Where did these policies come from in the first place? The Federal Gun-Free Schools Act of 1994 required states receiving federal educational funds to adopt zero tolerance policies.

I don't know whether to thank Bill Clinton or Newt Gingrich for its passage.

discordium: grinding_journalist: It makes me sad we have to legislate common sense BACK into law.

I hate to do this.... but...

THIS

Triple THIS!

notmtwain: Where did these policies come from in the first place? The Federal Gun-Free Schools Act of 1994 required states receiving federal educational funds to adopt zero tolerance policies.

I don't know whether to thank Bill Clinton or Newt Gingrich for its passage.

Zero tolerance for guns I can agree with. Same for certain controlled substances. OTC, hell no.

canadianloon: First thing I thought of.

/thanks.

I must say I have zero tolerance for her wearing clothes.

canadianloon: First thing I thought of.

/thanks.

No, thank you canadianloon!

/going in my emergency eye-bleach folder...

bhcompy: notmtwain: Where did these policies come from in the first place? The Federal Gun-Free Schools Act of 1994 required states receiving federal educational funds to adopt zero tolerance policies.

I don't know whether to thank Bill Clinton or Newt Gingrich for its passage.

Zero tolerance for guns I can agree with. Same for certain controlled substances. OTC, hell no.

Zero tolerance for recreational drugs almost makes sense. I would prefer a 0.001 tolerance though, lest some kid end up with a flake of resin on his sneaker and get ejected for that. What they do at home is no one's business but their own and their parents.

Zero tolerance for guns, less so. School rifle teams and after school gun saftey courses are, to my mind, if not a good thing then no worse than football and driver's ed. (Compare if you will traffic fatalities to gun fatalities in any recent year.)

And I am one of those folks in favor of a certain amount of gun control.

The Apocalypse is upon us. Republicans making sense. In Florida.

Saberus Terras: canadianloon: First thing I thought of.

/thanks.

No, thank you canadianloon!

/going in my emergency eye-bleach folder...

I'm guessing you got the "reach around" joke, eh?

canadianloon: First thing I thought of.

/thanks.

Good on 'em. Zero tolerance is a cancer as far as school discipline goes. If someone's getting their ass whooped, they can't fight back, or else they get arrested, too. Sometimes, a person just needs to be beat up by the person they keep treating like crap.

Didn't Crist write the original "Turn the Other Cheek" policy?

Aexia: Well, Senate Republicans are already lining up to oppose him so don't plan on seeing him around for long. Which is too bad because he's a good guy.

How long until he switches parties? I wonder. I wonder if he and snowe and collins and bloomberg and spectre and any number of blue dawgs might not get together and form a party of the middle. They might get my vote here and there.

TypoFlyspray:
Zero tolerance for guns, less so. School rifle teams and after school gun saftey courses are, to my mind, if not a good thing then no worse than football and driver's ed. (Compare if you will traffic fatalities to gun fatalities in any recent year.)

And I am one of those folks in favor of a certain amount of gun control.

Sure, but you issue permits for that, and make sure the firearm and ammo is controlled in a specific manner, even if it includes trigger locks with only the rifle team coach having the key. You shouldn't be carrying a handgun to school though.

discordium: ArrogantGod: StreetlightInTheGhetto:
/got detention in 9th grade for putting a blank floppy into a computer

I have you beat.

I got suspended when my mom came in to the office and picked me up and took me to the dentist for my appointment.

I got suspended because I left school during a bomb scare. Rather than wait outside in the snow for the school to be cleared, I went home with some friends.

/would do it again
//am not waiting for bombs

I got expelled when I called in that bomb threat.

tshetter: JACKSONVILLE, Fla. - Gov. Charlie Crist will visit Robert E. Lee Senior High School Wednesday


I remember seeing a REL HS in Tampa as well...it was in the ghetto.

So there's an Erwin J Rommel and an Isoroku Yamamoto High School as well? Or does Florida only name schools after failed military leaders when they're hillbillies?

For those of you who read the bill that was linked at the site... is it just me or does this really not do a damn thing.

