Leave Britney alone!

That was impassioned - not empassioned.

/Subby is imbarassed.

watch the video... it has win

obligitory

Link (new window)

possibly NSFW

Melodyne is better now anyhow.. QQ m0ar newbs lrn2sing

This is pretty much how I feel about the electric guitar & synth in general.

Well at least i know what to call that effect now instead of "that stupid thing Cher was doing years ago."

You fark with AutoTune News and I start hiring Somali gunmen to hunt you down.

EL_FABREZ: You fark with AutoTune News and I start hiring Somali gunmen to hunt you down.

He'll find himself on very thin ice, very thin ice

thisispete: EL_FABREZ: You fark with AutoTune News and I start hiring Somali gunmen to hunt you down.

He'll find himself on very thin ice, very thin ice


BOOOORING!

I HEAR A FOGHORN!

BOOOOORING!

/Shawty
//What you trying to say about Iowa?

I agree that it's been abused. It's a crutch for talentless hacks so they can pretend to be real vocalists. just because you can doesn't mean you should.


oh and all you rappers out there would it hurt to write a "song" every once in a while that wasn't about how farking cool and rich you are?

Hobodeluxe: I agree that it's been abused. It's a crutch for talentless hacks so they can pretend to be real vocalists. just because you can doesn't mean you should.


oh and all you rappers out there would it hurt to write a "song" every once in a while that wasn't about how farking cool and rich you are?

I just wish I could sing. More than anything I wished that when i sang, that i could hit the notes. I have a great voice, deep, could be a broadcaster if i trained i think, but when i sing i miss the notes. I play Rock Band on easy.

Autotune is what _I_ would use.

It's not just the obvious ones like T-Pain and Cher, it's every single pop song you've heard since the mid-90s. Record companies will no more let a pop artist release a track without vocal pitch correction than they would let a rock artist release one without a click track and trigger/sample drums, these days.

Speaking of which, click tracks also need to be banned. They do to rhythm and groove exactly what Autotune does to expressiveness in vocals. To say nothing of quantized drum tracks. Or that whole "building a track from individually recorded riffs and phrases" thing used by the Maroon 5s and Nickelbacks to make sure no trace of actual musical performance remains.

I sing a bad note on one of our albums, but I fix it the old-fashioned way: Make sure I am talking to someone REALLY LOUD when it gets to that part.

Artist should sing live without any help, especially these overhyped hacks and if they fail, they should be stoned to death in public. This fraud.

I blame Daft Punk.

I AM A KANYE RANT

Personally, if you don't play your own instruments and write your own music/lyrics, I have no interest in your music.

Don't care if you can't sing. Bob Dylan for example. Willie Nelson is another. Robert Hunter. All great musicians, all not so great vocalists. They don't need auto tune to be awesome.

jeez, and i remember when people used to biatch about singers using an eventide harmonizer live!

The difference between Kanye and the pop-tarts is that Kanye pretty much knows he can't sing, and is using AutoTune in an overt way. The album is called 808's and Heartbreaks for fark's sake. At least he's not hiding behind it like some of these talentless pop hacks

benlonghair: Personally, if you don't play your own instruments and write your own music/lyrics, I have no interest in your music.

Don't care if you can't sing. Bob Dylan for example. Willie Nelson is another. Robert Hunter. All great musicians, all not so great vocalists. They don't need auto tune to be awesome.

People say this, then as soon as they hear something not quite perfect, they're usually the first to point it out.

I know this as a songwriter with a less than stellar voice.

But fark it, I use Melodyne like crazy. Not Kanye-crazy, but still. It's that or put up with queries about why I used takes with missed notes.

Of course, very few people on Fark realise it is possible to touch up vocals without it sounding like a robot farking a vocoder, and therefore it's the devil.

/awaits the inevitable 'Subby is a dumbass, it's not autotune it's a vocoder' comments
//and the tuning's not auto if you do it manually, note by note, is it?

I'm an angry gorilla, so I'm really getting a kick out of this debate.

Get rid of AutoTune... make everyone use AutoWah.

Unlike the talk-box...and the Vocoder...

Those were also lame.

MikoSquiz: Or that whole "building a track from individually recorded riffs and phrases" thing used by the Maroon 5s and Nickelbacks to make sure no trace of actual musical performance remains.

Not always - sometimes there isn't enough time (or money), and you have to staple sections from a few takes together just to get something out of a session. But a single live take is always best!

MmmBadEggs: Unlike the talk-box...and the Vocoder...

Those were also lame.

