As if Palin hasn't damaged the GOP enough, now she's using the old 'Divide and conquer' tactic. It works really well.
Trouble is, Sarah, you're supposed to use it against the other team.

If Steele grows a pair the right could do well.

"Are you worried Mr. Chairman that Sarah Palin for example, or Rush Limbaugh or others in the conservative movement are going to go into some of these contests and go after the more moderate Republicans who might actually have a better chance at winning in the general election."

That is not their nature? What? That is exactly their nature.

It seems that Michael Steele thinks his job as GOP chairman is to be an attention whore. He doesn't seem to do much but get himself on TV. Not that I'm complaining that the GOP seems feckless of late.

So true.

As quoted from the article,

Of course, right-wing leaders are actually emboldened by their successful purging of Scozzafava, even despite the results of the election yesterday. Sen. Jim DeMint (R-SC) is actively backing Assemblyman Chuck DeVore, a friend of the anti-Obama tea party movement, against more moderate Carly Fiorina in the California Senate race. DeMint explained that DeVore will "stand against his own party leaders" and that conservatives need to continue to "shake up the Republican Party."

Considering how much I detest Carly Fiorina, I can't see how America could lose with this strategy.

Of course, my greatest fear is that these assholes could be right and that if they move far enough to the right they might just win the majority.

/After all, this same strategy worked in the 1930s.

Sabyen91: If Steele grows a pair the right could do well.

I agree with you on this. I would give him one of mine but The doctor already took one away lol but my other can make up for what he doesn't have. lol

Looks like most of the article has been quoted in the thread already.

Anyway, Steele is either being naive, or disengenuous, about Palin and Limbaugh.

Oh, and I'll expect Palin to ask for Steele's head on a platter, via Facebook. Literally, his physical head.

marcpen: Trouble is, Sarah, you're supposed to use it against the other team.

To Palin and the teabaggers, moderates are the other team. See NY-23.

I've got news for you.

You think that if the Republican party splits and becomes a Conservative party and a Republican party it will be bad?

You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

randomjsa: I've got news for you.

You think that if the Republican party splits and becomes a Conservative party and a Republican party it will be bad?

You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

Would it be bad news for Obama, though?

Sabyen91: If Steele grows a pair the right could do well.

He couldn't. He doesn't actually have any influence within the party, nor could he get any if he tried. He's a token black put there because Republican strategists in all their insight and wisdom looked at the election results and thought that's the kind of thing voters wanted.

He's in absolutely no position to lead the party in any way.

randomjsa: I've got news for you.

You think that if the Republican party splits and becomes a Conservative party and a Republican party it will be bad?

You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

no. it would just be bad for the republicans.

randomjsa: You think that if the Republican party splits and becomes a Conservative party and a Republican party it will be bad?

You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

I would love for the Republican party to split and become two parties. Let's call them the Reagressive Party (sic) and the Responsibility Party.

The first party will pretend that nothing after 19511981 ever happened. Wait, no, no nothing after 19812001 ever happened. Wait, or maybe Nov. 2008 is definitely where time ended. Nothing could have possibly happened after that. Our Lord would not have allowed it. We must all be through the looking glass, as it were. Or something.

On the other hand, if the second party has an attention span longer than 6 months and can find a message relevant to more than 15% of the population, maybe we'll get somewhere. Don't count on it.

Random Reality Check:

Of course, my greatest fear is that these assholes could be right and that if they move far enough to the right they might just win the majority.

/After all, this same strategy worked in the 1930s.

Godwin?

randomjsa: You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

Hey, remember in '92 when a conservative ran alongside the republican and democrat condenders? how'd that work out for everyone?

Non-issue. In the same quote, he said his own opinion didn't matter either because, once the candidates had been selected, only the voters of the district had any power to select their representative.

DNRTFA - saw him say the quote on TV.

When there aren't enough fresh souls to feed the demons, they start eating each other...

randomjsa: I've got news for you.