They say that it is not necessary to report b.s. (aka: being a teenager) behavior to law enforcement agencies and they encourage 'other options' but does not flat out specify what is and is not grounds for expulsion vs. (suspension, detention, write up, or ). Seems like it more the mayor saying "I acknowledge that there is the potential for problems and abuse, but us politicians really aren't saying what should be done to resolve it."

Also... Zero Tolerance got it's start in Los Angeles schools in the mid-80's during the gang problems there. It was sort of justified then. Now? In the rest of the country? No. Get rid of it. It's a veiled attack on the civil rights of students, at worst.

Reagan, Clinton, and Gingrich had nothing to do with it, really. It's really up to the states and the school districts.

This news brightens my day. If only this trend would catch on in other states...

/looking at you, PA

bhcompy

Zero tolerance for guns I can agree with.

You know that zero tolerance for guns often includes squirt guns and even finger pistols?

aerojockey: bhcompy

Zero tolerance for guns I can agree with.

You know that zero tolerance for guns often includes squirt guns and even finger pistols?

But under this new law, that would fall under misconduct rather than a serious threat to the safety of the students and staff. Kids shouldn't bring squirt guns to school, but they shouldn't be expelled for it either. Whatever happened to plain ol' detention?

aerojockey: bhcompy

Zero tolerance for guns I can agree with.

You know that zero tolerance for guns often includes squirt guns and even finger pistols?

And those aren't guns. I'm talkin about firearms.

I can't seriously believe there are high schools named after Robert E. Lee. Is there a Benedict Arnold High as well?

Girl got suspended for a plastic butterknife in her lunchbox, stuff like that is retarded, like Fark retarded. This is a good story.

tricycleracer: Zero-Tolerance: Decision making for idiots.

ZERO TOLERANCE = ZERO INTELLIGENCE

Learn it. know it. live it.

It's_A_Farking_Secret: I can't seriously believe there are high schools named after Robert E. Lee. Is there a Benedict Arnold High as well?

As someone who is not from the South(or the North), Lee is as much an American hero as anyone else. He was a brilliant general, one of the best in American history, who fought for his homeland, and wasn't particularly immoral nor was he unprofessional in defeat.

tricycleracer: Zero-Tolerance: Decision making for idiots So people can stop getting sued for making rational decisions.

It's_A_Farking_Secret: I can't seriously believe there are high schools named after Robert E. Lee. Is there a Benedict Arnold High as well?

Yeah. Lee isn't a failure as far as a military leader goes. Given the circumstances the man was provided with, he could be looked upon as one of the greatest military geniuses in human history. He held back the Union Army for 4 years with a rag- tag army and was often short of supplies and weapons. It's hard to agree with the cause he fought for, but Lee is one of the more blameless figures from the Civil War period. He was torn between his country (the US) and his state (Virginia), which was a common divide at the time. A state was first, not country. It's really a shame the man didn't fight on the side of the Union... the war would have been over in months, not years. His military genius would also be more widely recongnized.

I won't rest until a Greater Common Sense Act is passed

This is a rehash of something I wrote in late December 2007:

"Zero Tolerance"

One thing that pisses me off is the complete lack of common sense exhibited by people who are supposed to be in positions of authority, whether they are parents, teachers, administrators, bureaucrats, law officers, etc. in regard to "zero tolerance" policies. Where completely innocent and harmless people are victimized by process fetishists (i.e., policy drones with bureaucratic personality disorder) who refuse to exercise common sense and use discretion. Like someone peeing in the woods-- suddenly he finds himself under arrest, placed on a "sex offender" registry, forced to notify the authorities of his whereabouts for the rest of his life, forbidden from living within a half-mile of any school, etc. All because he had to pee really badly and wasn't anywhere near a rest room, and some asshole voyeur with a badge was spying on him and caught him in the act of peeing in the woods. Or like a 12 year old girl suspended for a week from school for giving a breath mint to a classmate (violates a "no drug" policy). Or a 1st grader suspended and sent for intensive counseling for drawing a picture of stick figures shooting guns, or for merely uttering the word "gun" on the school bus.

Here's what I propose. I won't go into great detail (I don't have much experience with drafting legislation), but I'll at least share my concept (up for discussion/criticism/suggestion/revision). We need a "Greater Common Sense Act" in this country.

