UnspokenVoice: Not many sane people would agree with you thus you've "reached no one." Imagine that... You're basically saying that it is natural to want to call the Sun "The bright square shining black thing in the ground." No, no it isn't right, it isn't okay, it's people like you appeasing the mentally ill and encouraging more of it.

Uh huh. I like the strawman, too. It's also sort of ironic because it actually applies more to you -- like if a physicist said that the sun was a nuclear furnace converting hydrogen to helium, and you were all like "nuh-uh any common man can plainly see it's a great ball of fire and you just don't know what you're talking about." The whole anti-scientific rhetoric swaddled in some laughably pro-science strawman is ... I don't know, it's like that warm fuzzy feeling I get when I know a retarded child is going home without feces in his diapers.

Now, meat and potatoes time: Where did you get your MD in psychiatry? Where did you take your surgeon's specialization? What institute of higher learning conferred a PhD on psychology or physiology or biology on you?

Again, I'm going to take a stab in the dark and say "none". If I had to make a best guess, I'm going to say you've got a Bachelor's degree at most, and probably not in a scientific or critical field.

Which really leads me to the question, then, is how are you in any way fit to make diagnoses about the mentally ill and who does or does not fit into it?

Is there anything about your body you would change, if you could -- any sort of body dysmorphism at all? Do you have anything in your genetic heritage you do not identify with, say a racial heritage or something?

Don't bother answering, I know the answer is "yes". And hey, unlike your tortured invalid analogy strawman about the sun, there is actually a tautology here; since this is what transsexuals suffer from, dysmorphism and identity issues, hey, that makes you mentally ill by your own admission.

Broom: I don't know you, but you are my new farking hero.

You go, girl or guy! Best doctor evah!

/ Happy hetero with peener, who thinks others' sex lives are their own business... unless they're sharing, in which case juicy tidbits are usually interesting!

Guy, hetero, (almost) married, no kids, dog, smoker, aged 25-39, white as the Irish (which makes sense, given), Canadian, etc.

All very vanilla. Learned to be threatened by threatening actions, no THE SCURRY DIFFERENT PEOPLE. Person tries to run me over with car, threatening, person wants to remove their penis and live as a woman, very non-threatening. Never understood any other line of reasoning.

I think that there's just a lot of "I NO I HOPE I HAVEN'T SLEPT WITH A SECRET XY-WOMAN" penis shrinking Zionist robot comb style terror here.

you cant cure the ghey its natural nature doesnt make mistakes, OOOHHHHHHHH you want to whack off the penis yea we can do that nature made a mistake.

me thinks the older sisters tortured poor little BOY about his penis. or HE never got over his vagina envy

i am going home to the 50's. fark all you enlightened ones.

bumkusfiveal: me thinks the older sisters tortured poor little BOY about his penis. or HE never got over his vagina envy

You got a hummer from the tranny, didn't you?

darrent83: A large proportion of the men getting gender reassignment surgery are not trans at all but simply gay men.

Supposedly, that was the case in western nations when sexual reassignment surgery first came out.

These days, everyone is screened. A friend of mine who went through the process was required to have 12 hour-long sessions with a licensed psychiatrist before being prescribed hormones. From there, s/he had to come in every month for a year before s/he could get a letter of referral for cosmetic surgery (facial reconstruction). Once s/he recovered, s/he transitioned full time.

Even then, s/he had to live a full year as a woman, with monthly appointments with the psychiatrist, before s/he could get a letter of recommendation for gender reassignment surgery. All together, s/he spent around three years under the care of a psychiatrist before the final surgery.

From what I have heard and read, once you reach puberty, if you have these kinds of feelings, they generally don't go away. There were a few reports that said that the rate of relapse for teenagers who were "cured" of their gender identity issues was fairly high.

To compound problems, the relapse generally occurs in their 30s and 40s. Many of these people had families with children by that point. Having a parent transition is psychologically devastating to a child. Others simply commit suicide rather than transition. For many, it is very destructive to transition at that age.

