F-you subby. This has nothing to do with cost and everything to do with the harms associated with population based screening.

Well, fellas, pretty soon you'll have to start f*cking each other up the ass because all us wimmins'll be dead.

bimalc: This has nothing to do with cost and everything to do with the harms associated with population based screening.

No, it had everything to do with cost.

"Risk and benefit is what drove" the new cervical-cancer recommendations, "but we considered costs," said Alan Waxman, head of the ACOG committee that developed the guidelines.

Link (new window)

SO FREAKING WHAT. You can still get all the check ups you want, they are only recommending that you do not need a mammogram/pap every year.

You can still do it, of your own accord, if you so feel like it. Jesus H.

I'm a guy, but DAMN. Pap smears sound just all kinds of wrong and painful, and look like they can have some serious side effects in the case of false positives.

LaurenAguilera: SO FREAKING WHAT. You can still get all the check ups you want, they are only recommending that you do not need a mammogram/pap every year.

Until insurance companies decide not to cover them for certain "low-risk" groups of people anymore.

Oh, and didn't we have an article about not needing prostate exams as often last month or two ago, or was that the lower GI procedure to check for colon cancer?

/doesn't know how you girls walk around with those things...

i've already begun offering to do pap smears and breast exams for a fraction of the price those quack doctors charge, but so far none of the high school girls in my area seem interested :(

I find it interesting that the Senate is planning a Saturday night vote on the health care bill.. Didn't the House do the same?

So... are they preparing for socialized medicine early, or something?

Well we need to start reducing medical costs, doctors will order all sorts of expensive tests at the drop of the hat and these costs are transferred to everyone.

We have to face it, we cannot keep the same level of care for everyone and reduce costs. So let's get some of these chronic hypochondriacs on a "test diet" you don't need to test for these things every year. If a few end up with bad fortune, well, that's a risk as a man I'm willing to take.

This is just another step in preparing the country for the rationed care that socialized medicine requires.

/Cancer? You don't need treatment for that for another 5 years.
//Good luck!

TOMORROW: Quit living so long, and sucking up so much Socialist Insecurity money; be a patriot, and die sooner.

Mark my words, it's coming.

Expensive? How about not statistically significant in reducing death.

why can't they just ration them? or do vagina and boobs check ups at the same time?

//bwhahahaahahah

Obamacare...prepare to be fisted!

bimalc: F-you subby. This has nothing to do with cost and everything to do with the harms associated with population based screening.

So it is entirely a coincidence that all of these new recommendations are coming out during the debate over publicly funded health insurance?

I'm not saying that the advice is incorrect - it just seems like very odd timing, no?

I'm starting to think that it all depends on who's pocket these people are in.

meat0918: Oh, and didn't we have an article about not needing prostate exams as often last month or two ago, or was that the lower GI procedure to check for colon cancer?

Yeah, we don't need to check our prostates as often -- for the exact same reasons that have been given for the breast cancer guidelines. But we're less prone to hysteria and managed to take the news in stride and not assume that we're being systematically culled.

I'm sure there are many gentlemen who would be willing to conduct amateur pap smears with penis instead of the normal instrumentation. Maybe it won't reach that far, but it won't stop me from trying.

I hereby volunteer to smear some farkettes with my own test equipment, totally free as often as needed.

I'm sure we can work something out.

smooshie: LaurenAguilera: SO FREAKING WHAT. You can still get all the check ups you want, they are only recommending that you do not need a mammogram/pap every year.

Until insurance companies decide not to cover them for certain "low-risk" groups of people anymore.

You can still get it, if you are worried about it. You will just pay for it. *shrug*

I go to the dentist every month. My insurance only covers two cleanings a year. I pay for the other 10 because I want it done.

No worries rich people. The good die young, but pricks live forever.

Jeez. Someone call the mod with the ban hammer!

olddinosaur: TOMORROW: Quit living so long, and sucking up so much Socialist Insecurity money; be a patriot, and die sooner.

Mark my words, it's coming.

Japan already seems to be doing that. I hear that cigarette vending machines are very commonplace there, and you can even smoke in freaking HOSPITALS.

