I'd say he's had quite a rocky road.

rotsky: I'd say he's had quite a rocky road.

My first sighting! Your actually real!

So, it was a conspiracy to put an innocent cop in jail?

Disapproves.

/he knew his friend

This is why there should not be capital punishment for child molestation (at least without extreme physical evidence). The words of children should really never be used to convict people. They believe in the Tooth Fairy for god's sake.

I think this guy is within his right to put a bullet into each head that colluded to put him away.

It just proves what I always say:

---You can't ever make them go away;

---You can't make them obey;

---But the one thing you can always do: You can always make them pay.

If you go to your door with a gun and make them take you the hard way, you will still be dead---but so will a lot of the enemy. Alexander Solzhenitsyn touched on it, and so did Leon Uris: What if every person arrested in the pogroms or the Holocast had gone to the door with a gun and started shooting?

Yes I concede, you would have been killed. Factor that quick death against a one way trip to Auschwitz, and you have to admit you haven't lost much.

Figure at 20 people, they would be damn worried;

At 200, they would be scared sh*tless;

They never would have gotten to 2000, they would have called it off long before that.

That is the price of 6 million murdered by Hitler, and at least twice that many by Stalin: 2000 people didn't have balls between their legs.

doyner: rotsky: I'd say he's had quite a rocky road.

My first sighting! Your actually real!

I see what you did there.

austerity101: We really need to get over our obsession with child molestation, too.

That's what the pope keeps saying.

Noam Chimpsky: It's strange that there wouldn't be some obvious medical evidence at the time, considering the violent nature of the crimes he was charged with. If there was medical evidence, then something isn't adding up.

During the child molestation trials of the 80's, the investigators were operating on several conflicting, yet absolutely believed, theories of child molestation:
1. Children NEVER lie about being molested;
2. Children WILL LIE to protect the molester (either from fear or misplaced love);
3. If the MOTHER says the child is acting "odd" it is de facto evidence of molestation;
4. If the CHILD says nothing happened, it's because they are "blocking" the memory, and may need repeated questioning and/or leading questions to get to the truth.

All these sound completely idiotic, but they were articles of faith during the witch-hunt molestation trials that ruined hundreds of lives in the 80's and early 90's. It was not uncommon for the child to be interrogated over a period of days or weeks until the story matched what either the prosecutor wanted them to say or what the psychotherapist wanted to believe had happened.

Fat and Nasty 86: What would YOU do for a Klondike bar?

I LOL'd.

USA! USA! We're Number One!

... at jailing our citizens. The United States has the highest incarceration rate and the biggest prison population of any country in the world.

/my state doesn't have its own Fark tag but still holds the record for the highest percentage of people in the justice system out of all 50 states: 1 in 13 adults.

This thread is missing some of our regular contributors. Where are the Farkers who like to say that prison rape is no big deal, and actually kind of funny, because everyone behind bars deserves it anyway?

/"can't do the time, don't do the crime"
//it rhymes, so it must be true

scottydoesntknow Quote 2009-07-11 08:29:12 PM
That's farked up. He spent 20 years in a Federal PMITA prison for child abuse...and he's an ex-cop. Like others have said, he's lucky to be alive. If I were him, the first thing I would have done upon release is walk up to now-retired Detective Krause, and cockpunch him for every day I was in there.

The prosecutors/detectives/and his ex-wife twisted those kid's memories until they didn't even know if he really did abuse them. "You just blocked it out of your memory, of course he abused you!" Sickening.

All those involved with his prosecution should face defamation charges. At least something to let the accused feel vindicated.


Agreed.

Does he still have to register as a sex offender?
Can he retire from the police force with 20+ years back pay? He deserves it if you ask me on top of damages,etc..

They should also lock up the psychologists who invented the whole "blocked memories" BS that led to countless witch hunts, ruining the reputations/lives of thousands of innocent parents just to make a buck.

Zombalupagus: /my state doesn't have its own Fark tag but still holds the record for the highest percentage of people in the justice system out of all 50 states: 1 in 13 adults.

But to be fair, most are black so it doesn't count. Our system really is just....

...if you have money....

...or aren't a minority.

dmd8605: doyner: rotsky: I'd say he's had quite a rocky road.

My first sighting! Your actually real!

I see what you did there.

