Chelle82: but what the hell is up with the Habs this week? Are they paying these guys with IOUs?

I wanted Gionta in Buffalo but not at that price. Get him at a bargain later on. the season depends on how ready Chris Butler is but one thing's for sure, it's Lindytime and Millertime for a long time. yeahhh

TheShavingofOccam123: Stephen Colbert is Canadian, isn't he?

That polite little bastard.

/all right, so i looked up his wiki and found out he is American Irish Catholic. Close enough.

Yeah, spent his life in South Carolina.

Chelle82
//and to keep it on topic, what are Canada's feelings on soccer?

I'm sure they'll like Stefan Raab's "Ice Football":

It's soccer played five-against-five.
The field is an ice hockey rink.
The players are wearing hockey armor..
..and bowling shoes.

Main site,
Link to the page with more videos

You should hear Europeans talk about baseball. They sound a lot like the haters in this thread.

I like football (soccer) and it tickles me pink to see so many people so riled up about it.


Visca!

Americans = teh lack of attention span

Jesterian: Americans = teh lack of attention span

Uh, Americans like baseball and nascar so I'm gonna call bullshiat.

Shadowknight: But I'm sorry, it's just infinitely a more watchable sport for Americans. Its' fast paced, has an actual win/lose outcome (no ties!) and things actually happen.

A sport that has about 5 seconds of action, followed by 40 seconds of standing in a circle, followed by another 5 seconds of action (you get the picture)... then there's timeouts... commercial breaks... 3 intermissions... and that's more fast-paced, eh? A 60 minute game stretched out into 3 hours is faster-paced than a 90 minute match that typically ends in roughly 2 hours?

I'm convinced Americans don't love football is because, with American football being more dominant, we only think football is sooo low scoring. I've posted this diatribe a few times here over the past couple weeks, but it won't hurt to do it again. What if, in football, every goal counted for 7 points? And how about shots that didn't score count as 3 points? After all, you might as well get credit for trying, even when you don't actually succeed, right? So, let's take USA/Brazil as an example. Brazil has 21 points on 3 goals, plus another 24 points on 8 shots on goal that were turned aside. USA had 14 points on 2 goals, as well another 6 points for 2 other shots that were stopped. So Brazil wins 45-20. Or how about the 3rd place game, Spain/South Africa? Spain would win that one 36-29. All of a sudden, we've got a game that Americans will be tricked into perceiving as high scoring and will also, therefore, consider to be wicked fast-paced.

On a side note, punting should be outlawed in American football. What farking sport has one team willfully and deliberately turn the ball/puck over to the opponent at any point in the game? I say, on 4th down, go for it or kick a field goal. You don't succeed, big deal, at least you didn't wuss out.

steamingpile:
CaptMacMillian: We're not in disagreement about scoring, only that there are idiots in this thread who think that it is soccer's problem.

No soccers biggest problem is that its farking boring, even to us adults who played it as kids find it dull now. The last time I had fun playing soccer was in an indoor complex that I think has been torn down since then, soccer was fun when it was played indoors like hockey and had action but fark that field they play on now is just too farking big for consistent action to take place.

I'm an adult, so are my friends. We all love soccer, make trips to USA games all across the east coast and all have our own favorite clubs. I only care to watch football when my hometown team (Who dey!) is playing.

I'm also a product of a new generation, one that doesn't really remember before the MLS (I was 7 in '93) and that can easily watch soccer from all over the globe. A generation where youth soccer doesn't stop when you enter high school and club teams travel all over the country and world playing each other.

My father and uncles grew up without even really knowing anything about soccer, they were all football/baseball/basketball guys and are still to this day. However in my family every single kid has played soccer in high school instead of the three sports our elder generation.

The people who said that soccer was going to take over aren't completely wrong. While even I doubt that soccer will overtake American football soccer is certainly on the rise everywhere in the United States, I'm living proof.

NicoFinn: You should hear Europeans talk about baseball. They sound a lot like the haters in this thread.

Do they compare it to cricket the way we compare football and soccer, or is it just a straight-up "baseball is stupid?"

madden101: NicoFinn: You should hear Europeans talk about baseball. They sound a lot like the haters in this thread.

