Wasn't Mousavi one of the people responsible for the 1979 revolution? and helped organize the current system of government there. Not to mention served as president previously? That's one hell of a sleeper agent.

Maybe he's one of the "Iranian moderates" the U.S. has been courting on and off for the past 30 years.

yeah... he and I went to different schools together.

FTFA: A top aide to Iran's supreme leader called the country's main opposition figure a U.S. agent...

I guess if he said so, it must be true!

40yoVirgin: I guess if he said so, it must be true!

They're taking lessons from the Republicans.. Remember, Obama is a secrit muslin.

Alacritous: Wasn't Mousavi one of the people responsible for the 1979 revolution? and helped organize the current system of government there. Not to mention served as president previously? That's one hell of a sleeper agent.

he was Prime Minister until the Ayatollah thought he gained to much power and the position was eliminated

Green Brief 17 (new window)

MonkeyVegetables: he was Prime Minister

Right.. knew it was one of those, and didn't bother looking it up, but my point stands. This is kinda like saying Benjamin Franklin was an agent of Holland.

My feeling is that Amadinejhad will survive this, for now, but the legitimacy of the Iranian power structure has been permanently -- and, eventually, fatally -- damaged in the long term.

For a theocracy to function, its people must believe that that is the will of God (or equivalent Supreme Being) that this government rule over them. Suddenly, Iran's government just looks like any other piss-pot dictatorship in the world.

Amadinejad farked up by making the election result a blowout. If he was going to fix it anyway, it should have been a squeaker.

Alacritous: Wasn't Mousavi one of the people responsible for the 1979 revolution? and helped organize the current system of government there. Not to mention served as president previously? That's one hell of a sleeper agent.

He was Prime Minister before, yes. It was a VERY long-term plan, but the CIA is sneaky that way.

I mean, you gotta remember, these are the same people who managed to put a fake birth announcement for one "Barack Obama" in the Honolulu Advertiser back in 1961 in advance support of a forty-year operation, they're gooooood.

Alacritous: This is kinda like saying Benjamin Franklin was an agent of Holland.

Look closely at the paintings of Ben... he is always seen hanging out with dikes.

jake_lex: My feeling is that Amadinejhad will survive this, for now, but the legitimacy of the Iranian power structure has been permanently -- and, eventually, fatally -- damaged in the long term.

In all seriousness, that's my basic take on it also. These were protests demanding a new election for a new president in the currently prescribed role, protests demanding the people be able to exercise the vote they have in the CURRENT system, NOT explicitly trying to overthrow the government or have a new revolution. Yet the aftermath has exposed (if not created fresh) various divisions in the government which are likely to lead to some changes, even if gradually. That plus the fact that there ARE some younger edge people in the protests who want more, maybe those ideas will gain more followers.

itazurakko: Alacritous: Wasn't Mousavi one of the people responsible for the 1979 revolution? and helped organize the current system of government there. Not to mention served as president previously? That's one hell of a sleeper agent.

He was Prime Minister before, yes. It was a VERY long-term plan, but the CIA is sneaky that way.

I mean, you gotta remember, these are the same people who managed to put a fake birth announcement for one "Barack Obama" in the Honolulu Advertiser back in 1961 in advance support of a forty-year operation, they're gooooood.

And let's not forget how they also made the Mars Bar into a Snickers Almond, the bastards. They're not supposed to operate on US soil, but those bastiches KEEP DOING IT TO FUTZ UP OUR GODDAMME CANDY! AND LACE THEM WITH HORMONES TO GIVE MEN biatch TITS! THE WORLD MUST KNOW!

jake_lex

Amadinejad farked up by making the election result a blowout. If he was going to fix it anyway, it should have been a squeaker.

Yeah, it always hurts your credibility when more people hit the streets to protest than supposedly voted for the opposition.

Plus they should have waited a tad longer to announce the official results. Say, half a day.

hubiestubert: AND LACE THEM WITH HORMONES TO GIVE MEN biatch TITS! THE WORLD MUST KNOW!

That's preposterous...

/Tightens government issued man-bra.

itazurakko: jake_lex: My feeling is that Amadinejhad will survive this, for now, but the legitimacy of the Iranian power structure has been permanently -- and, eventually, fatally -- damaged in the long term.

