I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that one Farker will be the overwhelming focus of this thread.

dahmers love zombie: I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that one Farker will be the overwhelming focus of this thread.

Not until Sunday.

Maybe we should let them work it out for themselves.

dahmers love zombie: I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that one Farker will be the overwhelming focus of this thread.

Why would linux_yes show up in this thread and argue his point?
Windows 7 looks like it's going to be a genuinely good product.

can we just combine our flame wars?

republican, gibson-playing, chevy-driving circumcised jewish PCs are better than democratic, fender-playing, ford-driving uncircumcised palestinian macs.

I really think this policy of appeasement is going to backfire. The ideological showdown between Islam and the West is inevitable unless Islam makes a leap forward of about a 100 years of social progress.

SockMonkeyHolocaust: I really think this policy of appeasement is going to backfire. The ideological showdown between Islam and the West is inevitable unless Islam makes a leap forward of about a 100 years of social progress.

When has appeasement ever went wrong in the history of the world? People have certain desires, and once those are met, they never want for more. SHOW ME ONE TIME WHEN APPEASEMENT HASN'T WORKED I DOUBLE DARE YOU!!

FlashHarry: can we just combine our flame wars?

republican, gibson-playing, chevy-driving circumcised jewish PCs are better than democratic, fender-playing, ford-driving uncircumcised palestinian macs.

muslims are circumcised (mandatory) fyi

/carry on (the impending flame war)

I really think this policy of appeasement is going to backfire. The ideological showdown between Islam and the West is inevitable unless Fundamental Christianity makes a leap forward of about a 100 years of social progress.

Carotid: muslims are circumcised (mandatory) fyi

um
stereotype much?
not all palestinians are muslim (dtrange but tru)

sheeeshhhhhh

Oh, you had a super-secret deal with President Bush? That's nice. Who's President now?

Elections have consequences.

...Alright, granted, the US has it's hands in damn near everything; some things the citizens and other nations approve of, others things not so much.

But seriously, even if they did have some super-secret agreement that was sealed by doing the ultra-confidential handshake, they can and are going to do what they want. Us wagging our finger and saying "No" only makes the US look like more of a pompous ass as long as we keep doing shiat that the collective world responds in the same way.

I believe it was George Washington who famously warned for us to stay out of international affairs.. Granted, in today's global economy, a country would be hard pressed to live in such a naive and sheltered way as to completely ignore other countries, but the line has to be drawn somewhere, even if the line has to occasionally adapt due to the times.

/my $.02
//been drinking a tad, so I may not respond to anything quoted here for a bit

Raiden333: dahmers love zombie: I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that one Farker will be the overwhelming focus of this thread.

Not until Sunday.

My goodness, you're right, and I'm a fool. I wonder if some of the admins have little sticky notes on their monitors that say things like "Only greenlight Israel threads on Friday night". It would tend to stymie the inevitable flamewars that crop up.

The problem being that Israel's neighbors don't want a smaller Israel, they want NO Israel.

peck: The ideological showdown between Islam and the West is inevitable unless Fundamental Christianity and Islam makes a leap forward of about a 100 500 years of social progress.

Fixed.

peck: I really think this policy of appeasement is going to backfire. The ideological showdown between Islam and the West is inevitable unless Fundamental Christianity makes a leap forward of about a 100 years of social progress.

While it does have a role in governing the West, Fundamentalist Christianity doesn't currently treat half the population of Europe and the Americas like cattle because they were born women.

SockMonkeyHolocaust: Fundamentalist Christianity doesn't currently treat half the population of Europe and the Americas like cattle because they were born women.

You misspelled "chattel". And you're right - you missed Africa and Asia. And you forgot the 100% of the population that are treated as less than human because they are non-believers.

Perhaps once the majority moves beyond religion as a primary social force.

Hail Eris

The settlements are the one thing that absolutely make Israel look like an asshole on the international stage. There are obviously other things they do that piss off certain segments of the international community, but this one thing pisses off everyone except the far right in the US and Israel. They would reclaim much more of their moral high ground in this whole mess if they would stop the colonization of Palestinian territories. I'm glad to see Obama standing up to them and drawing this line in the sand.

Not that all Palestinians are innocent victims. There are many militant Palestinians who are more at fault here than the Israelis (it was the Arabs who attacked Israel in the first place). Obama should also be continuing to stand up to the militant Palestinians as well. But this whole right wing approach to bending over and kissing Israel's ass pretending that they can do no wrong is also ridiculous.

dahmers love zombie: I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that one Farker will be the overwhelming focus of this thread.

Who?

/heard tale he was b****d
//not rly

Thing with settlements is, at least certain of them (Maale Adumim for starters), the official boundaries are far, FAR larger than the currently actual built up area. So the negotiation is about, should there be building in areas that are in the official legal boundary of the settlement, but that are currently completely undeveloped? And there's arguments over what exactly Bush promised in that regard.