MikoSquiz: Or that whole "building a track from individually recorded riffs and phrases" thing used by the Maroon 5s and Nickelbacks to make sure no trace of actual musical performance remains.

Not always - sometimes there isn't enough time (or money), and you have to staple sections from a few takes together just to get something out of a session. But a single live take is always best!

None other than the Beatles would beg to differ. Have you heard the single takes of Strawberry Fields?

And how do you record a single take of overlapping intruments when there are only three or four people in a band?

I have an opinion about the use of technology in songs created with the goal of appealing to the widest possible demographic in an attempt to sell more units at Walmart and I vote

doctorwormwood: watch the video... it has win

Everyone needs to read and heed this statement. That brought the laughs... I was covering my mouth to avoid guffawing at work.

danduran: But fark it, I use Melodyne like crazy. Not Kanye-crazy, but still. It's that or put up with queries about why I used takes with missed notes.

If the artist demands it, who are you to say no? DanDuran is just pawn in game of life. The real reason that pitch-correction software is used so much is because record companies have no patience for developed artists. They want one hot track and they want it now, so that they can then license it to marketers. There is no place for pitch imperfections in Subway or Visa ads.

Piss on the White Stripes all you want, but I don't think they do anything but live takes. "Ball and Biscuit" has plenty of guitar flubs and sounds terrific and alive.

danduran: And how do you record a single take of overlapping intruments when there are only three or four people in a band?

Huh? I meant if you were, say, tracking drums for a song - ideally you get the whole drum track in one take, but maybe the best you could do is two good tracks, one with a flub at the beginning and another where you dropped a stick at the end. So you put the two together...

Or maybe you'd rather build a track out of many separate takes. All methods are valid: tracking one at a time, live recording (with one mic or 50), tape collage, loops, whatever...

Dadt Punk gets the blame, but give them credit for doing it right.

In other news, best use of Autotune I've heard lately...

factoryconnection: The real reason that pitch-correction software is used so much is because record companies have no patience for developed artists. They want one hot track and they want it now, so that they can then license it to marketers.

That's half-right. Record companies want flashes in the pan because it makes them more money. Established artists get to basically name their price. One-hit-wonders are a dream for a record company - they have an artist signed to a crappy first deal, and by the time the deal is over they've been forgotten. Bands that do well all through their first deal and are in place for a second have leverage. Or now, a well-established band can say "screw the record companies" and release on their own.

Record companies live and die on their pop princes and princesses to make hit tracks where 99% of the money goes back to the record company, then fade away for the next one to happen. Hell, the dreaded "sophomore jinx" is practically by design.

MmmBadEggs: danduran: And how do you record a single take of overlapping intruments when there are only three or four people in a band?

Huh? I meant if you were, say, tracking drums for a song - ideally you get the whole drum track in one take, but maybe the best you could do is two good tracks, one with a flub at the beginning and another where you dropped a stick at the end. So you put the two together...

Unfortunately, what tends to happen nowadays is you get 3-4 good measures that get looped over the whole track.

Or the producer replaces the entire track with a drum machine - Mutt Lange was infamous for this in the 80s.

Where is Freddie Mercury when you need him. You ever seen pics of him singing live? He doesnt have an ear piece in so he can stay in tune. His vocals styles are what every singer should aim to be, but then again Kanye and Brittany are not even the start of a lesion on Freddies face

Die Kunst Der Fuge: This is pretty much how I feel about the electric guitar


I know! When I hear these kids like Chuck Berry using this instrument the way they do it makes me cringe! Such a racket!! How does that man sell records?

I'm not worried though because I'm sure it's a fad that will die out in the next couple of years. Like those cheeky neon signs that have been popping up everywhere.

rekoil: Unfortunately, what tends to happen nowadays is you get 3-4 good measures that get looped over the whole track.

Definitely not my preference, but it's just another way to do it. And much as I have no interest in loops, you see what some people can do with them, and it can be impressive!

Having seen Autotune being used the correct way, to fix a few flubs in a an awesome vocal performance, I have a new found fondness for it.

Everything has it's place, vocoder, talk box, what have ya. But if it's overused or obviously used to cover up a singers horribleness, then I don't like it.

I HATE CLICK TRACKS! Unless your songs are straight 4/4 an stay the same tempo....fine. Our songs...well, don't. Not at all. Unless your drummer just sucks, a good one should be able to keep a steady beat throughout the song.

I blame artists.

I blame producers.

I blame execs.