One of the provisions of this Act would be to establish a large "facility of shame" called something like "the FAIL Home" ("For Asinine Imbecilic Losers", perhaps?). This facility would be where those idiots of authority who are found guilty of refusing to use common sense in implementing and enforcing zero-tolerance policies would be incarcerated for a period of at least 1 year, depending on the severity of their willful stupidity. There would be no chance for parole or pardon, unless the convicted person was found to have been set up or to otherwise be totally innocent.

Every day on national TV, a head-shot photo of each retard who has been newly incarcerated would be shown one at a time, along with their name, which would be read aloud by an appropriately-voiced narrator (John Larroquette, perhaps?), after which a graphic of a big red X would be stamped over their photo (with an appropriate deep, cold, metallic stamping sound effect), followed by the narrator saying "FAIL!" in a contemptuous voice. A website would be maintained where people could look up any of these idiots and see their and name, crime, and photo (accompanied by the same red X animation and "FAIL!" soundfile at the click of a button).

People who are convicted of violating the Act would be ineligible for holding any positions of authority or to vote for a period of 5 years after being released from the FAIL Home. Their IDs (license, passport, etc.) would be stamped with a big red X with the word FAIL underneath for a period of 5 years to ensure of this.

What do you think of this so far? Anyone want to make suggestions and help me flesh this out some more?

Ziabatsu: Great, now only the black students will get expelled

This protects kids that actually aren't being disruptive. So I suppose you're right.

A Republican with common sense! Whodathunkit?

/Republican
//Sick of the neocon sellouts

It's_A_Farking_Secret: I can't seriously believe there are high schools named after Robert E. Lee. Is there a Benedict Arnold High as well?

You should read up on Benedict Arnold as well. A very fascinating person and not some evil villian that some people have made him out to be.

rasicar: For those of you who read the bill that was linked at the site... is it just me or does this really not do a damn thing.

Have you ever read any bill/law? No? Neither has 99% of supporters or reporters. They go off the description from the writers and the title. You could present a bill titled "Free Child Healthcare Doctrine" and say that it doesn't raise taxes but have the body of it be tax breaks for tobacco companies and you would have dumbasses rallying for weeks to ensure it passes..

Thunderpipes: Girl got suspended for a plastic butterknife in her lunchbox, stuff like that is retarded, like Fark retarded. This is a good story.

My nephew here in California got suspended a few years ago because his mom accidentally dropped a butterknife in his backpack. Seriously retarded. What did they think he was going to do... spread someone to death?

canadianloon: First thing I thought of.

/thanks.

Dear sweet Jebus.

I've heard so many stories at my school and other school sites of literally retarded stuff. One kid was stopped by a passing security guard trying to fix a set of scissors WHILE IN CLASS. The security guard, viewing these as 2 knives, got him expelled. It was so illogical, but under these rules, he was expelled. Ludicrous.

Shouldn't there be a committee of "we aren't so farking stupid" which resides over these cases?

canadianloon: First thing I thought of.

/thanks.

Odd, I've seen the same picture but the t-shirt says something like, "Admit it, you'd go to jail for this."

Marine1: Also... Zero Tolerance got it's start in Los Angeles schools in the mid-80's during the gang problems there. It was sort of justified then. Now? In the rest of the country? No. Get rid of it. It's a veiled attack on the civil rights of students, at worst.

Reagan, Clinton, and Gingrich had nothing to do with it, really. It's really up to the states and the school districts.

Students have less rights than slaves.

Zimmy: Marine1: Also... Zero Tolerance got it's start in Los Angeles schools in the mid-80's during the gang problems there. It was sort of justified then. Now? In the rest of the country? No. Get rid of it. It's a veiled attack on the civil rights of students, at worst.

Reagan, Clinton, and Gingrich had nothing to do with it, really. It's really up to the states and the school districts.

Students have less rights than slaves.

You mean the learning part or the not getting whipped part?

bhcompy: Sure, but you issue permits for that, and make sure the firearm and ammo is controlled in a specific manner, even if it includes trigger locks with only the rifle team coach having the key. You shouldn't be carrying a handgun to school though.