LaurenAguilera: smooshie: LaurenAguilera: SO FREAKING WHAT. You can still get all the check ups you want, they are only recommending that you do not need a mammogram/pap every year.

Until insurance companies decide not to cover them for certain "low-risk" groups of people anymore.

You can still get it, if you are worried about it. You will just pay for it. *shrug*

I go to the dentist every month. My insurance only covers two cleanings a year. I pay for the other 10 because I want it done.

how farked up are your teefs that you need the dentist every month!?!?

or are you just addicted to the nitrous gas?

or are you farking the dentist?

or both?

Well, the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists uses the acronym ACOG. Which is basically ACORN. And we know that Obama started ACORN to pull a Chavez and carry out a socialist takeover of the free world. So, I guess this is just more proof.

Also, Inge420:, that flashlight couldn't possible work with that silly putty jammed in it...

TheMadChaosopher: LaurenAguilera: smooshie: LaurenAguilera: SO FREAKING WHAT. You can still get all the check ups you want, they are only recommending that you do not need a mammogram/pap every year.

Until insurance companies decide not to cover them for certain "low-risk" groups of people anymore.

You can still get it, if you are worried about it. You will just pay for it. *shrug*

I go to the dentist every month. My insurance only covers two cleanings a year. I pay for the other 10 because I want it done.

how farked up are your teefs that you need the dentist every month!?!?

or are you just addicted to the nitrous gas?

or are you farking the dentist?

or both?

I like clean teeth. Never had any cavities, would not like to begin getting them now. Plus, I get them whitened.

/thanks for caring!

Those medical professionals. Always trying to scare off business and kill their customers with their "medical studies."

Does this argument even make sense to you guys, or are we still at the "OBAMACARE WILL KILL YOU!!!" phase? Even though, you know, the bill hasn't passed yet and thus is not related to any of this.

Next: Not all heart attacks require emergency medical treatment. If you are experiencing a relatively mild heart attack, don't call 911 needlessly, just take two aspirin, go to bed early, and pass away quietly in your sleep...

LaurenAguilera: TheMadChaosopher: LaurenAguilera: smooshie: LaurenAguilera: SO FREAKING WHAT. You can still get all the check ups you want, they are only recommending that you do not need a mammogram/pap every year.

Until insurance companies decide not to cover them for certain "low-risk" groups of people anymore.

You can still get it, if you are worried about it. You will just pay for it. *shrug*

I go to the dentist every month. My insurance only covers two cleanings a year. I pay for the other 10 because I want it done.

how farked up are your teefs that you need the dentist every month!?!?

or are you just addicted to the nitrous gas?

or are you farking the dentist?

or both?

I like clean teeth. Never had any cavities, would not like to begin getting them now. Plus, I get them whitened.

/thanks for caring!


cant you just plunk down a couple hundred bux for a really nice home electric brush/waterpick/floss/rinses and such?

you need a dentist to clean your teefs EVERY MONTH?

most people go every 6 months.

what are you eating, rocks?

sugar-coated rocks?

This is the result of government intervention into health care. Exactly the kind of thing Peikoff addressed almost 25 years ago in his speech about the death of the medical profession.

Rug Doctor: Those medical professionals. Always trying to scare off business and kill their customers with their "medical studies."

Does this argument even make sense to you guys, or are we still at the "OBAMACARE WILL KILL YOU!!!" phase? Even though, you know, the bill hasn't passed yet and thus is not related to any of this.

What I think is most amusing is that they're simultaneously arguing two things here:

1. For worse health care for women in the form of potentially dangerous and unnecessary treatment of false positives.

2. Even higher medical bills without any evidence that it provides any actual improvement in health care. In fact, higher medical bills DESPITE the evidence that it provides WORSE care.

The people arguing against these changes as a political matter - particularly this change - are basically saying "I WANT WOMEN TO BE TREATED TO THEIR DETRIMENT FOR DISEASES THEY DON'T HAVE SO THAT WE HAVE TO PAY EVEN HIGHER MEDICAL BILLS AS A RESULT!"

Pretty much par for the course for these idiots though. There do seem to be some legitimate arguments, but, of course, none of those are being made by the "hurrr duuuurr obamacare" crowd.

I can still get bloodlettings and leeches?

