Crosshair: clgrin: Ah yes,,, a currency flood. That would explain the massive inflation we're having... oh wait, we're deflating/neutral

If someone eats a high carb diet, but exercises a lot, they don't gain weight. If they just eat a high carb diet, they will get fat.

The deflationary pressures are temporary. Once they run their course, get ready to hear your ears pop. Though we are already seeing inflation. I see it manifesting locally in food prices.

Not to mention the Core CPI is horrifically manipulated. Just look at how it is calculated and how it is published in the media.

What do you trust more? The weatherman who says the sun is shining or the view out your window that shows it is raining. The government has a strong vested interest in under reporting inflation.

Yes... this would be true if you actually thought we were trying to print large amounts of money for a long time. So true in fact that the President turned down calls for second stimulus for that reason (among others). So true that it's preventing some banks from returning their TARP money at a discount rather than the nominal value. So true, in fact, that the FED has begun to shunt its purchasing of Treasury bonds, which is about the only aspect of the stimulus that could actuallyb e considered printing money

joethebastard: Nemo's Brother: James F. Campbell: I thought trolling was against the FArQ? If so, why don't these pieces of shiat do something about that Nemo farkwad?

Because disagreeing with your fragile little views isn't trolling. Name-calling may be though.

Nemo has a point, James: it's only trolling if they're pretending to be stupid.

Considering all of the personal attacks I am getting you would think that I was insulting somone's religion. Maybe I am. Maybe a lot of Total Farkers consider me an apostate or blasphemer for criticizing their guy.

Nemo's Brother: Obama has either gone full retard, or he is a brilliant and wants American to fall.

You are criticizing Obama's policies, and are therefore trolling.

Nemo's Brother: joethebastard: Nemo's Brother: James F. Campbell: I thought trolling was against the FArQ? If so, why don't these pieces of shiat do something about that Nemo farkwad?

Because disagreeing with your fragile little views isn't trolling. Name-calling may be though.

Nemo has a point, James: it's only trolling if they're pretending to be stupid.

Considering all of the personal attacks I am getting you would think that I was insulting somone's religion. Maybe I am. Maybe a lot of Total Farkers consider me an apostate or blasphemer for criticizing their guy.

No, you have every right to criticize anyone you want to. Hell, everyone will be criticizing him before his 4 are up, except some of those who voted for him and will never admit they farqued up.

IonBeam2: Nemo's Brother: Obama has either gone full retard, or he is a brilliant and wants American to fall.

You are criticizing Obama's policies, and are therefore trolling.

My bad.

came for the Metalocalypse quotes/pictures, leaving disappointed that I'm the first.

"And I promise every Floridian that you will all be rich! Because we're going to print more money; why didn't anybody ever think of this before?!"

/"I feel we should go to Purple Alert."

Nemo's Brother: Considering all of the personal attacks I am getting you would think that I was insulting somone's religion. Maybe I am. Maybe a lot of Total Farkers consider me an apostate or blasphemer for criticizing their guy.

A blasphemer? Wow.

An alternative hypothesis would be that we welcome intellectual criticism because we realize that economics is complicated and that Obama has been far from perfect. The personal attacks directed at you, then, are just because you're an idiot.

elchip: dustman81: Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator. Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator. Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator. Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator. Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator. Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator. Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator. Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator. Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator. Unemployment is a lagging economic indicator.

The jobs wouldn't magically appear as soon as Obama finished signing the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act (ARRA). The money is starting to flow, but it does take time. Agencies are starting to get the money and are bidding projects and hiring workers.

Unfortunately, Americans want everything fixed right now and don't understand the concept of patience.



Republicans are gonna be so pissed when the unemployment rate starts going down...



How many of those are government jobs? If you realize that there is no such thing as infinite resources, how can you think that spending money on things we don't need and lowering efficiency will help in the long run?

joethebastard Quote 2009-07-12 05:32:21 PM
libbynomore2: Wow, you're really dumb......Bush never said....." misunderestimated "...... it was a word " made up " by Will Ferrell on SNL

I know that your opinion isn't swayed by actual facts, but I'm posting this anyway for comedic effect.

