monkeys are surrendering their cheese?

Mwah hahahahahaha!

TAKE THAT, WORLD CULTURE! SOON, EVERYONE WILL BE PRETENTIOUS DOUCHEBAGS!

Good, GOOD! Everything is going just as I have foreseen!

They probably prefer them because they're cheaper and faster.

You're welcome.

Thanks, America

You're welcome. Now STFU and GBTW.

The French prefer fast food to traditional cafes and it's "thanks America?"

And I'm sure you're wearing your Birkenstocks to a local coffee shop rather than Starbucks, Subby.

the one thing the world would love to see disappear is a nation that values time off. i'm sure if it hasn't disappeared yet, the traditional summer vacation will shrink to 2 days optional but your fired if you take a vacation.

transfer of wealth and destruction of the family. capitalism at its best.

carmody: They probably prefer them because they're cheaper and faster.

Like women?

On average during a recession people's wealth declines so on average people begin substituting "inferior" but cheaper goods & services if available. Add the whole "deep recession" thing and you've got more expensive shops closing up at a fairly rapid clip.

Obvious causal relationship is obvious...

Goddamnit, no. No. No.

USA! USA! USA! USA!

Take that! Cheese-eating surrender monkeys!

You're welcome motherfarkers! No one does cultural imperialism like America! Happy Birthday!

Thanks, America

No one is forcing you to go to the fast food joints, chief. If you don't eat at those type of places, they will go the way of the dodo and the cafes will return.

/But again, why have personal responsibility when you can simply blame America?

I went to Paris once. The people there were coonts.

So I'm glad.

mekki: /But again, why have personal responsibility when you can simply blame America?

One might say they've learned VERY well.

TheShavingofOccam123: the one thing the world would love to see disappear is a nation that values time off. i'm sure if it hasn't disappeared yet, the traditional summer vacation will shrink to 2 days optional but your fired if you take a vacation.

transfer of wealth and destruction of the family. capitalism at its best.

Oh, biatch biatch biatch. You should be on your knees thanking capitalism for supporting a productive society where it's possible for you to trade money for quickly prepared meals, among other luxuries. In the wild, you'd have to build your own shelter and grow/hunt your own food. Do you think you would get plenty of time off if you had to live like that?

You spoiled, whining little biatch. Are you aware of how hard life was a mere century and a half ago? Consider how the frontiersmen of North America lived. They had to build societies from the ground up, with no welfare state governments to baby them from cradle to grave. You don't have to work nearly as hard as they did to enjoy a life far more luxurious than they enjoyed, yet you act like life is so terrible and unfair under capitalism. Grow the fark up.

We're all living in America
America ist wunderbar
We're all living in America
Coca Cola, sometimes war

Time to update the American vs European Women graphic...

TheShavingofOccam123: the one thing the world would love to see disappear is a nation that values time off. i'm sure if it hasn't disappeared yet, the traditional summer vacation will shrink to 2 days optional but your fired if you take a vacation.

transfer of wealth and destruction of the family. capitalism at its best.

Actually, socialism (read: taxes) are one of the problems with the cafe meal compared to the quick sandwich.

Sandwich shops, which include McDonald's don't have to pay the same taxes as restaurants and cafes, so their food is often cheaper.

If the french care about this there are a couple things they can do.

Even the playing field for taxes at all eateries.

Have the cafes and restaurants start offering WiFi.

Open up corporate culture to allow more remote work.

If they can do all 3 things then they can salvage more of their "food culture" but the times they are a changin' and convenience will always win out.

/Now if you'll excuse me my hot pockets are done
//And is the center still cold?
///It's like ice sir.

Yea! French Hatin'! Suck it France!

/This Foie Gras is delicious

From what I've read, outside of the major cities, French cafes and restaurants are really hit-or-miss. Think spoiled ingredients, food poisoning, etc. Unless you're a local, you don't know what the good places and bad places are.

I haven't actually been to France, but the other areas in western Europe I've been definitely suffer from uneven restaurants, so I find it quite believable.

timetokill: mekki: /But again, why have personal responsibility when you can simply blame America?

One might say they've learned VERY well.

Winner.

I'll kill for a French cafe near my work. All I have is a mall. A freaking mall with Subway and Panda Shaitpress and Starsucks. The world ain't fair I tells ya.

