This reminds me of Matthew Broderick's "For farks sake, stop mentioning Ferris Bueller to me every five goddamn minutes" clause when he was filming Godzilla.

But seriously, has it really come to this, that the entire film crew has to sign an agreement not to bring up Scientology whenever Katie Holmes is present?

Matthew Broderick had a clause like that?

Sheesh, Ferris Bueller was the only 2 hours of his career where he actually came across as somewhat likeable. He should hold onto that.

$50,000 for an alligator handbag?

I wouldn't ask her about religion, I'd be asking her about all the guys she has to share her husband with.

I guess it's okay to ask her about Suri's biological father, then.

If I could ask Katie Holmes just ONE question, it would be "Alright, so seriously- do you actually believe the whole intergalactic volcano ghosts thing, or are you just placating Tom because he's good for your career?"

If you're embarassed about your religion, isn't that sort of a red flag to re-examine your beliefs?

TheGreatZarquon: If I could ask Katie Holmes just ONE question

Shouldn't you ask a question that the answer to isn't obvious?

Nobody actually believes Scientology's teachings. It's a pyramid scam/tax dodge. Okay, Tom Cruise might, but I still doubt it.

I'd ask her if that stalker back in her Dawson's days really screwed her up so badly that she went completely insane.

theorellior: $50,000 for an alligator handbag?

Maybe it's a living alligator trained to carry your things and eat your enemies.

Best thing this side of sapient pearwood.

theorellior: I guess it's okay to ask her about Suri's biological father, then.

Doubtful since the whole pregnancy was orchestrated by Scientology.

All theistic religion is just as stupid and bullshiat as scientology. Christianity might be a hair dumber than the rest.

Blowmonkey: All theistic religion is just as stupid and bullshiat as scientology. Christianity might be a hair dumber than the rest.

You forgot, "Read some DAWKINS, Christfag."

Blowmonkey: All theistic religion is just as stupid and bullshiat as scientology. Christianity might be a hair dumber than the rest.

Well, the Campbellian reconstructionist pagans at least accept that their religious beliefs and practices are metaphors, not statements about the real world.

Occam's Chainsaw: Blowmonkey: All theistic religion is just as stupid and bullshiat as scientology. Christianity might be a hair dumber than the rest.

You forgot, "Read some DAWKINS, Christfag."

good thing you're here then.

Wait a minute.

Kirk Cameron is working?

TheGreatZarquon: This reminds me of Matthew Broderick's "For farks sake, stop mentioning Ferris Bueller to me every five goddamn minutes" clause when he was filming Godzilla.

But seriously, has it really come to this, that the entire film crew has to sign an agreement not to bring up Scientology whenever Katie Holmes is present?

That's disappointing, if true.

Reports suggested the actor spent $50,000 on an alligator skin handbag, as part of an $85,000 bill, but staff would not discuss any details.

the remaining $35,000 was spent on a gem encrusted e-meter and some thetan repellent spray

Blowmonkey: good thing you're here then.

We're glad you're here too. Someone always has to claim Scientology is no worse than any other religion, and they always make everyone else feel so much smarter in comparison. At least that's one thing most theists, atheists and agnostics can agree on.

Shhhhhhhh!! It's alll a big secret!!! Unless you have $50k-$100k for the introductory courses, then we can talk all about it. :)

t3knomanser: Blowmonkey: All theistic religion is just as stupid and bullshiat as scientology. Christianity might be a hair dumber than the rest.

Well, the Campbellian reconstructionist pagans at least accept that their religious beliefs and practices are metaphors, not statements about the real world.

So does pretty much every theist.

Remember, fundies are the exception, not the rule.

/Biblical literalism is heresy in most Christian churches
//Four tiers of meaning, from least important to most - literal, allegorical (denotative), allegorical (connotative), and divine.
///Fundies get stuck on the first and sometimes go to the second.
////For a primer, see one of the cornerstones of Xian thought, the Allegory of the Cave in Republic, bk 7

EdgeRunner: Blowmonkey: good thing you're here then.

We're glad you're here too. Someone always has to claim Scientology is no worse than any other religion, and they always make everyone else feel so much smarter in comparison. At least that's one thing most theists, atheists and agnostics can agree on.

Hey, that assertion is always a good way of weeding out the people who have had no training in theology or philosophy or reading comprehension.

