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(MSN)   How to steal WiFi and how to keep neighbors from stealing yours   (slate.msn.com) divider line 130
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37081 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Nov 2004 at 3:16 AM   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2004-11-20 08:24:47 PM
I was gonna take a little drive last saturday around my neighborhood with my notebook to look for open APs just for fun. I've got the fastest downlink my DSL providor has so I'm not really in need of more bandwidth so I was never really intrested but I figured I'd might as well introduce myself to the world of wardriving.

After hooking up my notebook I tested it with my own AP and it was ok. After that pointed my handy dandy antena (a tin can) at the office building a little distance aways just for shiats-and-giggles and viola, 5 SSIDs 3 transmitting their SSIDs without any security and those same with DHCPd up and running. I patched myself into their networks and was happy to find an open printer share on one of the machines in one of the offices and a nice fat downlink in the other, probably a webdevelopment company.

Damn, that took all the fun out of wardriving so I just stayed home and printed out a few tips on wireless security on the printer I found. Today, I checked again and everything was as it was last week.

Oh well, if my DSL ever goes down again, I'll use the fat downlink I found.

Jesus folks, it's called WEP - it might not be very good but it's more than enought to dissuade a casual snooper.
 
2004-11-20 09:48:12 PM
I did WEP.

I'm still paronoid about the wi-fi thing.

can someone steal internet access without seeing what your doing online?

Are they seperate concerns?
 
2004-11-20 10:42:26 PM
Hmmm....

I wonder how good security is up at the capital building these days...?

I think I found myself a project.
 
2004-11-20 10:53:47 PM
I use a wireless and don't know who the fark is providing the umbrella coverage, but my thanks to them for it. What I can't figure out is my email will download, but I can't send it out. Can't figure out the SMTP settings for it.

Any smart guys out there that can help? Email in bio.
 
2004-11-20 10:54:39 PM
Shut Up, if you need security over wifi, VPN is the way to go - it's a lot of overhead but you'll have point to point secure traffic.

If you don't really care but don't want snoopers or freeloaders, WEP above 128bits is Good Enough(tm). At 64 bits it's a very weak defence but if you have low traffic, it's enough as WEP key snooping depends on high traffic. You can also turn off SSID transmissions from your AP, it avoids passive listening if your traffic is very low.

However, addressing your concerns, yes. Someone can freeload without knowing what you're doing. If that same somebody wants to know what you're doing online they'll have access to it (hence VPN but SSL might be enough).

I consider it two seperate things, most users just want a free ride being that most of them are script-kiddies and/or illiterates. The few that are smart and know how to sniff traffic to obtain useful information are a hell of a lot harder to detect and block. Remember that if someone really wants to steal your information, he will.
 
2004-11-20 10:57:46 PM
darkhorse23, sniff the other folks traffic - find out who their SMTP server is. :)

Knoppix and tcpdump are your friends.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2004-11-20 11:05:26 PM
WEP/128 is not much better than WEP/64. Either is protection against casual eavesdropping. Neither is protection against a determined attacker.

I worked with Paul Boutin, the author of the article, at MIT. I sometimes wondered what happened to him. He left for Silicon Valley 13 years ago and that's the last I heard of him.
 
2004-11-20 11:56:28 PM
for those on comcast/roadrunnner or any other cable based broadband, you should check the acceptable use policy prior to putting up an AP and thinking your being nice by leaving it open for anyone. comcast AUP states that you cannot share your connection outside of your residence to other, and they WILL hold YOU responsible for anything that happens on YOUR broadband connection. DSL may or may not have the same sort of thing.
 
2004-11-21 12:41:10 AM
I'm surprised that nobody has said this yet:

USE WPA

WPA encryption is nearly impossible for anyone outside of intelligence services to defeat. WPA is just as easy to set up as WEP, except it actually works. You'll need to find a router and a client card that supports it, but they're not too hard to find.
 
2004-11-21 01:07:20 AM
Apple's latest AirPort (4.1) does WPA over WEP ... somehow ...

/confused
 
2004-11-21 02:06:29 AM
wow chakalakasp, I didn't think Roosevelt had that much foresight to have the efforts of the Work Projects Administration used for effective 802.11 encryption :)

/personally more of a fan of FAP
 
2004-11-21 02:56:01 AM
bubba-hotep:
Funny that those companies don't hold themselves to the same standards.
 
2004-11-21 03:00:21 AM
Is it ethical to steal others' service? I'm thinking that if they are that stupid (ie not setting up encryption), they deserve it.
 
2004-11-21 03:08:01 AM
I use WEP, turn off SID broadcast and I lock it down by MAC Address on both my AP and the firewall for my DSL.