Do they compare it to cricket the way we compare football and soccer, or is it just a straight-up "baseball is stupid?"

Both.

madden101
NicoFinn: You should hear Europeans talk about baseball. They sound a lot like the haters in this thread.

Do they compare it to cricket the way we compare football and soccer, or is it just a straight-up "baseball is stupid?"

I couldn't say - I never heard anyone talk about it.

Well, maybe if there's a movie around a baseball team you might get a "Do you by any chance happen to know how scoring works in baseball?".

/does someone besides the UK and its former colonies actually play cricket?

madden101: NicoFinn: You should hear Europeans talk about baseball. They sound a lot like the haters in this thread.

Do they compare it to cricket the way we compare football and soccer, or is it just a straight-up "baseball is stupid?"

I've never talked to anyone here about cricket. And even when they hate, they're more educated about it than as to just call it stupid. They call it boring, as if they've actually tried to watch a game or two. They haven't. Trust me.

Football > Baseball > Hockey > Basketball > Nascar >>> ETC >>>> World series of poker > Women's basketball > Women's golf >>>>>>>>>>>>>> soccer.

madden101: A sport that has about 5 seconds of action, followed by 40 seconds of standing in a circle, followed by another 5 seconds of action (you get the picture)... then there's timeouts... commercial breaks... 3 intermissions... and that's more fast-paced, eh? A 60 minute game stretched out into 3 hours is faster-paced than a 90 minute match that typically ends in roughly 2 hours?

I agree the commercial breaks are a problem with football. It is about the only problem though, otherwise it is basically the perfect sport.

Anyway, you are definiting action too narrowly as "the clock running." Football players are doing stuff before the clock necessarily starts while soccer players are often doing nothing very interesting for a minute before a short burst of action, even if the clock is ticking the whole time.

CaptMacMillian:
The people who said that soccer was going to take over aren't completely wrong. While even I doubt that soccer will overtake American football soccer is certainly on the rise everywhere in the United States, I'm living proof.

One dude ain't proof of much, no offense.

All of the other problems discussed here aside, the biggest obstacle for soccer in the us is that simply the league is crap.

America has all of the best football players (of course, they are all from here....), basketball players and baseball players in the world coming here to play. Our leagues are the peak of the sports.

Our soccer league is mediocre at best, with even the best American players choosing to play elsewhere.

As long as this is the case, America as a whole won't give much of a shiat about soccer. Soccer is on the rise now like women's baskeball was on the rise.

Things could change the the future, but it will be a long road...

Soccer fever. CATCH IT!

when stephen colbert turned his back on the venture brothers, i turned my back on him

I_Approve_Of_This_Message: I'm very much looking forward to the US Cup qualifier vs the Portland Timbers tonight. There's at least 500 supporters on their way down and it promises to be a crazy affair.

I was there. It was epic.

/GO SOUNDERS!

I know soccer isn't a sport talked a lot about here on Fark, but if I could add my 2 cents...

I'm a Toronto FC supporter - proud and loyal since the club was first created in 2006. Since the city was awarded the franchise from Major League Soccer, the media here in town has given little regard to the club and its fans. Prominent radio personalities and writers gave the whole concept so pretty dire predictions. One of the more recognized members of the sports journalism community went on the radio and flatly said he gives the new soccer club "3 years at the most". And as the anti-soccer crowd continued their tirades against the club and sport, everyone else started to fall into the same mindset. Heck, Toronto is a hockey town, right? Why would anyone here bother to watch soccer?

Fact: Toronto FC sold 14,000 season tickets three weeks after they went on sale for the first time in 2006. They actually had 7,000 more people wanting season tickets but had to cap off sales due to league restrictions for corporate clients and community groups.

Fact: Since the first game at BMO Field in April 2007, 9 out of 10 home games have had sell out crowds. There is such demand for season and single-game tickets that less than 5 years into the club's history, there have already been talks between Toronto FC and the City of Toronto (owners of the stadium) to expand seating and increase the capacity.

Fact: Toronto FC, being in a city with a fraction of the population of Los Angeles and currently playing in a stadium that only holds around 20,000 is second place just behind the LA Galaxy in gross revenue.