You think that if the Republican party splits and becomes a Conservative party and a Republican party it will be bad?

You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

Look, I know you are a goofball troll and all, but even you can't be this stupid. This so called Republican/Conservative split is only the latest death knell for the right as a political power. It is exactly what many of us had hoped for when Palin quit her jerb.

There could be nothing finer for Democrats than Sarah and her pals leading the former Republican base away into obscurity where they belong.

randomjsa: I've got news for you.

You think that if the Republican party splits and becomes a Conservative party and a Republican party it will be bad?

You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

You know, in all the years I have been reading your delusional ramblings, I don't believe there has ever been a time when I even vaguely agreed with you.

But, in all fairness, when you're right, you're right and in this case you hit the nail right on the head, squarely.

Now, do us all a favor and make this the glorious beginning of a new trend.

Dear Democrats,

Since you apparently need to be reminded.

We won you lost stfu.

Bad_Seed: Sabyen91: If Steele grows a pair the right could do well.

He couldn't. He doesn't actually have any influence within the party, nor could he get any if he tried. He's a token black put there because Republican strategists in all their insight and wisdom looked at the election results and thought that's the kind of thing voters wanted.

He's in absolutely no position to lead the party in any way.

The beautiful thing about all of this? The Republicans, despite their losses and their insistence on being the 'true' party of their little fictional America, are still aping the Democrats to a horrifying degree. NY-23 is their attempt to 'take back' their party like Obama usurped Hilary last year. Steele himself is their version of Obama that is now warring against Palin, who is their Clinton surrogate. They won't admit it, but the party is dying because they don't have any ideas, they're mimicking the other party out of some twisted idea that matching the events of the 2006-2008 elections will gain them the exact same success, and that by moving in the same manner but opposite direction will bring them back to power.

Hence, in Steele's mind, he has to take down Palin to regain the party, and hence the majority that all Republicans surely know is on 'their' side. It's not naivety, it's a lack of any kind of soul-searching on their side. They're aping the motions because deep down they know they're doing something wrong, but have no idea why it's wrong or why it doesn't fit. They will deny that they have no way, but their actions say otherwise. The party isn't just adrift, it's completely pointless after the majority of America ditched them in Bush for the events of the past eight years and the Republicans are such ideologues that they cannot face that they were pushed out of power because of their views, which to them simply cannot be...but is.

The Republicans have a schism to overcome, but it's not just the Palinites and the Fiscal Conservatives. It's the fact that they cannot get over their hundred-year Reich being five years of action followed by a complete refusal of their base, their party, and their leaders.

marcpen:
As if Palin hasn't damaged the GOP enough, now she's using the old 'Divide and conquer' tactic. It works really well.
Trouble is, Sarah, you're supposed to use it against the other team.

See... there's Team Sarah, and if you're not on Team Sarah, you ARE the"other team".

But this guy is ultimately correct. In a representative democracy, it should be constituents who matter to a politician.

ldsr: Dear Democrats,

Since you apparently need to be reminded.

We won you lost stfu.

Your troll-fu is weak.

ldsr: Dear Democrats,

Since you apparently need to be reminded.

We won you lost stfu.

Would you mind elaborating on exactly what you're talking about?

At best, in this last round of elections about the best any non-partisan could claim is that it was a wash.
Two governorships held by Democrats turned Republican and two Congressional seats that had previously been held by Republicans turned Democratic.

Unless you would like to make the claim that a bunch of elections that are next to meaningless decided the national agenda.

Gunther: randomjsa: You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

Hey, remember in '92 when a conservative ran alongside the republican and democrat condenders? how'd that work out for everyone?

On top of that, does anybody notice when an independent runs and eventually drops out they always seem to support the Democrat?

Yeah, these weren't exactly important, world changing elections. Tuesday, I got to vote on A: a slight sales tax increase to pay for new radios for police and firefighters, and B: a new public smoking ban.

Seriously, that's all I get to vote on this year.. they need to do this more often.