My neighbor across the street's is wide open though. So are a couple in the office building I work in.
 
2004-11-21 03:18:03 AM
Turning off SID broadcast doesn't really do anything for security. Locking the MAC down helps, but it's not that hard to spoof a MAC. With an air sniffer, it would take less than an hour to sniff out your WEP key and your MAC address and be using your router (and probably into your computer system).

Locking it down to MAC address and using WEP helps in that it deters all but those who really want in (and most people are "casual" users who just log in because it's there), but don't fool yourself into thinking you've really protected yourself from nerds who desire to get into your internet connection.
 
2004-11-21 03:28:43 AM
How to steal WiFi and how to keep neighbors from stealing yours
Say it with me now.
AT THE SAME TIME

Also, anybody else find it odd that msn is running a story about stealing internet bandwidth? I hear jewlers international is running an article about the best way to steal the Hope diamond.
 
2004-11-21 03:29:36 AM
*shrug* wpa's not the end all solution either.

http://wifinetnews.com/archives/004428.html

You push your bits. You take your chances.

Maybe I'll set up a honey pot and have a little fun.
 
2004-11-21 03:35:16 AM
I will admit, even though it is a bit on the legal shady side war driving is fun as hell. There are even programs that hook to a GPS and record the exact signal strength and location when you get a hit. :)

For security for the truly paranoid, since I'm the only one that uses my wireless, I leave it unplugged until I feel like surfing the web from the couch. Off: The ultimate security.
 
2004-11-21 03:39:13 AM
On "stolen" WiFi right now. But yes, last year we did have a wireless, and yes, it was protected.

/yay for being smarter than the neighbors
 
2004-11-21 03:42:27 AM
Here is how I can steal WiFi from my neighbours: Right-click on Wireless Network Connection, click on View Available Wireless Networks, and then Connect on one that does not have security enabled. Easy as that. Right now I have 3 networks available to me, but I stick to mine.

And I can't understand why anybody would leave their connection wireless network available for free use. What if somebody decides to download kiddie porn using that connection?
 
2004-11-21 03:47:49 AM
fezziwig: Well, obviously short passwords are subject to dictionary attacks. WPA is an encryption system, and so picking a weak password will leave it vulnerable. That applies to even the strongest crypto engines out there -- you can crack 3DES in thirty seconds if someone uses a three letter dictionary word passphrase.

But the encryption system itself, like WPA, IS secure, unlike WEP, which can be brute forced in a very short time. Brute focing goes around trying to figure out the passphrase altogether and just plows at the key solutions.
 
2004-11-21 03:49:28 AM
I've warsquatted more than my fair share of networks here in the Sili Valley. I'm completely cool with it just as long as the squatter doesn't overstep his/her social graces regarding this favor of bandwidth. If you're going to do stuff like hacking through someone who doesn't-know-any-better's shared directories, or use the shared printer on the squatee's network to print nasty shiat, then you are a tool who should have your wireless card legally stripped from you. I live in a neighborhood devoid of access points (beleive me, I've scanned), so i've purposefully left mine open to all comers. I love this technology. What else can make us feel like 'Mad Max's' of the internet?
 
2004-11-21 03:54:35 AM
I leave mine open because I can't connect to my own network if I put it on WEP. What can I say, I'm an idiot about these things.
 
2004-11-21 03:57:49 AM
A couple weeks ago, I found over 400 wireless networks in just a quick circle around my little college town.

Then well over 1000 in the "big city" near by. A frightening majority of them were residential-type networks (i.e., not easily identifiable as being public hotspots (Starbucks, community networks, etc) or corporate networks (with business names in the SSID, etc). I'd give some stats but I'm too lazy to go back and look at my results.

My two wireless networks, however, have WEP turned on (one is for me and my equipment, the other is for the roommates to hook their computers into the router without having to drill holes in the wall to run Cat-5e cable all over the place). And there are several nearby that are open, so I doubt I have anyone even trying to mooch of my DSL connection (even though it probably wouldn't hurt to rotate WEP keys every now and then). Maybe I should change one of them to serve out IP addresses on an open network, but not actually connect it to anything. Let the losers think the thing is working and waste their time and energy. :)

CyberDave
 
2004-11-21 04:01:37 AM
hehe, I limit mine to only the MAC addresses I want, and I use wep...

I know its not 100% secure, but I don't live in a tech-savvy neighborhood
 
2004-11-21 04:17:40 AM
Shut........UP


I did WEP.

I'm still paronoid about the wi-fi thing.

can someone steal internet access without seeing what your doing online?

Are they seperate concerns?



LOL
 
GCD
2004-11-21 04:17:58 AM
It's amazing how stupid people are when it comes to this kind of stuff - businesses especially.