Fact: Toronto FC supporters have travelled en mass to Columbus, Kansas City, Foxborough, New York, and other MLS in the thousands - possibly more than the number of Toronto Maple Leaf fans who travel to Ottawa, Buffalo, or Montreal.

And that's just Toronto FC's success. Seattle is looking spectacular in their first year playing in MLS and Philadelphia has been building up their supporter fanbase steadily since 2007 (they start playing in 2010). Vancouver is getting ready to start playing in 2011 alongside Portland, though if a stadium deal falls through with that city, Montreal will likely take the place of the Timbers.

I guess what I'm saying is that soccer probably isn't going away here in North America. In Canada, the sport is really picking up steam - likely a lot of that is due to the huge influx of immigrants we've had over the years who don't really have much interest in CFL football, baseball or lacrosse. I know the sport faces a bit more of an uphill battle in the US where baseball, basketball, and NFL/college football are the kings of sport; but I think the upcoming explosion of popularity for soccer is inevitable.



With Toronto FC, unlike the crowds we get at Maple Leafs, Raptors, Rock, or Argonauts games; almost EVERYONE wears red.

Oh, and now that I'm thinking of it:

"Soccer" is actually slang for Association Football.

The term came about when people started following Rugby Football and wanted to differentiate between the two. Soccer is actually English in origin and is still used today in places like South Africa, Australia, and the Caribbean as well as here in North America.

RadioAaron: I_Approve_Of_This_Message: I'm very much looking forward to the US Cup qualifier vs the Portland Timbers tonight. There's at least 500 supporters on their way down and it promises to be a crazy affair.

I was there. It was epic.

/GO SOUNDERS!

It was, indeed, a great game.
GO TIMBERS!

And hey, aren't we polite? Guy falls down, we give him a bottle of water. Hand-delivered.

/Not our proudest moment

1. Football (Yes, the NFL, but any football is better than NO football.)

2. Boxing/MMA

3. NBA

4. MLB (for a few weeks a year, anyway)

After that, it's pretty much just all kinda generic "sport" to be viewed when you're bored at home or munching your wings at Hooters, IMHO. Most sports fans can appreciate great play, no matter what the game. (That's one reason ESPN is popular year-round.)

Folks most appreciate sports they have experience with, or have grown up playing. We understand those games better and see the nuances more readily than in games with which we are less-experienced. Often, there are traditions to be respected, sometimes family or regional loyalty come into play. One likes what he likes. It's not a sin.

In conclusion: JUST GIVE ME MY FOOTBALL AND NOBODY GETS HURT!


/got the urge to bust out the Madden
//it's been a while...thanks for the inspiration, guys
///now go play whatever it is you kids are playing these days...just not on my lawn

Yeah, I seem to remember a dive in the NFL.

PullItOut: And hey, aren't we polite? Guy falls down, we give him a bottle of water. Hand-delivered.

/Not our proudest moment

I thought he flopped, but yeah, definitely ironic in front of the "A League Below; A Class Above" banner.

There were quite a few rave green jerseys rolling around on the pitch tonight, though.

Fantastic match, though. 2011 should be incredible.

Shadowknight: I know American Football is one of the more horribly named sports in the world, and is a result of us having to be different from everyone else...

But I'm sorry, it's just infinitely a more watchable sport for Americans. Its' fast paced, has an actual win/lose outcome (no ties!) and things actually happen.

About the only European sport I've been able to watch is Rugby, which is of course the granddaddy of American football anyway, just with more brutality and injury. I really did try to give the World Cup a shot last time around, and I just couldn't do it. Could not bring myself to care.

What? fast paced? I have watched paint drying that is faster paced that American football! The only American sport I can bring myself to even watch is Ice Hockey, oh wait thats Canadian.

insertcutename: I know soccer isn't a sport talked a lot about here on Fark, but if I could add my 2 cents...

I'm a Toronto FC...blah blah blah eh?

Has a Toronto FC fan ever traveled to watch Toronto FC in a MLS Cup game? Ha Ha! I flew to LA last year to watch Columbus defeat the New York Red Bulls for the MLS Cup!

I was also at BMO field earlier this year for the Columbus game. Good times! I'm glad MLS fans are getting into the soccer threads. I hate it when soccer comes up on fark and only the euro leagues are talked about.

I think a MLS soccer game would make a great fark party location or maybe one of the summer tour games that the big euro teams make.