Despite what all the haters in the thread think, the girl in the article is most likely going to live a very healthy, happy life. You don't go through all of that screening and suddenly go "oops, maybe I shouldn't have chopped off my pecker". It doesn't work that way.

The closer to puberty you can identify and transition, the better.

Dr. Mojo PhD: And yet I get the sneaky feeling I've reached no one.

You know what they say, "A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still." There are simply some people out there that will never allow themselves to accept that nature is wrong, no matter how convincing the argument. I could post a video of a panther killing and dragging her young into a tree because she's hungry and some people would still defend it.

There are clearly a great deal of farkers in here that are reading your mail, but I think they already subscribed to the same newsletter to begin with.

HAMMERTOE: Sxooter: So, HAMMERTOE, a woman who never ovulates isn't ever a woman? A young girl who has her ovaries removed before puberty, but takes female hormones and develops otherwise as a woman, isn't a woman because she can't provide an egg for someone to fertilize?

Are all sterile women not women then? Do they stop being a woman at 50 something when they hit menopause?

XY != XX

It's written into every last cell of his body.

Put all the Ford parts on a Chevy you like. A surgical scar, no matter how pretty, is still nothing more than a surgical scar. Props, if you will. People get leopard-spot tattoos and fangs implanted; does that make them leopards? Of course not.

This is another example of self-indulgence taken to extremes.

What!!! How dare you imply I'm not a vampire leopard. I was born that way, really really.

British: Talk about your manufactured pop stars.

Good one!

+1, golf clap

gweilo8888: Anybody else read this as "youngest ever sex swap pornstar"?

/shudders to think what this says about me

Nah, there are at least two of us

Ok so if s/he looks like a girl, s/he smells like a girl, feels like a girl and operates like a girl then why would attraction to him/her make a guy ghey?

In this situation this person could easily pass in public as a female with nobody here any wiser thanks to the quick reaction to his/her personality as a child.

For you "genetic basis advocates", sure genetically she's got guy chromosomes, but isn't that nothing more than a genetic blueprint? Obviously it can't be all-encompassing in determining gender if hormones can alter the end result.

If I buy a 2 bdr house and turn one bedroom into a garage, is it still a 2 bedroom garage? No. It's still a house and for all intensive purposes the blueprints may still remain identical if the location of the garage is practical.

/attraction, it's all a matter of perspective
//if it were an abomination unto god, why would he allow his creation to be so malleable?

HAMMERTOE: XY != XX

It's written into every last cell of his body.

Put all the Ford parts on a Chevy you like. A surgical scar, no matter how pretty, is still nothing more than a surgical scar. Props, if you will. People get leopard-spot tattoos and fangs implanted; does that make them leopards? Of course not.

This is another example of self-indulgence taken to extremes.

And then there's you. Forgot about you.

OK, let's get cracking.

First, your idea that 46, XY is the only chromosomal configuration for a male. Laughable.

Your comparison of animal paraphilia to transsexualism and transgendrism. DSM-IV clearly delineates the two. Also laughable.

And if all the Ford parts are in a Chevy, literally makes it a Ford in a Chevy's body. So that's a failed analogy accidentally proving the opposite point you were trying to make.

So good for you, your entire post can be summarized by the three massive mental farkups you had to make to write it.

Cthulhu Theory: Ok so if s/he looks like a girl, s/he smells like a girl, feels like a girl and operates like a girl then why would attraction to him/her make a guy ghey?

In this situation this person could easily pass in public as a female with nobody here any wiser thanks to the quick reaction to his/her personality as a child.

For you "genetic basis advocates", sure genetically she's got guy chromosomes, but isn't that nothing more than a genetic blueprint? Obviously it can't be all-encompassing in determining gender if hormones can alter the end result.

If I buy a 2 bdr house and turn one bedroom into a garage, is it still a 2 bedroom garage house? No. It's still a house and for all intensive purposes the blueprints may still remain identical if the location of the garage is practical.

/attraction, it's all a matter of perspective
//if it were an abomination unto god, why would he allow his creation to be so malleable?

