Clambam:
Non-Jewish citizens of Israel have exactly the same rights as Jews. There is no wholesale descrimination against Arab Israelis.

while I agree with a lot of your points...I'm a bit skeptical of this one. Yes, on paper, you are correct. But ask any minority anywhere how much that paper can be worth in everday life.

blanket statement can be a sticky situation.

Willy you are undoubtedly right. As a minority, the Arabs undoubtedly encounter discrimination along the lines of blacks in this country. The intent is there however, and the law, for what it's worth, guarantees their rights.

People need to understand that the Chernobyl disaster was caused by a specific type of nuclear reactor. Graphite core reactors moderate the nuclear reaction by surrounding the hot and reactive fuel with graphite. This is a really bad idea because if the graphite ever gets hot enough it burns explosively. This is what happened at Chernobyl. Other graphite core reactors like those still running at Chernobyl and others in the area are inherently unsafe and have this same failure mode. Other nuclear reactors are usually liquid cooled which is why they leak. Using liquid metal is a radical approach with some downsides, but even reactors like that have meltdowns and not explosions as the worst failure mode. That can still be really bad, but building and operating a nuclear plant that is essentially a huge bomb is not so good. That is what graphic core reactors are. If this plant is leaking radiation that is probably because it is the kind of plant that cannot explode like Chernobyl because it is probably not using a graphite core.

Bill Wick's friend/Willywanka,

I will consult my travel diaries from that time when I get home from work. I will also ask my Friend Solomon Adebe, ethopian jew to tell you the hardships he suffered before he emigrated to Canada and now works in Austrailia. BillWick's friend, I can't wait to show you up. i can't debate both you(ethiopian jews fleeing Israel) and Clamblam(the religious debate). You will be buying me many beers at the Next Toronto Fark party when i pull this out of my ass.
1/5 is better than being the long streak of misery you are each day. Check back here around 9:30 est, B.Wick's friend because your new name will be Hefty Neil's biatch!!

Wonderful. I will check back here at 6:30 PST.

But:

I will also ask my Friend Solomon Adebe, ethopian jew to tell you the hardships he suffered before he emigrated to Canada and now works in Austrailia.

One anecdotal evidence (and not even one which fits your "moving back to Ethiopia" criterion) does not a citation make. Just so you remember what you're "proving", it is your claim that:

Oh the Falasha's that are treated so well by the Israeli's most of them have returned to Ethiopia. .

I'd be willing to eat crow if you can show any exodous of Ethiopians back to Africa. Doesn't have to be "most of them", as I'll allow that statment may have been exaggeration or hyberbole.

See you at 6:30.

Personally, I'd rather live in Canada or Australia than Israel any day....but given the more limited option of Addis Abbaba or Tel Aviv, I'd take Israel.

clambam - As for the Palestinians, in 1999 Israel offered them 95% of the West Bank for a homeland and they turned it down.

What was actually offered at (?)Wye River prior to the total breakdown of negotiations and the eventual beginning of the current intifada? I keep hearing this figure of the Palestinians being offered some near total quantity of their demands but it keeps varying and applying to different things. Some say that it pertains to all off their demands whilst you, for example, simply relate it to the issue of land.

I want to know the substance of what was demanded, what was offered and what was rejected particularly with regards to issues which were supposed to be resolved as part of the permanent status negotiations provided for under the Oslo Accords. I want to see the detail and not merely some unqualified handwaving.

I do note that Clinton has been proclaiming that the Palestinians were offered almost everything that they wanted in the negotiations with Barak's government. However, this has been part of his recent self-aggrandisment when advertising his book so i'm coloured sceptical on the subject...

The Palestinians rejected the Oslo Accords and began their campaign of suicide bombings.

There's a charming little re-write of history. Oslo 2 expired in the middle of '99 with no substantive ground having been reached on the permanent status issues outlined in the annexes to the Oslo Accords. Those weren't mere details, they went to the heart of the structure, identity and capability of any Palestinian state to act effectively and for future issues between Israel and Palestine to be resolved.

This had been exacerbated further by the Netanyahu government (elected on a platform sceptical of Oslo and defeating Peres who had replaced Rabin following the assassination of the latter) which had routinely broken both the letter and the spirit of the Oslo Accords and only complied with some parts - such as further withdrawal of troops from Hebron - under heavy and frequent pressure from the US. Engaging in actions such as the supporting of the establishment of more settlements in the West Bank was a calculated attempt to destroy the peace process.

