Subby, you missed the point of that article entirely.

pixistick: Subby, you missed the point of that article entirely.

Neutral PITA, my ass.

LONDON (Reuters) - Abuse of prisoners at Guantanamo Bay has worsened sharply since President Barack Obama took office as prison guards "get their kicks in" before the camp is closed, according to a lawyer who represents detainees.

Yes. We should keep it open indefinitely because soldiers might be getting their kicks in.

How about this, republicans. Instead of pretending that you suddenly care, how about calling for this lawyer to present his evidence and arrest the prison guards?

Walsh said his review looked at 20 allegations of abuse, 14 of which were substantiated, but he did not go into details. Generally he said the abuse ranged from "gestures, comments, disrespect" to "preemptive use of pepper spray."

Ghappour said he had spoken to army guards who, unsolicited, had described the pleasure they took in abusing prisoners, whether interrupting prayer or physical mistreatment. He said they appeared unconcerned about potential repercussions.

This does make me angry. I hope the article is pepper spray to those hemorrhoid guards.

FTFA He stressed the mistreatment did not appear to be directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground.

I'm outraged by this. Happy now Subby?

This man clearly has no reason to exaggerate, and I think we should all take his account as fact.

Ohhhhh, I was confused until I actually RTFA. So they are "Getting their kicks in" because he is closing the place.

I thought you were implying that he ordered them to abuse more regularly......Wait, is that what you are implying?

Because during the Bush administration there is no way it also wasn't "directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground". Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

Why would they need toilet paper? Wouldn't they just use their left hand?

J3: Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

Really? REALLY? That's your farking comeback?
You're a genuine, turd-licking farktard.

That is pretty outrageous, and those doing the abusing should be charged.

Happy?

Meh, Muslim on Muslim violence doesn't bother me.

"...applying pepper spray to toilet paper..."

I'm almost finished laughing. Almost.

J3: Because during the Bush administration there is no way it also wasn't "directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground". Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

I don't think people were implying what you are referring to.

The difference is that those abuses are being looked into more quickly, whereas it seemed in the past to go on without investigation.

ozone: Meh, Muslim on Muslim violence doesn't bother me.

I think you are in the wrong thread.

pixistick: J3: Because during the Bush administration there is no way it also wasn't "directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground". Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

I don't think people were implying what you are referring to.

The difference is that those abuses are being looked into more quickly, whereas it seemed in the past to go on without investigation.

There have been multiple reviews of the conditions there including the most recent, by an Obama-appointed task force, that found conditions to conform to the Geneva Coventions.

I don't have any special knowledge, but I suspect that the ultimate story of Gitmo will be one of whether we should be detaining people without charges rather than one of prisoner abuse.

I guess the primary reason is that Obama condemns the abuse and is taking measures to end it quickly, whereas his predecessor either denied the abuse or condoned it.

Also, the fact that the increased abuse is based on the claims of a single LAWYER makes this all a bit dubious without further evidence.

J3: Because during the Bush administration there is no way it also wasn't "directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground". Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

Evidence suggests it was directed from above in the past, there isn't any evidence to suggest they are being told by Obama or his administration to do this now. Slight difference.

so they're basically having an "eviction party" like a bunch of dumb squatters. nice job.

Because criminals & defense attornies never lie.

The prisoners there now have attorneys? Where's the outrage?!!?

absoluteparanoia: How about this, republicans. Instead of pretending that you suddenly care, how about calling for this lawyer to present his evidence and arrest the prison guards?

that's what i thought. these guards need to be charged.

J3
Because during the Bush administration there is no way it also wasn't "directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground". Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

Are you farking kidding me? The Bush Justice Department drafted memos defending the use of torture. The administration even admitted to waterboarding a couple people. The first US general in charge of Gitmo is on record talking about his struggles to run the prison according to the Geneva Conventions even though he knew the administration was telling him he didn't have to. He was pushed aside by others in the administration who wanted to impose, shall we say, harsher treatment on the prisoners and after awhile was transferred.

TFA
"I can't really imagine why you would get your kicks from abusing prisoners, but certainly, having spoken to certain guards who have been injured in Iraq, who indirectly or directly blame my clients for their injuries and the trauma they have suffered, it's not too difficult to put two and two together."

