The doctor in question:

CPR doesn't always work.

Chariset: CPR doesn't always work.

Especially when you do it on a mattress.

Especially when you do it on a mattress.

Even better when you move the victim from the floor(where it should be performed) to the bed and then do it with the patient face down.

/fail fail fail death

doctor couldn't prescribe medicine in California, perform CPR evidently



/ Annie, are you OK ?

You only perform CPR on someone you want to save.

I'm sorry, did the article say that this man gets paid $150,000/month for being one man's doctor? Check-ups better come with happy endings.

deadapostle: Check-ups better come with happy endings.

For which one?

Chariset: CPR doesn't always work.

Usually doesn't work.

TeddyRooseveltsMustache: The doctor in question:

Are you sure? I thought that it was this one...

Fear_and_Loathing: Chariset: CPR doesn't always work.

Usually doesn't work.

CPR works fine when done correctly. It's whether or not someone can get the person's heart kickstarted again so that you can stop doing CPR.

Chariset: CPR doesn't always work.

Sometimes you get Skittles
http://tinyurl.com/m6fxb8
(copy and paste)

veedeevadeevoodee: doctor couldn't prescribe medicine in California, perform CPR evidently



/ Annie, are you OK ?

I haven't LOLd that hard in a while, bravo!

Me thinks Dr. Murry is going to be hit by the prefect shiat storm. I would not want to be in his shoes right about now.

Answer: A microscope.

Question: What are they climbing up Dr. Murry's ass with?

How was he able to convince anyone to pay him 150,000 a month?

gorgor: Chariset: CPR doesn't always work.

Sometimes you get Skittles
http://tinyurl.com/m6fxb8
(copy and paste)

Great, now I'm hungry... But I'm not sure if it's for Skittles or babies...

HaywoodJablonski: How was he able to convince anyone to pay him 150,000 a month?

Michael Jackson, rest his soul, didn't seem to be all that discriminating with his money. Good lord he was friends with Uri Geller and that rabbi Boteach. He didn't have good fraud-dar.

He died a heart-related death and his doctor was a cardiologist.
Did he have a heart condition, psychic vision?

That man, whatever sins he may have committed, didnt deserve to be surrounded by the turds he was. He has been used and abused since he was 6 years old.

veedeevadeevoodee: / Annie, are you OK ?

Winner winner, chicken dinner

walkingtall: That man, whatever sins he may have committed, didnt deserve to be surrounded by the turds he was. He has been used and abused since he was 6 years old.



Pretty much says it all.

Chariset: CPR doesn't always work.

That depends. An unattended cardiac arrest usually doesn't have a good outcome. By the time the EMT's get there, the patient has usually been down for ten to twenty minutes.

But an attended arrest can have a much better outcome. You can keep a patient "alive," or at the very least viable for about half an hour, without further advanced intervention like epinephrine infusions.

Thing is, this is a cardiologist, on scene at the time of arrest. Now, granted, some people are just too sick to recover even IF you are there to start CPR immediately. Problem is this yahoo went and did CPR on a cushy mattress. Anyone who is first aid trained knows that's a bad idea.

Something they don't tell you in CPR class is that if you don't compress hard enough to break the ribs, you're not doing it right. You're not getting enough compression to move the blood around the body. So if you are on a mattress, you are doing basically nothing to help the patient. You're just bouncing him around.

Maybe Jackson would have died anyway, maybe he could have been saved. But this numb skull was paid handsomely to not help when it REALLY mattered, and instead just wrote unnecessary prescriptions to a celebrity who was deeply troubled because he just wanted an easy, very large paycheck.

Yep,

America has the best Drug dealers money can buy!

and the best Health Drug Care system too.

at least, that's what they said on TV.

and after all, they wouldn't lie to us on TV.

Recoil Therapy: TeddyRooseveltsMustache: The doctor in question:

Are you sure? I thought that it was this one...

Could have been this one...


or even this one...

"Dammit, Jim, I'm a doctor, not a surgeon!"

Can someone explain this seemingly stupid regulation to me?