Arafat was persuaded to re-open negotiations based upon the Oslo Accords rather than simply declaring the unilateral independence of the Palestinian state. Ultimately, of course, those negotiations to achieve a lasting settlement with Barak's government failed but the current intifada did not begin immediately thereafter (the trigger event was Sharon's pre-election actions).

The Israeli orthodox/hard-right has to accept some of the blame for the current mess that is the Israeli-Palestinian situation.

clambam - of course Rabin made an unnecessarily generous offer to the Palestinians in '99 and look where it got him...

Rabin made an offer in '99? And how exactly did he do that? Was he contacted by a clairvoyant?

The New Yorker magazine (July 9, 2001) published a "Letter From Gaza," where Barghouti was asked: What would Israel have to do to bring an end to the uprising? He replied:

"'We need one hundred per cent of Gaza, one hundred per cent of the West Bank, one hundred per cent of East Jerusalem, and the right of return for refugees,' he said. [It was] pointed out that former Prime Minister Ehud Barak had, at the Camp David summit last year, offered the Palestinians a series of dramatic concessions: a free Gaza, around ninety per cent of the West Bank, a capital in East Jerusalem, and so on. 'No!' Nothing less than a hundred per cent is acceptable, he said. And if you get a hundred per cent? Will that end the conflict? Barghouti smiled, and then said something impolitic for a Fatah man. 'Then we could talk about bigger things,' he said. Such as? 'I've always thought that a good idea would be one state for all the peoples,' he said."

The middle east is so farked up. Why are these people so crazy?

Year 1960: Ben Gurion announced that Israel was building a 24 MW nuclear reactor "for peaceful purposes".

/yeah right!

Good its about time someone gave the arabs a taste of what the U.S. can release on their sorry backward countries at the push of a button. ("I dont like arabs").

Smithers... did my powerplant kill those ducks?

Rev's post got me googling on the subject of the 1999 Israeli offer. I noticed once again something that's always disturbed me. There were pieces written by Israelis, other Jews, Christians and other Westerners, and Muslims that came down strongly against the Israeli position. There were pages written by Israelis, other Jews, Christians and other Westerners that came down strongly in favor of the Israeli position. What I have yet to see is an editorial, post or article written by a Muslim that comes down in favor of the Israeli position. Is Muslim opinion really that monolithic? Is there not one single Muslim in the entire world willing or able to admit, or even consider the possibility that the Israelis might be in the right and the Arabs in the wrong? To be honest with you, I don't think so. You may scoff at the implications (especially if you're not Jewish) but it really raises an issue for the West because that same implacable, unshakable hatred is now being pointed at the rest of us. The issue for the West is now the same as the one the Israelis have faced for 50 years. How do you deal with an enemy who, in the final analysis, is homicidally insane? Short of capitulation, what can you do?

Bill Wick's friend,

The website given to me from Solomon is as follows:

http://student.cs.ucc.ie

I will modify my statement from the return to Ethopia to leaving Israel after the mistreatment by their "brothers".

Get changing your nickname to Hefty Neil's biatch. Anecdotal evidence froma first hand participant will do more for me than the semantics of a dude from Regina with a view(Vancouver) or Canada's human garbage can(BC).

Read it and weep.

Hefty Neil
Bill Wick's friend,

The website given to me from Solomon is as follows:

http://student.cs.ucc.ie

I will modify my statement from the return to Ethopia to leaving Israel after the mistreatment by their "brothers".

Get changing your nickname to Hefty Neil's biatch. Anecdotal evidence froma first hand participant will do more for me than the semantics of a dude from Regina with a view(Vancouver) or Canada's human garbage can(BC).

Read it and weep.

Okay let's see what the link says.

Welcome to the University College Cork, Computer Science Department, student pages.
On this site we have student home pages and some course related information.

Followed by a bunch of dead links to such relevent topics as :

First Years
Second Years
Third Years
Fourth Years
Graduates

Wow, Hefty Neil, or should I call you No Link Having biatch, you sure showed everyone.

Now, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that link was supposed to be to an Ethiopian Jew's website about the poor treatment of his people in Israel. But, even then, some guy's editorial is not this same mythical link you claim exists showing Ethiopian Jews moving back to Africa because Israel sucks so much (which on the surface is a laughable premise, since even if they did face massive discrimination, Ethiopia, where mass starvation, and endless war with their neighbor Eritria kills millions, is still 10,000 times worse). Now, maybe they would move to Canada like your friend, or to Europe. That I might believe.