FTFM

Cthulhu Theory: If I buy a 2 bdr house and turn one bedroom into a garage, is it still a 2 bedroom garage? No. It's still a house and for all intensive purposes the blueprints may still remain identical if the location of the garage is practical.

I like you, but please, please, use the correct term "all intents and purposes" before I have a seizure and an aneurysm all at the same time. (And also I think you meant 2 bedroom house, not garage... but that's obvious. But please, think of the children with the all intensive purposes thing. They do suffer so.)

I love medical science.

Go scientists!

...but she's a man, baby

TwistedFark: Grass Hopper: cchris_39: RemyDuron: Uh. . . 16? They gave her the operation at 16? What the fark? Unless there are some major extenuating circumstance, like the kid was a hermaphrodite and her parents chose one gender but she favored another, that seems pretty reckless and could backfire on the poor kid.

Agreed - and apparently they started on her on hormones at 13 to suppress the testosterone surge.

Really sick stuff.

Maybe. On the other hand (just playing devil's advocate) if s/he still wanted to be a woman at 18, then the body would have gone through a lot of changes that would be hard to reverse/overcome - something s/he avoided this way by changing early.

/not sure this is right or wrong. Just interesting.

Not really. The hormones should have stopped that. The real argument I suppose is "whats the magic number at which a human being can accept responsibility for their actions".

The answer seems to vary quite a deal :O

I see your point - hormones until age of Majority.

Dr. Mojo PhD: Cthulhu Theory: If I buy a 2 bdr house and turn one bedroom into a garage, is it still a 2 bedroom garage? No. It's still a house and for all intensive purposes the blueprints may still remain identical if the location of the garage is practical.

I like you, but please, please, use the correct term "all intents and purposes" before I have a seizure and an aneurysm all at the same time. (And also I think you meant 2 bedroom house, not garage... but that's obvious. But please, think of the children with the all intensive purposes thing. They do suffer so.)

Thanks for pointing that out, I make that mistake a lot, something I picked up from my family. I'm not entirely sure where I stand on this whole gender change thing. I do believe that XY does mean you're genetically a man, but like I said that's malleable and, for all "intents and purposes," I feel it boils down to how you appear to others.

I've a roommate that recently made a trip to meet a pre-op who's saving up for his gender reassignment, but still looks like a girl. I think the important part is how you view the person. You may know that it is/was a guy, but you view him as a female then ultimately the guy is no longer a guy but a female in your minds eye.

/Just because she WAS a man doesn't mean she still IS a man.
//Again it's all a matter of perspective
///understands it's human nature to be judgemental especially of the things we don't understand or even think we understand

HAMMERTOE: Despite all appearances, he won't be a "woman" until his first ovulation.


At her most recent concert, she received a standing ovulation

I don't know how good they are at the whole reconstructive surgery thing but I've seen a lot of phaginas, and I bet that a reconstructed one looks.... "fake."


/ seen a lot of phaginas
// you can tell from the pixels
/// 'shopped

TheSignPost: I don't know how good they are at the whole reconstructive surgery thing but I've seen a lot of phaginas, and I bet that a reconstructed one looks.... "fake."


/ seen a lot of phaginas
// you can tell from the pixels
/// 'shopped

do some googling, the good ones are pretty realistic looking, don't know how well they 'perform' though.

don't matter what happens to her, she'll still be far less f*cked up than Michael Jackson's "children"

I hate it when I miss a thread like this.

Miggity: adhamh:


good lord. is that it? i would totally hit it.

Who's the sleestak?

WhyteRaven74: I hate it when I miss a thread like this.

I know, you could have taught these guys a thing or two! Don't miss it next time, I need more allies. :)

TheSignPost: I don't know how good they are at the whole reconstructive surgery thing but I've seen a lot of phaginas, and I bet that a reconstructed one looks.... "fake."


/ seen a lot of phaginas
// you can tell from the pixels
/// 'shopped

There have been some amazing advances in surgery, and it makes for a fascinating afternoon (at least) of reading if you're up for it. The original surgeries were rather crude in nature, but as time has gone on and some brilliant surgeons have entered the game, they can make everything look indistinguishable from other women. Going female to male presents far more challenges, but male to female can look extremely realistic and function very well, too. It all depends on the skill of the surgeon, and luck as to how you'll heal up (some people just end up with more sensation and functionality than others).