I dont see wat you didnt do their.

alltandubh: This thread is missing some of our regular contributors. Where are the Farkers who like to say that prison rape is no big deal, and actually kind of funny, because everyone behind bars deserves it anyway?

/"can't do the time, don't do the crime"
//it rhymes, so it must be true

They always hide when there are stories like this, because they know we'll crucify them.

And also because I usually arrive to point out that rape in prison just isn't as universal as they secretly seem to hope. Pervs.

They said they realized as adults the abuse never happened, and they came forward because it was the right thing to do.

Adults? Uh hello? They're age 33 and 30 now. They became adults over a decade ago. Why did they wait to come forward until now? Did their supply of ice cream finally run out?

mud_shark: This is another example of why guilty verdicts should be beyond a reasonable doubt. The anti-death-penalty-pansies just want to ban capital punishment but have no regard for anyone else unfairly convicted.

I follow your argument as being for more accountability... but your first paragraph is very confusing. I am taking from it that you not only think it is an injustice when people are unfairly convicted... but that you also support the death penalty? I'm confused. What about if this fellow had been murdered by the state before his children were of an age of conscience?

I'm not arguing with you... I just felt your first paragraph completely conflicts with the rest. Just seeking some disambiguation.

Police interrogations are an unholy mindfark I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy.

arcas: They said they realized as adults the abuse never happened, and they came forward because it was the right thing to do.

Adults? Uh hello? They're age 33 and 30 now. They became adults over a decade ago. Why did they wait to come forward until now? Did their supply of ice cream finally run out?

Perhaps their supply of shame and human decency just arrived. Ped-Ex ran a little late.

FTFA: In 1985, Spencer entered the no-contest pleas, a type of guilty plea, after learning his court-appointed attorney had not prepared a defense. He felt pleading no contest was his only option, and that he would appeal his convictions.

IANAL, but I'm pretty sure "no contest" is NOT "a type of guilty plea." It's an acknowledgment that you face overwhelming odds.

Poor guy. A life ruined, and for what?

PhotoshopAmateur: their dad is a police office? woah

Their mom must have been a huge slut.

MadAzza: FTFA: In 1985, Spencer entered the no-contest pleas, a type of guilty plea, after learning his court-appointed attorney had not prepared a defense. He felt pleading no contest was his only option, and that he would appeal his convictions.

IANAL, but I'm pretty sure "no contest" is NOT "a type of guilty plea." It's an acknowledgment that you face overwhelming odds.

Poor guy. A life ruined, and for what?

A Klondike bar. We already covered this, sheesh.

Thats what he gets for getting married and having kids.

The two adult children of former Vancouver police officer Clyde Ray Spencer, who spent nearly 20 years in prison after being convicted of molesting them, testified in court Friday the abuse never happened.
/why jail the children?

Fat and Nasty 86: What would YOU do for a Klondike bar?

/thread

MadAzza: FTFA: In 1985, Spencer entered the no-contest pleas, a type of guilty plea, after learning his court-appointed attorney had not prepared a defense. He felt pleading no contest was his only option, and that he would appeal his convictions.

IANAL, but I'm pretty sure "no contest" is NOT "a type of guilty plea." It's an acknowledgment that you face overwhelming odds.

Poor guy. A life ruined, and for what?

No contest. Last I checked, it meant you were neither pleading guilty nor not guilty, but that you weren't contesting the charges and were accepting the sentence as given. In this case, it means the reporter couldn't be bothered to look up "nolo contendre" in his dictionotomy.

I don't get it.

There's something else going on if cops are framing cops instead of covering up for them.

cyberspacedout: I'd have voted for the asinine tag. The cops essentially committed perjury to back up a false accusation, by coercing false testimony from a couple of children.

Sad that it took so long for the truth to come out. Lawsuits, anyone?

Lawsuits o'plenty. This case might be a heads up for all the others that are accused of molesting or other inappropriate behaviour. True rapists, pedos etc should be dealt with appropriately, but it is too easy now with all the mass hysteria to ruin someone's life with some sort of bullshiat grudge or accusation.
The children's mother and the interviewing/coercing cop should fry.

/Clyde Ray? WTF?
//White trash Chester name for sure.

hej: They should let him rape his kids when he gets out, just to make a point.

The kids were bullied into it. I wouldn't blame them.

Cervidanti: Am I wrong, or does the article imply that a cop repeatedly harassed them with questions, trying to force them to come up with testimony that their father abused them?

