Maybe that UAW/Ford deal will work for GM now after all.

It's about damn time. What part of "your business model of selling inferior product at inflated prices while treating your customers like garbage isn't working" don't the employees of GM & Chrysler understand? The more this goes on, the less sympathy I feel for the factory workers, dealerships, and intermediary employees. There isn't just one reason why you guys are failing; it's a massive failboat of suck, from crappy dealerships to shoddy cars.

There's nothing in the article about a 162 million dollar severance package.

At first Obama was all, "Get the fark out.".

Then Ricky Wags as they call him over at GM said, "As you wish, master.". Then he got down, kissed Obama's feet, and crawled out of the room in shame.

That's how it went down in my head.

Wall Street's going to tank tomorrow. It you ever needed more proof that Obama hates capitalism, just look at this. Since when does the leader of the free world have the power to dismiss CEOs at will?

Now if we could just get someone to demand that Obama resigns. After all, he is the CEO of the largest and most wasteful organization in America - and he hasn't even turned it into his socialist empire yet.

floor9: It's about damn time. What part of "your business model of selling inferior product at inflated prices while treating your customers like garbage isn't working

GM sells as many cars as Toyota you ignorant fark. Their problems are because of their ridiculous contracts with the UAW. At least get your facts straight before you open your mouth and look like a farking ignorant retard.

floor9: The more this goes on, the less sympathy I feel for the factory workers, dealerships, and intermediary employees. There isn't just one reason why you guys are failing; it's a massive failboat of suck, from crappy dealerships to shoddy cars.

Wow, you put all the blame on who builds the cars and sell them and none of it on who makes the decisions to build the cars and the designers that design the stuff in the first place?

Truthiness: Wall Street's going to tank tomorrow. It you ever needed more proof that Obama hates capitalism, just look at this. Since when does the leader of the free world have the power to dismiss CEOs at will?

Since he gave them the money to keep operating. Duh.

I'm glad he's leaving, but having done some work at GM a few years ago, the problem there is systemic.

There is so much bloat to that company it's insane.

And, as a previous poster mentioned, the customer experience at the dealerships is poor at best.

When shopping for a car 2 years ago, my wife and I were looking for a SUV or truck to haul our boat and kids. We liked the GMC Yukon and were leaning towards a Denali. The dealership had a bunch of the model line down from the Denali, and kept trying to get us to purchase one of them instead. We left when they wouldn't work on a deal for us for a Denali.

We stopped at a Chevy dealer to check out the Suburbans, and we couldn't get anyone to help us. When finally someone talked to us abou tthem, they didn't have the model in stock. And simply seemed to think that was it. There was no discussion on ordering one, or checking another dealer for the model we wanted. We left less than enthused about the experience.

We finally ended up with a one year old Mercedes Benz R350. It doesn't haul our boat, but the kids love it. Plus, the experience at the dealer was top notch. Funny thing is that the R350 cost less than the Denali or Suburban would have and we were treated like customers, not like cattle.

Such is life when buying a car I suppose.

Bored Horde: There's nothing in the article about a 162 million dollar severance package.

Because Premier Comrade Obama has decided not to tell you about it. When you do read about it it will be because he has decided to tell you.

Do not question the Obama; he knows what's best for you.

Truthiness: Wall Street's going to tank tomorrow. It you ever needed more proof that Obama hates capitalism, just look at this. Since when does the leader of the free world have the power to dismiss CEOs at will?

Now if we could just get someone to demand that Obama resigns. After all, he is the CEO of the largest and most wasteful organization in America - and he hasn't even turned it into his socialist empire yet.

THIS. Things were going fine and then 1/20/09 and poof---it all went to hell

jj325:
THIS. Things were going fine and then 1/20/09 and poof---it all went to hell

Please tell me you are trolling, because if you think things were fine prior to 1/20/09, ummmm well yea uhhh well hmmmmmm.

Truthiness: Wall Street's going to tank tomorrow. It you ever needed more proof that Obama hates capitalism, just look at this. Since when does the leader of the free world have the power to dismiss CEOs at will?

Now if we could just get someone to demand that Obama resigns. After all, he is the CEO of the largest and most wasteful organization in America - and he hasn't even turned it into his socialist empire yet.

You honestly CAN'T possibly be THIS stupid, can you?

The guy who runs the Administration, i.e., the President, absolutely has the authority to put conditions on the federal government's dispersal of funds at its discretion. If GM wants public money, the public is putting conditions on it.

Seriously, how many others in your family are the product of a union between brother and sister?

Snowflake Tubbybottom: Bored Horde: There's nothing in the article about a 162 million dollar severance package.

Because Premier Comrade Obama has decided not to tell you about it. When you do read about it it will be because he has decided to tell you.

Do not question the Obama; he knows what's best for you.

That troll effort was so piss-poor I'm not going to give it the dignity of a score.

