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(ABC News) NewsFlash Russian Airline update: 135 dead; one plane has debris field covering 25 to 30 miles; witnesses say "three explosions" when first plane crashed   ( divider line
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14278 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Aug 2004 at 7:00 AM (12 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»

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255 Comments     (+0 »)

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2004-08-25 07:03:30 AM  
2004-08-25 07:05:08 AM  
Survey says:

1) Religion of Peace strikes again!
2004-08-25 07:05:22 AM  

2004-08-25 07:07:31 AM  
Odds of culprit:

Russian Mechanical Incompetence 500:1
Mid-Air Crash 50:1
Religion of Peace 5:4
2004-08-25 07:07:46 AM  
2004-08-25 07:05:08 AM CrazyBob

Survey says:

1) Religion of Peace strikes again!

What does Christianity have to do with it? Those guys are all molesting little boys.
2004-08-25 07:08:23 AM  
So the WTC attack is just 9/11, the Bali Bombing is the Austrailian 9/11 and this is the Russian 9/11 already?
I predict Britain next.
2004-08-25 07:09:15 AM  
When Russia's U.N. Ambassador Andrey Denisov was told of the initial report of two near-simultaneous crashes, he said, "Now we have to see if there's terrorism."

Not the typical kneejerk reaction eh?
2004-08-25 07:10:14 AM  
Radioberlin, you've forgotten to include the Madrid trainbombings as the Spanish 9/11..
2004-08-25 07:10:17 AM  
i'm always cautious about early reports because i remember the early eyewitness accounts of the Oklahoma City bombing said they saw a couple of Middle Easterners rushing away from the scene...but then again it does look awfully suspicious.
2004-08-25 07:10:21 AM  
Does this mean Russia will be sending troops to Iraq now?
2004-08-25 07:11:28 AM  
radioberlin: Unless this whole thing is some kind of insurance scam. Then we'd have to add the word 'gate' to something.
2004-08-25 07:12:57 AM  
radioberlin - a couple of things.

1. The Bali bombing would be the Bali 9/11.

2. There were terrorist attacks and plane hijackings before 9/11. I know it's hard to comprehend since it happened in other countries, but it is true. Please feel free NOT to appropriate global terrorism and attempt to make it about yourselves.

3. I don't suppose there's any danger that you'll wait for the rest of the facts before jumping to conclusions? No, guess not.
2004-08-25 07:13:28 AM  
I don't think that fits. Yes, it was a devistating attack but it caused the Spaniards to pull out of the War rather than becoming comitted to it.
2004-08-25 07:13:36 AM  
Probberbly the Chechens
2004-08-25 07:16:25 AM  
What a catastophe. My heart goes out to those affected.
2004-08-25 07:16:55 AM  
Firstly, I'm just quoting the term used in the media and here on Fark to make a point. I'm not jumping to any conclusions.

Secondly, the Bali Bombing didn't pull Bali into the War, it brought the Austrailians in because they lost so many tourists.

Thirdly, I'm aware of the fact that terrorism existed before the WTC attacks but that attack changed the world and it changed language.
2004-08-25 07:16:55 AM  
We should be allied with Russia on the War on Terror. Our leaders should be meeting weekly discussing global strategy
2004-08-25 07:17:28 AM  
GIS for 'Religion of Peace'

[image from too old to be available]
2004-08-25 07:17:50 AM  
No terror link according to officials. LINK

Nothing to see here, move along...
2004-08-25 07:17:58 AM  
no the Bali bombing was the Australian 9/11 because of the number of Australian that died AND it was specifically targetted to hit Australians. But yes many Balinese died too. So maybe it should be the Baustrali 9/11.
2004-08-25 07:18:01 AM  
I concour
[image from too old to be available]
Give it some anti reflux
2004-08-25 07:18:25 AM  
I would say that Bush is to blame.
But I doubt that he knows where Russia is.

Here's a little help: [image from too old to be available]

To be honest: it displays quite accurately the Americans according to the rest of the world.
2004-08-25 07:18:32 AM  
Holy crow.

