language that these people are speaking, which will take them nowhere. What the hell good is Brown V. Board of Education if nobody wants it?



What is it with young girls getting after some girl who wants to still remain a virgin. Who are these sick black people and where did they come from and why havent they been parented to shut up? To go up to girls and try to get a club where you are nobody.., this is a sickness ladies and gentlemen and we are not paying attention to these children. These are children. They dont know anything. They dont have anything. Theyre homeless people. All they know how to do is beg. And you give it to them, trying to win their friendship. And what are they good for? And then they stand there in an orange suit and you drop to your knees, (crying sound) He didnt do anything, he didnt do anything. Yes, he did do it. And you need to have an orange suit on too (laughter, clapping).

So, ladies and gentlemen, I want to thank you for the award (big laughter) and giving me an opportunity to speak because, I mean, this is the future, and all of these people who lined up and done..theyve got to be wondering what the hell happened. Brown V. Board of Education, these people who marched and were hit in the face with rocks and punched in the face to get an education and we got these knuckleheads walking around who dont want to learn English (clapping) I know that you all know it. I just want to get you as angry that you ought to be. When you walk around the neighborhood and you see this stuff, that stuffs not funny. These people are not funny anymore. And that s not brother. And thats not my sister. Theyre faking and theyre dragging me way down because the state, the city and all these people have to pick up the tab on them because they dont want to accept that they have to study to get an education.



We have to begin to build in the neighborhood, have restaurants, have cleaners, have pharmacies, have real estate, have medical buildings instead of trying to rob them all. And so, ladies and gentlemen, please, Dorothy Height, where ever shes sitting, she didnt do all that stuff so that she could hear somebody say I cant stand algebra, I cant standand what you is. Its horrible.

Basketball players, multimillionaires cant write a paragraph. Football players, multimillionaires, cant read. Yes. Multimillionaires. Well, Brown V Board of Education, where are we today? Its there. They paved the way. What did we do with it. The white man, hes laughing, got to be laughing. 50 percent drop out, rest of them in prison.

You got to tell me that if there was parenting, help me, if there was parenting, he wouldnt have picked up the Coca Cola bottle and walked out with it to get shot in the back of the head. He wouldnt have. Not if he loved his parents. And not if they were parenting! Not if the father would come home. Not if the boy hadnt dropped the sperm cell inside of the girl and the girl had said, No, you have to come back here and be the father of this child. Not ..I dont have to.



Therefore, you have the pile up of these sweet beautiful things born by nature raised by no one. Give them presents. Youre raising pimps. Thats what a pimp is. A pimp will act nasty to you so you have to go out and get them something. And then you bring it back and maybe he or she hugs you. And thats why pimp is so famous. Theyve got a drink called the Pimp-something. You all wonder what thats about, dont you? Well, youre probably going to let Jesus figure it out for you (laughter). Well, Ive got something to tell you about Jesus. When you go to the church, look at the stained glass things of Jesus. Look at them. Is Jesus smiling? Not in one picture. So, tell your friends. Lets try to do something. Lets try to make Jesus smile. Lets start parenting. Thank you, thank you (clapping, cheers)
 
2004-12-23 04:36:00 PM
Cosby's mad because his generation, as well as those older, dealt with real racism, and fought so that younger people wouldn't have to deal with the same shiat. And he's had to sit back and watch the younger generations piss it away.

Tasty, on-the-money-goodness. This is a man who saw people firehosed, beaten in the street, forced to ride the back of the bus, etc., was a black comedian doing intelligent material at a time when Step and Fetchit black man was considered hi-larious, and now he's watching kids only 2 generations removed from that taking the "easy way out", which includes: drug dealing, robbery, and getting killed by the time you're 20.

He's pissed, and he's saying what everyone is afraid to say: Believe in yourself, even when no one else does.

/white, working class, 2nd generation Irish
 
2004-12-23 04:36:39 PM
Hard knocks: Hardeman, 16, was once beaten up after school for knowing the answers in class

I know of a black man who was ridiculed for being intelligent or considering going to college. I believe he's now a MD, but he's one of the rare few that can fight against the negative images of education in the black culture.

Kenny, 17, a onetime stick-up man, puts it plainly. "Cosby is ... talking about me holding up my end of the bargain. Listen ... I robbed 'cause I was hungry. If he's going to put food on my table, if he's going to give me time to pursue education vigorously, then fine. But if he's not, then I'm going to hold up my end of the bargain and make sure I get something to eat."


I don't buy it. I seriously doubt many people rob to put food on their table, and if so it's only because they're spending too much money on bling as Bill Cosby says. My mother-in-law works at a food shelter that provides free food to struggling families indefinitely so I know it's about impossible to go hungry.
 
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