/literally

Nanookanano

Not listening is a pretty easy way of making sure your precious worldview isn't shattered.

No sacred cows here.

Shatter away.

Riiight.

I guess one could term land where a handful of rather primitive people inhabiting rude shacks and living by dirt-scratch farming as "unoccupied" and "undeveloped" land. Especially when when one has a modern civilization that will place large, clean, air-conditioned buildings and a large, industrial farm on that land.

My question is, do the Palistinians remain in such a primitive state because they are some kind of lesser life form, or are they being deliberately kept in that condition by Israel?

No, seriously, tell me.
I'll listen.

upsdrvr

I always wondered what the value was in a hunger strike.

Let's see..prisoners quit eating= less expense for food, less waste, less time preparing and cleaning up after preparing the food. WOW those Palestinians are really putting a hurt to the Israeli's with this one!

It forces people with attitudes like the one that you just put forth into a moral dilemma. Or else to simply retain that attitude without putting any thought into it, thus forever proving that they're amoral asses.

I think it's a sex problem. Let's face it. Some of those Israeli chicks are hot and willing to put out and they're not afraid to show it off. But will they give it up for a Palestinian dude? I doubt it! So the spurned Palestinian then has to say that the Israeli chicks are immoral for letting it all hang out.

Meanwhile, I for one, can't really blame the Israeli chicks because those Palestinian guys are amongst the most fugly ugly lookin' peeps around.

As for the Palestinian chicks, who can tell? From what I can see, , but they're not allowed to advertise if they're worth tappin'.

Obviously it's time for some of those Palestininan sympathising Europeans who have hot chicks and buff dudes to send some of their quality down to Palestine in order to create some better lookin' Palestinians who are a lot more liberal with the nay nay and willing to intermarry with the Israelis.

Meanwhile, let's get the Israeli girls to take one for the team and wander over to the Palestinian communities to give out a few charity BJs. I ask you, who blows up a chick who gives you a low cost per BJ? Exactly!

/Reverse Lysistrata strategy wins every time

Oh, man, this is straight out of Children of the Revolution! I think they called it the "Pork Sword" in the movie.

Their infrastructure was just fine untill the PLO took over and started diverting the funds from taking care of it's own people to bombing us...

Anyway, i'm off to go bash my head against a brick wall for a bit before bed. The result's gonna be about the same, but it's a bit less painful.

Yahweh

For those that don't, the IRA/INLA hunger strikers that died became Republican 'saints', it heralded an upsurge in IRA activity and membership, the leader of the hunger-strike (Bobby Sands) got elected to the British parliament a month before he starved to death (a major symbolic and moral boosting victory for the Republican movement), and the British ended up giving in to all their demands.

They really should do it the Irish way. Staggered hunger strikes. One person per week starts. One person per week dies. Much more effective than a mass strike that, if waited out, is simply one major PR hurdle to get past.

This thread is seriously lacking in Drooling Homer!

/http://www.jbeldin.com/personal/homer_drool.jpg
//Wish I could do HTML to include the necessary picture

Psychohazard

For those saying it's okay for Israel to do this because Palestinians use suicides bombers, don't you think it would be better to actually reward Palestinians who use non-violent protest? Let the Palestinians know that they have an honorable option to promote change and they might just use it over other options.

Cynically, from an Israeli government point of view, that would be the worst thing to do. Make a Palestinian Gandhi and Israel doesn't have a chance to hold on to its more outrageous claims.

Dano33

Why don't Arabs or Jews eat pork?
Serious, I'm stupid so could someone fill me in on why they
don't eat pork?

Because the Koran and the Torah (respectively) say not to.

My question is, do the Palistinians remain in such a primitive state because they are some kind of lesser life form, or are they being deliberately kept in that condition by Israel?

...or is it because their "leaders" are more interested in fomenting Jew-hating and keeping their people occupied with a war they cannot ever win using their current strategies, all the while taking monies that SHOULD be spent on infrastructure and lining their pockets?

Could THAT be the reason? Naahhh. I'm sure the hundreds of millions in Arafat's bank accounts are interest from money he socked away in the days when he used to have a newspaper route.

Gobbledigook

/http://www.jbeldin.com/personal/homer_drool.jpg
//Wish I could do HTML to include the necessary picture

Try:

<img src="http://www.jbeldin.com/personal/homer_drool.jpg" />

And it should wind up looking like:

toraque - I've often wondered why they don't, myself. The answers seem to boil down to:

A)The Palestinian people have suffered injustices too dispicable and grave for peaceful protest to be an option. I guess the Indians didn't have it so bad under British rule.
B)Israel would destroy the Palestinian race by Wednesday if the Palestinians abandoned terrorism for peaceful protest.

