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(USA Today)   Latest poll shows 49 percent for Bush, 49 percent for Kerry. In other news, 49 percent of U.S. voters are morons   (usatoday.com ) divider line 730
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9322 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Oct 2004 at 1:06 PM (11 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2004-10-04 02:14:09 PM  
I'm 20-something voter... I usually whine that both canidates suck and then pick an obscure 3rd party canidate that no one has ever heard of. I then proceed to inform everyone I'm a libertarian (i think) over and over...
 
2004-10-04 02:14:54 PM  
GorgeousOrifice

Oh yes, it's quite clear. And it's sad that you rely on your own self-generated fear and lies to form your political beliefs instead of actually looking at the issue of something like reinstating the draft logically.

It's not going to happen. Doesn't matter who is elected. There will be no draft.
 
2004-10-04 02:15:07 PM  
gorgeous...

Two bills to reinstate the draft have been introduced. Neither have any Republican co-sponsors. No Republican has said anything on the subject except "there won't be a draft." The military doesn't want a draft.

So, feel free to "believe what you say," but try to consider the fact that most delusional people also believe what they say.
 
2004-10-04 02:15:50 PM  
Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo

>> I think it's funny that all the inbred states are voting for Bush while the 2 coasts are Democratic...It really is true that America is LA and New York and a vast wasteland in between...

No kidding. Almost like the areas where people have the most exposure to people with different ideas, principles, backgrounds, etc are the more tolerant, live and let live types...
 
2004-10-04 02:16:06 PM  
jwa007

yah, i think you're completely correct about bush's pride in himself for being average.

my take on it is that most people would like to see themselves as president, and by electing bush, who is more like the average voter than any candidate in awhile, they can lead vicariously through him.

or maybe that's just wild psychobabble.

i think it is a fool's game to have an average american leading the country. the president needs to be wildly talented in diplomacy, economics, and connecting to the constituency.
 
2004-10-04 02:16:53 PM  
The chances of there being a draft are incredibly tiny. Enough to be non-existent.

However, I still wouldn't believe Bush if he said the sky was blue.
 
2004-10-04 02:17:21 PM  
There will be no draft

Beg to differ...especially if the war starts to get even more out of control and if we *ahem* attack Iran or Syria...
 
2004-10-04 02:18:14 PM  
Vote Libertarian!

I am, to the core, a Libertarian. A firm believer in personal responsibility and personal freedoms.

I will not vote for Michael Badnarik, whom I find to be a flaming wackjob.

No, in light of the current administration's position of "let's see how many personal freedoms we can infring upon before people start to complain. If no one complains, let's just start taking them away" I think I will be on the ABB (Anyone But Bush) party bandwagon.

Though Badnarik had one useful soundbite: "If people keep convincing themselves to choose between the lesser of two evils, they're always going to end up with evil."

/sick of the two-party system but looking for a third-party candidate who isn't out in deep left field
 
2004-10-04 02:18:17 PM  
Let's see...pay big bucks usually under onerous contract terms for crappy sound quality and constant annoyance to others and coughing up loads of money for batteries and the hazardous retardation of driving skills and the priviledge of being on an electronic leash which also happens to be a microwave transceiver held tightly to the side of your head.

Oh, yeah. Cell phones are just great.

Seriously, I am mystified by their popularity. I can see why people use them for business, but otherwise I don't get it at all. They are obnoxious, superfluous devices.

Style statement? Status symbol? Who knows?

I see them as an indicator of low I.Q., emotional insecurity, or both.
 
2004-10-04 02:18:32 PM  
Its weird how people have pounced on Kerrys one famous slip up (see cereal above) but its no problem for Bush to continuously mangle the english language, and make little sense at all.
 
2004-10-04 02:18:49 PM  
SpectroBoy - that was a funny picture, but please don't drag weezer down with gwb.
 
2004-10-04 02:20:17 PM  
whidbey

Of course you beg to differ.

Doesn't mean there will actually ever be a draft.