Dr. Mojo PhD: I think that there's just a lot of "I NO I HOPE I HAVEN'T SLEPT WITH A SECRET XY-WOMAN" penis shrinking Zionist robot comb style terror here.

Oh yes, I know I bring my karyotyping kit every time I seek out a guy to date. :D

Renowned transvestite sexologist: Wearing a beak and putting feathers up my ass doesn't make me a chicken.

I know people who'd pay good money for that kind of action.

Ok, who is this?



and this pics makes my no no place feel funny.

""I only ever did girls' stuff and only ever had female friends. I always wanted to play with dolls. I loved dresses and the colour pink - I was a totally girly girl." "

You can be a boy and still do this stuff. Nothing says you can only do this if you have a vagina.

katastrophe: I know, you could have taught these guys a thing or two! Don't miss it next time, I need more allies. :)

hehe if I had been able to check what was going over night, I would've seen this in the upcoming links list or seen it when it showed up on the main page.

There have been some amazing advances in surgery

That there have been. To the point to where a good doc can make it so only another doc can tell it's not original equipment. And even then, it takes some looking around.

Course besides the obvious surgery other surgery has improved to help things too, though it falls under the realm of more general plastic surgery, things like scraping down an adam's apple, facial feminization surgery etc. Though a bunch of the improvement is just better plastic surgeons getting in on it.

Dr. Mojo PhD: And yet I get the sneaky feeling I've reached no one.

Imagine how I feel in these threads ;) And thanks for picking up the slack brought on by me not being here

/kept saying it was waitng for Fark last night, every other page loaded right away except for Fark

Wouldn't "it" be a bit dry or what do you re-route for that?

gbv23: HAMMERTOE: Despite all appearances, he won't be a "woman" until his first ovulation.


At her most recent concert, she received a standing ovulation

At first I was like :|
But then I was like :D

MK-Ultra71: Ok, who is this?




Linetrap: http://www.myspace.com/gayforbridget

Dr. Mojo PhD

Trans-Farkette here, you've done a valiant job of fighting the tide of idiocy. You might not have reached anyone, but for what it's worth, thanks for trying. :)

darrent83: Dinjiin, why quote me at all if your going to totally ignore the point of my post? I mean you took a sentence fragment and then went on a rant that totally differed from what I was trying to say. I was never saying that this happens now a days in the western world. But it still goes on in Iran.

Eventually, things will change in Iran. Once they get their act together and throw the theocratic government out, there is a good chance that Iran will move to a western model for psychiatric care, and that gender reassignment will no longer be a back door for effeminate gay men to live their lifestyle.

I think the question we all have on our mind is what does he/she look like down there? Does it feel real? And, could I hit it without thinking about "it" being a dude in the back of my mind?

dougfm: Vash's Apprentice: ftfy
/sorry, couldn't resist :p

Did it even occur in that pea brain of yours to just quote the one line your moron picture went with?

Sorry, I tried being too clever and it backfired on me.
/Makes mental note:no more morning editing
//P.S.:Lighten up, Francis

you_idiot: ""I only ever did girls' stuff and only ever had female friends. I always wanted to play with dolls. I loved dresses and the colour pink - I was a totally girly girl." "

You can be a boy and still do this stuff. Nothing says you can only do this if you have a vagina.

Look at her. She's a scrawny little one who's into girly stuff.

As a boy, she'd be an epic farking failure. As a girl, she's epic farking win. And all she's changed is gender.

Can you blame her for choosing that life?

Pxtl: As a boy, she'd be an epic farking failure. As a girl, she's epic farking win. And all she's changed is gender.

That's a point a lot of people don't get. And if they don't, it's hard as hell to explain it to them. I mean it's not just about feeling out of place in your own body, but just not being able to innately act right or relate to things.