/Columbus Till I Die!
//Actually did meet TFC fans from Toronto at MLS Cup.

I think it's funny to see all Europeans here trying to convince Americans that football (soccer) is great. But if Americans really decided to agree, they would likely trounce all other teams in the world, and the rest of the World (tm) would hate them for it.

/ Do not wake the sleeping bear
// India(?)

Ball. A ball is round. A baseball is round. A basketball is round. A bowling ball is round. A tennis ball is round.

American football. That is NOT A BALL. That is an oval shaped thing. THAT IS NOT A BALL. The only bounce I've seen of an american football is a rugby styled fieldgoal (performed all of a handfull of times). More than 90% of the game has nothing to do with the ball and peoples feet.

Americans need to man up and call it something else. Carrysortaball? That's not football. Find a sexier marketing name for it and let the majority of the world quit laughing at us calling it 'soccer'.
Or just call it armoredwankball. Some guy ran an article about how much action occurs in american football. The average 'player' - 'ran' about 12 minutes over the course of the entire game. The rest of the time they stood around with their hands on their hips.

I'd rather watch grass diving. At least the farkers RUN.

kenwoodzanussi: I think it's funny to see all Europeans here trying to convince Americans that football (soccer) is great. But if Americans really decided to agree, they would likely trounce all other teams in the world, and the rest of the World (tm) would hate them for it.

/ Do not wake the sleeping bear
// India(?)

Americans seem to overestimate both how much other countries would care about them winning a few more matches and how much their economic power would matter. The most successful team in recent times and over the last 60 years has been Brazil. In the last couple of years Spain has emerged as the likely best team in the world (though they haven't been near winning the world cup). These are hardly economic superpowers. Football (soccer) is extremely low-tech and the countries with greater spontaneous grass-roots participation are usually on top. Kids playing in the street, jumpers for goalposts and all that.

Fano: bwesb: I'll settle for just a sport that Americans can play.

We had a big upset the other day and were close to beating the Brazilians, right?

/I don't think Europeans have thought this through. They don't REALLY want Americans to turn their effort and money into soccer, do they?

Beating Spain 2-0 was a pretty big upset really.

They're current European Champions, and are the 2nd ranked team in the world (behind Brazil) and they actually fielded their full team.

I've been saying since the USA world cup that if the USA turns into a soccer playing nation, we're all farked. There's such a large population base to pull from and the training resources are second to none, that the USA will start to dominate world football within 10-15 years from now.

It's not like "soccer" doesn't get played over there, it's just that you don't treat it that seriously. If the USA even put 1/2 of the effort into it that it does with college football they'll get to the final of the world cup within 10 years.

darkscout: Maybe we should propose this scoring to 'americanize' soccer.
4 points: 1/2 way line or back
3 points: Outside of the PK box
2 points: Inside the PK Box

How about no.

Changes were usggested prior to the USA world cup. IIRC thing like limiting players to which portions fo the field they can go into. i.e. defenders were only allowed in their own half, attackers not allowed into their own area. The people who suggested these were rightfully laughed at.

theinsultabot9000: you know i remember a thread a while back in which some European fellows were trying to once and for all prove that futbol was better and more widely viewed then football, and there proof was one of those google fights with futbol on one end and American football on the other. then the whole thing crashed and burned when someone (correctly) pointed out that Americans dont call it that, they just call it football, so instead they tried fifa vs the NFL and NFL won handily, followed by much European WHARRBLEGHARBBLING.


hilarious.

Uhm, so you beat the UK?

Good for you. :)

Bill Frist: Soccer does not predate American football, or not by any significant time. They both developed pretty much simultaneously.

Good one!

CaptMacMillian: While even I doubt that soccer will overtake American football soccer is certainly on the rise everywhere in the United States, I'm living proof.

Why the FARK didn't someone tell me CaptMacMillian liked soccer. I missed this revolution and now I'm years behind the rest of the country.


/Soccer players are the biggest pussies ever.
//Proof 1 (new window)
///Proof 2 (new window)
////There's lots more. But you get the point.

Ok... I'll be the first to say it.



I'm ashamed at you farkers...

Simpsons said everything needed to be said:

"Center, back to Winger, back to Center, holds, Holds It, HOLDS IT!!"