In all seriousness, that's my basic take on it also. These were protests demanding a new election for a new president in the currently prescribed role, protests demanding the people be able to exercise the vote they have in the CURRENT system, NOT explicitly trying to overthrow the government or have a new revolution. Yet the aftermath has exposed (if not created fresh) various divisions in the government which are likely to lead to some changes, even if gradually. That plus the fact that there ARE some younger edge people in the protests who want more, maybe those ideas will gain more followers.

There's also the sad fact, that most of the folks who are unemployed right now, are all young. They've been educated, trained, and now there's no work. And Ahmadinijad is part of that--while Mousavi created the Iranian bond market. He wasn't the hip young candidate--he was a PM during war years, and acknowledged by most folks in and OUT of Iran of having real knowledge about how the economy works.

I suspect the idea was to give Ahmadinijad an overwhelming victory so that there would be no question about pesky recounts, and manufacture support behind him with such an "overwhelming" majority--but for guys who overthrew the Shah without CIA support, that was frippin' amateur hour. They've gotten so used to the people not actually questioning what they do--and despite the abuses, the Iranian election system is still known as one of the more trustworthy, which is what they were banking on.

They've screwed that pooch now, and dealt themselves a serious blow--not because the Mousavi is going to get his recount necessarily, but because that's all they were asking. Not to tear down the system, not to open up to the West, not to install a different Supreme Leader. They wanted a recount. They want to believe in the current system. And the government has shown that they themselves don't believe in it, so why should anyone else?

Gosh, and all these Republicans told me that we should have been totally way more proactive in getting into Iran's business!

But the real tragedy is that no one wants to play with Ahmadi anymore! A SUDDENLY MOST UNWELCOME GUEST (new window). They wont even visit him anymore! Oman sultan postpones Iran visit over political unrest (new window). Sadness.

I know, not exactly fresh news.

So, how long will it take for them to arrest Mousavi (if he hasn't been already), organise a "trial" and hang him for treason?

Good grief, that is one embarrassing bunch of sophomoric assholes masquerading as a legitimate government.

hubiestubert: There's also the sad fact, that most of the folks who are unemployed right now, are all young. They've been educated, trained, and now there's no work. And Ahmadinijad is part of that--while Mousavi created the Iranian bond market. He wasn't the hip young candidate--he was a PM during war years, and acknowledged by most folks in and OUT of Iran of having real knowledge about how the economy works.

Yeah, the economy was a huge issue in the election, even before all the vote-tampering shenanigans and the protests. Those sort of more prosaic concerns seemed almost entirely ignored in the coverage, which was unfortunate, in favor of a "new revolution!!!" narrative which was... overly optimistic for an outside POV, I think.

hubiestubert: They've screwed that pooch now, and dealt themselves a serious blow--not because the Mousavi is going to get his recount necessarily, but because that's all they were asking. Not to tear down the system, not to open up to the West, not to install a different Supreme Leader. They wanted a recount. They want to believe in the current system. And the government has shown that they themselves don't believe in it, so why should anyone else?

Also this. (Though they wanted a new election, since the ballots were not all available for counting and very possibly not all legitimate.) Hindsight is always 20/20, but I do think that Ahmadinejad had possible opportunities to think to himself "oh shiat" early on and allow a rerun with only a little dirt on his face, but in all the flailing around afterward, managed to get covered with mud.

We'll never know who won that election really, and it was supposed to be close, everyone was expecting a runoff election on BOTH SIDES. Imagine Bush v. Gore in 2000 but during the overnight vote tally it comes out that people have burnt loads of ballots under a bridge, lost others, and some cities have 140% of the citizens voting. But yes - it's possible that Ahmadinejad did win it, he actually DOES have lots of supporters, but it's ceased to matter as the election scandals (rightly) became the bigger story.

At this point we see where the garden variety political minutiae and maneuvering takes things now, given the cracks exposed.

hubiestubert: They want to believe in the current system. And the government has shown that they themselves don't believe in it, so why should anyone else?

Sounds like the US. =/

paulseta: Good grief, that is one embarrassing bunch of sophomoric assholes masquerading as a legitimate government.