It appears that you need a federal number registered with the FDA in order to prescribe drugs if you're a doctor. However, this number is tied to the state you are practicing in?

Wait, why? Isn't it a federal number? Is this one of the things Obamamama was talking about when he said that we needed to invest some IT dollars into our healthcare infrastructure, because it sure seems to me like this is a huge waste of administration resources for something that probably doesn't work that well to start off with...

Pre cordial thump.


/don't think they teach that anymore.
//breaks ribs/sternum

TwistedFark: Wait, why? Isn't it a federal number?

States' Rights. Healthcare isn't "inter-state trade" (or hasn't been ruled as such yet AFAIK) so the Federal Government doesn't get involved.

Only one of the many, many reasons US healthcare is very, very inefficient and expensive.

I assume said doctor is in custody?

You get that kind of gig because of who you know, not what you know.

vabeard: Pre cordial thump.


/don't think they teach that anymore.
//breaks ribs/sternum

Also only works for defibulation. Only worked if the heart was already beating. Besides, it wasn't very effective, as most people can't hit hard enough to pause the heart and reset it back into rhythm.

El_Swino: You get that kind of gig because of who you know, not what you know. you run loose with your perscription pad and are willing to play a la carte pharmacy at the whims of your wealthy employer.

Not to use the meme, but I fixed that for you.

How come the Johnny Gage and Roy DeSoto on Emergency! were almost always able to save a person from cardiac arrest? Hasn't entertainment medicine advanced in the last 30 years?

Recoil Therapy: TeddyRooseveltsMustache: The doctor in question:

Are you sure? I thought that it was this one...

Isn't that the guy from that James Garner movie, "Support Your Local Doctor."

Oh, he went to Hollywood Upstairs Medical College too? WoW!

Harry_Seldon: How come the Johnny Gage and Roy DeSoto on Emergency! were almost always able to save a person from cardiac arrest? Hasn't entertainment medicine advanced in the last 30 years?

That show is a favorite among the EMS field for it's cheesiness and extremely... Let's say "optimistic" view of the techniques at the time. It was probably one of the first shows that started the misconception that you shock a person and their heart goes from full arrest to beating again, and it's followed as fact to this day.

In reality, you need to have a shockable rhythm to actually be able to bring someone back to sinus. But people don't know that, because what they've seen on TV for years is a simplistic "no pulse, CLEAR!"

I bring this up, because it gives my patient's family false hopes sometimes. We attach the paddles, but if they are in full arrest and we can't get a spontaneous beat, we don't shock because it won't do any good. But the families are pissed when we call it, because they didn't see the familiar "CLEAR!" followed by the body jumping, and think we are just giving up.

/sorry, just needed to vent

Shadowknight: Harry_Seldon: How come the Johnny Gage and Roy DeSoto on Emergency! were almost always able to save a person from cardiac arrest? Hasn't entertainment medicine advanced in the last 30 years?

That show is a favorite among the EMS field for it's cheesiness and extremely... Let's say "optimistic" view of the techniques at the time. It was probably one of the first shows that started the misconception that you shock a person and their heart goes from full arrest to beating again, and it's followed as fact to this day.

In reality, you need to have a shockable rhythm to actually be able to bring someone back to sinus. But people don't know that, because what they've seen on TV for years is a simplistic "no pulse, CLEAR!"

I bring this up, because it gives my patient's family false hopes sometimes. We attach the paddles, but if they are in full arrest and we can't get a spontaneous beat, we don't shock because it won't do any good. But the families are pissed when we call it, because they didn't see the familiar "CLEAR!" followed by the body jumping, and think we are just giving up.

/sorry, just needed to vent

That is Conservative Republican Quitter talk. Is that CLEAR?

// I keed

Harry_Seldon: Hasn't entertainment medicine advanced in the last 30 years?

Medical entertainment has advanced, entertainment medicine? Not so much ;)

Shadowknight: Thing is, this is a cardiologist, on scene at the time of arrest. Now, granted, some people are just too sick to recover even IF you are there to start CPR immediately. Problem is this yahoo went and did CPR on a cushy mattress. Anyone who is first aid trained knows that's a bad idea.