Of course, in reality, it is a tough life for an Ethiopian immigrant in Israel. Due to lack of education (and I'm sure some discrimination) they are having trouble finding good jobs and moving up in society. Because of that, there is unrest in the Falasha community. Hell, there was a protest in Tel Aviv by some Falasha when I was last there in January. So, life definitely isn't perfect. But it is still a damn site better than living in Ethiopia.

But serious, if after 3 hours all you can show to back your claim is a dead link to a theoretical student website at some college, you seriously need to STFU.

I was gonna rebut but:

1) beowolf smith pretty much covered what i was about to say

2) there's nothing in your link to rebut

3) you changed the goalposts (no longer talking about returning to Ethiopia, NOW talking about leaving Israel) so I'm not playing this game anymore.

You'll notice I've not insulted you personally, nor your city, nor anything but your blatantly bogus assertion. It is a shame that you cannot extend the same courtesy to me or to others with whom you disagree.

Not only did he change the goalposts, but he then kicked it wide right!

LACES OUT!!!!!11one1!!1

Hefty Neil = pwnd

Oh, jeopardy question:

A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism.

arguing...internet.....special olympics.....

i may be retarded, but i'd rather be a retarded winner than a retarded loser.

Vanunu huh? Interesting. Isn't he already in jail in Israel for blowing the whistle on their nuke program or something?

sounds like we just found some land that Israel might just give up to Palestine!! Peace at last, peace at last!!

Considering Dimona's main reactor(s) are in the underground complex at the site, it's hard to imagine how radioactive particulate matter can drift that far on the wind to endanger other countries. Are we talking noble gas emissions or what? Any radiation safety & shielding course would let you know what enormous amounts would be required to be emitted to cause harm after atmospheric dispersion takes effect.

student.cs.ucc.ie/cs1064/jabowen/ IPSC/php/topics.php?option=listAllTopics

There's the right link. I have a life outside FARK so excuse me for not doing all your work for you. Douchebags!!

Beowulf aren't you sore from Bill Wick's friend(Hefty Neil's biatch) suckling your teats and Bootlog way to get in the game late. We will meet again in another thread.

Bite my shiny metal ass.

Hefty

Well Neil, let me be the first to say it, yet another broken link. Gotta say, everyone on this page has been extremely polite to you despite your abusive language. How old are you, Neil? 15? Your posts would seem to indicate otherwise but you've got the attitude of a pouty, potty-mouthed adolescent. Grow up a little there, son.

this dead link is much more imformative than your last crop of dead links.

i'm not sure what you're trying to prove. seriously....you have already conceded that ethiopian jews have not and are not returning to ethiopia from israel. since that was your initial claim that you were called on, i don't know why you feel some need to prove that ethiopian jews are leaving israel to go to other places, since everyone has agreed that this is likely the case.

please, though, keep posting dead links for the amusement of all. hint: they're not laughing with you.

mmmmmm yesss... there is a space in that fellow's latest address. if you go to
http://student.cs.ucc.ie/cs1064/jabowen/IPSC/php/topics.php?option=listAllTopi cs

you get a pro-palestinian website. searching for 'falas' brings http://student.cs.ucc.ie/cs1064/jabowen/IPSC/php/db.php?tid=202

among all the articles in this section i can not find one that would remotely support hefty neil's allegations, original, or the ever-so-conveniently modified.

what gives, dear neil?

At least one genius was able to get to the site which is not pro-palestinian if you can read English correctly. I had no trouble reviewing it moments ago. Clam Bam, if you think that is potty mouthed you are a corksacking prude who needs yto get out from mommy's basement more often and bill Wick's friend, you are a semantic douche. Who chews your food for you??? As far as laughing at me, Guess which fingers I've got up. Like I give a fark. The Jews will get us all killed which was my original post. Israel only cares about the $$$$ and some pie in the sky draft pick they supposedly received for some Skygod. So keep up the Jew apologizing and don't come crying to Hefty when the (for the sensitive Clambam)excrement hits the oscillator because of the Israeli Governments wanton disregard for Humanity. Big Merl is right. No wonder those Hebrews make such great litigators(for Clambam)contact my email address so when you visit the centre of the universe you can collect your prize . A Hemorrhaging proboscis. In the immortal words of John Cochrane, "why settle with words what you can settle with a flamethrower."