Besides, terrorism is working out so well for them.

I dunno. I just think that it's a crying shame.

Two and a half billion Euros is more like it.

(That's something like three billion US.)

nanookanano

that's what's in Arafat's accounts?!?!?

Must cause a huge dichotomy in Gaza: exactly how can we blame charman Arafat's blatant graft and corruption on the Jews?

Littlepig:
"Ah yes, our wonderful Israeli allies. Why would anyone have a problem with us pouring money on such fine folks?"

What a creepy post. Go buy yourself some perspective on the issue.

As I remember it, that's the estimate.
His wife is/was under investigation in France.

I'm not blaming things on the Jews, I'm noticing trends in events, and asking questions.

It matters nothing whether you prove me wrong or right, if I persist, in the end I will know the truth of the matter, anyway.

I'm not blaming things on the Jews

i didn't say you were...unless you're in Gaza, in which case, based upon your posts, I think you are a very atypical Gaza resident and what i posted above applies to most of your neighbours and not you.

Certainly it's a sh*tload of money.
I don't know if graft and corruption is the source.
Most, if not all, Muslim leaders tend to have boatloads of money. It's like it is expected of them. But, that's typical in absolutist societies. The population lives vicariously in the glory of the one. I'd lay odds that the hungriest, dirtiest, scruffiest Palistinian one could find on the street would respond with vast pride at hearing of Arafat's billions.

What? No naked pyramid pictures?

/LOL Abu Ghraib

Indeed, what could be more amusing than tormenting the wrongfully imprisoned?

The Israeli/Palestine mess was created when the Brits decided to stick their noses into this particlar corner the middle east, with the help of some ancient writings.

The US right now is main "Meddler" right now.(Saudi, Iraq, etc) The Former USSR was heavily into it too (Cuba, Angola, Afghanistan). Of course, before that is was Germany. Spain, Holland, France, Belgium and countless others played this game at one time. Most of those miserable states in Africa are former colinies of European nations.

Too bad the world's powerful nations that always feel justified in doing this an invariably wind up making a MUCH bigger mess in the long run.

Yes, I know there are some success stories out there but by in large, once the big boys gt involved, they leave basket cases in their wake.

"Certainly it's a sh*tload of money.
I don't know if graft and corruption is the source.
Most, if not all, Muslim leaders tend to have boatloads of money. It's like it is expected of them. But, that's typical in absolutist societies. The population lives vicariously in the glory of the one. I'd lay odds that the hungriest, dirtiest, scruffiest Palistinian one could find on the street would respond with vast pride at hearing of Arafat's billions."

They also have a fool-proof strategy to CONTINUE to steal millions. That is to tell their poor, uneducated and filthy rabble of a peoples that the JEWS and the USA are to blame for their misery. Works every time. The Saudis have been doing it for years, and then turning around when someone calls them on their bullshiat and saying, "Wha...ME?" Oh, I'll pay for ads on American television and radio saying we are good guys...

Can't agree with you on the Catholic terrorist thing, Gogo.
My people have been Prots since there was such a thing, but I and my folks have our sympathies with the Irish.

Treat me like an Irish soldier
And a prisoner of war
For the days of Irish freedom
Is the thing I hunger for

Oh, my folks have practiced starving
Since the British came in view
Treat me like an Irish soldier
For I do what I must do

I do condemn terrorist methodology, whoever uses it.

(US included)

All of you can flame about this as long as you want. The fact is, you have to respect the resourcefulness of the Isrealis. The Palistininians are asking for things that the Isreali government views as a threat. Try living in a country where a major terrorist attack is as common as a delayed flight or rainshower. Then you can preach about human rights. All of you flamers have your panties in a wad over nothing. If you don't live in Isreal, it's not for you to judge their criminal laws. I'd rather be arrested there than about 95% of the rest of the world. And besides, they are really keeping their sense of humour about it. I must say, this makes me proud to be a Jew!

"I'd rather be arrested there than about 95% of the rest of the world."

Well Inanna, you're not a ni- . . uh, I mean "Palistinian".

Nanookanano

You whine about your money going to Israel... so funny. Do you realize the U.S. gives almost as much to Egypt? and they HATE you.

keep running with the herd of the easily led.

I'm not happy with US money going to Egypt, either.

"Whine"? Say that to my face, big guy.