Something they don't tell you in CPR class is that if you don't compress hard enough to break the ribs, you're not doing it right. You're not getting enough compression to move the blood around the body. So if you are on a mattress, you are doing basically nothing to help the patient. You're just bouncing him around.

Maybe Jackson would have died anyway, maybe he could have been saved. But this numb skull was paid handsomely to not help when it REALLY mattered, and instead just wrote unnecessary prescriptions to a celebrity who was deeply troubled because he just wanted an easy, very large paycheck.

The thing is, though, we really don't know how far gone MJ was when he found him. Maybe he knew it would be futile, but went through the motions anyway so that people didn't think he was not doing his job.

I'll be very interested to learn who got him the propofol.

veedeevadeevoodee: doctor couldn't prescribe medicine in California, perform CPR evidently



/ Annie, are you OK ?

She says she can't feel her legs.

Bindyree: veedeevadeevoodee: doctor couldn't prescribe medicine in California, perform CPR evidently



/ Annie, are you OK ?

She says she can't feel her legs.

Tell her to take her pants off. That might help.

Chariset: CPR doesn't always ever work except in movies.

Tommy Moo: Chariset: CPR doesn't always ever work except in movies.

CPR doesn't work in movies, either. Usually they do compressions for a minute or two, then start sobbing and beating them on the chest with their fists and shouting "LIVE DAMN YOU, LIVE! I love you dammit, you can't die!"

[citation: The Abyss, numerous others]

Cpr isn't as successful as you think.

Sorry to burst people's bubble... even if they do get you back, sometimes you're a vegetable...

According to my understanding, he not only tried to do the CPR on a mattress, but he also did it with one hand, with the other stabilizing the back. Those of you who've done compressions, how much force do you think you could get like that? Sandwiching the patient's chest between your two hands like an accordion.

SVC_conservative: you're a vegetable...

Yee haw!

DrMcNinja: According to my understanding, he not only tried to do the CPR on a mattress, but he also did it with one hand, with the other stabilizing the back. Those of you who've done compressions, how much force do you think you could get like that? Sandwiching the patient's chest between your two hands like an accordion.
you're force is transferred into the mattress. You need a good 1.5-2inches of depth to make a good compression. Should have dropped him to the floor asap, you're not strong enough to do it accordion style..

/Pumped a variety of chests... EMT here

SVC_conservative: DrMcNinja: According to my understanding, he not only tried to do the CPR on a mattress, but he also did it with one hand, with the other stabilizing the back. Those of you who've done compressions, how much force do you think you could get like that? Sandwiching the patient's chest between your two hands like an accordion.
you're force is transferred into the mattress. You need a good 1.5-2inches of depth to make a good compression. Should have dropped him to the floor asap, you're not strong enough to do it accordion style..

/Pumped a variety of chests... EMT here

Right, my point exactly. So either this guy was absurdly incompetent (really, I can't imagine someone being this unknowledgeable), he really wasn't intending for it to be effective (as alluded to earlier in the thread), or other.

veedeevadeevoodee: doctor couldn't prescribe medicine in California, perform CPR evidently


/ Annie, are you OK ?

+1

/smooth

Jeez. It sounds like MJ would have been better off with this doctor:

I'm not a doctor, but I am in the Emergency Services, and the first thing you are supposed to do is get him or her on the ground. Like I said, there could be something an M.D. knows that we don't but I doubt it. The whole fire department immediately started yelling at the TV when they mentioned him doing the compressions on the bed. Maybe M.J. was very very skinny and frail, but I haven;t heard any evidence that that was an acceptable way to do CPR.

No matter what, it is uncommon for CPR to work without the prompt assistance of an AED. It is even less effective in traumatic arrest or an overdose without ALS intervention. And as many have said before, asystole is not shockable.

I keep hearing that MJ was $300M+ in debt.