This is what happens between prison guards and inmates when abusive treatment is not prohibited. Even some guards who weren't up for it at first begin to enjoy it. The administration pushed for harsh treatment and as a result have farked up some of our own military men and women who've learned to enjoy abusing people. The name escapes me right now, but there's a very famous psychological experiment where ordinary college students were divided into prison guards and inmates. The experiment had to be ended early because the "guards" became too abusive toward the "inmates".

patrick767: The name escapes me right now, but there's a very famous psychological experiment where ordinary college students were divided into prison guards and inmates. The experiment had to be ended early because the "guards" became too abusive toward the "inmates".

The Zimbardo prison experiment at Stanford Univ. Link (new window)

Eddie Adams from Torrance: I'm outraged by this. Happy now Subby?

Whew, as long as Obama's good name isn't besmirched we shouldn't care about any injustices that occur under his watch.

Children getting raped? Oh it's ok, Obama didn't know!

Another subby outraged about how there isn't any outrage over his butthurt

Ryan2065: J3: Because during the Bush administration there is no way it also wasn't "directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground". Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

Evidence suggests it was directed from above in the past, there isn't any evidence to suggest they are being told by Obama or his administration to do this now. Slight difference.

Don't bother the 20%ers with facts or evidence, thay have no use for either.

Does the submitter have some sort of serious learning disability?

The guards getting their kicks in would get a kick out of this thread.

deltabourne: Whew, as long as Obama's good name isn't besmirched we shouldn't care about any injustices that occur under his watch.

Children getting raped? Oh it's ok, Obama didn't know!

Someone didn't read the article.

J3: Because during the Bush administration there is no way it also wasn't "directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground". Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

I'm not sure you have any liberal friends.

Deltabourne, I'm asking this and I'm deadly serious.

Would you even care if a child was actually raped right in front of you ?

You are disgusting and not even human.

Subby, correlation != causation.



/hot like the global temperature.

The military is dangerously close to crossing the rubicon in this nation.

It needs a top to bottom purge of the ideologues from the Military. If these reports are true in the context they're presented (and they are in line with lots of recent politicization of the Military), it's a damn shabby report on the military's willingness to defend the constitution en-lieu of politics.


Scrap the volunteer force -- it's a dangerous new class of citizen. Return to the draft. Democracies should fight their own wars -- not hire a pseudo private industrial complex with questionable loyalties.

These kinds of reports should worry all citizens.

I'd like to hear a statement from Obama, but I rather expect he's outraged as well.

Fark those guards. Love the Pentagon's response, "we feel that eveyrone is being treated according to the geneva convetion." Force-feeding with laxatives, pepper sprayed toilet paper, beatings severe enough on the way to lawyers to make the detainees not want to meet anymore? God bless america. What assholes.

flup: I'd like to hear a statement from Obama, but I rather expect he's he'll pretend to be outraged as well.

FTFR

It would be nice if courts martial would increase as a result of abuse increasing.

J3: Because during the Bush administration there is no way it also wasn't "directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground". Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

Truth hurts I can see, from the abuse you got for stating the obvious.

Using this sort of behavior to score political points is a new low, even for fark.

This is reaaly disgraceful.

It's ObamaTime!

Subby, Your link seems to idicate it.

deltabourne: Eddie Adams from Torrance: I'm outraged by this. Happy now Subby?

Whew, as long as Obama's good name isn't besmirched we shouldn't care about any injustices that occur under his watch.

Children getting raped? Oh it's ok, Obama didn't know!

Huh?

flup: I'd like to hear a statement from Obama, but I rather expect he's outraged as well.

I hope (and it's something he should have done the day he announced the closing) that they replace every guard there with MPs from other facilities that have had no connection with Gitmo, Iraq or the War on Error at all.

While not as effective as carefully vetting each guard to weed out the psychos, it can be done quickly and make for a much easier transition rather than dealing with kids with giant chips on their shoulders having to dismantle their own work over the next year.

J3: Because during the Bush administration there is no way it also wasn't "directed from above, but was an initiative undertaken by frustrated U.S. army and navy jailers on the ground". Can't have it both way my liberal friends.

Except for the fact that they allowed waterboarding, which is torture.

dont you republicans get tired of being wrong. When are you going to learn to just shut the fark up already, jesus?

deltabourne: Children getting raped?

I'm sorry...your what hurts?

Remember when Bush got blamed for Abu Ghraib?

Well if a lawyer made this claim it must be true....right?

Link (new window)

There's no butthurt like conservative butthurt.