/I mean, that's sub-elementary school level critical thinking

Why does the film crew even need to discuss Katie's religion with her? JUST DO YOUR FRIGGIN' JOBS, ASSWIPES!

If you've never flattened an engram, on all flows, you have no grounds to be coming off like you know what the hell you're talking about in regards to Scientology. This is why some of us have our OTs, and others are just SPs who will get what's coming to them.

I know I'd get tired of answering "Are you for farking real?" and "So, how's Xenu treating your gay ass today?", etc every time I ran into someone outside the cult....

luidprand: Hey, that assertion is always a good way of weeding out the people who have had no training in theology or philosophy or reading comprehension.

/I mean, that's sub-elementary school level critical thinking

So glad you agree with me about the pyramid scheme defenders. It's surprising that such a transparent money grab, so utterly devoid of any meaningful teachings or ideals, ever managed to gain as much ground as it has. It's like watching a bunch of imbeciles gather to make excuses for the Fred Phelps clan.

TheGreatZarquon: If I could ask Katie Holmes just ONE question, it would be "Alright, so seriously- do you actually believe the whole intergalactic volcano ghosts thing, or are you just placating Tom because he's good for your career been the death of your career?"

FTFY

EdgeRunner: luidprand: Hey, that assertion is always a good way of weeding out the people who have had no training in theology or philosophy or reading comprehension.

/I mean, that's sub-elementary school level critical thinking

So glad you agree with me about the pyramid scheme defenders. It's surprising that such a transparent money grab, so utterly devoid of any meaningful teachings or ideals, ever managed to gain as much ground as it has. It's like watching a bunch of imbeciles gather to make excuses for the Fred Phelps clan.

THOSE farkING BASTARDS!

Trust a bunch of inbred freaks to move religion back to the days of cthonic Sky Wizards who smite the tribe across the river.

/They'll be sacrificing infants to brazen images next.

I suspect these types of agreements aren't unusual. I did some work for QSound back around 1990, and I got to tag along to do a technology demo for Michael Jackson. I had to sign an agreement to not talk to him, or look him directly in the eyes, amongst other things.

Harry_Seldon: I suspect these types of agreements aren't unusual. I did some work for QSound back around 1990, and I got to tag along to do a technology demo for Michael Jackson. I had to sign an agreement to not talk to him, or look him directly in the eyes, amongst other things.

Did he have a slave follow behind people chanting "Memento mori" whenever they had a question for His Glovedness?

luidprand: THOSE farkING BASTARDS!

Trust a bunch of inbred freaks to move religion back to the days of cthonic Sky Wizards who smite the tribe across the river.

Ooo, aren't you clever! You know big words like cthonic! True, it should be spelled "chthonic", but that's no big deal. Not everyone knows how to enable spellcheck in their browsers. Oh, and perhaps the word you really meant to use was "Cthulian" rather than "chthonic"? "Cthulian" would refer to the Lovecraftian elder gods which thrive on death and destruction, whereas "chthonic" refers to something which resides underground. A chthonic spirit would not be a sky spirit, you see, on account of the whole "being underground" and "not in the sky" part.

But you keep right on trying to expand your vocabulary! Once you get the correct spellings and meanings figured out, just imagine all the pseudo-clever statements you'll be able to make! Why, you'll be just like Bill O'Reilly with his constant spouting of rarely used words like "blatherskite" and "bloviate"! Soon you'll be just as respected for your intellect as he is for his!

EdgeRunner: Ooo, aren't you clever! You know big words like cthonic! True, it should be spelled "chthonic", but that's no big deal. Not everyone knows how to enable spellcheck in their browsers. Oh, and perhaps the word you really meant to use was "Cthulian" rather than "chthonic"? "Cthulian" would refer to the Lovecraftian elder gods which thrive on death and destruction, whereas "chthonic" refers to something which resides underground. A chthonic spirit would not be a sky spirit, you see, on account of the whole "being underground" and "not in the sky" part.

But you keep right on trying to expand your vocabulary! Once you get the correct spellings and meanings figured out, just imagine all the pseudo-clever statements you'll be able to make! Why, you'll be just like Bill O'Reilly with his constant spouting of rarely used words like "blatherskite" and "bloviate"! Soon you'll be just as respected for your intellect as he is for his!