And yet, with just his doctor and his rent ALONE, he was spending a quarter-mil a month. How does a guy who's worth negative 300 million dollars continue to shell out $3M+ per year? Are the stories of his debt exagerated, or was his music empire making enough money for him to pay the debt interest and lawyer fees and STILL live lavishly?

shower_in_my_socks: Are the stories of his debt exagerated, or was his music empire making enough money for him to pay the debt interest and lawyer fees and STILL live lavishly?

Quite possibly neither.

If you can make people believe you'll be good for your debts eventually due to your oh-so-secret investments, they'll let you borrow and spend what you like.

/ Sort of like a one-man investment bank. Not that any of those would go bust.

Recoil Therapy: TeddyRooseveltsMustache: The doctor in question:

Are you sure? I thought that it was this one...



That doctor just loved to stick his finger up people's asses.

Anyone's ass! He loved it!

Ironically, he stuck his finger up Farrah Fawcett's ass too.

FTA:
The next day around noon, Murray went to check on Jackson and found him lying on his bed unconscious, but with a weak pulse, the doctor's attorneys say.

Um, ultimate fail. Pulse present? No CPR. AR only.

Rubber Biscuit: I knew there would be a necktie party coming out of this.

A Cincinnati necktie party?

"Apparently, I've logged more hours in surgery than any other man my age. Four thousand hours this year alone. What no one seems to have noticed that it was all with the same patient."

Chet, why is there lasagna all over the defibrillator?



//hot

shower_in_my_socks: I keep hearing that MJ was $300M+ in debt.

And yet, with just his doctor and his rent ALONE, he was spending a quarter-mil a month. How does a guy who's worth negative 300 million dollars continue to shell out $3M+ per year? Are the stories of his debt exagerated, or was his music empire making enough money for him to pay the debt interest and lawyer fees and STILL live lavishly?

I'm not intimately familiar with everything, but he apparently sold quite a bit of things for vast sums of money. Fark had a thread on a Sotheby's auction he was doing recently which featured a great deal of everything from movie memorabilia to furniture to what have you. He's also sold quite a few of the music rights he owned, among them songs by the Beatles.

I don't think he was still anywhere close to breaking even, but his financial status was probably not as bad as what the media painted.

/ Annie, are you OK ?

Yep, that was awesome.

WFern: Fark had a thread on a Sotheby's auction he was doing recently which featured a great deal of everything from movie memorabilia to furniture to what have you. He's also sold quite a few of the music rights he owned, among them songs by the Beatles.

The auction was cancelled, and the Beatles catalog is co-owned 50/50 by Sony and MJ. He also still owns rights to thousands of other songs.

He's deeply in debt because of his spending habits. Now that he's not spending anymore, the estate should recover pretty fast, even just considering his music catalog alone.

vernonFL: SVC_conservative: you're a vegetable...

Yee haw!

they be hatin you...

This is so starting to sound like Elvis when he died...incompetent doctor, too many drugs, and "Gee, George, whatta ya think we should do, he's just laying there not breathing" when something bad happened.

And no, just because he's a doctor doesn't mean he can do CPR. It's why they make you re-cert every 2 years.

Gyrfalcon: And no, just because he's a doctor doesn't mean he can do CPR. It's why they make you re-cert every 2 years.

The guy was a cardiologist. I still think he knew it would be futile and was just making an effort so that the clueless bystanders wouldn't say, "why aren't you doing anything to save him!?"

Time Traveler: Get off this doctor's back he has a GED in medicine!!

*golf clap*

I have high hopes for this meme.

Why in the hell would you do CPR on someone with ANY pulse??!? Bad doctor, no biscuit. Idiotic doctor, really.

dodecahedron: Gyrfalcon: And no, just because he's a doctor doesn't mean he can do CPR. It's why they make you re-cert every 2 years.

The guy was a cardiologist. I still think he knew it would be futile and was just making an effort so that the clueless bystanders wouldn't say, "why aren't you doing anything to save him!?"

what bystanders? apparently, he sat there bouncing him on the mattress for a full 30 minutes before letting anyone know that mj was unconscious and someone needed call an ambulance. why that wouldn't be the first thing he did is beyond me.

