Judging from the headline, this appears to be a completely unbiased comparison between two of the best QB's in the NFL.

Subby, you fail.

Hmmm, why do I think the IndyStar may be a little biased on this one? Peyton is Wilt and Brady is Russel, winning means more than stats

Ahh, its the most wonderful time of the year...Pats v. Colts week.

Tom is a better at cheating? Why do I a get the impression that this a was a submitted by an Italian?

In crunch time.. aka: playoffs..
check Manning vs Brady numbers, we'll wait.

Also, why do people need to debate this? Right now you get to see Brady and Manning playing damn good football. You get to see a piece of NFL history as 2 HoF's duke it out for AFC/NFL QB supremacy (Farve not withstanding..and we'll see about Brees).

I_C_Weener: Ahh, its the most wonderful time of the year...Pats v. Colts week.

Oh, gee, is that why last night the NBC NFL broadcast was "OMG THE INDIANAPOLIS PEYTON MANNINGS STAYED UNDEFEATED!!! oh and somebody in New Orleans won, too. Tulane, maybe?"

/I really don't care. The less attention on the Saints the better, IMO.

Dr.Knockboots: (Farve not withstanding..and we'll see about Brees).

I am not afraid of Brett Favre. Adrian Peterson worries the shiat out of me.

Nabb1: Dr.Knockboots: (Farve not withstanding..and we'll see about Brees).

I am not afraid of Brett Favre. Adrian Peterson worries the shiat out of me.

SnakeLee: Hmmm, why do I think the IndyStar may be a little biased on this one? Peyton is Wilt and Brady is Russel, winning means more than stats

This.

FriarReb98: SnakeLee: Hmmm, why do I think the IndyStar may be a little biased on this one? Peyton is Wilt and Brady is Russel, winning means more than stats

This.

In football, one player has less control over the number of championships than, say, the NBA. By that measure, Emmett Smith would be a better running back than Barry Sanders, or Andy Pettite better than Nolan Ryan. Smith and Pettite are great players and HOFers in their own right, but I don't think their championships puts them above Sanders and Ryan.

Payton Manning is the best quarterback playing today, IMO.

dletter: farm3.static.flickr.com

His stiff arm long TD run vs the Browns (I think) was embarrassing for me to watch as an adult. He threw a grown man to the ground like a baby.

This is pretty much a "duh" for anyone not blinded by Pats love or Colts hate.

SnakeLee: Hmmm, why do I think the IndyStar may be a little biased on this one? Peyton is Wilt and Brady is Russel, winning means more than stats

Lol!
SnakeLee thinks Robert Horry is a better player than Tim Duncan!

Tom is on a better team? Nope, not this year.

Dr.Knockboots: In crunch time.. aka: playoffs..
check Manning vs Brady numbers, we'll wait.

How about you post them? What are Manning vs. Brady's individual numbers int he playoffs?

A good quarter back makes the tough passes to win the game. A great quarterback makes the tough passes to win the championship.

And an amazing QB hands the ball off all year and doesn't throw ints to win the SB. I love you Trent Dilfer!

Dr.Knockboots: In crunch time.. aka: playoffs..
check Manning vs Brady numbers, we'll wait.

Also, why do people need to debate this? Right now you get to see Brady and Manning playing damn good football. You get to see a piece of NFL history as 2 HoF's duke it out for AFC/NFL QB supremacy (Farve not withstanding..and we'll see about Brees).

I checked Bradys playoff numbers. I had to throw out every season except the one two years ago because they cheated throughout the season and playoffs, so we've really only got the 18-1 year to look at. Then, looking at that I realized Randy Moss was responsible for most of the yards attributed to Brady. Not looking too good for him here.

GAT_00: Payton Manning is the best quarterback playing today, IMO.

He played yesterday.

I'm not going to compare the two because I think they're equal and I can't wait to see the both of them play each other again.
But there were many years when Peyton had the better team. For close to 6 or 7 years Peyton had Marvin Harrison (Future HOFer) and Reggie Wayne (pro bowler, don't know about HOFer yet) and Edgerrin James in his prime all in the same offense. The best receiver Tom Brady had up until Randy Moss and Wes Welker came to town, was Troy Brown. Don't know the best running back, maybe Antwoian (sp?) Smith. Bottom line is, Tom Brady had some pretty ordinary players in his offense for quite a number of years.

INeedAName: A good quarter back makes the tough passes to win the game. A great quarterback makes the tough passes to win the championship.

And an amazing QB hands the ball off all year and doesn't throw ints to win the SB. I love you Trent Dilfer!

I think it is hilarious that he is the QB guru to some people. He sounds like he is smart, but his only real experience is handing the ball to an RB or completing the check-down process.

Here in Dallas, we have Babe Laufenberg acting like a real source on the issue but anyone who remembers when he played knows his NFL career was really, really, really awful.

dletter: Nabb1: Dr.Knockboots: (Farve not withstanding..and we'll see about Brees).

