I hope my estate won't get billed thousands of dollars per hour for the time I spent bleeding to death unattended in the back of an ambulance. Give me that much, Obama.

WTF does the U.S. healthcare bill have to do with an unfortunate incidence in the U.K.?

Is the submitter suggesting that this could only happen in a country with a national healthcare system?

Bathia_Mapes: WTF does the U.S. healthcare bill have to do with an unfortunate incidence in the U.K.?

Is the submitter suggesting that this could only happen in a country with a national healthcare system?

How about because the UK system keeps getting held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalized health care?

johnsoninca: How about because the UK system keeps getting held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalized health care?

Yes, because this sort of thing never happens in the private system in the US. It never happens in other countries with socialised medicine.

/sarcasm

Don't be a twat.

johnsoninca:
How about because the UK system keeps getting held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalized health care?

No, it's pretty much entirely used as a strawman by opponents of health care reform. Supporters of single-payer realize that the UK is probably the worst European system we could adopt. That being said, it's still far superior to ours and spends far less. The others are just a lot better.

Hmmmm.

Not EMT's. From the article, it's a taxi service.

baka-san: Hmmmm.

Not EMT's. From the article, it's a taxi service.

This. It's not even a medical transport team. It's just transportation for folks that can't do it on their own.

Ambulance would have a guy in the back attending to the guy at all times, that I would hope would yell "Hey, why are you parking? There's a guy back here, dumbass."

Shadowknight: Not EMT's. From the article, it's a taxi service.

This. It's not even a medical transport team. It's just transportation for folks that can't do it on their own.

Ambulance would have a guy in the back attending to the guy at all times, that I would hope would yell "Hey, why are you parking? There's a guy back here, dumbass."

Hell, even an EMT basic can do that.

baka-san: Shadowknight: Not EMT's. From the article, it's a taxi service.

This. It's not even a medical transport team. It's just transportation for folks that can't do it on their own.

Ambulance would have a guy in the back attending to the guy at all times, that I would hope would yell "Hey, why are you parking? There's a guy back here, dumbass."

Hell, even an EMT basic can do that.

I don't know, I've run with basics that might not.

johnsoninca: Bathia_Mapes: WTF does the U.S. healthcare bill have to do with an unfortunate incidence in the U.K.?

Is the submitter suggesting that this could only happen in a country with a national healthcare system?

How about because the UK system keeps getting held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalized health care?

This was a private ambulance company, not one that is state run btw

johnsoninca: How about because the UK system keeps getting held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalized health care?

I have never seen a supporter of nationalized health care praise the UK's system as a "world standard".

But since you insist, let's compare nationalized systems against the US.

cretinbob: Hell, even an EMT basic can do that.

I don't know, I've run with basics that might not.

Ouch.

Think I might be in class with a few who are going to be pretty useless.

HansensDisease: But since you insist, let's compare nationalized systems against the US.

www.conferenceboard.ca
sso.conferenceboard.ca
www.conferenceboard.ca
www.conferenceboard.ca

WOW!

Such information at our fingertips...

Now all we need is the code for the graph maybe.

baka-san: Now all we need is the code for the graph maybe.

Knock yerself out^.

johnsoninca: How about because the UK system keeps getting held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalized health care?

No, I don't recall anyone doing that. I do recall people holding up Canada and Germany as good countries to emulate.

Accidents will happen.

baka-san:
WOW!

Such information at our fingertips...

Now all we need is the code for the graph maybe.

Hmmm... an A-D scale associated with rating performance. How mysterious. I've never seen anything like it

Anyone else notice Ambulance is spelled backwards on the hood of the vehicle pictured? Yet the one on the top is right?

HansensDisease: johnsoninca: How about because the UK system keeps getting held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalized health care?

I have never seen a supporter of nationalized health care praise the UK's system as a "world standard".

But since you insist, let's compare nationalized systems against the US.



Hmm, fark Europe let's move to Japan.

Zebby: Anyone else notice Ambulance is spelled backwards on the hood of the vehicle pictured? Yet the one on the top is right?

My pancakes weren't very good this morning. We clearly need national standards to guarantee minimum pancake quality in all restaurants.

Anyone can see that this is "necessary and proper" to congress's directive to "provide for the general welfare".

That pic does not look like it was taken through a mirror, besides if that was the case, wouldn't both be backwards?

Anyway, its simple human error, though I am not saying the workers should not be reprimanded however. I read a story a while back about a woman who woke up from being under anethstesia(sp?)in a dentist chair, but the office had closed on her. Lights were out and she was alone, and she had apparently been forgotten at the end of the day. So I would side with the guy left in the vehicle, I would hate to be in that kind of situation.

Racht: Supporters of single-payer realize that the UK is probably the worst European system we could adopt

To be fair, It used to be very good, was farked by the Tories (who privatised as much as they could get away with) and continues to be messed up by new labour, who are Tory lite.

The scores in the charts posted are also likely to be influenced heavily by our god-awful lifestyle. Especially in Scotland, we have huge issues with heart disease and cancer. This is largely caused by smoking and very poor diet.

As you say, still better than the US system.

Zebby: That pic does not look like it was taken through a mirror, besides if that was the case, wouldn't both be backwards?