Guntram Shatterhand: The beautiful thing about all of this? The Republicans, despite their losses and their insistence on being the 'true' party of their little fictional America, are still aping the Democrats to a horrifying degree. NY-23 is their attempt to 'take back' their party like Obama usurped Hilary last year. Steele himself is their version of Obama that is now warring against Palin, who is their Clinton surrogate. They won't admit it, but the party is dying because they don't have any ideas, they're mimicking the other party out of some twisted idea that matching the events of the 2006-2008 elections will gain them the exact same success, and that by moving in the same manner but opposite direction will bring them back to power.

Now compare with Spinoza's views on man's relationship with god(s). It's like watching a pagan shouting at the sky and sacrificing goats as the volcano pays him no mind.

randomjsa: I've got news for you.

You think that if the Republican party splits and becomes a Conservative party and a Republican party it will be bad?

You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

You're right! I sure hope that doesn't happen.

Befuddled: It seems that Michael Steele thinks his job as GOP chairman is to be an attention whore. He doesn't seem to do much but get himself on TV. Not that I'm complaining that the GOP seems feckless of late.

Well you want the GOP to succeed on some level. Because unchecked, we'll see all sorts of retardation come out of the other side.

Deagan Herumor: Well you want the GOP to succeed on some level. Because unchecked, we'll see all sorts of retardation come out of the other side.

False dichotomy. There are other choices than "let the GOP sh*t on us some more" and "total Democratic hegemony".

Random Reality Check: At best, in this last round of elections about the best any non-partisan could claim is that it was a wash.
Two governorships held by Democrats turned Republican and two Congressional seats that had previously been held by Republicans turned Democratic.

That is indeed the "at best" portion. At worst, a staunchly Republican base revolted, while a trend in opposite-party-to-the-Whitehouse governorship was upheld to no real surprise.

That's what I'd call a loss.

Tor_Eckman: randomjsa: I've got news for you.

You think that if the Republican party splits and becomes a Conservative party and a Republican party it will be bad?

You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

Look, I know you are a goofball troll and all, but even you can't be this stupid. This so called Republican/Conservative split is only the latest death knell for the right as a political power. It is exactly what many of us had hoped for when Palin quit her jerb.

There could be nothing finer for Democrats America than Sarah and her pals leading the former Republican base away into obscurity where they belong.

Better

Occam's Chainsaw: Deagan Herumor: Well you want the GOP to succeed on some level. Because unchecked, we'll see all sorts of retardation come out of the other side.

False dichotomy. There are other choices than "let the GOP sh*t on us some more" and "total Democratic hegemony".

Well I mean you want some sort of competition to weed out the crazies. The GOP is crap. But who will take the Green Party or any of the other myriad of parties seriously. If the Republicans keep marching their way into insanity and broken fronts the party as a whole will die off. And since people are by and large retarded, not seeing that (R) next to any names will probably kill any competition the Democrats could have for a while.

And where are you getting the whole "let the GOP sh*t on us some more" thing? I didn't say that we want the GOP to be dominating, just that having 1 side win because the opponent caught a bad case of the crazies and the stupids isn't' good for anyone.

Deagan Herumor: Befuddled: It seems that Michael Steele thinks his job as GOP chairman is to be an attention whore. He doesn't seem to do much but get himself on TV. Not that I'm complaining that the GOP seems feckless of late.

Well you want the GOP to succeed on some level. Because unchecked, we'll see all sorts of retardation come out of the other side.

Yes, we don't need any more of that retardation like civil rights, medicare, medicaid, 40 hr work weeks, the minimum wage, unemployment compensation, the FDIC, the SEC, worker's comp, and social security now, do we.

Guntram Shatterhand: The beautiful thing about all of this? The Republicans, despite their losses and their insistence on being the 'true' party of their little fictional America, are still aping the Democrats to a horrifying degree. NY-23 is their attempt to 'take back' their party like Obama usurped Hilary last year

They got Hoffman instead of Scozzafava on the ballot. That's their victory. They'll try again, provided the little hate party still has some steam left by this time next year.