It says the boy said he abused htem to get another cop to stop repeatedly asking them questions...

Yup. Said cop should get life without parole.

xria: Cervidanti: Am I wrong, or does the article imply that a cop repeatedly harassed them with questions, trying to force them to come up with testimony that their father abused them?

It says the boy said he abused htem to get another cop to stop repeatedly asking them questions...

In some places now they have special teams to interview children, because it is so easy to get them to agree to something that isn't true if you ask it in the wrong way. Someone good at pressuring a gang member to confess to a crime isn't necessarily well equipped in getting the truth from a five year old.

Yeah. As far as I'm concerned all interactions between the police or a therapist with a kid in a suspected abuse situation should be recorded. No tape and they can't testify on the side the person is on. (Normally that would be the prosecution but if the defendant hires someone to examine them the same rule should apply.) Kids are too easy to manipulate!

doyner: He was a cop and he though he had a better chance on APPEAL than from pleading NOT GUILTY? WTF?

He doesn't deserve prison for pederasty but he sure did pay for being a moron.

The problem was at the trial it turned out the public defender hadn't prepared a defense. What else was he supposed to do?

arcas: They said they realized as adults the abuse never happened, and they came forward because it was the right thing to do.

Adults? Uh hello? They're age 33 and 30 now. They became adults over a decade ago. Why did they wait to come forward until now? Did their supply of ice cream finally run out?

Because they realized they weren't repressing memories--that the event never happened in the first place.

This has nothing to do with turning adult, but rather with realizing repressed memories like this normally don't happen.

Someone needs to send that guy to Vagas with a gimp mask, a ball gag, a chainsaw and ten million dollars...

Loren: The problem was at the trial it turned out the public defender hadn't prepared a defense. What else was he supposed to do?

Again, WTF? Wouldn't his union provide a decent lawyer? If not, a cop could sure as heck afford to pay for one.

ctobio: Noam Chimpsky: It's strange that there wouldn't be some obvious medical evidence at the time, considering the violent nature of the crimes he was charged with. If there was medical evidence, then something isn't adding up.

Someone didn't read the article:

For several years, Spencer's appeals failed. He was denied parole five times because he refused to admit guilt and enter a sex offender treatment program.

He hired Seattle attorney Peter Camiel in the mid-1990s. Camiel and a private investigator uncovered several disturbing facts about the investigation - including that prosecutors withheld medical exams that showed no evidence of abuse, despite Krause's claims that the children had been violently, repeatedly raped - and those discoveries led Gov. Gary Locke to commute Spencer's sentence in 2004.

I read it, just didn't process all of it. Hard to see how a cop could be railroaded like that, but I probably didn't process something else in there that explains how that happened. I thought it said something about an affair between the cop's wife and the cop's boss or something too, but I don't feel like reading it again. If I lose any more faith in the system, I will become unpleasant.

hej: They should let him rape his kids when he gets out, just to make a point.

I LOL'd

If I had my life ruined by the biatch wife/prosecutor/etc... after 20 years I'm sure you are bound to the system and will never live a normal life.

Depending on if i felt like living on the outside or not - I would make sure I punish all those who falsely put me in prison. Maybe not killing but definetly some loss of limbs. Serving as a reminder their entire life that true justice is not something you Fark with just so you can get a verdict you want.

Oh yeah - and I would rape the grown up 30 year old kids too, he did the time, might as well do the crime. Yeah they are old, pedobear wouldnt approve but he might as well get some revenge sex out of it.

It took them twenty years to figure out that they made it all up? Shenanigans. Family members recant on testimony all of the time.

TFA: In 1985, Spencer was also convicted of abusing a 4-year-old stepson, who was not at Friday's hearing.

Yeah.

Ahhh. 1980s American Family Values.

accelerus: Depending on if i felt like living on the outside or not - I would make sure I punish all those who falsely put me in prison. Maybe not killing but definetly some loss of limbs. Serving as a reminder their entire life that true justice is not something you Fark with just so you can get a verdict you want.



Approves

Those of you railing against capital punishment, I present you a few points:

1. If this had been a capital punishment case, the flimsy evidence from the prosecution would have been scrutinized a hell of a lot more than it was at the time.

2. Appeals all the way up the chain would have been automatic.

3. The defendant would have had much better representation than he did initially.

mynameist: I think this guy is within his right to put a bullet into each head that colluded to put him away.