Talk about creating an issue where there was none just to have fodder for the Chicken Little Approach to Politics.
 
2004-10-04 02:20:43 PM  
canyoneer --
"Seriously, I am mystified by their popularity. I can see why people use them for business, but otherwise I don't get it at all. They are obnoxious, superfluous devices."


Cheaper, more convenient, and more versatile than a land line.
 
2004-10-04 02:20:51 PM  
The DIFFERENCE between JFK and W...

HILLER: "Can you name the general who is in charge of Pakistan?"
DUBYA: "Wait, wait, is this 50 questions?"
HILLER: "No, it's four questions of four leaders in four hot spots."
DUBYA: "The new Pakistani general, he's just been elected, not elected, this guy took over office. It appears this guy is going to bring stability to the country and I think that's good news for the sub-continent."
HILLER: "Can you name him?"
DUBYA: "General. I can't name the general. General."
HILLER: "And the prime minister of India?"
DUBYA: "The new prime minister of India is - (pause) No."
Then Bush hit back.
DUBYA: "Can you name the foreign minister of Mexico?"
HILLER: "No sir, but I would say to that, I'm not running for President."

And if JFK were asked...
HILLER: "Can you name the general who is in charge of Pakistan?"
JFK: That would be General Pervez Musharraf who assumed control of Pakistan on October 12, 1999. General Musharraf was born in India in 1943, joined the military in 1961. Is well educated, including graduate school in the UK. He conducted national referendums in 2002 to legitimize his authority in Pakistan.
 
2004-10-04 02:21:26 PM  
Is it too much to ask for people to support different politics and still be civil to one another? I'm getting sick of all the name calling. Not just here on FARK where I expect it, but in the real world as well.

I am taking this moment to request that everyone reading this let at least one dumb@55 comment from the hated other side of the spectrum drop. And maybe say something polite on whatever subject the dumb@ss is going on about.

Can't we all just get along?
 
2004-10-04 02:22:01 PM  
RE: Cell phones.

I use mine to call AAA if my car gets wonky out in the boonies.

I also use it to order me up some steamed broccoli on my way home so I can whip by the Outback curbside takeaway.

Don't call regular people and have chats. HATE IT. Mobile phones still don't have the quality that landlines do and until they do, I'm sticking with what I have.
 
2004-10-04 02:23:18 PM  
elendilmir

Thank you Rodney King...
 
2004-10-04 02:23:34 PM  
I can see why people use them for business, but otherwise I don't get it at all.

I have one for business that the office gives me. Why waste additional money on a landline that

1) I can't take calls anywhere except the home
2) Doesn't work when I"m in other countries (see 1)
3) Requires me to give out an additional number
4) Until recently (don't know how well the list is working) would be swamped with telemarketing calls.

It's nothing to do with status. Like all things there are rude people who use them in cinemas, loudly on the bus, in restaurants and so on. Unfortunately assholes are one of life's constants. One can only strive not to be one.
 
2004-10-04 02:24:13 PM  
Actually, this is the difference between JFK and Dubya:

The DIFFERENCE between JFK and W...

HILLER: "Can you name the general who is in charge of Pakistan?"
DUBYA: "Wait, wait, is this 50 questions?"
HILLER: "No, it's four questions of four leaders in four hot spots."
DUBYA: "The new Pakistani general, he's just been elected, not elected, this guy took over office. It appears this guy is going to bring stability to the country and I think that's good news for the sub-continent."
HILLER: "Can you name him?"
DUBYA: "General. I can't name the general. General."
HILLER: "And the prime minister of India?"
DUBYA: "The new prime minister of India is - (pause) No."
Then Bush hit back.
DUBYA: "Can you name the foreign minister of Mexico?"
HILLER: "No sir, but I would say to that, I'm not running for President."


VS

HILLER: Can you name the prime minister of Pakistan?
JFK:
HILLER: Can you name the prime minister of Pakistan?
JFK:
HILLER: Can you name the prime minister of Pakistan?
JFK:
 
2004-10-04 02:24:44 PM  
Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: Haha. Which coast full of superior beings are you lucky enough to inhabit, Oh God-Like Being?