Let me guess.....Obama voter right?

I'm educated and pay my taxes; you figure it out.


I stand corrected ( although an actual audio citation would help...I mean BBC? they got busted for ficticious reports on the Iraq war... )....that said...wish Obama would do the same.....he claims he misunderestimated an economy that he claimed was the worst since the Great Depression......how do you misunderestimate that?

His plan has been a colossal failure and will leave us in debt for generations and yet wants to spend trillions upon trillions more on health care and energy not to mention his budget......

apparently YOU'RE willing to trust him on all of that........people who actually foot the bill don't.......and the pennies you pay in taxes don't really count....but hey, I have no problem with the messiah's disciples paying for his folly....

WhyteRaven74: xaveth: Um, yeah... keep waiting on that sheeple.

If you have any better ideas, offer them up, or STFU.

Riiiiight... because Obama and his cute apologists have all the right ideas, huh? Yeh, good luck with that one sparky. Just keep chanting, "Hope and change."

ZippyChippy: I am a college grant proposal writer so this stimulus money has has had a direct impact on my job at school, both as it's filtered down through the feds and the state. From where I sit it seems like the equivalent of flying over in a helicopter and throwing money out. Some of the people who pick the money up are going to spend it wisely and on necessaries, and some are going to squander it and come whining for more when it's gone. In my state, there seems to have been several large block grants made to various entities. These entities are now figuring out, rather haphazardly, how to spend the money. We were just given a $300,000 grant by our local workforce investment board. We asked the funder when we got the grant, how they would like us to report results back to them, they said they didn't know. And if you look at the funding document, sure enough, under "reporting," it says, in so many words, we haven't read the bill yet, we don't
what requirements there are, if any, so we'll get back to you. It's the first time I've seen the phrase "unknown at this time" in a government funding document regarding accountability. These people aren't going to check to see if we did what we said we would. We are, but no one's really checking. And it all has to be spent by mid-August. We had 6 weeks to spend the money. It's not as easy as you might think to spend that kind of money without going to jail. It's all very rushed, mostly very half-assed, and much of it is of questionable use. The emphasis is on "green" jobs almost to the exclusion of all else, even though this is not a high-growth sector in my area right now. Thus, the people we are training with all this money...still won't have jobs when they're done. Most of the green stuff is mandated, so there's no choice to use the money to bolster the workforce in whatever sector is hiring locally. There's the opportunity for great good to be done...but it's like the program shot itself in the foot right off the bat. Some people will end up being helped by this, which is good, but there's not nearly enough bang for the buck here, at least from the experiences I've had with it so far.

Not to dispute your account, but you do realize the vast majority of the stimulus money has yet to be paid out. The delay was to specifically prevent the frivolous waste you describe. In addition, only a couple of billion was specifically set aside for "green" jobs/effects. The whole reason there has yet to be "bridge to nowhere" type reports of stimulus spending is that was disbursed was either directly to the unemployment rolls or pre-targeted projects (which tend to be the green ones) Most states are still waiting for the general construction funds to come in (at least thats the case here in Virginia)

PC LOAD LETTER: Nemo's Brother: Obama has either gone full retard, or he is a brilliant and wants American to fall.

Remember Descent:

The highest form of patriotic.



The highest form of patriotic.

xaveth: WhyteRaven74: xaveth: Um, yeah... keep waiting on that sheeple.

If you have any better ideas, offer them up, or STFU.

Riiiiight... because Obama and his cute apologists have all the right ideas, huh? Yeh, good luck with that one sparky. Just keep chanting, "Hope and change."

ACtually, if you read the words he wrote and not the whatever the impotent rage put before your eyes... he was in fact asking for ideas, not saying he has the correct ones. In fact, I'm sure if you had actually listed something rather than calling him a cultist, a good discussion may have been had by all.

yelmrog Quote 2009-07-12 05:34:09 PM
libbynomore2: Wow, you're really dumb......Bush never said....." misunderestimated "...... it was a word " made up " by Will Ferrell on SNL

No, "Strategery" is the word made up by Will Ferrell.