Some of the rhetoric on the issue wants to make it seem as if any negotiation on the boundaries, or restrictions, means that people are going to be uprooted their homes tomorrow. But, it isn't.

There's the built up area, and then there is the area surrounding it that's in the legal boundary but nothing touched it yet.

AND, the built up areas if you look at them in google or whatever you have, not to mention reading the ads drawing people (foreign people, but that is an entire other ball of wax) to move there, shows single family homes of one story.

To which, I cannot deny, my Asian self has to reply, hey, have you not heard of high rises? There is room to move, density wise. Move UP. Tokyo and Hong Kong can give hints, if it's actually a problem of no room for kids to live.

But the bottom line is, the official boundaries of certain settlements are far far larger than the actually currently settled and built up area. Far larger. So to say, well, we can "naturally" build to fill up the borders of the settlement, is incorporating currently unimproved land.

Who is to credit/blame for those boundaries is no doubt another thread.

Raiden333: Not until Sunday.

Actually sundown tomorrow. Jewish sabbath is from sundown tonight to sundown tomorrow. At least officially. Some Jews will begin at a set time and end at a set time, even if the sun hasn't set yet.

Personally I like how he totally omits the existence of Palestinian Jews. And his claims on the vastly superior social attitudes of Israel, which in some cases is demonstrably false.

Haaretz

You take that liberal rag seriously?

That's funny.

dahmers love zombie: Raiden333: dahmers love zombie: I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that one Farker will be the overwhelming focus of this thread.

Not until Sunday.

My goodness, you're right, and I'm a fool. I wonder if some of the admins have little sticky notes on their monitors that say things like "Only greenlight Israel threads on Friday night". It would tend to stymie the inevitable flamewars that crop up.

There's something odd about knowing that I can pretty depend on most of fark (except him) to be here on a Friday night.

Raiden333: dahmers love zombie: I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that one Farker will be the overwhelming focus of this thread.

Not until Sunday.

Boy, is he going to be pissed

Looks like George "Shiathead" Bush strikes again. I think Obama's going to need a new mop and bucket.

feckingmorons: Haaretz

You take that liberal rag seriously?

That's funny.

Yeah, you can't trust Haaretz to post a story from REUTERS

i'm jewish and i'm hammered

time for bed

However, in the double-secret case, they're on probation.

Raiden333: dahmers love zombie: I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that one Farker will be the overwhelming focus of this thread.

Not until Sunday.

praise be to Allah

Obama went to Cairo, gave a great speech to the Muslims and told them to shape up... ball is in their court.

Obama tells the Israeli's to stop the farking settlements and come back when you do... ball is in their court.


/Likes a President that acts like an adult

SockMonkeyHolocaust: I really think this policy of appeasement is going to backfire. The ideological showdown between Islam and the West is inevitable unless Islam makes a leap forward of about a 100 years of social progress.

appeasement? please

go learn yerself a book or three about the history of western meddling in the ME and get back to me.

tin_man: Maybe we should let them work it out for themselves.

Because that would be bad for the poor oppressed Palestinians. Because every time they have instigated violence against the state of Israel they have gotten their arses handed to them. When both sides of a conflict have legitimate complaints but only one side has a competent military and functioning government the underdog ends up being splattered all over the evening news.

Of course after the seeing the celebrations in the streets by the Palestinians after 9/11 I would be tempted to "let the Israeli's work it out for themselves" but two wrongs do not make a right.

FlashHarry: can we just combine our flame wars?

republican, gibson-playing, chevy-driving circumcised jewish PCs are better than democratic, fender-playing, ford-driving uncircumcised palestinian macs.

Screw both sides.

brainiac-dumdum: SockMonkeyHolocaust: I really think this policy of appeasement is going to backfire. The ideological showdown between Islam and the West is inevitable unless Islam makes a leap forward of about a 100 years of social progress.

appeasement? please

go learn yerself a book or three about the history of western meddling in the ME and get back to me.

gothelder: Of course after the seeing the celebrations in the streets by the Palestinians after 9/11 I would be tempted to "let the Israeli's work it out for themselves" but two wrongs do not make a right.

The cheers from the ME after 9/11 got a ton of coverage, but there were far more vigils and other peaceful gatherings to morn the dead and express sympathies for the US.

Obviously the ME is a volatile part of the world and often act against their self-interests, but they are not the caricature often portrayed in our media.

SockMonkeyHolocaust: Fundamentalist Christianity doesn't currently treat half the population of Europe and the Americas like cattle because they were born women.

There are plenty of fundamentalist Christian sects that go the "Women are property" route in their teachings. That they lack the power to implement does not mean they lack the wish to see it happen.

Bucky Katt: brainiac-dumdum: SockMonkeyHolocaust: I really think this policy of appeasement is going to backfire. The ideological showdown between Islam and the West is inevitable unless Islam makes a leap forward of about a 100 years of social progress.

appeasement? please

go learn yerself a book or three about the history of western meddling in the ME and get back to me.