But frankly ... and most of all ... i blame musically pig-ignorant and tone-deaf music consumers most of all.

I'm not sure what it is ... maybe it's declining church attendance and therefore less participation in music-making and singing and such ... or cuts to school music programs ... or just the shallowness and insipidness of the current yout' ... but it seems to me the divide between those who love music and appreciate musicianship ... and those who listen to be part of a brand or a lifestyle (and the size of the latter group) is bigger than ever.

People just don't DEMAND enough of the music they listen to because they don't KNOW enough.

And the ones that do -- real music fans -- seem like snobs and elitists by comparison.

Die Kunst Der Fuge: This is pretty much how I feel about the electric guitar & synth in general.

If the autotuner was used in a way that helped expand the musicians sonic palette, it would be excused much in the way guitar pedals are. But since I don't think that is the desired effect...

towatchoverme: But frankly ... and most of all ... i blame musically pig-ignorant and tone-deaf music consumers most of all.

bigbadideasinaction: Record companies live and die on their pop princes and princesses to make hit tracks where 99% of the money goes back to the record company, then fade away for the next one to happen. Hell, the dreaded "sophomore jinx" is practically by design.

Absolutely; look at the sales figures for N'Sync, Backstreet Boys, etc... huge, huge CD sales. Since those guys don't write anything, and don't even have to spend much time in the studio, the record company doesn't end up owing them much of anything. They pay their stable of hitmakers (The Matrix, for one) and make sure that the "talent" doesn't get fat or ugly, meanwhile lining up their replacements in advance.

Realistically, the market demands pop crap to play on dance and top 40 stations. Good music will always be there for people that want it, if they put in a little effort to find it.

tailormadebassist: I HATE CLICK TRACKS! Unless your songs are straight 4/4 an stay the same tempo....fine. Our songs...well, don't. Not at all. Unless your drummer just sucks, a good one should be able to keep a steady beat throughout the song.

You know, having recorded both ways, most recently my acoustic duo without a click track... there is a perceivable difference in "life" between the two. I went in thinking that the songs would sound empty and rhythmically flawed without a metronome, but instead they just came alive and sound like us playing in front of me. I think it comes down to three things:

1. Rehearse the hell out of your songs so that nobody has any question as to what part comes next
2. Familiarize yourself with a studio environment to prevent vapor-lock
3. Accept the idea that not all imperfections are flaws

factoryconnection:
1. Rehearse the hell out of your songs so that nobody has any question as to what part comes next
2. Familiarize yourself with a studio environment to prevent vapor-lock
3. Accept the idea that not all imperfections are flaws

And sometimes this still doesn't prevent the day from being a complete bust! One time my band went in, planned on cutting a few things, "we'll knock this out no problem!" 3 hours later, and we still couldn't get one good live cut of the first goddamn song we were gonna do, and of course the more false starts you have, the more conscious of it you are, and it just snowballs...

Next week, we went in and nailed it in 30 minutes. No rhyme or reason!

factoryconnection: 3. Accept the idea that not all imperfections are flaws

I like that! Etching in my brain right now.

Why does it matter if they used auto tune on the recording? They never actually do live performances.

/listens to musicians, not singers

factoryconnection: tailormadebassist: I HATE CLICK TRACKS!

You know, having recorded both ways, most recently my acoustic duo without a click track... there is a perceivable difference in "life" between the two. I went in thinking that the songs would sound empty and rhythmically flawed without a metronome, but instead they just came alive and sound like us playing in front of me. I think it comes down to three things:

1. Rehearse the hell out of your songs so that nobody has any question as to what part comes next
2. Familiarize yourself with a studio environment to prevent vapor-lock
3. Accept the idea that not all imperfections are flaws

I really like that last one. Mental note so I don't forget it.

Next time we record, I'm going to ask the guy if we go through and lay down the rough track with drums/bass/guitar, and then go back and layer that. The guy really likes the click tracks, but we're paying him...soooooo.......

www.myspace.com/tailormadetragedy

Those are with a click track. Except the acoustic one.
/yay self promotion!

Correct use of AutoTune (new window)

ITT: People confuse Autotune with Vocoder.

I've cleaned up a few horribly flat notes in my own vocals with autotune. If I could sing, I wouldn't have to. Believe me, there are still plenty of imperfections left over.

Hobodeluxe: oh and all you rappers out there would it hurt to write a "song" every once in a while that wasn't about how farking cool and rich you are?

I wish someone wrote song about being sad and miserable, something with emotion

While we're at it, let's get rid of lip syncing too.