You refute your supposed cosmopolitan excellence by exposing your provincial stupidity and simple-minded worldview.
 
2004-10-04 02:24:51 PM  
Ok, Threadjack here.
I have seen KarmicHoax post in previous threads and always found her to have intelligent insight on whatever she was opining on, but this is the fist time I actually read her profile, and I would like to say, for the record:
She is hot.
Especially when dressed up in that spandex costume.

That is all.
 
2004-10-04 02:25:09 PM  
It's not going to happen. Doesn't matter who is elected. There will be no draft.

I seriously doubt either candidate would advocate for the draft. I doubt either man would consider, even Bush in a second term. However, if we continue our present course and do not do everything we can to get the countries of the world behind our objectives on the international scene I am afraid we will reach a point where we will be forced to commit more land troops than we have and will be in a situation where we have to reinstitute the draft. I am positive President Bush will be reluctant about this and if he does cave in to it he will do with utter reluctance. But his own short-sightedness will be what brings us to that point.
 
2004-10-04 02:25:18 PM  
Mouser-
Go back to that site (www.electoral-vote.com) and run your mouse over each and every state. See those dates? That's when the polls were taken. Notice something? They all say September. The first polls to really measure the impact of the first debate weren't until yesterday, and that site doesn't have any state polls that recent.
 
2004-10-04 02:25:37 PM  
Disagree with me on rational grounds if you like. Draft versus no draft. I have no problem with that. If you are sure there won't be a draft regardless of who wins and regardless of what else happens in Iraq, then fine. I'm not going to change your mind.

I know it seems unlikely, but then again not many people thought we'd have committed 9/10 of our entire army to occupying Iraq in 2000. Bush has pissed off the UN and our allies to the point where they won't come into Iraq without concessions Bush isn't willing to make. We are staying in Iraq, and we will need at least double the number of troops we have now to pacify the country. So if Bush stays, either we cut and run, we keep the current level we have now, or we increase numbers.

Option 1 is out because it is tantamount to admitting that it was wrong to go there at all, and Bush isn't ready to do that. Kerry won't either because he believes that pulling out would result in a failed state and Iran Jr. would spring up if we did. Option 2 is out because we're already keeping troops there way beyond their commitments with stop-loss orders and morale is fading fast. The effectiveness of troops already there is going down because of this. Option 3 requires a draft because nobody's enlisting anymore (wonder why). If Kerry wins, we can either have a draft OR get some international help in. Obviously Kerry will do the latter. Since Bush can't do the latter, the only option is a draft.

If you disagree with all that, fine, and more power to you. But contrary to what you seem to think, I HAVE thought this through to some degree.
 
2004-10-04 02:25:51 PM  
2004-10-04 02:20:17 PM KarmicHoax

There will be a draft. We're not going to slow down as a military force in the world. It's only going to escalate, and the volunteer force is going to go down to zero. Plus, if you haven't noticed, Congress is getting that "let's get our kids involved in some National Service" fervor...

It's on the table...of course, I HOPE it won't happen...
 
2004-10-04 02:26:29 PM  
 
2004-10-04 02:27:06 PM  
Bush is a bonehead!

His mutant followers are beneath bonehead status.
 
2004-10-04 02:27:18 PM  
Omega Ohm: Fine for business, as I said. Otherwise, I hate the awful things. Harley Davidson's and cell phones should be outlawed.
 
2004-10-04 02:27:24 PM  
99% of you are wrong. Im voting libertarian, which makes me part of the missing 1%.
 
2004-10-04 02:28:12 PM  
Colleges have started issuing cell phones instead of having phones in the dorms because they have lost a lot of money coming in from long distance bills. So you have all these college kids with cell phones, which has been for a few years. The college kids graduate and move into a smaller apartment working, etc etc still keeping the cell phone since they dont have the reason to have 2 phone lines. I think it will be very telling in the future... This isn't 2000... this is 4 years later, and thats a looooong time for people to go to cell phones only.
 