You're gonna have to narrow that down a bit..

Alacritous: Wasn't Mousavi one of the people responsible for the 1979 revolution? and helped organize the current system of government there. Not to mention served as president previously? That's one hell of a sleeper agent.

Birth certificate?

you telling me no one noticed the silly costume?



/hot like the brats i'm grilling later

i refuse to beleive that the us would meddle in any other county's affairs.
...i also drive a hummer and think obama's tearing the country apart with socialism, and that karl rove's head is a supercomputer powered by the tear of xenu the spacelord.

Obama releases CIA docs showing that Mousavi is on its payroll in five, four, three............

I'm so glad that Obama's keeping his mouth shut during this had such a profound impact on preventing this regime from blaming the US for this uprising.

Oh wait, just blame Bush.

Remember that guy who ran for president of Iran against Ahmadinejad, and all the people were angry and rioted that he didn't win? Turns out he was a U.S.Zionist agent

Fixed that for ya, subby

It's true. Ahmadinnerjacket works for me. He's not been good value for money, but good help is tough to find these days.

Oh gee, no one saw a statement like this coming! Especially with the recent diplomatic history of the US and the support of US citizens! OMG! The guy wants to over throw the system, he must be an American agent! Its the only thing that makes sense.

/we all saw this coming.

I recently wrote an article / lit review of Steinbeck's "The Moon is Down" which is a book primarily concerned with the themes of occupation, war, and rebellion against said occupation.

While this is tangential, I suppose, it struck me as somewhat thought provoking material to consider when thinking about how societies deal with oppression in its myriad forms, even when it comes from within rather than from without.

Excerpt :

The occupation continues to waver and crumble over the cold winter, until at last the sounds of insurgent traps and explosives are incessant, and the news grows worse for the occupiers. During the dying pages of the novel, Steinbeck elaborates, through Orden, on the nature of freedom and the indomitable spirit of man. Speaking to his good friend, Doctor Winter, under penalty of death, Mayor Orden speaks.

"You know, Doctor, I am a little man and this is a little town, but there must be a spark in little men that can burst into flame. I am afraid, I am terribly afraid, and I thought of all the things I might do to save my own life, and then that went away, and sometimes now I feel a kind of exultation, as though I were bigger and better than I am..." (pp. 108)

Continuing this notion, a few exchanges later, Orden directs one of his final monologues to Colonel Lanser.

"You see sir, nothing can change it. You will be destroyed and driven out." His voice was very soft. "The people don't like to be conquered, sir, and so they will not be. Free men cannot start a war, but once it is started, they can fight on in defeat. Herd men, followers of a leader, cannot do that, and so it is always the herd men who win battles and free men who win wars. You will find that is so, sir." (pp. 112)

Link (new window)

Oh well. America's president is a non-citizen, with terrorist funding ties, illegal alien family members, and has relatives in the international drug trade communities.

Iran learned from the beat.

So Hossein Shariatmadari is like the Persian Rush Limbaugh?

Mongo cut wood: I'm so glad that Obama's keeping his mouth shut during this had such a profound impact on preventing this regime from blaming the US for this uprising.

Oh wait, just blame Bush.

Y'might want to tone down the moron here. Perception and truth differ from each other.

For example, in order to portray President Obama as encouraging the uprising, they had to wilfully mistranslate his words so they bore no resemblance to what he said. It would have been different if he had actually said that because that would have been interference, rather than concern.

Bush's approach was different and the uprisings which have taken place previously in Iran were not bountifully successful, even with his vocal support. I'm not saying he wasn't sincere or even absolutely wrong: it just didn't work.

On the other hand, Amadinejhad still achieves his goal to retain presidency and the usefulness of the Revolutionary Guard has been confirmed when it comes to smashing the baton across the face of a protester. The fact that the British Embassy workers have been made into targets, further shows that aside from a few tough words there is nothing that can legitimately challenge the president from within Iran, much less from the outside.

Not to draw comparisons, but this situation seems like embracing the "any power is good power" concept of ruling, and while US and EU wisely do not get involved, the world also has to concede that Iran will not undergo significant political and economical changes for at least one more generation.

Wow.

