I guess by essential they mean "things you don't really need".

List is missing the most obvious: Email

Kyosuke: List is missing the most obvious: Email

Ninite.

Kyosuke: List is missing the most obvious: Email

i thought that's what web browsers were for

As long as it's getting better, especially security and that god awful registry.

Needs a gallon of anti-freeze.

FTFA: So you're about to ask: If Windows 7 has zip compression built in, why do I need the latest version of WinZip?

Answer: Because the makers of WinZip told us you do.

I mean, you could use a much better, free, open-source alternative, but what the hell. Waste your $30.

Mac users swear by their computers. PC users swear at their computers. Windows 7 won't change that.

What about a decent file manager?

WinZip 14 Standard

Why? 7zip is free and works just as well.


Kyosuke: List is missing the most obvious: Email

Why? Even on macs I've owned, I just use the web client. Loads just as fast as any mail app and eliminates any synching between mail apps on various computers.

essential downloads for Apple users: Linux, or a Windows emulator.

Does it include the "Pay double for the same hardware and programs" add-on?

Phideaux: What about a decent file manager?

Or search.

Does Windows 7 still have that annoying dog that returns worthless results?

Microsoft's lack of taste might be forgivable if it didn't take up half of the screen.

anyone else notice the crappy spelling in that? the author either combined words or didnt finish some

MacDaddy:
Mac users who have Windows7 running under Parallels also swear at their computers. 7 is nicer than Vista, but within 20 minutes, I was already frustrated at its quirks. Instead of broken Windows, now they're just cracked.

whatshisname: Does it include the "Pay double for the same hardware and programs" add-on?

Snow leopard full version: $29
http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC223Z/A?fnode=MTY1NDAzOA&mco=MTA4MjgwNDE

Windows 7 full version: $190
http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Windows-7-Home-Premium/dp/B002DHGMK0

Next talking point: priceless

Fursecution: Phideaux: What about a decent file manager?

Or search.

Does Windows 7 still have that annoying dog that returns worthless results?

Microsoft's lack of taste might be forgivable if it didn't take up half of the screen.

He's been gone since Vista, not to mention you always had the option to turn that feature off.

cxjohn: MacDaddy:
Mac users who have Windows7 running under Parallels also swear at their computers. 7 is nicer than Vista, but within 20 minutes, I was already frustrated at its quirks. Instead of broken Windows, now they're just cracked.

What quirks of 7 are more annoying than Vista? For me, it's been a relatively painless transition. However, I imagine I'd be pretty frustrated if I hadn't been familiar with (desensitized to?) Vista already.

So essential, you'll never miss them.

1. People biatched so much about IE being "integrated" into the OS. Microsoft doesn't roll AV or whatever the hell 'essentials' are so that you can pick your own? Well, time to biatch some more.

2. Clean installs are "tedious"? Give me a farking break. ONOZ I HAVE TO REINSTALLZ MY PRON VIEWERS.

3. The fark? Photo Gallery is essential... to no one. Maybe that's why it's not included in the base install.

4. Yep, not essential.

5. The tweaker sounds interesting. I'll give it a whirl at least.

6. WinRAR, done. Or you can use the built in decompressor (which was included with Vista and XP).

7. I have no idea what this is, based on the description. Maintenance app that you can choose the resolution on? WTF?

8. No idea, probably a plug.

9. Isn't this included on the disc?

10. Uh... yeh. Nice counting there douchebags.

me texan: whatshisname: Does it include the "Pay double for the same hardware and programs" add-on?

Snow leopard full version: $29
http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC223Z/A?fnode=MTY1NDAzOA&mco=MTA4MjgwNDE

Windows 7 full version: $190
http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Windows-7-Home-Premium/dp/B002DHGMK0

Next talking point: priceless

Go ahead and install retail Snow Leopard on non-Apple hardware.

If you're really lucky, or you build your computer with specifically compatible hardware, you might be able to do it. But most of the time, you'll be resorting to community hacks, which are specifically a "no-no." Not to mention, by installing Snow Leopard on anything but Apple hardware, you're already breaking the EULA, so.

"Brave souls upgrading to Windows 7 from XP must do a clean install, a tedious process that includes, among other things, reinstalling all of your apps."

haha!

Does the search in Windows 7 actually work? Ever since the desktop search got downloaded to my XP box a few months back, I can't find any files, even if I type the exact name. Indexed, non-indexed, doesn't matter. If I type *.* in the file filter I get everything. Any other combination, including the exact file name, results in nothing...