YES....you'd absolutely right...that was the word.....again....I stand corrected.....

and again......wish Obama would do the same on his money grab disguised as a stimulus plan...which has not, and will not work.

That's why so many have already lost faith in him

Klingon Penis: It also happens to describe most of the modern-day Republican Party

Yep it does. To the point you don't even need to address how while they claim to be for the people, if a corporate lobbyist shows up they'll do whatever that one person wants no matter what the people want. Or their lovely trend to never putting people ahead of business or money.

libbynomore2: I stand corrected ( although an actual audio citation would help...I mean BBC? they got busted for ficticious reports on the Iraq war... )

Yeah, I'm sure they made it up. American news is so much more reliable.

His plan has been a colossal failure and will leave us in debt for generations and yet wants to spend trillions upon trillions more on health care and energy not to mention his budget......

No one that understood economics, at all, would have expected his plan to work yet. He hasn't even spent all the money in the stimulus package. So by what metric are you determining that the plan has already failed?

apparently YOU'RE willing to trust him on all of that........people who actually foot the bill don't.......

I never said that I trust Obama. I don't even necessarily trust Keynesian economics- but it's the only systematic approach to the problem that anyone suggested.

and the pennies you pay in taxes don't really count....

It's hard to tell- when you're just making crap up to fit what you already believe, do you realize that you're just making crap up?

libbynomore2: joethebastard Quote 2009-07-12 05:32:21 PM
libbynomore2: Wow, you're really dumb......Bush never said....." misunderestimated "...... it was a word " made up " by Will Ferrell on SNL

I know that your opinion isn't swayed by actual facts, but I'm posting this anyway for comedic effect.

Let me guess.....Obama voter right?

I'm educated and pay my taxes; you figure it out.


I stand corrected ( although an actual audio citation would help...I mean BBC? they got busted for ficticious reports on the Iraq war... )....that said...wish Obama would do the same.....he claims he misunderestimated an economy that he claimed was the worst since the Great Depression......how do you misunderestimate that?

His plan has been a colossal failure and will leave us in debt for generations and yet wants to spend trillions upon trillions more on health care and energy not to mention his budget......

apparently YOU'RE willing to trust him on all of that........people who actually foot the bill don't.......and the pennies you pay in taxes don't really count....but hey, I have no problem with the messiah's disciples paying for his folly....

You might as well leave the thread. No one is going to take you seriously (they never did anyway) after we've proved you're outright lying and obviously not checking any of your cute little facts.

IonBeam2: elchip: dustman81:



Republicans are gonna be so pissed when the unemployment rate starts going down...



How many of those are government jobs? If you realize that there is no such thing as infinite resources, how can you think that spending money on things we don't need and lowering efficiency will help in the long run?

Not to many, I would imagine. Despite what you may have heard, the government (feds included, but especially state and local) have been shedding jobs with the rest of them. US mail is down. DHS is down (well, stagnant) HHS is down. State law enforcement is way down. About the only gov't sectors that got any serious cash during the last year or so have been in R&D/tech, and it takes a while for money there to uptick a large # of jobs

libbynomore2: yelmrog Quote 2009-07-12 05:34:09 PM
libbynomore2: Wow, you're really dumb......Bush never said....." misunderestimated "...... it was a word " made up " by Will Ferrell on SNL

No, "Strategery" is the word made up by Will Ferrell.


YES....you'd absolutely right...that was the word.....again....I stand corrected.....

and again......wish Obama would do the same on his money grab disguised as a stimulus plan...which has not, and will not work.

That's why so many have already lost faith in him

What was really strange about the whole thing is how Obama decided that he'd rather give the money to failing corporations rather than welfare moms.

Obama, seekrit reepublikim?

libbynomore2: I stand corrected ( although an actual audio citation would help...I mean BBC?