For some reason, I think Russia does not have an equivalent of the NTSB or an efficient FAA-type organization. Who the hell knows how they're going to investigate this.
2004-08-25 07:18:47 AM  
More than likely Chechnya. Election coming up and all.

Whatever it is it's damn sad!
2004-08-25 07:23:25 AM  
It's things like this that make movies like Swordfish more and more plausible to people who don't mind the Patriot Act...
2004-08-25 07:23:52 AM  
Terrorism suspected, according to

Russian security heads believe al Qaeda behind crash of two Russian Siberian Airways planes after takeoff from Moscow Tuesday night. Both pilots sent hijack signals before their planes disappeared off radar screens killing all 89 people aboard.

Russian airports and airspace on emergency alert. Two black boxes found at crash sites south of Moscow - near Bushelaki 180 km S. of Moscow in Tula region and near Rostov-on-Don. They were bound for Volgograd and Black Sea resort of Sochi, where Putin on holiday. The second plane exploded and broke up in mid-air. Terror attack connected with Sundays presidential elections in Chechnya.
2004-08-25 07:24:17 AM  
One of the planes that exploded actually sent out a hijacker alert before it disappeared from the radar.

This was terrorism, duh. Specifically it was Chechen Islamist terrorism.
2004-08-25 07:25:23 AM  

1. Fair enough. I was talking to the media too, but I can't confirm whether they read Fark. They probably do.

2. I don't understand what the war has to do with the Bali bombings. Why do the two have to be connected at all? The reason you give for the non-inclusion of the Madrid bombings makes little sense to me either - like I say, it doesn't all have to connect to the US. If there's a connection, it's muslim extremists, but that doesn't mean they're all Al Qaeda. The Chechyens certainly aren't.

3. In America, yes it probably did. In the rest of the world, where it's happened before, it didn't.
2004-08-25 07:25:41 AM  
Reuters is saying that a hijack alert was triggered in one of the planes.

/horror continues
2004-08-25 07:27:16 AM  
Ouch, we never trained Chechen people how to hijack planes. Nor did we train Al-Qaeda guys either. Al-Qaeda didn't even exist as a terrorist organization until the 1990s. And Osama Bin Laden was never trianed by the CIA either.

You got to get your facts straight, buddy.
2004-08-25 07:28:54 AM  
I was Chechen rebels trying to do a copycat attack of 911 but failing to hit anything but he ground.
In other news....earthworms to pull out of Iraq.
2004-08-25 07:30:11 AM  
Two Russian Planes Crash, One Sent Hijack Alert;jsessionid=311DM0RHOWC3UCRBAE​0CFFA?ty pe=topNews&storyID=6064787
2004-08-25 07:30:12 AM  
dukefluke, the Chechens are in bed with Al-Qaeda. The 20th hijacker, Moussaoui, actually fought in Chechnya against the Russians as a mujahadeen before becoming an Al-Qaeda operative. There were lots of foreign Arab fighters in Chechnya (less so now) and Al-Qaeda maintains ties to organizations in the area and also has support and sympathy of most of the population of Chechnya.
2004-08-25 07:30:54 AM  
Chechens seem to move faster than Saudis.
2004-08-25 07:31:02 AM  
"Officials made conflicting statements about whether the signal from the Tu-154 indicated a hijacking or another severe problem on the aircraft, and there was bad weather overnight in both areas."

So, no, not confirmed terrorism yet.
2004-08-25 07:31:08 AM  
Okay, but to compare something to 9/11 it has to meet certain criteria:
It must be a large scale devistating attack
It must attract global attention
and it must bring the effected country to support (or further support) the War.

Bali brought the Aussies while Madrid took Spain out, although both are believed to be Al Qaeda attacks.
2004-08-25 07:33:10 AM  
radioberlin - "and it must bring the effected country to support (or further support) the War."

Why? There was no war before the original 9/11 - I don't see what this has to do with anything.
2004-08-25 07:33:16 AM  
the War.