If it does... the GOP as a whole has a serious problem. It's anyone's guess.

Guntram Shatterhand: The beautiful thing about all of this? The Republicans, despite their losses and their insistence on being the 'true' party of their little fictional America, are still aping the Democrats to a horrifying degree. NY-23 is their attempt to 'take back' their party like Obama usurped Hilary last year. Steele himself is their version of Obama that is now warring against Palin, who is their Clinton surrogate. They won't admit it, but the party is dying because they don't have any ideas, they're mimicking the other party out of some twisted idea that matching the events of the 2006-2008 elections will gain them the exact same success, and that by moving in the same manner but opposite direction will bring them back to power.

Hence, in Steele's mind, he has to take down Palin to regain the party, and hence the majority that all Republicans surely know is on 'their' side. It's not naivety, it's a lack of any kind of soul-searching on their side. They're aping the motions because deep down they know they're doing something wrong, but have no idea why it's wrong or why it doesn't fit. They will deny that they have no way, but their actions say otherwise. The party isn't just adrift, it's completely pointless after the majority of America ditched them in Bush for the events of the past eight years and the Republicans are such ideologues that they cannot face that they were pushed out of power because of their views, which to them simply cannot be...but is.

The difference is that Obama made peace with Hillary and despite some people's predictions Clintonistas didn't desert the Democrats because they chose the "wrong" candidate. They can tolerate a diversity of opinion in their party and don't demand the lynching of whoever strays from the Orthodoxy.

The Democrats were fighting over who got to lead them, knowing they were going to win and knowing that the outcome of the fight meant something. The Republicans are cannibalising each other in blind rage at having been defeated. Those things are not at all the same.

The Republicans have a schism to overcome, but it's not just the Palinites and the Fiscal Conservatives. It's the fact that they cannot get over their hundred-year Reich being five years of action followed by a complete refusal of their base, their party, and their leaders.

The Republicans have completely lost touch with reality. They completely believe their spin. Their redefinitions of things like "socialism" and "Obama's war" aren't just hyperbole, but become in their minds a new reality, and are the base from which they begin their arguments. Which is why they look so crazy to anyone who still has a bit of rationality. It's very post-modernist, really.

He's entirely correct, and NY23 proves it.

Not only that, but this epic battle was staged over some shiatheel farm district. Palin doesn't have the clout to go after big name republicans.

If she thinks she had a problem with liberal media, she's going to be reduced to a quivering mass of tears when the GOP attack machine decides she needs to be marginalized.

Deagan Herumor: And where are you getting the whole "let the GOP sh*t on us some more" thing?

Any success will be seen by the GOP as vindication. It is only through at least a decade of non-stop ballbusting marginalization that they'll even begin to have an inkling that wiping their asses with the Constitution, drunken spending, corporate whoredom, pimping of religiosity, total abandonment of core values, and the myriad other despicable acts they undertook might've been a bad idea. They'll redouble their efforts, and God help us if they ever regain power.

Random Reality Check: /After all, this same strategy worked in the 1930s.

*clap clap clap*

HotWingConspiracy: If she thinks she had a problem with liberal media, she's going to be reduced to a quivering mass of tears when the GOP attack machine decides she needs to be marginalized.

That's an interesting thought experiment: what would the GOP media say about her? There's many true criticisms that could be used, but that's not their style.

marcpen: As if Palin hasn't damaged the GOP enough, now she's using the old 'Divide and conquer' tactic. It works really well.
Trouble is, Sarah, you're supposed to use it against the other team.