OK

Klingon Penis: There's a phrase for morans like Mr. Right: witless contrarian. Opposes everything, right or wrong, for the sake of acquiring/reacquiring political power and/or trying to prove a particular ideology.

It also happens to describe most of the modern-day Republican Party, which is why they're so far in the crapper they won't see daylight for decades.

When immature minds run out of argument, they descend to name calling. I have absolutely no desire for political power. That would be Obama - track his career. Politicians in general these days are much more interested in the acquisition and maintenance of power than in any intelligent governance. I not only am not interested, I wish no one else was.

I don't need to prove an ideology. Free market capitalism, limited government interference, a government that works for the governed instead of the other way around, individual liberty and security - those were proven long before I was around and they will be valid ideas long after I'm gone - whether they still exist in this country or not. And I'm all for those. I am against a government that arrogates to itself the power to take those things away. And our government has been working on that for decades now. Both parties. There have been a few shining moments but it has generally been a long, down-hill slide.

I have absolutely no patience or tolerance for people who allow themselves to be enslaved by the government in search of some greater good. From seatbelt laws to smoking restrictions to EPA regulations to the onerous regulations on businesses, to the incredible amount of regulation regarding how one can transport a young child in a motor vehicle, the government has decided that it knows best and must take care of us. And we have let it. When I lose my patience is when people actually argue in favor of more government control under the guise of taking care of us.

I'm amused by your view of the Republican Party. Understand that I am not now nor have I ever been a member of any political party. But the same was said about the Democrats in 1994. It was said they were out of touch. They were and they are. The Republicans are now out of power in addition to being out of touch. That will change. What seems to be constant is that our politicians will serve themselves and we, the people, will be screwed. So keep supporting Obama's economic policies. Because they are rooted in government control, they will fail. It will not be amusing.

And now I have to go bury the woodchuck that just encroached on my deck. And I'll have to clean the deck. Single shot, .22 LR hollowpoint, just behind the right ear. Bastard then had the temerity to bleed all over my deck.

So have a nice day. Bye.

libbynomore2: Take responsibility for your actions for once!

Yeah how about getting the people on your side of the aisle to take responsibility for what they've wrought? And if you honestly think the economy can be fixed, by any means, in a few months, you really need to study economics. Even the profs at the U of Chicago, the people that produced the thinking beloved by the GOP, don't think it's possible to turn the economy in a few months.

lefande: he ran on a platform of the criminalization of profit and the redistribution of wealt

Reality called, it misses you.

xaveth: Riiiiight... because Obama and his cute apologists have all the right ideas, huh? Yeh, good luck with that one sparky. Just keep chanting, "Hope and change."

If you are unwilling to help, you have no place in trying to blame others for not succeeding or criticizing them for trying.

clgrin: IonBeam2: elchip: dustman81:



Republicans are gonna be so pissed when the unemployment rate starts going down...



How many of those are government jobs? If you realize that there is no such thing as infinite resources, how can you think that spending money on things we don't need and lowering efficiency will help in the long run?

Not to many, I would imagine. Despite what you may have heard, the government (feds included, but especially state and local) have been shedding jobs with the rest of them. US mail is down. DHS is down (well, stagnant) HHS is down. State law enforcement is way down. About the only gov't sectors that got any serious cash during the last year or so have been in R&D/tech, and it takes a while for money there to uptick a large # of jobs

Correcting my self, state law enforcement also got a lot in the stimulus, it's only now starting to come in

Mr. Right: Free market capitalism

Adam Smith wants a word with you about your idea of that. What you call a free market Smith would call an abomination.

the government has decided that it knows best and must take care of us

A great many of those regulations arose only after it became clear those who should be doing things properly had no interest in doing so.

Mr. Right: And now I have to go bury the woodchuck that just encroached on my deck. And I'll have to clean the deck. Single shot, .22 LR hollowpoint, just behind the right ear. Bastard then had the temerity to bleed all over my deck.

You see? He's a tough rugged individualist. Those damn woodchucks encroach on his proper-tie, they'd better start prayin'. In fact, just the other day, some wild Indians showed up to rape his wife and kidnap his children, but he beat them off single-handed.

