Kind of how we reached out to Moderate Nazis post-WWII?

Considering that experts around the world and a lot of politicians in Afghanistan have pleaded with the US to treat the more moderate elements of the Taliban as a political party, this isn't surprising.

scruffy1: Kind of how we reached out to Moderate Nazis post-WWII?

Um, not quite. DNRTFA but this is probably along the lines of what Petraeus did in Iraq- work with locals to drive out the more hard-line Al-Qaeda types. Right now the Afghan government is corrupt and not even in control of large parts of the country. Who else are you going to work with? You make do with what you have and try to divide and rule, to use a colonial term.

If he can pull that off it shouldn't be too much harder to work with some of the more moderate republicans on domestic issues.

These are interesting times.

coco ebert: scruffy1: Kind of how we reached out to Moderate Nazis post-WWII?

Um, not quite. DNRTFA but this is probably along the lines of what Petraeus did in Iraq- work with locals to drive out the more hard-line Al-Qaeda types. Right now the Afghan government is corrupt and not even in control of large parts of the country. Who else are you going to work with? You make do with what you have and try to divide and rule, to use a colonial term.

Oh I agree with you there I was just making a bad attempt at trolling and godwinning all in one. It does make sense to work with the opposition, at least the reasonable ones. It does make one wary of the other's intentions but at least you know who you are dealing with and don't have to worry about just racking up more "No. 2" kills.

coco ebert: Um, not quite. DNRTFA but this is probably along the lines of what Petraeus did in Iraq- work with locals to drive out the more hard-line Al-Qaeda types. Right now the Afghan government is corrupt and not even in control of large parts of the country. Who else are you going to work with? You make do with what you have and try to divide and rule, to use a colonial term.

Pretty much, yeah. It's not the first time.

To bastardize a Rumsfeld phrase, sometimes you have to actually work with with the opposition you HAVE.

Puppet governments with no support don't make real negotiating partners, because they have no power. So while I'm not saying the US should roll over, by any means, there's value in sitting at the table with the actual opponents, slow as that might go.

I also object to the use of "Fark Independents" in the headline. For some reason the tag has come to be used as a term for the hardcore neocons and admitted Republicans, which is the opposite of it's reason for existence. The point of being a true "Fark Independent" is that you're too much of a pussy to actually take a stand for what you say and obviously believe ("you don't know me !", etc.)... so by definition they can never be right because they never really take any stance that you can pin them down on. Officially.

This is not your father's Taliban.

Among the reasons the Northern Alliance was never able to get the upper-hand on the Taliban on their own is that their leaders were perceived (justly or not) as thugs and criminals. When the US put the Northern Alliance in charge of the country, those perceptions were largely validated, and the average Joe in Afghanistan started gravitating to Taliban resistance.

Most of the more recent Taliban recruits are people who hate the thugs and criminals of the Northern Alliance and are not in love with the Islamic regime of the Taliban. If Obama is giving them a third option, that's the right move.

Mordant: The point of being a true "Fark Independent" is that you're too much of a pussy to actually take a stand for what you say and obviously believe ("you don't know me !", etc.)... so by definition they can never be right because they never really take any stance that you can pin them down on. Officially.

Or you can be like me and think that both the major parties are so full of shiat and hypocrisy that you could never stand to be a declared member of either, no matter how much you may agree with their typical issue stances.

Eh, it's worth a shot long as Obama doesn't go full Jimmy Carter blathering about the Taliban being ruggedly noble or some such shiat.

It's about time we started dealing with our adversaries using something other than bombs and bullets.

JohnnyC: It's about time we started dealing with our adversaries using something other than bombs and bullets.

Yeah, I'm thinking nerve and/or blood agents.

PacManDreaming: Yeah, I'm thinking nerve and/or blood agents.

You're the reason we can't have nice things... you know that, right?

Hender: Or you can be like me and think that both the major parties are so full of shiat and hypocrisy that you could never stand to be a declared member of either, no matter how much you may agree with their typical issue stances.