Fluffball: TheShavingofOccam123: the one thing the world would love to see disappear is a nation that values time off. i'm sure if it hasn't disappeared yet, the traditional summer vacation will shrink to 2 days optional but your fired if you take a vacation.

transfer of wealth and destruction of the family. capitalism at its best.

Actually, socialism (read: taxes) are one of the problems with the cafe meal compared to the quick sandwich.

Sandwich shops, which include McDonald's don't have to pay the same taxes as restaurants and cafes, so their food is often cheaper.

If the french care about this there are a couple things they can do.

Even the playing field for taxes at all eateries.

Have the cafes and restaurants start offering WiFi.

Open up corporate culture to allow more remote work.

If they can do all 3 things then they can salvage more of their "food culture" but the times they are a changin' and convenience will always win out.

/Now if you'll excuse me my hot pockets are done
//And is the center still cold?
///It's like ice sir.

Actually, Frrance just lowered the VAT for cafes. It is now lower than the sales tax rate in most US states.

France cuts VAT (new window)
VAT cut means more visitors can enjoy fine French cuisine

By Sarah Gordon
Last updated at 10:54 AM on 30th June 2009

Holidaymakers heading to France will be able to enjoy their cafe, moules and fromage at more affordable prices thanks to a cut in VAT at restaurants and cafes.

From the beginning of July the French government will substantially cut VAT from 19.6 per cent to 5.5 per cent in eateries across the country.

The tax cut will make eating out more accessible for visitors with a meal that used to cost around €15 (£13) now only costing €13.20 (£11.40).

WhileAmericaBurns: TheShavingofOccam123: the one thing the world would love to see disappear is a nation that values time off. i'm sure if it hasn't disappeared yet, the traditional summer vacation will shrink to 2 days optional but your fired if you take a vacation.

transfer of wealth and destruction of the family. capitalism at its best.

Oh, biatch biatch biatch. You should be on your knees thanking capitalism for supporting a productive society where it's possible for you to trade money for quickly prepared meals, among other luxuries. In the wild, you'd have to build your own shelter and grow/hunt your own food. Do you think you would get plenty of time off if you had to live like that?

You spoiled, whining little biatch. Are you aware of how hard life was a mere century and a half ago? Consider how the frontiersmen of North America lived. They had to build societies from the ground up, with no welfare state governments to baby them from cradle to grave. You don't have to work nearly as hard as they did to enjoy a life far more luxurious than they enjoyed, yet you act like life is so terrible and unfair under capitalism. Grow the fark up.

THIS

Seven Mason: WhileAmericaBurns: TheShavingofOccam123: the one thing the world would love to see disappear is a nation that values time off. i'm sure if it hasn't disappeared yet, the traditional summer vacation will shrink to 2 days optional but your fired if you take a vacation.

transfer of wealth and destruction of the family. capitalism at its best.

Oh, biatch biatch biatch. You should be on your knees thanking capitalism for supporting a productive society where it's possible for you to trade money for quickly prepared meals, among other luxuries. In the wild, you'd have to build your own shelter and grow/hunt your own food. Do you think you would get plenty of time off if you had to live like that?

You spoiled, whining little biatch. Are you aware of how hard life was a mere century and a half ago? Consider how the frontiersmen of North America lived. They had to build societies from the ground up, with no welfare state governments to baby them from cradle to grave. You don't have to work nearly as hard as they did to enjoy a life far more luxurious than they enjoyed, yet you act like life is so terrible and unfair under capitalism. Grow the fark up.

THIS

WHEN IN THE COURSE OF HUMAN EVENTS, THIS.

WhileAmericaBurns: TheShavingofOccam123: the one thing the world would love to see disappear is a nation that values time off. i'm sure if it hasn't disappeared yet, the traditional summer vacation will shrink to 2 days optional but your fired if you take a vacation.

transfer of wealth and destruction of the family. capitalism at its best.

Oh, biatch biatch biatch. You should be on your knees thanking capitalism for supporting a productive society where it's possible for you to trade money for quickly prepared meals, among other luxuries. In the wild, you'd have to build your own shelter and grow/hunt your own food. Do you think you would get plenty of time off if you had to live like that?