/would be so screwed if not for my love of sports, video games and nerd stuff
//even then, fail at teh dude stuff, badly

ColdFusion: Dr. Mojo PhD

Trans-Farkette here, you've done a valiant job of fighting the tide of idiocy. You might not have reached anyone, but for what it's worth, thanks for trying. :)

Well, I was on the fence as to the age at which this was done, but much of his argument helped to sway me fully to the side that this was the correct course of action. Your time was not totally wasted, if that makes anyone feel better.

Well, I was on the fence as to the age at which this was done, but much of his argument helped to sway me fully to the side that this was the correct course of action. Your time was not totally wasted, if that makes anyone feel better.

I can say with extreme ease that I knew as far back as I could remember that something was wrong, but I couldn't put a word to it. Until I was 13 and learned that there was even a word for how I felt, I thought I was the only person in the world who felt that way. To a kid, that's the worst feeling in the world, to be lonely like that. There was no way I could've told anyone. Once I found out there were other people, though, I told my mother.

But, because I was 13, she said I was confused, took me to a "Christian Therapist" to get "fixed". It didn't work, clearly. I had a few suicide attempts with pills, almost drank a drain-o smoothie before a friend talked me out of it. I tried to "deal", and I repressed it for a while, but my mom disbelieving me and not helping me, it farked up my head for about a decade until things eventually came to a head all my little "coping tricks" stopped working, and I had to confront it.

Now, I've got to fight my own biology and a whole host of other legal and personal issues that would've been less painful for everyone involved if it was just handled sooner. Hell, part of it might have been covered by my parent's health insurance when I was little (not the surgery, but the therapy and doctor's visits and such) but I can't even GET insurance because I'm trans, even if I walked into CIGNA HQ with a briefcase full of $100's. They won't touch me now; disqualifying pre-existing condition, after all.

I'd give a kidney and my left eye if I could've done what this girl's done. But at least I can hope her example means that that someone like me won't have to go through what I did because people don't understand it.

ok, I would hit it and bet I would get anal from her too!

XX = female

XY = male

If you are XY, then you are a male. If you are XY and take artificial hormones and have your penis surgically transformed into a "vagina," then you are still a male. But, now you have a mutilated penis.

Approve

/obscure to some?
//link hotter than the summer of 76

Did they also remove all reason and accountability?

Dr. Mojo PhD has plummetted into this thread like a ninja riding a lightning bolt into the centre of a thousand rioting demons. It is a thing of great beauty to watch him smack his opponents upside the head with his butterfly kicks of justice. LOGIC! *pow* SCIENCE! *pow* PSYCHOLOGY! *pow* I am not ashamed to admit that as I read this thread, I wept a single tear of joy.

That is all.

ColdFusion: I can say with extreme ease that I knew as far back as I could remember that something was wrong

In my case, I always knew what I wanted. Just got lucky and knew saying anything to my parents would be bad mojo. But a bunch of the other details are the same.

jigger: If you are XY, then you are a male

Even if the single gene on the Y chromosome that triggers male development is defective and thus that development never occurs resulting in a female body?

Mole Man: Approve

hah niiice

Pxtl: As a boy, she'd be an epic farking failure. As a girl, she's epic farking win. And all she's changed is gender.

Technically all she changed was sex, her gender remained the same. I know, it's confusing, because so often in the States we use gender as a PC term for sex, but they are two different things. Sex is the physical stuff, gender is the mental stuff though.

But yeah, I was pretty much considered to be a dweeb/dork/nerd whatever, but because I had some masculine interests I was able to pass as a man for years. When I finally transitioned and started living as a woman, relationships became a lot easier in some aspects. I had a girlfriend for a few years, we broke up, now I'm living with another woman who is absolutely wonderful, and we just celebrated our 1 year anniversary of being together. I guess what I'm saying is you're absolutely right in that failure tends to happen when you're not in the right body and can't relate to other people.

jigger: XX = female

XY = male

If you are XY, then you are a male. If you are XY and take artificial hormones and have your penis surgically transformed into a "vagina," then you are still a male. But, now you have a mutilated penis.

So what is your point? Wow, so you have specific chromosomes, big deal. No one cares about chromosomes, people care about appearance and genitals.