/would be better with pic of broadcaster out of his chair and on the glass of the booth

or



/Loves me some football....both kinds..."soccer" more though.

ONE AND A HALF MONTHS TO GO.....SUCK IT HATERS!!

SwallowTheKnife: CaptMacMillian: While even I doubt that soccer will overtake American football soccer is certainly on the rise everywhere in the United States, I'm living proof.

Why the FARK didn't someone tell me CaptMacMillian liked soccer. I missed this revolution and now I'm years behind the rest of the country.

What the hell are you going on about?

Pinko_Commie: Fano: bwesb: I'll settle for just a sport that Americans can play.

We had a big upset the other day and were close to beating the Brazilians, right?

/I don't think Europeans have thought this through. They don't REALLY want Americans to turn their effort and money into soccer, do they?

Beating Spain 2-0 was a pretty big upset really.

They're current European Champions, and are the 2nd ranked team in the world (behind Brazil) and they actually fielded their full team.

I've been saying since the USA world cup that if the USA turns into a soccer playing nation, we're all farked. There's such a large population base to pull from and the training resources are second to none, that the USA will start to dominate world football within 10-15 years from now.

It's not like "soccer" doesn't get played over there, it's just that you don't treat it that seriously. If the USA even put 1/2 of the effort into it that it does with college football they'll get to the final of the world cup within 10 years.

That's what I was saying...if becoming a professional soccer player were the goal of all the little boys around America, the US team would be incredible.

I'm no soccer fan, but I love watching it in other countries with people who care. It seems a lot of people on Fark just really don't understand American football though (not directing this at you, Pinko). It's a game of strategy, holding your position and conquering the territory of your opponent. Why is there punting? Because the goal isn't necessarily to score with every offensive possession...it's to hold on to your territory and advance as far onto theirs as you can get.

Personally, I think the most "exciting" game in the world is playoff hockey, but football and all of its macho "I will take this field by force and cunning" chest thumping is in our American blood. Then again, my livelihood depends on the success of the NFL, so I may be biased...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rounders Much more similar to baseball than cricket. And while I much prefer cricket to baseball, I enjoy going to the ballpark every now and then..

TonnageVT: ONE AND A HALF MONTHS TO GO.....SUCK IT HATERS!!

I've got a good feeling about Valencia! Hopefully with Ronaldo gone SAF will play Rooney and Berbatov up front and return Anderson to his more familiar attacking midfield role. Hargreaves, Fletcher, Carrick are the holding midfielders, let Ando get back to his favoured position, the one that caught people's eye in the first place.

As long as we shove Liverpool's lucky 4-1 win down their throats I'll be happy!

The Envoy: Bill Frist: Soccer does not predate American football, or not by any significant time. They both developed pretty much simultaneously.

Good one!

Association football (soccer) in its modern form began with the formation of the Football Association in 1863 and the promulgation of its rules (earlier rules permitted carrying the ball and tackling, and would not be recognizable as modern soccer).

American football in its modern form began with a series of games played between Harvard University and McGill University in 1874. Unless you consider 11 years to be a huge historical difference.

So yeah, both sports really developed around the same time.

Chelle82: Roger Arseways: Chelle82: Granted, I'm doing an assload of speculating here. And I have the benefit of never being able to be proved wrong as soccer will probably never take hold in American culture the way football and basketball have. At least not in my lifetime.

You're from Buffalo -- did you see that the Habs overpaid for Spacek?

I will miss doing impressions of him, but what the hell is up with the Habs this week? Are they paying these guys with IOUs?

/That's just as good as money, sir. Those are IOUs!

Not just the Habs. What the hell money is Chicago spending? 12 year contract for Hossa? How the hell are they going to re-sign Toews and Kane next summer. The Hawks are going to be in serious cap hell.

I'm sad to see Spacek go, but not terribly surprised. I guess we'll see if Montador can bring some sandpaper to the blueline. But in all honesty, I'm more excited to see Tyler Myers make his NHL debut. That kid's a monster.

The Envoy: Bill Frist: Soccer does not predate American football, or not by any significant time. They both developed pretty much simultaneously.

Good one!