People over-read the NY 23 situation

The anointed candidate of the GOP was a bad candidate
She had corruption issues
she had ethical issues
She was to the left of the democrat on numerous substantive issues that mattered to republicans in the district and around the country
AND
I have heard numerous stories from people in the process and "guys who heard from guys" in the process. Some people say they picked some grass roots guys and they really thought hard about picking them, and other people say no that didn't happen

Process of selecting the candidate lacked openness and transparency


So this is why Hoffman did what he did. And Palin decided to blow this thing up because the Republican wasn't going to end well (due to her corruption issues)

The Fourth Karamazov: randomjsa: I've got news for you.

You think that if the Republican party splits and becomes a Conservative party and a Republican party it will be bad?

You're right, it would be, for the Republicans and the Democrats.

You're right! I sure hope that doesn't happen.

You know, I don't think I've ever exchanged a pleasant word with my Random counterpart.

In this case, I believe he is correct, we need a vibrant and effective opposition party - not that this latest iteration of the Republican Party has come close to meeting that need.

With that said, I am in agreement with you. There is a need to marginalize the lunatics and return to a party of intelligent discussion.

There are many excellent people who should have been run in these last few election cycles, instead we got less than the best offered to us. This trend will either continue, which will be a self-correcting strategy, or the Republican leadership will make the necessary changes.

At this point, all we can do is vote and watch as the drama unfolds.

Bachmann 2012 - because she's just crazy enough to fill both positions.

Ineffectual token black leader of republican party is ineffectual.
More news at 11:00

Sabyen91: If Steele grows a pair the right could do well.

Steel was pretty tepid about endoring Scozzafava and quickly endorsed Hoffman once she dropped out of the race. The guy hasn't been running the train for awhile now. He's been reducted to a Pullman porter.

karasoth: marcpen: As if Palin hasn't damaged the GOP enough, now she's using the old 'Divide and conquer' tactic. It works really well.
Trouble is, Sarah, you're supposed to use it against the other team.

People over-read the NY 23 situation

The anointed candidate of the GOP was a bad candidate
She had corruption issues
she had ethical issues
She was to the left of the democrat on numerous substantive issues that mattered to republicans in the district and around the country
AND
I have heard numerous stories from people in the process and "guys who heard from guys" in the process. Some people say they picked some grass roots guys and they really thought hard about picking them, and other people say no that didn't happen

Process of selecting the candidate lacked openness and transparency


So this is why Hoffman did what he did. And Palin decided to blow this thing up because the Republican wasn't going to end well (due to her corruption issues)

Bull!

Scozzafava has been serving her constituents in the New York State Assembly in 1998. She is pretty well liked (one would surmise if she keeps getting reelected) has moderate views and is certainly not what anyone except for the lunatics would consider liberal.

I don't know where you got your information from but you might want to consider a new source, because when Wikipedia is more accurate than your present source of information it should be obviously your source is defective.

Fart_Machine: Sabyen91: If Steele grows a pair the right could do well.

Steel was pretty tepid about endoring Scozzafava and quickly endorsed Hoffman once she dropped out of the race. The guy hasn't been running the train for awhile now. He's been reducted to a Pullman porter.

Running the train?
He's the cow on the tracks!

Came here for this picture.
Had to do it myself.

Leaving disappointed.

Random Reality Check: karasoth: So this is why Hoffman did what he did. And Palin decided to blow this thing up because the Republican wasn't going to end well (due to her corruption issues)

Bull!

Scozzafava has been serving her constituents in the New York State Assembly in 1998. She is pretty well liked (one would surmise if she keeps getting reelected) has moderate views and is certainly not what anyone except for the lunatics would consider liberal.

I don't know where you got your information from but you might want to consider a new source, because when

Seconded. Partly for that, and partly for the break down of the vote. It was very close. Had Hoffman stayed the fark out of the race, Scozzafava would've won without much ado.

karasoth:I have heard numerous stories from people in the process and "guys who heard from guys" in the process. Some people say...

Stories that you heard from guys who heard it from guys? Yeah. Good source. So what's that about transparency? Openness? Hard to hear that and then look at a line that pretty much means you're basing your position on rumors and nothing more.