Agent Ransack FTW!!

macdaddy357: Mac users swear by their computers. PC users swear at their computers. Windows 7 won't change that.

I'd buy a Mac for my desktop if you could swap out GPU's. The extra cost isn't an issue for me. I like the warranty and the customer service is bar none the best of any computer or computer hardware company I've dealt with outside of Corsair. The Mac Pros are also very well built.

And I don't want better GPUs for gaming. Adobe CS fills up the GPU memory awfully fast with GPU acceleration. The newest quad core iMac still has only 512MB GPU RAM on a 2560x1440 display. Granted the iMac isn't a massive editing station, but 512 is a really weak top end offering. I'm really surprised they don't offer a 2GB variant of some kind of card in even the Mac Pros. I tried out the GTX 285 1GB Mac version in a Pro and filled up that card with GPU acceleration in Photoshop very quickly. The only other option is to stuff it full of 4 pathetically weak 9500GTs laughably rebranded as GT120's to get even 2GB of video RAM. At that point you've also filled up every available PCIe slot.

That GTX285 is the best card you can put in a Mac Pro and have it run natively without using netkas injectors on a PC card and have it fail half the time. Add to that the fact that the best GPU offering for the Mac Pro only has DVI out and can't be used with their 24" display and it creates a whole new issue. Of course, you could buy the $200 adapter that does this and happens to be the ONLY one on the market, but why? Granted that's an issue that lies with EVGA and not Mac, but still, it just creates needless confusion and frustration where there shouldn't be any.

A GTX 285 2GB with Mini DisplayPort outs would have been a perfect solution. Although with the 5870's out now, they might as well just make it a 2GB 5870 with 6 MDP outs. The card has already been shown off and it's obviously coming. They'd make a killing on a Mac version of that card.

me texan: whatshisname: Does it include the "Pay double for the same hardware and programs" add-on?

Snow leopard full version: $29
http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC223Z/A?fnode=MTY1NDAzOA&mco=MTA4MjgwNDE

Windows 7 full version: $190
http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Windows-7-Home-Premium/dp/B002DHGMK0

Next talking point: priceless

I use mac laptops, and he's right. The hardware is overpriced for what you get. Dancing around that issue doesn't help Mac users if they're trying to "defend" themselves in what happens to be a stupid argument to begin with.

Some of the cost of the operating system and software development is shoved into the price of the individual hardware units they sell. If you miss that then....well there's not much that can be done to help you. It either bothers you, or it doesn't.

Doesn't bug me, as the product you get works very well.

/Also, get a new schtick. The "priceless" meme is sad.

GoodyearPimp: 6. WinRAR 7zip, done.

Fixed.

Why, we've had all of that stuff since System 6.0.8. Additionally, no operating system created will ever top the robustness of 7.6.1.

GranoblasticMan: FTFA: So you're about to ask: If Windows 7 has zip compression built in, why do I need the latest version of WinZip?

Answer: Because the makers of WinZip told us you do.

I mean, you could use a much better, free, open-source alternative, but what the hell. Waste your $30.

What kind of a moron PAYS for WinZip? Just use the evaluation version. That said, a few of the features of WinZip are useful to IT folk, but for the ordinary goob that just wants to compress some text files or bundle a few files together the evaluation version works fine.

/Just use what's built into windows.

OldRod: Does the search in Windows 7 actually work? Ever since the desktop search got downloaded to my XP box a few months back, I can't find any files, even if I type the exact name. Indexed, non-indexed, doesn't matter. If I type *.* in the file filter I get everything. Any other combination, including the exact file name, results in nothing...

Agent Ransack FTW!!

It works beautifully.

me texan: Snow leopard full version: $29

Better tell Psytars lawyers that's the full version, that'll be the ace in the hole for their case.

OldRod: Does the search in Windows 7 actually work? Ever since the desktop search got downloaded to my XP box a few months back, I can't find any files, even if I type the exact name. Indexed, non-indexed, doesn't matter. If I type *.* in the file filter I get everything. Any other combination, including the exact file name, results in nothing...

Agent Ransack FTW!!

Works fine on MY Windows 7. I didn't like the new interface but then I never like new interfaces once I have the old one mastered.

Was that ad for Winzip paid for?