I love these places that have "IT Specialists" on staff, yet they have a wide open wireless network that anyone can access...

/disgruntled IT tech
 
2004-11-21 04:18:54 AM
(I just realized that I was being confusing above. Brute forcing does utilize trying to find the "password" in order to retreive the key. The problem is that with WEP, no matter how strong your password is, the cryto is trivially weak and can be broken quite easily. With WPA, on the other hand, the crytpo is strong. A very short passphrase will still make it easy to dictionary attack WPA, but a decent passphrase will make WPA rather impossible to brute force, especially when you use WPA hardware capable of utilizing the AES encrytion engine. IIRC, it would take a supercomputer more than the length of the universe to brute force AES-128.)
 
2004-11-21 04:23:53 AM
WTF is with all this "stealing" nonsense? Maybe I'm just blessed to live in Austin, but "stealing" wifi access seems pretty pointless. Right now in this city it's harder to find a cafe or other hangout that *doesn't* provide free wireless.
 
2004-11-21 04:27:13 AM
darkhorse23, yeah. In Windows you can type "tracert www.fark.com" and figure out the route from the network you are on to the Fark website. When it starts working, it will probably have three "*" symbols and then an address like 192.168.something.something or 172.something.something.something. The address after that is where the DSL terminates at their ISP and it should have a hostname like something.dsl.earthlink.net or something.bb.aol.com. Using those hostnames, you should be able to guess who the person's ISP is.
Once you get the name of the ISP, go to Google and type something like "SMTP settings EarthLink" and you should see morans all over the web posting this stuff after a few minutes of browsing the results.

Write down the old smtp server settings for your outlook and put in the new to see if it works.

On a Mac everything is the same except you might have to download a "traceroute" program.
 
2004-11-21 04:33:14 AM


Please, won't somebody think of the megahertz?
 
2004-11-21 04:36:20 AM
my neighbor has an open wifi AND one of the computers on the network is setup for full sharing.... some people shouldnt have wireless. also i found a bank building that has 6 open WAP's im going to have to see what i can do there soon.
 
2004-11-21 04:37:35 AM
If you drive past my house and find a wireless connection without any prtection please use it. It is a free service provided by me therefore will not be considered stealing.
 
2004-11-21 04:48:35 AM
ok folks... odds... all it comes down to...

unplug from your wifi/etc., to secure.
 
2004-11-21 04:56:46 AM
(1) WPA doesn't work with xbox wireless adapter

(2) WEP doesn't work with Apple Airport used for streaming iTunes over a heterogenous network

(3) passwords and MAC filtering are a big pain in the butt for the people who live with you and their guests.


In most residential cases, the security provided by these technologies isn't worth the hastle. Geeks should stop sneering down their noses at us more human people. (but yeah, I always use VPN+smartcard for corporate work.)
 
2004-11-21 04:57:08 AM
What an extremely timely posting, I just installed my wireless card. Fark must have h4x0r3d my wireless internets or something.
 
2004-11-21 05:01:54 AM
I had the exact same situation a few months ago (moved to a new location and had to wait a whole month to get an Internet connection). Found out that there were 6 APs in my neighborhood, 3 of which weren't secured. I'd like to thank Gert (where/whoever he his) for letting me check my mail via his network on a daily basis! I couldn't have functioned without his lack of security.
 
2004-11-21 05:19:13 AM
I live in a shiathole city, odds are when I set up my brokeass wireless network next year, there will STILL be nobody in range who can use it.

Then again, Time Warner is pushing wifi on local digital cable subscribers....
 
2004-11-21 06:02:31 AM
Drat, the only network in range, despite having the default server name of "linksys" appears to have a network key. Or perhaps I'm wireless retarded and managing to not connect to an open network. When I click ok on everything it doesn't give me an error, it doesn't say anything, it just doesn't connect.
 
2004-11-21 06:13:43 AM
How can this writer be so irresponsible as to write about stealing Wi-Fi without once mentioning coffee can antenna construction techniques?? Tilting the computer and holding it out the window? Puh-leez.
 
2004-11-21 06:15:44 AM
for those who are conserned, WPA is an extention to WEP
 
2004-11-21 06:16:59 AM
My wireless network at home is completely open. Feel free to browse to your heart's content. You may even check out my open shares, if you can login to my win2003 domain...

/if you see a network SSID named Biyotch!, its mine...
 
2004-11-21 06:46:21 AM
On a Mac everything is the same except you might have to download a "traceroute" program.

Dunno what Mac experience you've had, but 'traceroute' is there on my Mac OS X box. It's in /usr/sbin/traceroute.