2004-10-04 02:28:22 PM  
elendilmir

But that wouldn't be staying the course, and besides what message would that send to the Farkian people? I know how this world works. You cant have mixed up messages that consider both sides of an issue, and expect the Farkian people to respond.

And, you forgot Poland. What kind of post is that? What kind of message does that send to the Farkian people?
 
2004-10-04 02:28:33 PM  
canyonqueer and his high IQ doesn't have anybody to call. he's not bitter, though.

EVERYONE: lick bush in '04.
 
2004-10-04 02:28:53 PM  
Election day is the only poll to pay attention to.

But I hate when one side says "the other %age are morons" How friggin assinine can you get?
 
2004-10-04 02:29:00 PM  
Problem: you find yourself stuck in a hole of your own making.

Moron solution: hard work, stay the course, keep digging.
 
2004-10-04 02:29:08 PM  
2004-10-04 02:18:17 PM canyoneer
For me, it was a security issue. I am in the car a lot by myself, my car is older, and when I have a problem, I have the phone by my side. I had a blowout on a rather desolate highway in northwestern Connecticut - was glad to my my celphone and was able to call AAA.
 
2004-10-04 02:29:23 PM  
megatraum
no chance that 49% are behind that man.

I guess you haven't read the "Kerry cheated" thread, then.
 
2004-10-04 02:29:58 PM  
Let us look at exactly how meaningless this new "poll" is.

1) The US president is not elected by public opinion. If that were the case Bush would have lost 4 years ago. The EC makes sure that national opinion is irrelevant.

2) Polls tend to change every single day and from company to company. It makes you wonder what the point is in even doing polls since everyone comes up with something different. What happened ot Bush 13 point lead a week or two ago?

3) As the debates continue, these current numbers will shift. There are still 3 debates on the horizon.

4) These polls typically have an error rate of +/- %4. So that basically means a perfect tie like this is impossible and wrong. One of those sides is off by so many points.

5) There are many complaints that polling is done with weighted samples for one side or another, for the parties over independants, for whites over minorities, for old over young, for "likely" or "registered" voters over everyone.


Basically, nobody knows what is going to happen in November, least of all the polls.
 
2004-10-04 02:30:49 PM  
What's great about the headline is that in reality,

49% favor bush
49% favor kerry
49% won't vote

It's 49% all around.

You know, after reading previous posts, there really doesn't seem to be anything in Kerry's record that implies he'd be an effective president. The only response to my previous question was "well, he investigated BCCI." That investigation took 3 years, which is about 75% of one presidential term.

To me, that implies that he might be able to do one thing in office before he starts his reelection campaign.

Plus, all Edwards has done is sue people. Even Dan Quayle did more during his short (pre-VP) career than Edwards, which is a shocker. Neither Kerry nor Edwards have managed a staff larger than 40 people. At least Clinton had some experience governing before he was elected, as did Carter.

Hopes and dreams aside, would Kerry/Edwards be effective if elected? Neither has anything in their background that shows they've been effective in doing anything, really. Which is kind of sad, considering that both of them are, theoretically, two of the more powerful guys on earth.
 
2004-10-04 02:30:59 PM  
Let's see...pay big bucks usually under onerous contract terms for crappy sound quality and constant annoyance to others and coughing up loads of money for batteries and the hazardous retardation of driving skills and the priviledge of being on an electronic leash which also happens to be a microwave transceiver held tightly to the side of your head.

Let's see how many places we disagree, here:

1) I get better quality with my digital cell service than I ever did with an analog landline.

2) I don't have to worry about missing a call because I need to run to the store.

3) Cell phones (currently) aren't listed, so the phone companies can't blackmail you to pay them not to sell your number to telemarketers. I switched to wireless a year before the do-not-call list came out, and have never had a telemarketer call me.