In all fairness, my doctor told me last year that I didn't have to get a pap smear every single year, being "low risk" and all. I doubt she's part of a huge governmental conspiracy.

Further, I'm off the opinion that pap smears should be done away with all together and replaced with a blood test.


/stirrups
//speculum
///shudder

There has been plenty of debate on yearly pap smears for healthy women for years now. This is nothing new. Conspiracies and Death Panels please proceed to the next ripe thread... old news here.

meat0918: I'm a guy, but DAMN. Pap smears sound just all kinds of wrong and painful, and look like they can have some serious side effects in the case of false positives.

It's not that big of a deal. The doctor puts in a speculum to widen the vagina and then uses a spatula or brush to collect a sample for testing. For most women it is not painful but is just uncomfortable. It's mostly uncomfortable because someone you don't know very well is touching your privates. It can be more painful for some women, especially women with certain health conditions, but for most women it's just uncomfortable but no big deal.

If they notice something abnormal, however, they have to do more invasive testing that can be more painful and uncomfortable than just the pap smear.

LaurenAguilera

TheMadChaosopher: LaurenAguilera: smooshie: LaurenAguilera: SO FREAKING WHAT. You can still get all the check ups you want, they are only recommending that you do not need a mammogram/pap every year.

Until insurance companies decide not to cover them for certain "low-risk" groups of people anymore.

You can still get it, if you are worried about it. You will just pay for it. *shrug*

I go to the dentist every month. My insurance only covers two cleanings a year. I pay for the other 10 because I want it done.

how farked up are your teefs that you need the dentist every month!?!?

or are you just addicted to the nitrous gas?

or are you farking the dentist?

or both?

I like clean teeth. Never had any cavities, would not like to begin getting them now. Plus, I get them whitened.

/thanks for caring!

I've never had any cavities, and only go to the dentist every six months. But hey, if you want to buy your dentist a new Porsche, that's your business.

DeadZone: I can still get bloodlettings and leeches?

I do believe that leeches are still available over the counter...

These recommendations are actually exactly what this country needs. The result of this should be to limit Health Insurance's responsibility to have to pay for said screenings; this is because scientific research shows increased screenings to have negligible positive effect for society and public health.

Women should feel free to pay for their own earlier-than-recommended screenings if they feel they don't want to be that 1/1900 that dies. This is exactly the way the system is intedend to work.

If you want to derive individual benefit beyond the calculated public health recommendations, then the burden is on you ( and not society) to fund your own testing.

Yesterday I said -- And so it begins...

Today I say -- And so it continues...

What I want to know is when are they gonna tell the doctors they don't need to stick their finger up my butt. Do not like it, do not like it at all.

Is it really pronounced schmear?

Insurance companies have a 2-3% profit margin.

TORT REFORM!

JohanW: This is the result of government intervention into health care. Exactly the kind of thing Peikoff addressed almost 25 years ago in his speech about the death of the medical profession.

What kind of government intervention?

I'll get this out of the way since nobody has mentioned it yet.

wet_dream: What I want to know is when are they gonna tell the doctors they don't need to stick their finger up my butt. Do not like it, do not like it at all.

They already said it a few months ago.

thegreatmurgatroid: These recommendations are actually exactly what this country needs. The result of this should be to limit Health Insurance's responsibility to have to pay for said screenings; this is because scientific research shows increased screenings to have negligible positive effect for society and public health.

Women should feel free to pay for their own earlier-than-recommended screenings if they feel they don't want to be that 1/1900 that dies. This is exactly the way the system is intedend to work.

If you want to derive individual benefit beyond the calculated public health recommendations, then the burden is on you ( and not society) to fund your own testing.

Don't come in here with your bullshiat "scientists know best" routine. All red-blooded, patriotic Americans know that it is their right to have as many god damned medical tests done as necessary to ensure that they're in perfect health. And if they're going to pay thousands of dollars a year in insurance premiums then it's the insurance company's responsibility to pay for them to exercise their right!

What a pap smear may look like.

The point is false positives in over-testing fark up more lives than are saved by real positives. Because our culture is obsessed with eliminating all risk at any cost (see women who get preemptive mastectomies based on nothing but genetic testing), a lot of people can't handle the truth that there is risk is thinking like that.