You spoiled, whining little biatch. Are you aware of how hard life was a mere century and a half ago? Consider how the frontiersmen of North America lived. They had to build societies from the ground up, with no welfare state governments to baby them from cradle to grave. You don't have to work nearly as hard as they did to enjoy a life far more luxurious than they enjoyed, yet you act like life is so terrible and unfair under capitalism. Grow the fark up.

Shut the hell up right now, you ignorant boob! The notion of having liberty and having a functional society are NOT mutually exclusive. Capitalism might have gotten us fancy new toys and gee-jaws, but people were inventive throughout the course of human history, whether a tyrant or president ran the show. The point you are trying to make very carefully, and very subtly, misses the point you seem to be responding too. Nothing in capitalism requires you to trade your liberty, personal freedom, or independence as you seem to infer in your little tirade.

This whole "either our way or the cave man way" is a bunch of straw man hokum cooked up by the folks on the top to try and get us to realize "we need them", just like the frickin fear monger Chancellor in "V is for Vendetta". Nothing says that a society with out level of resources and technological development would not actually advance faster under another format. Nothing says that it would not advance slower either, but your burst of capitalistic nonsense suggested an absolute, which I am here to refute.


Why is the debate always framed as "Modern society OR the caveman world"? Why can't you accept that maybe, just maybe, their are alternatives to be had, and that some people want to talk about those, rather than simply slobbering on Adam Smiths' knob. Though I would bet you've never actually read Adam Smith, as he talked about the need to regulation, and the fact that the rich ought to pay more in proportion than the poor do. You more then likely read a summary of half of his works, if anything, you know, the half that utterly ignored the moral aspect to his theory, the moral aspect he devoted a whole damned book too because it grew too long to fit in with his "Wealth of Nations". Its called "A History of Moral Sentiments" if you are curious and want to give it the once over. Or you can continue to spout out your ignorance, and let that speak for you.

Never mind that though, as that does not support your current debate about how if we had nice vacations, we would still be living in the stone age. Seriously, that's what your argument boils down too. The fact that people who came before us had it worse is utterly and totally irrelevant to this talk, but it seems to add weight to your argument, so you toss that in there just for bulk. So what? The same could be said for the people in Iran, Russia, most of Europe, etc. All of them have wildly different forms of economy, so obviously its not JUST about capitalism, now is it?

We deserve to be in charge of our own fate, come hell or high water. We deserve to make choices about our own lives, not have them made for us. We should have the right to choose how many farking days out of the year we want to work, knowing if we do not work enough, we don't get paid as much as that other buy, but that's okay with us. Right now, you are nor given anything other than a "yes/no" ultimatum when employed. That is not independence, that is not control over ones own life. That is being subject to the whims of management, which is NOT how a good and just society (like the one envisioned by the founding fathers) ought to be organized.

You argue that to want for those things is to want to live in a cave, do you realize how utterly foolish that makes you appear?

How is a Big Mac intrinsically worse than some snails in hollandaise sauce? Maybe if poor fat slobs at snails and the snobs ate burgers with secret sauce, how would that be different? In a dozen large and small ways, the Francophone world is being shown to be a hypocritical, pretentious, empty suit.

Their record of imperialism is more cruel and less competent than the British.

They meddle in their spheres of influence worse than the US and UK, then wag their narrow, girley fingers at us.

They resent our saving their derrieres in WW1 and WW2. They had the cheek to say "France freed herself" in their newspapers when WE liberated them from the Germans and Vichy collaborators. After the war everyone claimed to be in La Resistance. Je pense que NON.

We would have never dirtied our reputation with Viet Nam if not for their imperialism in the area.

Americans are fatter because we smoke less.

I would rather be a poor, Muslim minority in the US or UK than France.

Ex-colonies of the French are much worse off today than the UK, other things equal.

The shabby treatment of the weak by the powerful is a constant of the human condition, but we own up to our continuing errors.

Dughan: That is being subject to the whims of management, which is NOT how a good and just society (like the one envisioned by the founding fathers) ought to be organized.

You do realize that Jefferson had free labor? His slaves didn't have justice. The FFs didn't envision a world in which you could say, "I want this job, but I think I'll work 20 hours, not 40, mkay?" That world only exists in your bong. It never has existed and as long as private individuals govern their businesses, it won't exist.


You're a raging idealist, rage on, you crazy diamond.

yep, we're doing our best to fark up the rest of the world, as long as their is a buck to be made and the media can continue to be controlled by our corporate marketing machine.


isn't Freedom Great!