The lettering on the front of the ambulance is reversed so as to be correct when seen through a rear-view mirror. On top, its the correct way round so it can be seen normally, so as to cover all eventualities

Sometimes, the Daily Mail's articles are based upon the truth and should be treated as a fair warning.

But when the article's headline is "HAS HEALTH & SAFETY INFECTED YOUR CHILDREN WITH AIDS?", then something is amiss.

But "COULD FEMINISM HAVE SEX WITH THE QUEEN?" takes the cake for best headline ever.

And "COULD 3:30 AM GIVE MY INTERNET CONNECTION CANCER?" Because the internet always times out at this time. Very annoying.

mantabulous : mmm... an A-D scale associated with rating performance.

But no decent description of the metric being rated.

"Life Expectancy", of what, people in hospitals? Or people in general?
"Mortality due to Diabetes", same as above.

Doing a little digging around on their site, I found their report, and also this statement.

It is important to note that the Conference Board is not attempting to rate Canada's health-care system. Although the health-care system has an impact on the health status of a population, our goal is to evaluate the health status of Canadians and of their peers in other countries.

IE, the metrics being measured have very little to do with health care, and more to do with the health of the population in general. And I'm sure there's no factor other than health care (cough, Americans being fat asses, cough) that could affect that metric.

/or this?

Zebby: Anyone else notice Ambulance is spelled backwards on the hood of the vehicle pictured? Yet the one on the top is right?

Yes, the reversed ambulance on the hood is for the car that they are coming up behind so they can tell that they are going to get rear ended by an ambulance. The one up top is for oncoming and foot traffic so they can see what they are going to be hit by.

baka-san: Hell, even an EMT basic can do that.

Now come on, dude, I ran as a basic for almost a year. And I know quite a few (I hope myself included) that were more than proficient. Yeah, they can't do a lot, but for simple traumas and transport with no LOC or AMS, that's all you really need.

johnsoninca: How about because the UK system keeps getting held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalized health care?

Since when? I've been in a lot of these threads, and I've never seen the NHS held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalised health care once. Stop making shiat up.

Bathia_Mapes: WTF does the U.S. healthcare bill have to do with an unfortunate incidence in the U.K.?

Is the submitter suggesting that this could only happen in a country with a national healthcare system?

Governmental price controls = rationing

Every time.

Bunnyhat: HansensDisease: johnsoninca: How about because the UK system keeps getting held up as the "world standard" by supporters of nationalized health care?

I have never seen a supporter of nationalized health care praise the UK's system as a "world standard".

But since you insist, let's compare nationalized systems against the US.



Hmm, fark Europe let's move to Japan.

...or you know we could come up with a bill that looks more like Japans system and less like Europes.

jdmac:Governmental price controls = rationing

Every time.

Privatised price controls = rationing. Every time.

Every system rations to some extent. Insurance companies ration based on your profitability and your ability to pay. Government-provided systems ration based on their budgets and your need.

Neither system is perfect, but you're an idiot if you think that your system doesn't ration already. You're also an idiot if you think that systems in other countries don't allow citizens other options.

Left in an ambulance by one idiot vs left to die in an ER waiting room in full view of everyone (new window).

Shadowknight: baka-san: Hell, even an EMT basic can do that.

Now come on, dude, I ran as a basic for almost a year. And I know quite a few (I hope myself included) that were more than proficient. Yeah, they can't do a lot, but for simple traumas and transport with no LOC or AMS, that's all you really need.

I know, it's a joke. Ya know...J,O,K,E.

He shouldn't be suspended, he should be fired. If his union complains, tell them to go on strike, and also get fired.

I heard on NPR radio that there are 200,000 people employed in the US whose sole purpose is to ensure that medical conditions/treatments are coded correctly so that insurance companies will pay out adequately. There's a cartoon on this page showing Obama in a white coat and being sarcastic about having too much red tape...you think you don't have red tape now? And hey...US pays 16% of their GDP to Healthcare...UK pays 8%, France 11% as I understand it. Now I WONDER where some savings could be made...and maybe pay for the 15% of poor suckers who have no health cover at ALL? The person left in the ambulance was, I would think, a rare incident...the 15% not covered (and hoping for a FREE Fire Dept ambulance) is NOT a rare incident. Get real, guys

thenewflesh: Privatised price controls = rationing. Every time.

Every system rations to some extent. Insurance companies ration based on your profitability and your ability to pay. Government-provided systems ration based on politics and the bureaucracy's need for press.

When "rationing" becomes a negative, try-TRY to redefine the word. When PRICE is the gate for obtaining a commodity, producers have an incentive to make more. When GovCo's bureaucrats' edicts are the limiting factor, producers ... lobby Congress for a subsidy. You CANNOT repeal human nature. ...but keep trying, your efforts add to the proofs of the law of unintended consequences.

Incidently, it's not really fair to compare cold countries with warm countries when talking life expectancy, because violence and crime correlate fairly strongly to temperature. If you look at a map of crime in the US, for instance, the worst parts are in the south. What you SHOULD be looking at when comparing quality of medical care is deaths from equivalent diseases, normed for age, climate, etc. So you'd compare the UK only to parts of the US that are also cold and wet, and you'd eliminate non-health-related deaths. Similarly, Canada could only be compared to the northernmost parts of the US.