WhyteRaven74: Mr. Right: Free market capitalism

Adam Smith wants a word with you about your idea of that. What you call a free market Smith would call an abomination.

the government has decided that it knows best and must take care of us

A great many of those regulations arose only after it became clear those who should be doing things properly had no interest in doing so.

How in the hell do you presume to know what I call a free market?

Who gets to decide how things are "properly" done?

One of the ways we know the left is out of touch is that they actually believe they get to come up with all the definitions. You don't.

clgrin: Not to dispute your account, but you do realize the vast majority of the stimulus money has yet to be paid out. The delay was to specifically prevent the frivolous waste you describe. In addition, only a couple of billion was specifically set aside for "green" jobs/effects. The whole reason there has yet to be "bridge to nowhere" type reports of stimulus spending is that was disbursed was either directly to the unemployment rolls or pre-targeted projects (which tend to be the green ones) Most states are still waiting for the general construction funds to come in (at least thats the case here in Virginia)

Yes, I do. That's why I am only talking about something that I know first-hand. The way education will experience this crazy stimulus thing will be different than other sectors, I'm sure. The money certainly seems to be flowing more quickly to us than other areas. From what I can see both from my own experience, and from perusing all of the available funding out there that is springing from this, there is a hell of a lot of money being put up, an incredible surge in funding opportunities at all levels of education, much of it, so far, on green initiatives. Personally, I think the emphasis on the green sector is overdone right now, but I don't get paid to write proposals for projects I agree with. I'll do what I need to do. My only real concern is the uncharacteristic lack of accountability and reporting in many of the guidelines I've seen so far. I think the rush has something to do with the approaching end of the federal fiscal year Sept. 29. Traditionally, all federal funds must be encumbered by that time. Maybe that accounts for the rush. I have no idea if the other stimulus money has that same stipulation or not. If so, they won't be able to spend much more than they've spent now. But I suspect they have more leeway than that.

WhyteRaven74: Klingon Penis: It also happens to describe most of the modern-day Republican Party

Yep it does. To the point you don't even need to address how while they claim to be for the people, if a corporate lobbyist shows up they'll do whatever that one person wants no matter what the people want. Or their lovely trend to never putting people ahead of business or money.

And the Democrats will do the same for the unions. Repugnicans give it to us from the front, Democrats give it to us from the rear.

Mr. Right: How in the hell do you presume to know what I call a free market?

By virtue of what you say about government regulation and other things.

Who gets to decide how things are "properly" done?

In some cases it's rather simple, when you have the means to do things better and don't and as a result harm people or increase the likelihood harm will come to them, yeah you've failed. In other cases, not so easy.

ZippyChippy: clgrin: Not to dispute your account, but you do realize the vast majority of the stimulus money has yet to be paid out. The delay was to specifically prevent the frivolous waste you describe. In addition, only a couple of billion was specifically set aside for "green" jobs/effects. The whole reason there has yet to be "bridge to nowhere" type reports of stimulus spending is that was disbursed was either directly to the unemployment rolls or pre-targeted projects (which tend to be the green ones) Most states are still waiting for the general construction funds to come in (at least thats the case here in Virginia)

Yes, I do. That's why I am only talking about something that I know first-hand. The way education will experience this crazy stimulus thing will be different than other sectors, I'm sure. The money certainly seems to be flowing more quickly to us than other areas. From what I can see both from my own experience, and from perusing all of the available funding out there that is springing from this, there is a hell of a lot of money being put up, an incredible surge in funding opportunities at all levels of education, much of it, so far, on green initiatives. Personally, I think the emphasis on the green sector is overdone right now, but I don't get paid to write proposals for projects I agree with. I'll do what I need to do. My only real concern is the uncharacteristic lack of accountability and reporting in many of the guidelines I've seen so far. I think the rush has something to do with the approaching end of the federal fiscal year Sept. 29. Traditionally, all federal funds must be encumbered by that time. Maybe that accounts for the rush. I have no idea if the other stimulus money has that same stipulation or not. If so, they won't be able to spend much more than they've spent now. But I suspect they have more leeway than that.