The ancient form of "football" almost certainly resembled rubgy (and thus arguably american football) more than soccer)


In england there were tons of different versions of football, again most more like rubgy. In the mid-19th century efforts were made to make more strict and universal rules. Early codes were drawn up in cambridge in 1848.... but it didn't really become soccer as we know it until much later (you could still run with the ball in the Football Association's rules in the 1870s and beyond). The IFAB wasn't formed until the 1880s.

Over in the Atlantic, the first intercollegiate match that resembled american football was in 1869. The "rule standardization" happened in the 1873-1880 according to Wiki, which basically predates the real standardization in England.

"but... but.... mommy told me the cavemen played soccer!!!!"

Doc Daneeka: Association football (soccer) in its modern form began with the formation of the Football Association in 1863 and the promulgation of its rules (earlier rules permitted carrying the ball and tackling, and would not be recognizable as modern soccer).

American football in its modern form began with a series of games played between Harvard University and McGill University in 1874. Unless you consider 11 years to be a huge historical difference.

So yeah, both sports really developed around the same time.

I was talking about the concept of football the sport, not the modern iteration that is soccer, I got my terms wrong. We can go all the way back to the 12th century in England, London and Ashbourne, although those games resembled a mass brawl, for some of the earliest "organised" games. The reason that it developed so early is the same as the reason for it being the most popular sport on the planet: all you need is something vaguely round. From coconuts to pig's bladders to rattan, as long as you can kick it you can have a game.

The MLS sucks and it's basically a 3rd rate league.

That is all.

I enjoy watching most sports in moderation with maybe an exception for baseball (I'd rather play it). I respect the skill and the talent required to play every sport... just some aren't that fun to watch. (Some of it has to do with piss poor leadership and marketing, game times etc.. *cough* *cough* hockey)

The thing that irks me about Soccer is how flopping on the ground, to me, seems to be an integral part of the game, hell it's basically a form of strategy.

Play-off NBA Basketball: the refs call less fouls and let the game get more physical
Play-off NFL Football: the refs call less fouls and let the games get more intense and physical
Play-off/Tournament International Soccer: The players still flop to draw fouls.

I have no problem with Soccer the sport, but too often in the last world cup players would flop at the first sign of contact, or take an extra dive to make contact look worse than it was. I realize this happens in other sports but it's most apparent in Soccer. Also I can't speak for Soccer personally, but I've gone to plenty of Spurs games and seen San Antonio fans boo their own players when they do an especially poor job of acting like they took a monster hit. Which goes with the mentality to the sport. Amercan Football might not be anymore physically demanding than Soccer, but you can be darned sure no linebacker will ever flop on a hit just to draw a penalty...

Also the advertisements all over uniforms is annoying and makes me think European soccer is a giant sell-out. The NFL, NBA, MLB, etc.. are all super strict on what kind of stuff you can have on your uniform which I think is pretty classy as opposed to I don't know a giant "AIG" logo on the front of your uniform with no team name in-sight.

The Envoy: I was talking about the concept of football the sport, not the modern iteration that is soccer, I got my terms wrong. We can go all the way back to the 12th century in England, London and Ashbourne, although those games resembled a mass brawl, for some of the earliest "organised" games. The reason that it developed so early is the same as the reason for it being the most popular sport on the planet: all you need is something vaguely round. From coconuts to pig's bladders to rattan, as long as you can kick it you can have a game.

"Football" games have been played in Europe for centuries, agreed.

All modern codes of football (soccer, American/Canadian football, Rugby Union, Rugby League, Aussie Rules, Gaelic football) equally evolved from those common antecedents. They didn't start to diverge into the games we know today until the mid-late 19th Century, as I said.

Association football/soccer doesn't have any greater claim to that centuries of history than the other football codes do. In fact, as I said, before 1863 at the formation of the Football Association and its rules, England had been playing a form of football that more closely resembled rugby than soccer.

Listen, Bill Frist and all you soccer haters.

We don't care.

We simply like soccer, sorry.

We like the low scoring, we like ties, we like the pussy players, we like the acting, we like the flopping, we like the bad calls, we like the few scoring chances, we like the pointless passes in midfield, we like the vuvuzelas, we like penalties and we like everything else about it.

Yes, we even like that you don't like it.

Thank you.