You sound like a twat, is it intentional?

Blowmonkey: You sound like a twat, is it intentional?

I suppose I could ask you the same question, but in your case it's plainly unavoidable. My sympathies go out to those who have to tolerate your inanity in real life.

EdgeRunner: luidprand: THOSE farkING BASTARDS!

Trust a bunch of inbred freaks to move religion back to the days of cthonic Sky Wizards who smite the tribe across the river.

Ooo, aren't you clever! You know big words like cthonic! True, it should be spelled "chthonic", but that's no big deal. Not everyone knows how to enable spellcheck in their browsers. Oh, and perhaps the word you really meant to use was "Cthulian" rather than "chthonic"? "Cthulian" would refer to the Lovecraftian elder gods which thrive on death and destruction, whereas "chthonic" refers to something which resides underground. A chthonic spirit would not be a sky spirit, you see, on account of the whole "being underground" and "not in the sky" part.

But you keep right on trying to expand your vocabulary! Once you get the correct spellings and meanings figured out, just imagine all the pseudo-clever statements you'll be able to make! Why, you'll be just like Bill O'Reilly with his constant spouting of rarely used words like "blatherskite" and "bloviate"! Soon you'll be just as respected for your intellect as he is for his!

Maybe if you did a little more research before calling someone out.... Chthonic (thank you for the spelling correction) can mean underground, but it can also mean primordial. When applied to religion, it refers to a belief system that is quasi-animist, without any reflection - a belief that almost predates language and is usually localized to a single pack or tribe. Most deities start as chthonic at one point or can point to usurped chthonic deities (some of the Titans come to mind in Greek mythology - Bacchus, dryads, fauns, and the like are more sophisticated versions of ur-deities). There several theories as to the Abramaic God's chthonic form - He is commonly held to be originally a mountain or thunder deity.

The Phelpsian version of Xianity approaches this state. God, to them, is the God of their small pack. He (and their God is definitely gendered, not "He" for the sake of convention, but "He" on a biologic level) is petty, spiteful, vengeful, and rewards the pack while smiting all enemies of the pack (i.e., everyone else). Like a chthonic deity, he grants wishes to those who perform the right acts - miracles become magic, as guided by the shaman (in this case, Phelps).

This is about as primitive a faith as one can get. Pretty much all of the Old World civilizations (Mediterranean/Mesopotamian, Indian, and Chinese) moved past this by 100 BC, although some outliers (like the Druidic and Cybelene cults) persisted.

/So, yeah, a chthonic god can be a sky god (Ouranos and possibly proto-YHWH), water god (Tiamat), even madness god (Bachhus)

Scientology gets mentioned and all the Atheists make random retarded statements that have nothing to do with Scientology, while all the Theists try to deflect the fact that most the reasons you can debunk Scientology apply to their own religion of choisce.

Shouldof seen it coming...

ggggbabybabybaby: Anyone ever tell you that your login looks like it should be sung by a stuttering R&B artist?

ggggbabybabybaby: Scientology gets mentioned and all the Atheists make random retarded statements that have nothing to do with Scientology, while all the Theists try to deflect the fact that most the reasons you can debunk Scientology apply to their own religion of choisce religions based on faith healing.

Shouldof seen it coming...

FTFY

In fact, there's an excellent book Mark Twain wrote about the Christian Scientists (the Gutenberg version (new window)) and many strong parallels can be drawn between Mary Baker Eddy and LRon.

luidprand: Biblical literalism is heresy in most Christian churches

Uh, yeah: Not so much.

ggggbabybabybaby: Scientology gets mentioned and all the Atheists make random retarded statements that have nothing to do with Scientology, while all the Theists try to deflect the fact that most the reasons you can debunk Scientology apply to their own religion of choisce.

Shouldof seen it coming...

I'm thinking of a word... it sounds a little bit like a verb... Yeah, "have", that's the word I was thinking of!

ggggbabybabybaby: Shouldof

This will negate any point you have to make.

wee: luidprand: Biblical literalism is heresy in most Christian churches

Uh, yeah: Not so much.


No, it really is. Of the larger Christian faiths, only Southern Baptists consider Biblical literalism to be valid. Every other sect that allows literalism has less than five million adherents worldwide.