Well, no, he's not. But he really really should.

browser_snake: Those of you railing against capital punishment, I present you a few points:

1. If this had been a capital punishment case, the flimsy evidence from the prosecution would have been scrutinized a hell of a lot more than it was at the time.

2. Appeals all the way up the chain would have been automatic.

3. The defendant would have had much better representation than he did initially.

And yet, there are still innocent people on death row.

accelerus: Depending on if i felt like living on the outside or not - I would make sure I punish all those who falsely put me in prison. Maybe not killing but definetly some loss of limbs. Serving as a reminder their entire life that true justice is not something you Fark with just so you can get a verdict you want.

Hypothetical ITG?

Noam Chimpsky: If I lose any more faith in the system, I will become unpleasant.

This is you on "pleasant" mode?

Cases like this one show exactly why the amount of power put into the hands of cops is absurd. They even turn on their own with it.

Noam Chimpsky: I read it, just didn't process all of it. Hard to see how a cop could be railroaded like that, but I probably didn't process something else in there that explains how that happened. I thought it said something about an affair between the cop's wife and the cop's boss or something too, but I don't feel like reading it again. If I lose any more faith in the system, I will become unpleasant.

There is no reason to have faith in it. Those who have faith in it get consumed by it. Odds are this cop was naive and had some faith in the system. He just didn't realize how evil his co-workers and managers were. He knows now.

Some farkers must of done some time, I see a little prison argot in here.

/if you had to look that up, you suck

Sadly, this is only news because he may get out. I'd wager there's hundreds, if not thousands of people wrongfully imprisoned for this. It's the salem witch trials of the modern age. Not that there aren't real offenders, of course there are.

doyner: mud_shark: The anti-death-penalty-pansies just want to ban capital punishment but have no regard for anyone else unfairly convicted.


This ruins what otherwise was an ok argument. Where do you get this shiat?

Okay, I've already admitted to being a bit "unfocused" today (actually getting more and more out of focus as the beer leaves my fridge), but there are people who argue that we should not have capital punishment because sometimes innocent people are convicted.

Are you with me so far? Have I used any words that confound your vocabulary?

Okay, good. Let's continue then. These same people who argue that innocents are sometimes found guilty and sentenced to death do not seem to give a flying fark if some innocent is found guilty and sentenced to life in prison.

Shouldn't we focus on reforming our courts so innocent people are never convicted rather than making sure they are not given the ultimate punishment?

Tell the guy serving 20 years for walking on water (or whatever - oh, sorry, was that obscure?) even though he didn't do it that it's okay because at least we're not executing him,

I look back to the last time I served on a jury - I couldn't believe the charges that were brought against the defendant. It was not something where the death penalty was even a consideration, but the charges brought against him were not supported by the evidence. And yet, the defendant spent months in jail of a crime he didn't commit (IMO and the opinion of every fellow juror that I spoke with).

Is that type of "justice" okay with you? Is it okay for someone to serve time in prison when they are innocent so long as they don't get the death penalty?

The principles upon which this country was founded do not state "innocent until proven guilty, unless it's a misdemeanor". I don't care if you are arrested for jay-walking, if you are going to be found guilty in a court of law, you must be proven guilty. If you are convicted of jay-walking while merely standing on the sidewalk, then we have a problem.

fnordfocus: I don't get it.

There's something else going on if cops are framing cops instead of covering up for them.

Man, it is almost as if they were trying to cover up an affair or something. Perhaps in relation to a higher up in the force such as a supervisor with somebody close to the sentenced man, like his wife.

It is a shame we'll never know.

Derek313: Some farkers must of done some time, I see a little prison argot in here.

/if you had to look that up, you suck

I know what "farkers" means, thank you very much.

onebadgungan: And yet, there are still innocent people on death row.

Who exactly?

Name them and present credible evidence and I will fight to get them out of prison. Otherwise, STFU.

fnordfocus: Again, WTF? Wouldn't his union provide a decent lawyer? If not, a cop could sure as heck afford to pay for one.

No, unions don't provide lawyers for non-duty related matters.

That being said, I'm very suspicious about this. What cop would plead no contest to such serious charges knowing he was facing many years in jail for something he didn't do? His excuse of "My public defender didn't prepare a defense" is extremely weak and for his kids to wait this long to decide they were never molested is suspicious too.