I am not afraid of Brett Favre. Adrian Peterson worries the shiat out of me.

That was a nice run, but I'll just point out that he only ran for 69 yards that entire game and until that run was averaging an amazing 2.9 yards/carry. Meanwhile, Favre had to throw 50+ passes to move the ball because his ass was getting shut down.

Dr.Knockboots: In crunch time.. aka: playoffs..
check Manning vs Brady numbers, we'll wait.

Actually, I'll check some quickly. Skipping 08 since Brady wasn't around (Manning was #3 rating in 08):

2007:
Manning 3rd highest QB rating, Brady 4th. Manning with a much higher yards per attempt.

2006:
Brady 8th highest rating, Manning 10th. Manning better numbers in general (higher yards per attempt, etc.) but more interceptions knock him down.

2005:
Brady 4th, Manning 5th.

2004:
Brady 1st, Manning 2nd (Manning with way higher yards per attempt)

2003:
Manning 1st, Brady only 5th with worst numbers overall.

---

I see zero evidence that Brady's numbers are significantly better than Mannings in the postseason. In fact, they are worse in a lot of ways.

Brady has more rings cause he has a better team (and a better coach). End of story.

Wait, all the numbers in that article would suggest Brady is the better qb AND more accurate to boot...

When Brady had absolutely nobody for receivers or runningbacks, he won championships (I know..I know....cheated)

When he finally got skill position players around him the likes of which Manning has almost always had, he rewrote the record book (I know...I know....18-1)

Bag-o-Nugs: Tom is a better at cheating? Why do I a get the impression that this a was a submitted by an Italian?

I don't think ethnic people are allowed in Indiana.

Brady is pretty good but if you say you wouldnt take Manning over him then you are crazy, Manning has done more with less in Indy.

Cant take away what Brady has done but his coach and they system does play into that success.

priestrape: When Manning had a shiatty defense around him, he couldn't win championships. When his D started playing well, he won one

QFT

Bill Frist: priestrape: When Manning had a shiatty defense around him, he couldn't win championships. When his D started playing well, he won one

QFT

why do Brady's championships get discounted because he had a good defense, but Manning gets a pass because of his?

Numbers don't lie. You're just not wording the question correctly.

So, the fact that Marvin Harrison spent his whole career in Indy means nothing? Or Randy Moss for the past 2+ seasons? Nor can we fold into each player's stats where the defense and special teams wound up giving them the ball, or how good of a running game each QB had? Or offensive line protection?

No, we look at TDs per game and yards per game and make definitive statements about a player's worth. Because we are fans, and how dare we let subtle facts get in the way of our preconceived truth.

Bag-o-Nugs: Tom is a better at cheating? Why do I a get the impression that this a was a submitted by an Italian?

or a completely retarded headline troll. but yes, manning > brady. duh

Can't I think that both of them are great? They're both unique and awesome...I lean towards Brady because he married a hottie.

priestrape: Bill Frist: priestrape: When Manning had a shiatty defense around him, he couldn't win championships. When his D started playing well, he won one

QFT

why do Brady's championships get discounted because he had a good defense, but Manning gets a pass because of his?

I am not discounting anyone's championships. I'm implying that it is absurd to pretend that the QB is the only player on the NFL team and also suggesting that the Pats super bowl wins were due more to the defense than to Brady.

It would be one thing if the Pats three super bowls had shown greatest show on turf quality offense, but instead it was a great kicker and great defense leading teh way. Brady did well, but he was hardly some QB god out there.

The only time he was a QB god was when the year they lost the super bowl.

Peyton mental and physical approach are to this point superior to Toms championships***. The Pats defense mauled our wide receivers...where is the stat for that? huh?

/Still pissed Belicheat was hardly punished
//and stole 2-3 championships from the Colts

I'd just like to say that they're both incredible talents and we're all lucky for getting to watch them play. Its not often you get two QBs that good playing at the same time.

There really isn't much of a debate at this point unless you mis-use team accomplishments like wins and losses (a la Peter King) in support of Brady.

From a true QB positional discussion there is no real comparison.

In the past, the "better surrounding talent" point was a valid one for Brady supporters, but given what Manning has done the last 1.5 years with no (or gimpy) Harrison, a rookie-laden and patchwork o-line and a horrible running game...I'd say those differences are no longer there.

And Moss, Welker and Watson are as good, if not better than Wayne, Clark and Gonzalez/Garcon/Collie, IMO.

Bill Frist: The only time he had a supporting cast on offense like Manning has always had, Brady was a god.

QFT

priestrape: The only time he had a supporting cast on offense like Manning has always had, Brady lost the superbowl and looked like a chump because his defense was no longer carrying him to championships.


QFT

Bill Frist: priestrape: The only time he had a supporting cast on offense like Manning has always had, Brady lost the superbowl and looked like a chump because his defense was no longer carrying him to championships.