As opposed to the war?
2004-08-25 07:35:22 AM  
radioberlin - Please explain to everyone in the thread what 9/11 had to do with the war in Iraq?

Thanking you in advance.
2004-08-25 07:36:00 AM  
I think this shows the REAL impact of 9/11: Nobody is just going to hand over a plane to hijackers anymore. Before, the assumption was that hijackers wanted to keep the passengers alive for ransom purposes and so the name of the game was "just keep calm and go along". Now, the assumption is that if you give up the plane you're just going to die anyways, so you might as well fight for it.
2004-08-25 07:36:36 AM  
[image from too old to be available]
2004-08-25 07:37:02 AM  
9/11 created the War so it's clearly related to matters of terrorism.

(I use a capital because it's a name (War on Terrorism) rather than just an event)
2004-08-25 07:37:59 AM  
bbcrackmonkey, the Chechyens have their own agenda, namely, getting the Russians out of Chechnya. Sure, they're sympathetic to terrorists of the same religion, but don't blindly assume they're the same, because they're not. Moussaoui is an individual, and although he was connected to both, that doesn't mean that both organisations are automatically connected. It's like saying that football team A is the same as football team B because the quarterback has played for both sides.
2004-08-25 07:38:59 AM  
Bush must have blown up the planes, to get Russia to participate more eagerly in the War on Terror!
2004-08-25 07:39:54 AM  

radioberlin - Please explain to everyone in the thread what 9/11 had to do with the war in Iraq?

Short answer: Nothing.

the war in Iraq and the War on Terrorism are two different things.
2004-08-25 07:41:12 AM  

Ouch, we never trained Chechen people how to hijack planes. Nor did we train Al-Qaeda guys either. Al-Qaeda didn't even exist as a terrorist organization until the 1990s. And Osama Bin Laden was never trianed by the CIA either.

You got to get your facts straight, buddy.

Yeah buddy, check these facts. The CIA didn't train Al Qaeda, it only funded and armed Osama's front organisation in the eighties, leading to Al Qaeda's creation in 1988.
2004-08-25 07:42:13 AM  
Q. Steltanus

No terror link according to officials. LINK

Nothing to see here, move along..

"An FSB spokesman said searches had revealed no signs of terrorism but sabotage had not been ruled out."
2004-08-25 07:42:57 AM  
Radioberlin - so why do matters of terrorism have to be related to the war? Sorry... The War?
2004-08-25 07:43:30 AM  
the war in Iraq and the War on Terrorism are two different things.

So, let me get this straight, theres 'the war' and 'The War'
Who's fighting The War then, as you are currently fighting the war, for reasons best known to Bush, and his whispering hidden voice of god.
2004-08-25 07:44:40 AM  
Is there a connection between Chechen terrorist groups and al-Qaeda?
Evidence of a direct Chechen connection to Osama bin Ladens al-Qaeda terrorist network remains limited; it focuses largely on the reported ties between bin Laden and the Chechen warlord Khattab, a Jordanian-born fighter who apparently first met bin Laden while both men were fighting the 1979-89 Soviet occupation of Afghanistan. The U.S. ambassador to Russia, Alexander Vershbow, said shortly after September 11, We have long recognized that Osama bin Laden and other international networks have been fueling the flames in Chechnya, including the involvement of foreign commanders like Khattab. In April 2002, Russian officials said Khattab had been killed in Chechnya.

Beyond the Khattab connection, the Wall Street Journal has reported that Zacarias Moussaoui, whom U.S. authorities have charged with being the 20th hijacker in the September 11 attacks, was formerly a recruiter for al-Qaeda-backed rebels in Chechnya. Several bin Laden associates also reportedly provided financing and training for Chechen fighters during the 1994-96 war. Moreover, the Taliban regime in Afghanistan was one of the only governments to recognize Chechen independence, and some Chechen militants reportedly fought alongside al-Qaeda and Taliban forces against the U.S.-backed Northern Alliance in late 2001.

For dukefluke and everyone else. Google is everyone's friend.
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