Look, no-one anywhere needs Winzip. Zipping is built-in, and Winzip adds little to that. If you want something more powerful, WinRAR or 7-Zip are better choices.

Schadenfreude ist die schoenste Freude: I use mac laptops, and he's right. The hardware is overpriced for what you get. Dancing around that issue doesn't help Mac users

Seems to me TFA is comparing OSX to Win 7. I didnt realize Apple gave me a hardware charge every time I bought a new OS version for my mac mini that I've had for a while. Must be hidden in that -$140 difference somewhere.

farkeruk: Was that ad for Winzip paid for?

Look, no-one anywhere needs Winzip. Zipping is built-in, and Winzip adds little to that. If you want something more powerful, WinRAR or 7-Zip are better choices.

We get that at work. 7Zip is on every single computer by default, but we'll always get some new hire or random marketing person going "i need winzip license and winzip on my computer"

"you have 7zip, it does everything you'll need (i.e. - opening a zip file from your email attachments)"

....

And we never get a reply.
Ever.

It's like their either pissed off we denied them a freebie, or they're embarrassed that they never even bother to see what their computer had.

We also get those who need the full version of Adobe Acrobat to make PDFs, when we explain they have a PDF printer installed.

Then there was the person who wanted the full Adobe CS suite because they couldn't understand that Print Screen + MS Paint would get them what they needed.

People like commercial software cuz it's etched in their head that they need it.

Buy winzip.

I use Windows 7 and couldn't be happier. If you enjoy using something else, swell. You're the only one who lives in your head, so make yourself happy.

me texan: whatshisname: Does it include the "Pay double for the same hardware and programs" add-on?

Snow leopard full version: $29
http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC223Z/A?fnode=MTY1NDAzOA&mco=MTA4MjgwNDE

Windows 7 full version: $190
http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Windows-7-Home-Premium/dp/B002DHGMK0

Next talking point: priceless

The page you linked to is the UPGRADE. As in, You have to have Leopard and you can't do a clean install. Furthermore, it's "single user"; you can only install it on ONE computer. Windows retail boxes have always allowed essentially unlimited activations (as long as it's obvious you're not a pirate).

Macfag status: TOLD

Dear Microsoft, I don't really care about Windows Media Live Photo Player Special Edition (now with Extended Customer Experience Improvement Package!), but it would be nice to be able to MOUNT A @#$% ISO.

Harvey Manfrenjensenjen: Dear Microsoft, I don't really care about Windows Media Live Photo Player Special Edition (now with Extended Customer Experience Improvement Package!), but it would be nice to be able to MOUNT A @#$% ISO.

Yeah, I thought it was a bit odd that you could burn an ISO, but not mount it out-of-the-box.

I guess there's always Daemon tools.

Dinki: I guess by essential they mean "things you don't really need".

Pretty much. I scanned the list and zero of those programs are on my computer (just reinstalled 7 yesterday).

What I did install:

1. OpenOffice
2. VLC
3. BitTornado (use whatever torrent program you prefer)
4. ThumbsPlus! (not free, but easily activated)
5. Firefox
6. WinRAR (mine isn't free, but I think they have a free one, or just use 7-Zip)
7. K-Lite Codec Pack (VLC has them, but for some reason ThumbsPlus! does not find them in VLC)

That's it other than some specific programs I need for work. If you want a virus scanner use a free one like ClamWin.

Tingle007: essential downloads for Apple users: Linux, or a Windows emulator.

FTFY

Wow that list is garbage.

winzip?!?!?!??!
I thought people stopped using that back in win98? Remember:
Installed 657 Days Ago 21 Day Trial Expired

I didn't see anything useful in that list. Of course I don't run win7, but none of them sounded interesting or worthwhile to do anything.

Just me or lots of spelling errors and random stuff in article?

1. Microsoft Security Essentials
Ok, maybe it works great. I thought you had to pay yearly fees to use it (I know they are selling subscription for something).
The article mentions getting AVG free. UMM NO! AVG is garbage after v7.5
AVG now infects other software (firefox) and is extremely slow.

2. Ninite
Sounds interesting, but then states itunes, and how using nanite won't install crapware. Umm, itunes on windows is crapware. It installs like 5 programs, and has 3 or more constantly running in background.
So basically it is a much worse version of linux version of all apps in a repository (get everything in one location, no crapware).