And as far as WEP goes, it's pretty safe if it's used for an intermittent connection. The amount of time, effort, and number of captured encrypted packets needed far outweigh the benefit you get from cracking someone's WEP encryption key. If there are other people around with open networks, your neighbors will use them and not bother with your network.

If you use your wireless connection to replace a wired connection, then your packet generation rate goes way up. Increases the potential for your WEP key getting crack.

Then again, I've heard of tools recently that can crack WEP with under a million encrypted packets--they don't have to be the "weak" kind that traditional cracking tools like AirSnort required (most, if not all, wireless hardware can now avoid creating packets that have weak encryption). Haven't had a chance to look into those new tools, though, so I can't personally vouch for their effectiveness. I can say, however, that I set up a test wireless network last spring, generated something on the order of 12 million encrypted packets (many many gigabytes of data), and was unable to crack the WEP key using the popular AirSnort tool.

/CS Grad student specializing in network security.
//This post has been brought to you by myself and several bottles of Mike's Hard Lemonade
 
2004-11-21 07:07:18 AM
VPN is the way to go. I basically had the following:

internet =eth0= linux firewall =eth1= wireless AP

Basically, I would hop on the access point and grab an IP via dhcp. Even tho I do get an IP, there's no route for anyone go to. I can hit the firewall, and that's it. So, to actually get in, I use PPTP to tunnel into the linux firewall (requires authentication) and grab an IP from a block of IPs that is allowed to masq/NAT via iptables. Pretty secure, I think. I haven't touched it in a while since I no longer use my access point since I moved, but I may set this up again.

/yeah, PPTP sucks compared to other VPN stuff, but IPsec is a pain in the ass
//the opensource implementation of a PPTP server is better than Microsoft's offering
 
2004-11-21 07:24:26 AM
Folks, once and for all: 128-bit WEP can be trivially cracked if and only if you can collect a reasonably big number of packets with weak IV's (Initialisation Vectors).

After the big scare in late 2000/2001, all the manufacturers added code to avoid weak IV's; for old equipment, there's probably a firmware update, and all equipment newer than 2001 has the new mechanism built-in.

Today's scenario look more like this: you fire airsnort/kismet/whatever, lock in on a WEP-protected network with medium to high traffic, start looking for weak IV's, come again in 3 days and find out that you've collected 3 or four (if lucky). You need over 10000 in order to have a chance of cracking the key in this millenium.

It's really funny to see how the myth of WEP insecurity is alive and well and keeps lazy people from easily secure their networks in a couple of minutes.

On the other hand, using a simple word or any stupid password leads to instant breakin (google wepcrack).

Mmmmkay?
 
2004-11-21 07:25:59 AM
During hurricane Frances my cable went out with the first storm band (a wimpy band, too) so maybe I ran net stumbler and found my neighbor's wireless/DSL was still working.

When our power went out the next day maybe I used net stumbler to find an unsecured AP at the freaking BANK down the road.

And what did I maybe do with this maybe access? I posted storm pictures on Fark.
 
2004-11-21 07:29:05 AM
Don't forget that a lot of wireless routers will log your mac address as well as your netbios name, so don't set your netbios name to your real name, even if you don't wardrive.

I've accidently connected to other people's wifi points before, like when I was visiting a friend in Phoenix for a few days a few months ago and asked if he had a wireless connection I could use, he said sure, and I spent the next few days using it from the room I was staying in.

It wasn't until a few days later when I was ssh'ed into my home box that I noticed I was coming in from pacbell.net and not cox.net (that he used). Turns out I had grabbed his neighbors signal instead. His home's router didn't reach the room I was staying in apparently.
 
2004-11-21 07:30:44 AM
Oh, my router's name will be PLANET DRUIDIA'S AIR SHIELD. They'll NEVER guess the combination.
 
2004-11-21 07:35:59 AM
CyberDave
Then again, I've heard of tools recently that can crack WEP with under a million encrypted packets--they don't have to be the "weak" kind that traditional cracking tools like AirSnort required

Right on!
I guess you're thinking aircrack (google)- nice idea, still doesn't do "instant" cracking. And if you change your WEP key from time to time (let's say 2 weeks) it's impact is rather minimal.

The real answer is point-to-point security (vpn or ssh tunnel or whatnot). But for 90% or more of the home users, WEP is enough, for the time being.
 
2004-11-21 07:56:11 AM
This is nothing new about the how insecure wireless routers are, they have been insecure ever since they came out. I am a network administrator and none of this suprises me since I have seen it many times when I used to do network security. People would always wonder why thier bandwidth was all used up. I found one guy who had a Counter-Strike server set up using stolen bandwidth. We have laptops where I am at now which have wireless NIC cards built into them so when we test it out by picking up someone else's signal in the building to make sure the wireless NIC works.
 
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