There's another category called "actual Independents" for that. Although "may agree with their typical issue stances" is a bit confusing. I can see how a true conservative might agree with the stated stances of the Republicans, but 30 seconds of reality is like getting hit in the face with a shovel.

scruffy1: Kind of how we reached out to Moderate Nazis post-WWII?

That's unpossible, Obama wasn't even born yet.


_{/trying to stay on course}

Mordant: There's another category called "actual Independents" for that. Although "may agree with their typical issue stances" is a bit confusing. I can see how a true conservative might agree with the stated stances of the Republicans, but 30 seconds of reality is like getting hit in the face with a shovel.

Well, I tend to lean towards the more liberal side of politics, but I don't belong to a political party. I agree with a lot of the positions that the Democratic party takes on issues, but I could never bring myself to join them because I don't like the party, plus I vote for Republicans on occasion.

Better?

Worst President ever.

TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

Maybe I haven't been hitting the Politics page much recently, or maybe you haven't been around lately, but I'vr missed your trademark drive-by comments with no information or debate.

Hender: TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

Maybe I haven't been hitting the Politics page much recently, or maybe you haven't been around lately, but I'vr missed your trademark drive-by comments with no information or debate.

Information is an affront to God and debate is for librul weenies. You betcha.

TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

you got caught lying about being a Marine

No more splenda for me. No sir, from now on I'm just going to use this sweet vindication in my coffee.

When the Iraqi Taliban rammed those planes into the Empire State Building on 9/11, everything changed. Everything.

Hender: TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

Maybe I haven't been hitting the Politics page much recently, or maybe you haven't been around lately, but I'vr missed your trademark drive-by comments with no information or debate.

Give him a break. As a Marine Core soldier, he's undoubtedly very busy fighting America's enemies.

priestrape: TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

you got caught lying about being a Marine

Go easy on him. That was his wife.

Or a Fark admins. Same thing

TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

I agree, but what's Bush got to do with this?

El_Swino: Hender: TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

Maybe I haven't been hitting the Politics page much recently, or maybe you haven't been around lately, but I'vr missed your trademark drive-by comments with no information or debate.

Give him a break. As a Marine Core soldier, he's undoubtedly very busy fighting America's enemies.

WIFE-LIKE TYPING DETECTED, PROCESS SHUTTING DOWN.

I always feel that story is like the end of the Simpsons episode where Marge has the gambling problem. "Remember when I got caught stealing all those watches from Sears? Well you have a gambling problem!"

It practically invalidates anything he ever has to say, ever again. "Worst President ever? Well you got caught lying about being a Marine! Obama eats children for breakfast? Well you got caught lying about being a Marine!"

That, and I don't think I've ever seen him respond to it.

I surprise myself that I have no problem with Obama at least giving it a try. Where I'll have a problem is if the tactic fails but he doesn't recognize it and try something else. There's reasonable and then there's sticking your head in the sand.

Great president you guys elected, farktards.

Diplomacy? With moderates? Shocking!

"Man, once surrendering his reason, has no remaining guard against absurdities the most monstrous, and like a ship without rudder, is the spot of every wind. With such persons, gullability, which they call faith, takes the helm from the hand of reason and the mind becomes a wreck."

Thomas Jefferson, letter to James Smith, December 8, 1822

Ball Sack Obama: Great president you guys elected, farktards.

Trying to make peace in Afghanistan using diplomacy--HOW DARE HE!

TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

This plan probably came from Michelle. You know how wives like typing things that get people in trouble.

priestrape: When the Iraqi Taliban rammed those planes into the Empire State Building on 9/11, everything changed. Everything.

Did we surrender when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?! Then we won't surrender our principles to the Iraqi Taliban!

/nice

006andahalf: Hender: TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

Maybe I haven't been hitting the Politics page much recently, or maybe you haven't been around lately, but I'vr missed your trademark drive-by comments with no information or debate.

Information is an affront to God and debate is for librul weenies. You betcha.

Who needs debate when everything you would ever need to know is already contained in the bible.