If I might ask, do you primarily get grant requests for a certain business sector or is more by whoever is in the area. My brother used to do a lot a grant writing himself, but he pretty much only did stuff with think-tanks.

RadicalArcher: came for the Metalocalypse quotes/pictures, leaving disappointed that I'm the first.

"And I promise every Floridian that you will all be rich! Because we're going to print more money; why didn't anybody ever think of this before?!"

/"I feel we should go to Purple Alert."

Well just because it was a rerun the other night..I let it go..But I did fall off my sofa laughing..

Didn't Obama himself give a completely unrealistic timeline for his stimulus plan to start affecting the job market?

The stimulus plan is a great way boost oil speculation and keep fuel prices up. I don't know that it helps anyone else.

libbynomore2: Wow, you're really dumb......Bush never said....." misunderestimated "...... it was a word " made up " by Will Ferrell on SNL

No, "Strategery" is the word made up by Will Ferrell.

"They misunderestimated me," - G.W. Bush Nov 6, 2000, Bentonville, Arkansas, in response to peoples' surprise that he had beaten out John McCain for the nomination

From Time magazine.
libbynomore2,

As they say on That Seventies Show....


Buuuuuuuurrrrn.

Good research yelmrog and joethebastard.

My take is that they are all politicians and therefore all bad. Obama's going to be bad for the economy too. The economy can rectify itself if we let capitalism work as another farker mentioned in his reference to Adam Smith's "The Invisible Hand." Now if we could just keep the politicians' hands out of it.

Oh and if the economy does recover (in spite of Obama), he'll be first in line to take credit.

Mr. Right: Free market capitalism

Hasn't existed since the Sherman Act. That's 1890, if you have no idea what I am talking about.


limited government interference

What's "limited"?

What's "interference"?

Completely variably-definable buzzword crap.

Also, the Government has demonstrated it's right to "interfere" with things ever since the Whiskey Rebellion. That's 1794 if you don't know what I am talking about.

a government that works for the governed instead of the other way around

More buzzword undefinable crap. Lobbyists are a great source of lack of democracy in legislation. Get rid of them. Obama's admin has the lowest number of lobbyists in recent history (though he missed on his "none" bit). You should be applauding. I don't hear you.

individual liberty and security

More undefinable GOP buzzword bullshiat.

The problem with buzzwords is at some point, they have to represent something uniformly real. The Democrats made that mistake in the 80s and again with Kerry. Buzzwords get ignored at some point.

GaryPDX: SingletonFactory: This wasn't a simple case of a company making or selling a bad product or service, it was a case of whole industries becoming toxic to the entire economy via the greed and stupidity of a handful of incredibly wealthy people. Caveat emptor doesn't really apply.

Who's all tied up with Wall Street now..eh? And the biggest ponzi scheme in American history was done by a Democrat.

Good point, but that wasn't your original argument.

Anyway, the economy has been crapping out because it was built on a crappy foundation for so many years. You can't pin it on one group of people, one party, or one administration. As much as I hate Bush, I can't even give him full credit for the mess we are in.

As you pointed out earlier, people are starting to learn a little bit and are starting to save money, live within their means a little more, and we are getting to a point where we can try to rebuild a more sustainable economy.

To that end, the current stimulus package and anything else trying to "fix" everything in the short term is not really useful. My idea of an ideal stimulus package (which I realize you probably won't agree with) would be enhancements to unemployment insurance (since more people will be out of work, and for longer - this helps mitigate some of the pain), investments in making education (especially in sciences and engineering) more attainable for people, and more investment in alternate energy (forget the environment, I'm more concerned about the economic implications).

We are in for a bit of pain in the short term, but our long term challenges are pretty daunting.

Partisan arguments never seem to change anyone's mind, do they?

PC LOAD LETTER: individual liberty and security

More undefinable GOP buzzword bullshiat.

Wow, just wow.

We know what these words mean, and they mean a great deal to us.