If those guys want a shiat-storm in short order, I highly recommend trying and executing Mousavi. It'll make the last two weeks seem like a kindergarten play date.

And if you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn.

/yea, its old, but you get the f*cking point

Can't say I miss the Iran threads, the election results were probably the biggest disappointment of the year. We desperately wanted to believe the Iranian people were just like us, (and not like the belligerent Arab) A civilized people eager to renounce their incumbent peasant leader while returning Obama's warm embrace and offerings of Pax Parthia.

Instead it was a sad month as we learned that Iran has a sane progressive minority, albeit very visible, amongst a much larger population that lusts for blood and rises up to Ahmadejinad's calls for Islamic supremacy over his opponent's softer words. It's not surprising, Muslims openly admit that turning the other cheek is not part of Islamic scripture. We overestimated this people for even today the greatest bogeyman in the Iranian hive-mind isn't the government with Persian blood on its hands, it's the British Queen and anybody that speaks English.

First, it was "Obama: The Secret Muslim!"

Now, it's "Ahmadinejad: The Secret Jew!" Link (new window)

The only reason there was a serious opposition candidate was bc Bush (and the exteral threat he caused) was gone. Many Iranians said they went along with the regiem bc of that threat while Bush was in office and McCain was shown singing "bomb Iran".

If this still confuses you read "The Prince" the whole playbook is in there.

Why would the Council of Guardians allow a US agent to run for the Iranian presidency?

We overestimated this people for even today the greatest bogeyman in the Iranian hive-mind isn't the government with Persian blood on its hands, it's the British Queen and anybody that speaks English.

It's like you internet revolutionaries need this hyperbolic romantic bullshiat to survive.

People who knew anything about Iran didn't overestimate anything because the result was a foregone conclusion. It wasn't going to be a second Marcos overthrow no matter how much you blogged about it.

People who got their news from Wikipedia or Twitter and who watch too much TV are the ones who overestimated the internet hype for a revolution that no one showed up to participate in.

Tis is what we get for being involving ourselves. The US should have just stayed out of it. Now Iranians will be outraged that we tried to make one of our agents their president.

beoswulf:
Instead it was a sad month as we learned that Iran has a sane progressive minority, albeit very visible, amongst a much larger population that lusts for blood and rises up to Ahmadejinad's calls for Islamic supremacy over his opponent's softer words. It's not surprising, Muslims openly admit that turning the other cheek is not part of Islamic scripture. We overestimated this people for even today the greatest bogeyman in the Iranian hive-mind isn't the government with Persian blood on its hands, it's the British Queen and anybody that speaks English.

I understand the depression, but I will have to disagree on one key point. All reports and photos indicate that it is not those that want "revolution" that are the minority. Most thoughtful analysts agree that it is the minority in power lashing out to maintain their control against the majority on the street.

The numbers were close according to polls before the election, but after the crackdown many fell on the side of the protesters.

I look at it in many ways like our 2000 election here. Gore had the majority, but Bush won due to our government structure. The difference is that our system is transparent, mostly, and therefore actually demoralized those against Bush before anger could really fester.

Fox News is now a mouthpiece for the Khamanei-Ahmadinejad administration?

Dome: you telling me no one noticed the silly costume?

/hot like the brats i'm grilling later

Wait... Captain America carries a gun? Has he always carried a gun? I've never noticed before...but it seems appropriate.

gadian: Dome: you telling me no one noticed the silly costume?

/hot like the brats i'm grilling later

Wait... Captain America carries a gun? Has he always carried a gun? I've never noticed before...but it seems appropriate.

You can't be a Real American unless you are armed.

And a Christian.

Alacritous: Wasn't Mousavi one of the people responsible for the 1979 revolution? and helped organize the current system of government there. Not to mention served as president previously? That's one hell of a sleeper agent.

prime minister, not president

moothemagiccow: Alacritous: Wasn't Mousavi one of the people responsible for the 1979 revolution? and helped organize the current system of government there. Not to mention served as president previously? That's one hell of a sleeper agent.

prime minister, not president

And he was the PM that we helped arm Sadaam against to boot. Man, that CIA is always thinking ahead. Especially given that Iraq was the aggressor in that conflict...