Big Red Al: There is so much bloat to that company it's insane.

GM sells as many cars as Toyota and does it with a lot less employees. Once again, please know what the fark you're talking about before you open your mouth.

Big Red Al: Please tell me you are trolling, because if you think things were fine prior to 1/20/09, ummmm well yea uhhh well hmmmmmm.

Subtlety isn't your thing, is it?

Do you play cards, because I'd like access to your money. KTHXBYE.

Truthiness: Wall Street's going to tank tomorrow. It you ever needed more proof that Obama hates capitalism, just look at this. Since when does the leader of the free world have the power to dismiss CEOs at will?

Now if we could just get someone to demand that Obama resigns. After all, he is the CEO of the largest and most wasteful organization in America - and he hasn't even turned it into his socialist empire yet.


You're a child.

Industry sources had said the White House planned very tough medicine, which turned out to be an understatement. And it went to the very top. The measures to be imposed by the government will have a dramatic effect on workers, unions, suppliers, retirees and the communities where plants are located, the sources said.


hmm....

I wonder how intrusive this deal is going to be?

MIguy: Big Red Al: There is so much bloat to that company it's insane.

GM sells as many cars as Toyota and does it with a lot less employees. Once again, please know what the fark you're talking about before you open your mouth.

I was at GM in Detroit for 6 months. I saw waste and indifference at all levels of management. I was not in a shop or a dealership. I was in the world headquarters of the business. The amount of time it took to get minor tasks completed was insane. Luckily, I was offered another project at a bank that got me out of there. Bloat = waste. It doesn't necessarily mean that there are less employees than Company X.

I am quite sure I know what I'm talking about, thanks for playing though.

It's one thing to talk about it, but it's completely different to experience it first hand.

Big Red Al: jj325:
THIS. Things were going fine and then 1/20/09 and poof---it all went to hell

Please tell me you are trolling, because if you think things were fine prior to 1/20/09, ummmm well yea uhhh well hmmmmmm.

You're that guy that needs every subtle joke explained to him, aren't you.

Bored Horde: Big Red Al: jj325:
THIS. Things were going fine and then 1/20/09 and poof---it all went to hell

Please tell me you are trolling, because if you think things were fine prior to 1/20/09, ummmm well yea uhhh well hmmmmmm.

You're that guy that needs every subtle joke explained to him, aren't you.

I don't get it.....

Awesome move! How many reorganizations can one CEO fail at?

Give the whole thing to Bob Lutz. Let a car guy run the show.

MIguy: GM sells as many cars as Toyota you ignorant fark. Their problems are because of their ridiculous contracts with the UAW. At least get your facts straight before you open your mouth and look like a farking ignorant retard.

Ridiculous contracts like health care. Those damned Europeans and Japanese undercut us by their socialist socilisty socialized medicine. Why don't they realize that it isn't fair to sell a better car for less money under these conditions? Damned socialists and their anti-capitalist ways.

Big Red Al: I don't get it.....

He was saying that the economy and GM were in major trouble before Obama took office, and blaming the market situation on Obama is foolish and short-sighted at best.

Okay, I'm now officially scared of Obama Administration. Direct state control of a country's largest companies is what a farking fascists does.

The White House confirmed Wagoner was leaving at the government's behest after The Associated Press reported his immediate departure, without giving a reason.

Was the reason "Obama told me to resign now or I'll use every presidential power I have to make your life a living hell."

If Obama and Congress don't back down from this asshattery, I would consider it justifiable grounds for civil insurrection.

MIguy: Big Red Al: There is so much bloat to that company it's insane.

GM sells as many cars as Toyota and does it with a lot less employees. Once again, please know what the fark you're talking about before you open your mouth.

a. Does this account for a higher percentage of Toyota components being made *by* Toyota vs. independent suppliers?

b. Does this account for the vastly larger and more bloated dealer network that GM maintains compared to the one Toyota maintains?

NewportBarGuy: Awesome move! How many reorganizations can one CEO fail at?

Give the whole thing to Bob Lutz. Let a car guy run the show.

At this point I'd trust the Sham Wow guy over any of the execs at GM.

TheAbstractor: If Obama and Congress don't back down from this asshattery, I would consider it justifiable grounds for civil insurrection.

Yeah. He should leave those guys alone and just invade another country like a true patriot instead.

Bored Horde: Big Red Al: I don't get it.....

He was saying that the economy and GM were in major trouble before Obama took office, and blaming the market situation on Obama is foolish and short-sighted at best.

Come again?

/This is fun - haha

NewportBarGuy: Awesome move! How many reorganizations can one CEO fail at?

Give the whole thing to Bob Lutz. Let a car guy run the show.

No, no, no, no, and NO. The last thing that the U.S. auto industry needs is another Detroit insider. That business has ZERO hope until it severs all of its significant ties with Detroit.