I'm very sorry you and your President apparently don't.

lefande: We know what these words mean, and they mean a great deal to us.

I'm very sorry you and your President apparently don't.

you know nothing.

5 people in room can't define this consistently.

I think it's a point of liberty to ensure abortion is legal.

Go for it folks. Come to a consensus.

Cagey B: So when you see someone go "OMG why hasn't it WORKED YET!?!"

You mean like Obama and his crew who are saying that because the first one didn't work, we need another round?


You people and your double-talk.

"OMG! We NEED to pass this stimulus bill NOW NOW NOW! There's NO time to waste! No! There's NO time to READ it! Just pass it because the country will disintegrate if you don't DO...IT...NOW!"

A few months later...

"OMG! You people are morans! What? Do you think the government can spin on a dime?"

A little while later...

"Yeah, only a few percent of the stimulus package has been spent. And yeah, most of the spending in the stimulus package isn't even slated for spending until the out-years but we didn't know that the economy was THIS bad when we had to pass it in that very expeditious manner where nobody read it where we put in that the spending was to take place in the out-years. We just figured that if we PASSED THE BILL that the economy would be scared into recovering. We didn't think that the spending actually had to occur now which was why we scheduled it for the out-years. So now we think we need another stimulus package as the first one isn't working because the spending mostly in the out-years so that we can maybe spend some money now. We don't want to rescind the spending in the out-years of the first package even though they haven't been spent yet because we think that it may still help..blahbity-blah-blah-blah

Nakito: Partisan arguments never seem to change anyone's mind, do they?

Ye olde "Us vs. Them".

PC LOAD LETTER: I think it's a point of liberty to ensure abortion is legal.

Agreed.

If you realize that conservatism does not equal religious fundamentalism, you wouldn't make a stupid comment like that.

GaryPDX: Who's all tied up with Wall Street now..eh? And the biggest ponzi scheme in American history was done by a Democrat.

The biggest ponzi scheme in American history is the Social Security retirement program and it was done by Progressives.

Benjimin_Dover: GaryPDX: Who's all tied up with Wall Street now..eh? And the biggest ponzi scheme in American history was done by a Democrat.

The biggest ponzi scheme in American history is the Social Security retirement program and it was done by Progressives.

Yea we should just work people to death or let old people go homeless!

elchipRepublicans are gonna be so pissed when the unemployment rate starts going down...
===================

I'll be pretty happy.

Your comment was stupid.

/republican.

lefande: PC LOAD LETTER: I think it's a point of liberty to ensure abortion is legal.

Agreed.

If you realize that conservatism does not equal religious fundamentalism, you wouldn't make a stupid comment like that.

I said consensus, fool.

If I think a part of liberty is legal abortion and others do not, then we all want "liberty" but the phrase is retarded when you claim WE do not support liberty and that only YOU do when reality is that we think liberty means different things and indeed America cannot agree on the term either. So shut up with the "I'm for Liberty". It's a useless phrase. We all are for it.

YodaTuna: Benjimin_Dover: GaryPDX: Who's all tied up with Wall Street now..eh? And the biggest ponzi scheme in American history was done by a Democrat.

The biggest ponzi scheme in American history is the Social Security retirement program and it was done by Progressives.

Yea we should just work people to death or let old people go homeless!

We should "LET" people do whatever they want.

WhyteRaven74: thermodie: Quit taxing our industries so hard that they take their jobs over seas

Taxes are just the excuse offered up, it in reality has little if anything to ever do with it.

Idiot.

Farking pathetic. America will be worse off than Chicago after this empty head leaves.

Codyl: YodaTuna: Benjimin_Dover: GaryPDX: Who's all tied up with Wall Street now..eh? And the biggest ponzi scheme in American history was done by a Democrat.

The biggest ponzi scheme in American history is the Social Security retirement program and it was done by Progressives.

Yea we should just work people to death or let old people go homeless!

We should "LET" people do whatever they want.

I don't see how social security infringes upon anybody's rights. Unless you think being taxed is an affront to liberty.