More fast food = more fat asses = higher health care costs = more taxes to support socialized healthcare = economic downturn.

So the Euro will eventually be our biatch again. Great plan all around.


/happy 4th

FTFA:

Xavier Mazzoni, who operates the stand, said he left his job in a traditional restaurant a little over two years ago to open the sandwich stand, renting the space from the cafe owner. As clients lined up to be served, Mazzoni, 42, said he has to get up at 5 a.m. to make the sandwiches -- tuna, chicken, ham, cheese, salmon -- but is rewarded with enough business to bring in a good living and finance a planned beach vacation this summer for his two children.

A waiter circulating among the traditional cafe tables only a few feet away acknowledged that Mazzoni's sandwich stand drains away food business from the Benjamin, which advertises in gold letters painted on the wall that it offers "traditional cuisine."

Huh, a hardworking guy takes advantage of shifting french habits and sets up a successful business in order to provide for his family.

Obviously, some people are going to have a problem with this.

I'm guessing subby also hates Wal*Mart for selling inexpensive goods.

/Free will. It's so overrated

How about this? For breakfast on a busy morning, I can log onto a nearby cafe's website, order an omelette sandwich (which is far better than what you'd find at a typical sandwich shop or fast-food chain), and pick it up on my way to work. I probably won't eat it on my way to work, since my office is less than a block away from the cafe, but once I'm at the office, I can check my e-mail to make sure that nothing requires my immediate attention, then retreat to the break room and eat the sandwich while brewing a cup of tea.

So the French eat fast food, and it's America's fault. Uh huh. Yeah. Because we all know the French are just scrambling to try to be as much like their American heroes as possible.

Dughan and others, go read the essay "I, Pencil". It is *exactly* true that some form of capitalism is necessary to have a modern lifestyle. It's downright unavoidable. Now, the degree is debatable. But some underlying capitalist structure must exist that's able to adapt to supply-and-demand changes. You might not know this, but even the Soviet Union quickly set up a pseudo-price structure for resources because it is impossible for any central planner to simply decide how resources should be allocated off the top of his head. The Kremlin even went so far as to subscribe to the Wall Street Journal and look at commodity prices as a guideline for how to distribute their resources.

Also, Dughan, your argument has one fundamental flaw. You seem to be assuming that setting your own schedule is a form of personal liberty. And you know what? You do have that right. I do it all the time as a researcher. However, others have the right to tell you to go to hell if they don't want to hire you for that schedule. And it's not a big evil corporate conspiracy. The majority of employers are small business owners, not the big evil faceless men-in-suits. Are you really telling me that you should have the ability to force business owners to accept your schedule? Find a job where you can set your own schedule. Setting your own schedule is one of the top reasons people start their own businesses. But quit whining about it.

CnFlght: DughanYou argue that to want for those things is to want to live in a cave, do you realize how utterly foolish that makes you appear?/i>

Speaking of caves, you just bit for one of the more obvious trolls I've seen in awhile. Look at his handle.

Can somebody explain to me what's wrong with my handle? I don't get it.

French cuisine isn't necessarily all it's cracked up to be, what with the higher-than-should-be-normal chance of developing extremely unpleasant food poisoning.

I'm surprised that the French are only choosing between sandwiches and sit-down three-course meals. As soon as French businesses install microwave ovens, the sandwich stops are doomed.

Picard is a chain that sells only frozen food, and their site is at picard.fr

Tarte à la rhubarbe et aux pommes
4€95 la pièce de 510 g
(Rhubarb and apple tart)

First course:

10 crepes, cheese with or without ham (50 g each): 2.10 euro
2 quiche lorraine, 180 g each: 2.55 euro

Main course:

Red chicken curry with jasmine rice: 3.60 euro
Chicken tagine with apricots and semolina couscous: 1.65 euro
Basque-style chicken with rice: 1.95 euro
Beef Bourginion: 1.95 euro

Dessert:

Two individual flans: 2.75 euro
Two creme brulee: 4.20 euro

Two people eating together: Entree 2.55 euro, Main course 5.25 euro. Total: 7.80 euro plus fizzy drink of choice (or vin ordinaire) Add 3-4 euro for dessert (or just grab a piece of fruit and some cheese for 1-2 euro).