3. Windows Live Photo Gallery
WOW! a photo gallery! Hasn't this type of software been out for years?

4. Windows Easy Transfer
They state you need $20 proprietary cable to transfer programs. wtf?

5. Ultimate Windows Tweaker v2
Tweaking is good if you need to.

6. WinZip 14 Standard
Sounds like it was written back in 1999. 7-zip is 100% free (cost and code) and better. I'd like to compare 7-zip and winzip14 programs open see which uses less ram/CPU.

7. EnhanceMySe7en Free
Confused by explanation. It says it is a diagnostic/maintenance utility, then states it can auto rezize pictures? wtf? What does that have to do with windows diagnostics and maintenance?

8. Systerac Tools for Windows 7
Looks like a shiatty ripoff of ccleaner

9. Windows 7 Upgrade Advisor
Makes sense. duh.

Yahoo! was paid to put these programs in their list. Their links have the redirect info so they can count clicks.

me texan: Schadenfreude ist die schoenste Freude: I use mac laptops, and he's right. The hardware is overpriced for what you get. Dancing around that issue doesn't help Mac users

Seems to me TFA is comparing OSX to Win 7. I didnt realize Apple gave me a hardware charge every time I bought a new OS version for my mac mini that I've had for a while. Must be hidden in that -$140 difference somewhere.

I wasn't referring to TFA, I was clearly referring to your "credit card meme" ragging on this statement which you quoted:

whatshisname: Does it include the "Pay double for the same hardware and programs" add-on?

Hell, I don't know why I bothered, you're clearly a troll.

me texan: Snow leopard full version: $29
http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC223Z/A?fnode=MTY1NDAzOA&mco=MTA4MjgwNDE

Windows 7 full version: $190
http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Windows-7-Home-Premium/dp/B002DHGMK0

So, I can save $150 dollars by spending > $500 or more on the equivalent Apple hardware to run it?

Excuse me while I cut off my nose, as my face needs some spiting.

And oh by the way, the Snow Leopard price you're quoting is an upgrade. The equivalent Windows 7 Premium upgrade from Amazon is $115, and I paid $50 when they were running the pre-release sale.

You can argue Mac vs PC on its merits, but raw price is not one of them.

whatshisname: Does it include the "Pay double for the same hardware and programs" add-on?

I'm actually on one of those nifty little $600 PC laptops so praised in Microsoft's anti-Apple commercials. It's a piece of shiat. I will gladly drop my dime for a new MacBook Air when the next generation comes out. I've never had such a shiatty computing experience, a bunch of poor quality components held together with scotch tape and rubber bands. It takes this POS a full three minutes to wake up from sleep, god forbid I'm reading a long document on battery power and the screen dims right before I reach the bottom of the page. Flick the track pad and go make coffee... I tried to get around this by modifying the power settings to basically make everything always on, which works for about a week then the computer repeatedly and unexplicably reverts back to its default power settings.

All the rubber boots came off within three weeks.
The web cam software is a massive POS I had to uninstall because every time I would move my mouse to the top of the screen a webcam software panel would slowly slide out.
It has 2 GB of RAM yet still can't play a flash video full screen at more than 2 fps, and struggles to play most Hulu and YouTube videos at minimized resolution.
There is a full minute lag between the time I hit the key combo for "volume down/up" and when it actually takes effect so it inevitably goes ALL the way down far too late.
The computer is regularly dragged to its knees in the middle of extremely simple processes, like switching between WordPad and Firefox.

Your "costs less" argument can suck my ass. It costs less because it's a massive piece of shiat.

//Article was dumb.

ctobio: me texan: Snow leopard full version: $29
http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC223Z/A?fnode=MTY1NDAzOA&mco=MTA4MjgwNDE

Windows 7 full version: $190
http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Windows-7-Home-Premium/dp/B002DHGMK0

So, I can save $150 dollars by spending > $500 or more on the equivalent Apple hardware to run it?

Excuse me while I cut off my nose, as my face needs some spiting.

And oh by the way, the Snow Leopard price you're quoting is an upgrade. The equivalent Windows 7 Premium upgrade from Amazon is $115, and I paid $50 when they were running the pre-release sale.

You can argue Mac vs PC on its merits, but raw price is not one of them.

Oh, and don't forget a Family Pack (3 upgrade licenses) is only $150.