With a very few, very specific exceptions (eg. A member of the rifle team has cleared participating in a handgun competition with the coach) I am fine with that. In fact, now that you've laid it out, I would be willing to insist on it. That's not zero tolerance, though. That's strictly limited tolerance. It's tight regulation. It's the way to handle the dangerous things.

JESUS H. CHRIST! After reading this thread, it's clear that the only thing Fark has zero-tolerance for is Republicans.

If I wanted this kind of spew I'd go read CNN.

/Wants to know where the political meters are?

Zimmy: Students have less rights than slaves.

Fortunately, knowing everything and never being wrong makes up for it.

/ Lawn. Off. Now.
// Twerp

ricktwig: JESUS H. CHRIST! After reading this thread, it's clear that the only thing Fark has zero-tolerance for is knee jerk, idiot Republicans.

FTFY

This is not necessarily directed at you unless you want it to be, and there are plenty of farkers out there who I am sure do have zero tolerance for Republicans. However, I am under the impression that well reasoned Republicans such as Crist and perhaps a few others I could name, who have seen the drubbing handed out last election and realized that the party line they have been either toeing or bucking depending on specifics has gone stale and sour, and they need to come back to the core principles that will play in the 21st century and jettison the one that were supposed to have been gone with the englightenment, actually tend to get their props when circumstances dictate.

What is nigh unto universal here, though, is a certain cynicism, which informs the farknoscenti that those currently in control of the machinery of the Republican party have determined that the values needed are the ones that worked so well in the 10th century, and who have a gross distrust of the populace that elected them (in the latter, they are no different from the democratic leadership, by the way). Unfortunately for the admirable republicans, the strength of the Republican party has always been lockstep unity (in my life at least), and dissent if punished harshly. Therefore the pervasive projections of defection to the Democrats. Add to that a certain bias, a longing toward, if you will, toward a multi party system (one I don't share) or the historical recognition that a third party can only flourish in a power vacuum (which we may be prematurely detecting, but hope springs infernal(sic)), and you get the projections that moderate republicans and conervative democrats may split off of the parties to become a powerful middle, to become kingmakers if not kings.

So no, there is not zero tolerance for Republicans here, but they are, all things being equal, frowned upon.

I'm fairly sure the more ludicrous types of zero-tolerance policies all came into effect after Columbine. Of course, back then people believed that the Columbine killers were two mostly normal kids who had snapped, while most psychologists today agree that Eric Harris was a diagnosable psychopath who, if he hadn't killed at age 18, would probably have killed at age 20 or 25, etc. All that zero-tolerance policies did was prevent a whole bunch of mostly harmless kids from getting an education.

ricktwig: JESUS H. CHRIST! After reading this thread, it's clear that the only thing Fark has zero-tolerance for is Republicans.

If I wanted this kind of spew I'd go read CNN.

/Wants to know where the political meters are?

You sound fat.

Everyone's praising the guy. Don't blame us if the party doesn't have more than a handful of standouts.

FlashHarry: good move, charlie. now he's a republican we can all, ahem, get behind.

Like I've said a brazillion times, if McCain had picked someone like Crist, I'd have voted McCain. Oh well.

We need more politicians with a good dose of common sense.

fuzzycuffs: Cagey B: FlashHarry: good move, charlie. now he's a republican we can all, ahem, get behind.

He's sane and has some good ideas. Which means the GOP will do everything they can to try and destroy him.

They've already started. There's a good sized faction of the GOP that has already shunned him because he's agreed with Obama on a thing or two, which is tantamount to heresy.

They've been at it for a while, really... the Religious Rong down there have gone to battle with him for his pro-gay policies. There was a thread on Fark, actually, AGES ago, about that very thing. They tried to slander Crist, do some dirty dealings using another GOP candidate during one of the gubernatorial primaries...yeah.

It's_A_Farking_Secret: I can't seriously believe there are high schools named after Robert E. Lee. Is there a Benedict Arnold High as well?

I assume you are unaware of Washington & Lee University? (new window)

Excuse me, sub, don't you understand how this website works?

Take your GOP-asshattery elsewhere.

discordium 2009-06-17 12:22:57 PM
grinding_journalist: It makes me sad we have to legislate common sense BACK into law.

I hate to do this.... but...

THIS

Agreed.

Bottles of aspirin heard sighing relief statewide.