4) I don't have to go searching for the ever-more-rare pay phones to fork over $0.30 a minute to call someone when I'm out of town, so long as I have service there (which I do in most cities.)

5) If I don't want the "electronic leash" on, there's this handy little device called a "power button" I can use to switch it off.

Oh, and I've had the same phone for 5 years, and never have had to buy a new battery.

/not trying to threadjack, really
 
2004-10-04 02:31:20 PM  
Seth_J


Early Monday morning and the flaming begins. I guess it can be expected from Democrats. Don't think, just make noise.

/for picklehead


Riiiiight... which candidate kept repeating themself over and over? "We gotta stay the course" "Keep doign what we are doing" "We can't change our mind, or else we'll lose"

Shows A LOT of deep thought.
 
2004-10-04 02:31:53 PM  
A vote for Kerry is a vote for McCain as President in '08*

talk to folks in the moderate wings of BOTH parties and you'll know thats the truth. I actually think...

A vote for Kerry is a vote to stop the H. Clinton/B. Obama ticket in '08

*with Guiliani as VP


The election of John Kerry will prevent Hillary from being President, while the re-election of Bush would almost guarantee it.

I have a feeling McCain sees the writing on the wall. Bush is going down, and the GOP is heading for the same asskicking the Democrats got in 1994. McCain must show his loyalty to the party while not strapping himself to the sinking ship that is the 2004 Republican Party. McCain, Chuck Hagel, Dick Lugar, Lindsey Graham and a few other Republicans who did not ingest too much of the Bush kool-aid are positioning themselves to take over the party after the fallout.

As for 2008, McCain would be 72, IIRC. He may not run himself, but will enthusiastically back one of his buddies, probably Hagel.

Lindsey Graham has a good shot at the VP slot on this ticket. He's a rising star in the GOP, a close ally of McCain, and the perfect opponent to John Edwards (same birthplace)

Of course, who am I kidding? They would NEVER win a Republican Primary. The fix is probably already in. It will be Jeb Bush/Elizabeth Dole. The GOP isn't that creative.
 
2004-10-04 02:32:06 PM  
It's hard work!

We're turning the corner!

Stay the course...

[image from gregragland.com too old to be available]
 
2004-10-04 02:32:33 PM  
canyoneer --
"Fine for business, as I said. Otherwise, I hate the awful things. Harley Davidson's and cell phones should be outlawed."


They're great all around. Really depends on your area and the coverage there as well as the plans available. Quality on mine is the same as a land line, no long distance charges, last two comparable bills I had:

Land line: $120
Cell: $51

Of course people can be pricks with them as with anything else and as with a land line, you can choose to answer or not.
 
2004-10-04 02:35:08 PM  
[image from enemies.com too old to be available]

THE RACE IS ON!
 
2004-10-04 02:35:23 PM  
You can really see how desperate the libbys have become in the past 2 weeks



it's too funny
 
2004-10-04 02:35:32 PM  
The question is: Is a "cellphone only" type person one who would most likely vote for Kerry or for Bush. I'm thinking they would be more apt to vote for progressive change since they are more of a mover and shaker quality.
 
2004-10-04 02:35:43 PM  
99% of you are wrong. Im voting libertarian, which makes me part of the missing 1%.

Come on... be honest... You aren't physically going to go to a polling location and vote libertarian, you just like telling people youre a libertarian.

I had buddies in 2000 that did the "everything sucks" routine and said they were voting Nader, then they got caught up playing a video game and never made it the polls.
 
2004-10-04 02:35:43 PM  
Excellent headline.

Also McCain being 72 in '08...isn't that Reagan's age when he was elected the first time?
 
2004-10-04 02:36:32 PM  
2004-10-04 01:58:44 PM drgruney


vegasj


bwahahahahahahaha

whew... wasn't sure if anyone had the patience to DL'd the mp3

;)

 
2004-10-04 02:37:57 PM  
Actually, it means 98% of all voters are morons.
 
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