I Like Bread: The page you linked to is the UPGRADE. As in, You have to have Leopard and you can't do a clean install. Furthermore, it's "single user"; you can only install it on ONE computer. Windows retail boxes have always allowed essentially unlimited activations (as long as it's obvious you're not a pirate).

Macfag status: TOLD

However, in contrast to Microsoft--which offers a confusing array of full and upgrade versions of Windows, all of them requiring that users enter a unique serial number in order to prove they're not pirates--Apple continues to rely on the honor system for Mac OS X. Not only does Snow Leopard not require the entry of any serial numbers, but the standard version of Snow Leopard is a bootable "full install" disc that doesn't actually check for the presence of Leopard in order to install.

Ooh you got me there (oops look again) and the "macfag" comment makes you the ultimate internet tough guy. Too bad you're both wrong and ignorant.

I Like Bread: Macfag status: TOLD

Go back to /b/ and stay there.

ZipSplat: Your "costs less" argument can suck my ass. It costs less because it's a massive piece of shiat.

What's Apple's option in the $600 laptop range? Have you tried taking the money you would spend on an Air and bought a PC laptop with it? For that matter, do you consider yourself the same type of user that is highlighted in the ads? Or are you comparing...*sigh*... Apples to not-Apples?

I Like Bread: The page you linked to is the UPGRADE. As in, You have to have Leopard and you can't do a clean install. Furthermore, it's "single user"; you can only install it on ONE computer. Windows retail boxes have always allowed essentially unlimited activations (as long as it's obvious you're not a pirate).

Macfag status: TOLD

Uhm, Mac OSes don't have copy protection.

God, this thread is retarded. Just reading it has made me more stupid.

Schadenfreude ist die schoenste Freude: Hell, I don't know why I bothered, you're clearly a troll.

If you disagree with me, I'm clearly a troll.

GoodyearPimp: ZipSplat: Your "costs less" argument can suck my ass. It costs less because it's a massive piece of shiat.

What's Apple's option in the $600 laptop range? Have you tried taking the money you would spend on an Air and bought a PC laptop with it? For that matter, do you consider yourself the same type of user that is highlighted in the ads? Or are you comparing...*sigh*... Apples to not-Apples?

Apple doesn't have a $600 laptop because you simply cannot make a decent laptop for that price. I have yet to do anything that I would consider remotely taxing on a computer's hardware on this guy. All I use it for is internet stuff and downloading documentaries on BitTorrent. The most taxing thing it does (apparently) is play Hulu videos.

I'm sure if I spent as much on a laptop as I would spend on a MacBook air I would get a quality computer because I would be paying the cost of reasonable components and software engineering, but I've also seen shiatty expensive PCs. The ones where that extra cash goes to buying bigger shiatty components.

ZipSplat: I'm actually on one of those nifty little $600 PC laptops so praised in Microsoft's anti-Apple commercials. It's a piece of shiat. I will gladly drop my dime for a new MacBook Air when the next generation comes out. I've never had such a shiatty computing experience, a bunch of poor quality components held together with scotch tape and rubber bands. It takes this POS a full three minutes to wake up from sleep, god forbid I'm reading a long document on battery power and the screen dims right before I reach the bottom of the page. Flick the track pad and go make coffee... I tried to get around this by modifying the power settings to basically make everything always on, which works for about a week then the computer repeatedly and unexplicably reverts back to its default power settings.

All the rubber boots came off within three weeks.
The web cam software is a massive POS I had to uninstall because every time I would move my mouse to the top of the screen a webcam software panel would slowly slide out.
It has 2 GB of RAM yet still can't play a flash video full screen at more than 2 fps, and struggles to play most Hulu and YouTube videos at minimized resolution.
There is a full minute lag between the time I hit the key combo for "volume down/up" and when it actually takes effect so it inevitably goes ALL the way down far too late.
The computer is regularly dragged to its knees in the middle of extremely simple processes, like switching between WordPad and Firefox.

Your "costs less" argument can suck my ass. It costs less because it's a massive piece of shiat.

//Article was dumb.

If your experience is so bad with windows, why not download and burn Ubuntu (new window) to a CD, pop it in cd-rom, see if stuff works, and if you like it use "usb startup disk creator" and put ubuntu onto usb stick so you can get better realistic performance measurements. Then install if you really hate your installed windows so much. It's free and new version was released October 29.
A $600 computer bought recently should work fast. netbooks work good with linux, so a $600 laptop should too.