QFT

ugh

What I make out of this submission is a question. Why the Hell are Boston sports teams always rivals with elite teams?

Red Sox - Yankees
Celtics - Lakers
Bruins - Canadiens (yeah it's cooled lately)
Patriots battle the Colts, Steelers, Broncos and/or Chargers every damned year lately, and even picked a feud with Parcells not too long ago.

Peyton will be the first to tell you that Superbowl Rings take precident over stats. End of story.

Nana's Vibrator: What I make out of this submission is a question. Why the Hell are Boston sports teams always rivals with elite teams?

Red Sox - Yankees
Celtics - Lakers
Bruins - Canadiens (yeah it's cooled lately)
Patriots battle the Colts, Steelers, Broncos and/or Chargers every damned year lately, and even picked a feud with Parcells not too long ago.

cheating, obviously

Priestrape:

Who do you think was a better player, Ken Griffey Jr. or Coco Crisp? Robert Horry or Steve Nash?

Nabb1: Dr.Knockboots: (Farve not withstanding..and we'll see about Brees).

I am not afraid of Brett Favre. Adrian Peterson worries the shiat out of me.

The Saints would only see Minnesota in the playoffs, by which time 1) Ellis and Fujita will be back from their injuries and New Orleans won't be as shaky against the run as they were with Atlanta/Carolina and 2) BRETTFAVRE!!!11 will be just suggesting, not demanding mind you, but merely suggesting to Childress and the staff that maybe perhaps he should be throwing the ball more - a lot more.

priestrape: Nana's Vibrator: What I make out of this submission is a question. Why the Hell are Boston sports teams always rivals with elite teams?

Red Sox - Yankees
Celtics - Lakers
Bruins - Canadiens (yeah it's cooled lately)
Patriots battle the Colts, Steelers, Broncos and/or Chargers every damned year lately, and even picked a feud with Parcells not too long ago.

cheating, obviously

You know the rest of the Fark world would gain sick satisfaction from priestrape battling Nana's Vibrator in some twisted game.
/because they're weird

This thread is just as whiny as I imagined it would be.

Bill Frist: Who do you think was a better player, Ken Griffey Jr. or Coco Crisp? Robert Horry or Steve Nash?

I'm definitely NOT saying championships are the end-all be-all, especially in football. Manning has more rings if he had a better d

And, once Peyton had a non-chokey playoff run he, like ARod, is forever absolved from the "yeah he's good, but not in the playoffs" thing.

What I AM saying is that Brady, before this year, basically had a Manning-in-his-prime level set of offensive weapons only one time. And he broke virtually every record in the book, had an undefeated regular season and, despite losing the superbowl, did put a typical Brady superbowl drive together to get them the lead at the end before Eli's great drive.

Again, he didn't just have a Manning-level statistical season. He obliterated anything Manning ever did for a season.

So I'm using the 18-1 season as proof that, had Brady always had Manning's weapons, here's what he could've done with them

robsul82: The Saints would only see Minnesota in the playoffs, by which time 1) Ellis and Fujita will be back from their injuries and New Orleans won't be as shaky against the run as they were with Atlanta/Carolina and 2) BRETTFAVRE!!!11 will be just suggesting, not demanding mind you, but merely suggesting to Childress and the staff that maybe perhaps he should be throwing the ball more - a lot more.

Its cute to see aints fans get all worked up and keeping the knowledge that they will lose horribly in their first playoff game shoved down.

As the year has gone on they have looked worse, thats not good news.

robsul82: The Saints would only see Minnesota in the playoffs, by which time 1) Ellis and Fujita will be back from their injuries and New Orleans won't be as shaky against the run as they were with Atlanta/Carolina and 2) BRETTFAVRE!!!11 will be just suggesting, not demanding mind you, but merely suggesting to Childress and the staff that maybe perhaps he should be throwing the ball more - a lot more.

I think you are right on both counts. I just wish the Minnesota Favres would lose another game or two to give the Saints at least some margin of error. Barring a catastrophe (and let's not forget - they are still the Saints) the division seems more or less wrapped up, but home field is not a foregone conclusion. Minnesota's lone loss is against an AFC team, so the Saints cannot afford to drop one to an NFC team.

Nana's Vibrator: What I make out of this submission is a question. Why the Hell are Boston sports teams always rivals with elite teams?

Red Sox - Yankees
Celtics - Lakers
Bruins - Canadiens (yeah it's cooled lately)
Patriots battle the Colts, Steelers, Broncos and/or Chargers every damned year lately, and even picked a feud with Parcells not too long ago.

Haha, wtf? The Pats arent' some historic rival of the Steelers or Colts or any of those teams. They are currently a good team and htus "rivals" of other good teams... same with, you know, every other good team in any given sport who play each other.

Bears no relation to historic rivalries like Celtics-Lakers or Sox-Yanks.