Hender: Mordant: There's another category called "actual Independents" for that. Although "may agree with their typical issue stances" is a bit confusing. I can see how a true conservative might agree with the stated stances of the Republicans, but 30 seconds of reality is like getting hit in the face with a shovel.

Well, I tend to lean towards the more liberal side of politics, but I don't belong to a political party. I agree with a lot of the positions that the Democratic party takes on issues, but I could never bring myself to join them because I don't like the party, plus I vote for Republicans on occasion.

Better?

When a new party forms that blends the ideas of real liberals and real conservatives and doesn't welcome hardcore Dems or Republicans at all we may both be very happy. TCS, for example... will never be allowed to join.

Ball Sack Obama: Great president you guys elected, farktards.

it'll all be over in 8 short years....maybe 4. Cheer up,though. Your tiny fists should unball within a year. It must be hard to type your elbows

Gulper Eel: Eh, it's worth a shot long as Obama doesn't go full Jimmy Carter blathering about the Taliban being ruggedly noble or some such shiat.

Yeah, he isn't giving into hardliners or terrorists, he's simply putting diplomacy on the table for Taliban moderates.

It isn't the Taliban so much as it is the extremists within the Taliban.

This is bad.....for Osama.

Hender: El_Swino: Hender: TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

Maybe I haven't been hitting the Politics page much recently, or maybe you haven't been around lately, but I'vr missed your trademark drive-by comments with no information or debate.

Give him a break. As a Marine Core soldier, he's undoubtedly very busy fighting America's enemies.

WIFE-LIKE TYPING DETECTED, PROCESS SHUTTING DOWN.

I always feel that story is like the end of the Simpsons episode where Marge has the gambling problem. "Remember when I got caught stealing all those watches from Sears? Well you have a gambling problem!"

It practically invalidates anything he ever has to say, ever again. "Worst President ever? Well you got caught lying about being a Marine! Obama eats children for breakfast? Well you got caught lying about being a Marine!"

That, and I don't think I've ever seen him respond to it.

I would be more concerned that anyone believes that he's here to debate anything like a sane human being, especially after that whole thing. He hasn't been on recently, so he dusted off this log-in to be relevant again (much like skookum).

I mean, he pays real money to have that shiny tag by his name just to troll. Why would you give money to a site where 99% of the posters see you as a liar? That should show everyone that he's a few soldiers short of a full Core.

Peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations, entangling alliances with none.

Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1801

heinekenftw: Yeah, he isn't giving into hardliners or terrorists, he's simply putting diplomacy on the table for Taliban moderates.

It isn't the Taliban so much as it is the extremists within the Taliban.

As a semi-related aside, the Taliban doesn't appear on the State Department list of foreign terrorist organizations. Not that I could find, at least.

Taliban does not mean what most farkers think it means.

Surprising? Not really

Wow. This site is really going to shiat.

priestrape: it'll all be over in 8 short years....maybe 4. Cheer up,though. Your tiny fists should unball within a year. It must be hard to type your elbows

Unball? You amuse me.

"There's 100 decent citizens in the subway and one ass at the front end molesting women, that's the Republican party now..."

The Bruce Dickinson: Peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations, entangling alliances with none.

Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1801

"Exhume Washington and bring me his teeth so that I may tear these maple-leaf-loving commies' throats out with them. George deserves another taste of blood."
-Jefferson, the first day of the war of 1812.

Truncks1: Taliban does not mean what most farkers think it means.

Surprising? Not really

Muslim=terrorist=Taliban=Al Qaeda=Rev. Wright=brown people

it's simpler that way

TheConvincingSavant: Worst President ever.

Semper Fib!

Hender: It practically invalidates anything he ever has to say, ever again. "Worst President ever? Well you got caught lying about being a Marine! Obama eats children for breakfast? Well you got caught lying about being a Marine!"

Oh, that sounds like a FUN thread. Happen to have an idea where I can find it?

Gulper Eel: Eh, it's worth a shot long as Obama doesn't go full Jimmy Carter blathering about the Taliban being ruggedly noble or some such shiat.

Yeah, that Jimmy Carter.

Whatta tool.