Oohhh, I love Edward Said. His book Covering Islam: How the Media and the Experts Determine How We See the Rest of the World was one of the first books I read that got me thinking about how media portrayals of Muslims and how they impact opinion in the US.

and of course there's Culture and Imperialism, suggested reading for all.

WhyteRaven74: Actually sundown tomorrow. Jewish sabbath is from sundown tonight to sundown tomorrow

This is what I love the most about Summer. It keeps the Jews off the inter-tubes for an few extra hours during the week.

/I keed.

Prepare for the impending Tatsuma shiatstorm

Ringshadow: Screw both sides.

RON PAUL PLAYS AN IBANEZ!!1!11!

The Dog Ate The Constitution: Prepare for the impending Tatsuma shiatstorm

RoxtarRyan: .
I believe it was George Washington who famously warned for us to stay out of international affairs.. Granted, in today's global economy, a country would be hard pressed to live in such a naive and sheltered way as to completely ignore other countries, but the line has to be drawn somewhere, even if the line has to occasionally adapt due to the times.


It's too late for that. We've already given Israel so much support and so much money, it'd be ridiculous for us not to call them out on their mistakes with the excuse of not interfering in international affairs.

brainiac-dumdum: gothelder: Of course after the seeing the celebrations in the streets by the Palestinians after 9/11 I would be tempted to "let the Israeli's work it out for themselves" but two wrongs do not make a right.

The cheers from the ME after 9/11 got a ton of coverage, but there were far more vigils and other peaceful gatherings to morn the dead and express sympathies for the US.

Obviously the ME is a volatile part of the world and often act against their self-interests, but they are not the caricature often portrayed in our media.

Well yes I know about that and that is why I said the celebrations pissed me off, but two wrongs do not make a right. Just like I know that average Iranian does not the Americans either.

Though at the time I would have gladly funneled a pound of fire ants into some celebrating assholes asshole.

WorldCitizen: Not that all Palestinians are innocent victims. There are many militant Palestinians who are more at fault here than the Israelis (it was the Arabs who attacked Israel in the first place). Obama should also be continuing to stand up to the militant Palestinians as well.

"In the 16 years since the Oslo accords turned the West Bank and Gaza over to the Palestinians, their leaders built no roads, no courthouses, no hospitals, none of the fundamental state institutions that would relieve their people's suffering. Instead they poured everything into an infrastructure of war and terror, all the while depositing billions (from gullible Western donors) into their Swiss bank accounts." --Charles Krauthammer, Washington Post

Alien Robot: "In the 16 years since the Oslo accords turned the West Bank and Gaza over to the Palestinians

Gaza was only given back in whole to the Palestinians in 2005. Glaringly large errors like the one I quoted should make it obvious what the rest of the columnists opinion is worth.

Alien Robot: WorldCitizen: Not that all Palestinians are innocent victims. There are many militant Palestinians who are more at fault here than the Israelis (it was the Arabs who attacked Israel in the first place). Obama should also be continuing to stand up to the militant Palestinians as well.

"In the 16 years since the Oslo accords turned the West Bank and Gaza over to the Palestinians, their leaders built no roads, no courthouses, no hospitals, none of the fundamental state institutions that would relieve their people's suffering.

this is a lie. Completely.


Instead they poured everything into an infrastructure of war and terror, all the while depositing billions (from gullible Western donors) into their Swiss bank accounts." --Charles Krauthammer, Washington Post

Some of this is true.

dahmers love zombie: I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that one Farker will be the overwhelming focus of this thread.

*blushing*

Pffft...oh, come on, you guys. I will not.

Oh...right. You meant Tatsuma.

/Broken hearted

Alien Robot: --Charles Krauthammer

Lets update favorites to read "cites Neoconservative douchebags"

Whats next? Bill Kristol?

I had a Jewish guy who worked for me. He was a half a slacker, but if he agreed to do something, it would get done. Above all else, his word was his bond. He told me how Jews take their word seriously and are deliberative about signing contracts. He said the marriage contract he signed took 12 hours to negotiate.

It's sad that the sovereign nation of Israel makes a deal they have zero intention of abiding by. That is the real problem here.

Honestly, I don't care one goddamn iota if the deal is fair, or moral, or even in good faith. They signed it. They need to abide by it. I'm glad Obama is holding them to their word.

I'm also curious if Israel is generally this dishonest about all the contracts/treaties they agree to...

/I'm gonna get flamed Saturday night by the Fark Rabbi

Murkanen: Gaza was only given back in whole to the Palestinians in 2005.

So? It was turned over partially 16 years ago then. In those areas of Gaza turned over to and controlled by the Palestinians "their leaders built no roads, no courthouses, no hospitals, none of the fundamental state institutions that would relieve their people's suffering."