The largest Xian religions - Catholicism, the various Orthodoxies, Anglicanism/Episcopalianism, and Lutheranism all make a point to avoid it. This isn't to say that there aren't heretical sects within those faiths (Opus Dei and the Marians come to mind in Catholicism), but it is pretty verboten.

/Hell, Biblical literalism didn't even start until later in the Reformation, which is why members of the Catholic, Orthodox, and "high church" Anglican faiths look down upon it.

Biblical literalism didn't even start until later in the Reformation, which is one of the many reasons why members of the Catholic, Orthodox, and "high church" Anglican faiths look down upon it.

FTFM

luidprand: dumb vs. dumber.

That's really all you're arguing.

Blowmonkey: luidprand: dumb vs. dumber.

That's really all you're arguing.

How so?

EdgeRunner: luidprand: THOSE farkING BASTARDS!

Trust a bunch of inbred freaks to move religion back to the days of cthonic Sky Wizards who smite the tribe across the river.

Ooo, aren't you clever! You know big words like cthonic! True, it should be spelled "chthonic", but that's no big deal. Not everyone knows how to enable spellcheck in their browsers. Oh, and perhaps the word you really meant to use was "Cthulian" rather than "chthonic"? "Cthulian" would refer to the Lovecraftian elder gods which thrive on death and destruction, whereas "chthonic" refers to something which resides underground. A chthonic spirit would not be a sky spirit, you see, on account of the whole "being underground" and "not in the sky" part.

But you keep right on trying to expand your vocabulary! Once you get the correct spellings and meanings figured out, just imagine all the pseudo-clever statements you'll be able to make! Why, you'll be just like Bill O'Reilly with his constant spouting of rarely used words like "blatherskite" and "bloviate"! Soon you'll be just as respected for your intellect as he is for his!

I've never heard the word "Cthulian." I think you just mean Lovecraftian.

So, if we can't talk about religion, can we at least still talk about these:



Or, the NSFW edition, if you like.

Although that also might be a religious experience for some.

Blowmonkey: All theistic religion is just as stupid and bullshiat as scientology. Christianity might be a hair dumber than the rest.

No. . .

I usually hate people who quote South Park for real world opinions, but I think they pretty much nailed the response to "Well, is Scientology really that much dumber than the other religions?"

Yes. Yes it is. I am a hardcore atheist who sees no need for religion in the modern world, but the major world religions are all good degrees more sensible than Scientology. The people who established their dogma, which I do not agree with, were nevertheless usually very smart folks. L. Ron Hubbard was no where near that level of smart.

TheGreatZarquon: But seriously, has it really come to this, that the entire film crew has to sign an agreement not to bring up Scientology whenever Katie Holmes is present?

i think its more of a don't ask don't tell agreement. IIRC they were having a very hard time keeping crew members on the last few Cruise movies because he wont shut the hell up about it and they end up going over budget because of having to pay people a lot more to put up with it.

Harry_Seldon: I suspect these types of agreements aren't unusual. I did some work for QSound back around 1990, and I got to tag along to do a technology demo for Michael Jackson. I had to sign an agreement to not talk to him, or look him directly in the eyes, amongst other things.

That was because his eyes would suck your soul out of your body if you looked at him.

luidprand: Maybe if you did a little more research before calling someone out....

Fair enough, I concede the point. However, it's important to keep in mind that Fred Phelps only has one true religion, and it isn't primordial. It's profit-based. His group might claim Christianity as "justification" for their offensive protests, but it's no secret they're only trying to incite violent reactions in hopes of being able to sue people for assault. Had they been around in Christ's time, they would have happily disrupted his funeral too if they'd thought there was any money in it.

optional: I've never heard the word "Cthulian." I think you just mean Lovecraftian.

AFAIK, neither word appears in any mainstream dictionaries. However, at least going by common usage, "Lovecraftian" refers to anything that resembles or takes inspiration from Lovecraft's work in content or tone, while "Cthulian" is an adjective specifically used to describe creatures similar to HP's infamous tentacled monstrosities.

The first "Hellboy", for example, featured Cthulian monsters and a smattering of Lovecraftian elements. Whereas the "Evil Dead" films were very Lovecraftian, but unless you count the evil trees, they were devoid of any Cthulian beasties.