And, go ahead and keep calling people "sheep" when they don't think like you do.
It helps the cooperative folks locate the lone predators.

It's not so bad being a sheep . . when you're a bighorn ram.

Come, starving cur, let us butt heads.

Ok, am I the only one who read the article and said "I can see them asking for improved sanitary conditions, but strip searches and isolation are just part of the summer ca... prison experience"?

Yahweh

Hahaha, not worth it, gremmer is kind of crappy.

Oh the hmanity! BBQ'ing in front of the prisoners on hunger strike!

Some people really need to get their heads out of their asses. First, they're in prison for a reason. Second, we do worse daily to our own prison population and I don't see any biatching on this side of the fence. In fact, I see daily referrences to the all too humurous "pound me in the ass prison."

If you have such a bad problem with something so benign as this and find yourself biatching about everything Israelis do, yes, you might just be an anti-semite.

Christ, you people griping about this care more about Palestinian criminals than you do American criminals. How much more pathetic can you possibly be? Yes, it's pathetic. Look in the mirror if you don't believe it.

It could be a hell of a lot of worse, they could be in an Islamic prison. Those are just so much more humane. How many human rights abuses did Turkey's prisons get with again this year, how about Saudi, or Iran? And here y'all are biatching about a farking BBQ in Israel.

Anyway, pass the BBQ sauce and hold the hypocrites. Better yet, throw them on the barbie too, we can feed the dogs while we're at it.

I've read every post in this thread, Omega, and I don't recall more than two or three posts decrying this tantalization technique.

The arguements against the Israeli treatment of Palistinians given above are all based on more serious charges than teasing hungry people.

Check out Norman Finklestein's website.

http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/

He is a Jew and makes a very convincing case against Isreal. He debated Alan Dershowitz on Democracy Now and made him look like a fool.

Normally I find torture deplorable (especially in the hands of the already ruthless Israelis), but this is goddamn hilarious. Take THAT, moral compass!

I'd have to say someone is an 'anti-semite' if they fundamentally disagree with the notion of Israel as a Jewish state.

Israel has the right to defend its borders, protect its people, and clamp down on insurgents at every turn.

They're harsh SOMETIMES, but they can hold their own, too. And they're really getting sick of the hundreds of millions of Arabs blaming them for everything, and attacking them daily.

They have a right to be over the top occasionally, and knock down their enemies. The Jews have a land and an ideal to protect.

The Palestinians are finally doing the right thing and resorting to non-violence and look what the Israelis do to them. It's awful.

BTW.. the term palestinian comes from Palestine.. the country which was removed from the map by the british to make israel 50 years ago. So technically speaking, there are no israelis over 50. Just Americans, Russians, Poles, and other Jews. Keep that in mind.

Palestinians are being kicked out of their hoomeland and then imprisoned for trying to get it back.

Interesting thread on something that will be proved useless by simple demographics.

Like most Westernized countries' populations, Israeli Jews reproduce at about replacement rate, 2 children per couple.

Arab Palestinians reproduce at about 6 children per couple. Even with two killed by throwing stones at tanks, and the resultant gunfire, Arabs still win in population numbers.

Israel is trying to import Russian and even African Jews, but their melting pot is apparently too hot.

Palestine was recognized as a country by the IOC. WTF? Where's the Vatican team?

What we have here, folks, is a genyoowine clusterfcuk.

/Have fun storming the castle

F**king Israelis.
F**king Palestinians.

Only primarily-racial conflict I know of where BOTH sides are almost completely in the wrong.

The only solution I can think of for that conflict at this point involves the word "Megaton," or possibly even "Gigaton."

noodlegts, I must enlighten you on the history of the area.

Lesse here, there has never been a country known as Palestine. Palestine, an area inhabited by Bedouin tribes, Jews, Arabs, and Druzh, was first contolled by the Jews in the ancient times, then the Romans, then the Fatamid Caliphate, then the Ottoman Turks, finally becoming a protectorate of the British Empire. Then when Israel was formed, Jordan and Egypt happily stole the West Bank and Gaza Strip and ruled those areas for the next 2 decades. Then the six day war came along and Israel controlled the area.

The area was actually given the known as Judea by the Romans, but was renamed to Palastina by the Emperor Hadrian decades after the birth of Jesus, as Hadrian was tiring of Jewish revolts and decided to rename the area in order to squash Jewish identity with it. Arabs would never name a place Palestine, as they have no "P" sound in their alphabet, and most native Palestinians cannot pronounce the name of their country, calling it "Balestin".

You're welcome for the history lesson.