Big Red Al: I am quite sure I know what I'm talking about, thanks for playing though.

Yeah, seeing something happen at one location makes you an expert on the entire company. Check the facts moron. GM and Toyota are basically tied in worldwide sales and GM does it with something like 12,000 fewer employees. You know two things, jack and shiat.

TheAbstractor: Okay, I'm now officially scared of Obama Administration. Direct state control of a country's largest companies is what a farking fascists does.

I think it was more along the lines of a Faustian bargain. The price for saving the company was the sacrifice of key individuals.

Hey - GM didn't *have* to take the deal either.

MIguy: Big Red Al: I am quite sure I know what I'm talking about, thanks for playing though.

Yeah, seeing something happen at one location makes you an expert on the entire company. Check the facts moron. GM and Toyota are basically tied in worldwide sales and GM does it with something like 12,000 fewer employees. You know two things, jack and shiat.

Lets just stick to the one thing we can agree on - Detroit Red Wings hockey. This is going nowhere!

I think we should also wait until the details on this become clear.

On Monday, President Obama is to unveil his plans for the auto industry

I missed the part in the Constitution where the President is in charge of the auto industry.

Oh, and in your WHAAARGHBARGL response, don't forget to include Ford in the mix.

This thread already seems as sane and grounded in reality as all the other GM hate threads lately.

Weaver95: I think we should also wait until the details on this become clear.

What kind of interwebs angry gentry are you? Who needs facts when there's a flamewar to fight?

okay - what. the. fark.

why the FAIL tag, trollmitter? is it for wagoner, who helped run his company into the ground? or is it for you for completely making up the part about the severance package?

TheAbstractor: Okay, I'm now officially scared of Obama Administration. Direct state control of a country's largest companies is what a farking fascists does.

The White House confirmed Wagoner was leaving at the government's behest after The Associated Press reported his immediate departure, without giving a reason.

Was the reason "Obama told me to resign now or I'll use every presidential power I have to make your life a living hell."

If Obama and Congress don't back down from this asshattery, I would consider it justifiable grounds for civil insurrection.

You know, if I was going to take on an entity as large, powerful and internet-savvy as the United States Government, I wouldn't post my intention to do so on a public website that attracts thousands of unique readers every day.

MIguy: heir problems are because of their ridiculous contracts with the UAW.

their problems couldn't be due to poor quality control or ignoring engineers or anything like that.

jj325: THIS. Things were going fine and then 1/20/09 and poof---it all went to hell

GM has been farked for years. John Delorean retired on account of their asshatery, over 35 years ago.

Weaver95: I think we should also wait until the details on this become clear.

FIRE, READY, AIM

doyner: At this point I'd trust the Sham Wow guy over any of the execs at GM.

Sigh... No shiat. You'll love his nuts.

DarthBrooks: I missed the part in the Constitution where the President is in charge of the auto industry.

I missed the part where you can come crying for money due to your own incompetence and not have strings attached.

Truthiness: Since when does the leader of the free world have the power to dismiss CEOs at will?

Since when do CEOs who are totally incompetent get to expect to keep their jobs?

Big Red Al: Lets just stick to the one thing we can agree on - Detroit Red Wings hockey. This is going nowhere!

Wings are tied 1-1.

As for GM, I'll be the first one to admit that they have huge problems but it's because of the UAW. Almost my entire family works for or has worked for GM and it's farking ridiculous some of the benefits they get. You know it's bad when GM can sell just as many cars as Toyota and be in such deep trouble. Fark the UAW.

WhyteRaven74: Since when do CEOs who are totally incompetent get to expect to keep their jobs?

Perhaps you should meet AIG.

NewportBarGuy: doyner: At this point I'd trust the Sham Wow guy over any of the execs at GM.

Sigh... No shiat. You'll love his nuts.

Stop driving boring GM cars, stop having a boring life.

doyner: Weaver95: I think we should also wait until the details on this become clear.

What kind of interwebs angry gentry are you? Who needs facts when there's a flamewar to fight?

All kidding aside, I really do want to read the full details on this deal before going off on a rant about it. I mean yeah, it kinda looks a bit dodgy right now...but not all the facts are in yet.

so for what it's worth, i'd urge restraint.

MIguy: Fark the UAW.

In all truth, as far as the auto industry goes, the original conception of a labor union has become an anachronistic weight around the neck of the industry. Deming quality circles, TQM, or some other collaborative approach borrowed from the Japanese would work much better at this juncture than the UAW.

cameroncrazy1984: Perhaps you should meet AIG.

But that's not Liddy's mess, actually.

cameroncrazy1984: Perhaps you should meet AIG.

I'm wondering how any of the top brass at AIG are allowed to hang around. That AIGs share holders have run them out on a rail is baffling.

doyner: Stop driving boring GM cars, stop having a boring life.

WIN