/lots of weirdness surrounding this story
//though it IS mj, so .... pretty much a guarantee

dodecahedron: WFern: Fark had a thread on a Sotheby's auction he was doing recently which featured a great deal of everything from movie memorabilia to furniture to what have you. He's also sold quite a few of the music rights he owned, among them songs by the Beatles.

The auction was cancelled, and the Beatles catalog is co-owned 50/50 by Sony and MJ. He also still owns rights to thousands of other songs.

He's deeply in debt because of his spending habits. Now that he's not spending anymore, the estate should recover pretty fast, even just considering his music catalog alone.

Yikes. Guess I was a little out of the loop. I also didn't realize Sony owned that much of the catalogue.

Frankly, I'm a little amazed they haven't up and sold Neverland yet. He moved out and took everything with him, yet it's still in the family trust.

DieselChick: Why in the hell would you do CPR on someone with ANY pulse??!? Bad doctor, no biscuit. Idiotic doctor, really.

Vfib and VTac both require cpr and AED shocks. even PVT (Pulseless VTac) If untreated for too long, they wind up going bye-bye. You can still technically have a rhythm...

Also oxygenation is the important thing, it'd better to do cpr than not... most people think that their own pulse (which you can feel in your thumbs and fingers) is the patient's pulse cause they're adrenaline is running. Worst you're going to do for the guy is piss him off and break some ribs...

que lastima:

apparently, he sat there bouncing him on the mattress for a full 30 minutes before letting anyone know that mj was unconscious and someone needed call an ambulance.

is that what happened? that is sketchy...as if the mattress thing didn't make it sketchy enough

maybe it was an assisted suicide? i think that poor bastard had probably been wanting to die for a long time

I really can't believe Rep. Peter King (R-epugnant). Sometimes, the better person just keeps his mouth shut. Everyone knows the troubled personal life of Michael Jackson.

Why don't the Christians act like Christians when it actually matters?

Yeah, I went there Rep. King.



//hot

Harry_Seldon: img2.timeinc.net
Fruits, vegetables and nuts all make up a healthy diet

They would have been better off doing this (Pulp Fiction).

mreuther: They would have been better off doing this (Pulp Fiction).

Had Travolta stab a needle into Uma Thurman's heart? How would that have helped MJ?

/needle probably would have gone straight through MJ and into the floor

gorgor: Skitt

So everybody else doesn't have to copy and paste:

Also one of the meds MJ was prescribed, is not even supposed to be prescribed its in a Hospital pharmacy need assload of paperwork to get it for surgery

Harry_Seldon: Yeah, I went there Rep. King.

//hot


King my ass. This is the only pic of a U.S. President with The King:

Physicians in general do not have the ability to perform basic health care tasks. When was the last time you had an MD give you a shot or take blood? NEVER. They only receive rudimentary training at best.

Get a Nurse or EMT - these are the people that know what the fark to to in an emergency situation!

Hi, Dr. Nick!

Shadowknight: Harry_Seldon: How come the Johnny Gage and Roy DeSoto on Emergency! were almost always able to save a person from cardiac arrest? Hasn't entertainment medicine advanced in the last 30 years?

That show is a favorite among the EMS field for it's cheesiness and extremely... Let's say "optimistic" view of the techniques at the time. It was probably one of the first shows that started the misconception that you shock a person and their heart goes from full arrest to beating again, and it's followed as fact to this day.

In reality, you need to have a shockable rhythm to actually be able to bring someone back to sinus. But people don't know that, because what they've seen on TV for years is a simplistic "no pulse, CLEAR!"

I bring this up, because it gives my patient's family false hopes sometimes. We attach the paddles, but if they are in full arrest and we can't get a spontaneous beat, we don't shock because it won't do any good. But the families are pissed when we call it, because they didn't see the familiar "CLEAR!" followed by the body jumping, and think we are just giving up.

/sorry, just needed to vent

Jeebus, you're so full of shiat.

DieselChick: Why in the hell would you do CPR on someone with ANY pulse??!? Bad doctor, no biscuit. Idiotic doctor, really.

In his defense, you don't know how weak it is, and he's obviously not perfusing anyway. CPR could have been the right call.