No, because Carter was an idiot in 1980, and he's remembered as that idiot today. And he confirms it every time he opens his mouth.

Even Nixon later found redemption during Clinton's presidency when people realized the value of his foreign policy insight and savvy. That didn't excuse the other things he did, of course, but all presidencies are a mixed bag of successes and failures to a degree and it takes years to sort them all out. Perhaps Bush may find some of that years from now.

Of course, perhaps an asteroid will collide with the Earth and end all life as we know it, too.

Nabb1: Of course, perhaps an asteroid will collide with the Earth and end all life as we know it, too.

Not on his watch

carter and h.w. bush had redeeming qualities. carter's presidency was a mess, but he has done some good work since he left office. h.w. bush ran the first gulf war very effectively and pretty cheaply.

and neither left the country in quite the state it is in today.

current george bush doesn't have many redeeming qualities, either personal or professional.

Hell, even Nixon gave us the EPA and public television. All Bush gave us a steaming pile of shiat.

Dang! Y'all will miss mah verbal skull-farts after listenin' to some uppity ejubacated prezodunt yap on fer four ta eight years!
Mark my turds -er- wurds!
HAW Haw haw....

Nixon hit all time lows due in large part to scandal, Carter due to policy.

W. has both scandals and shiatty policy, home and abroad.

I really don't think he will be remembered well at all.

Bush is Herbert Hoover part 2.

No. Nothing will redeem this Presidency.

My life has been great over the past 8 years so fark all of y'all. Sure, the economy is in the crapper now, but we had more successive months of economic growth under BushII than ever. Anyone who is surprised by (or unprepared for) the recent economic downturn is either an idiot or has had their head up their arse for the past couple years...the signs were on the wall long ago. As far as the Iraq war goes, time will tell.

Harry Truman fought a war to a stalemate, abused the constitution more than any President in history, and left office as the most unpopular President of all time. Now, history actually looks upon his service pretty well.

SangamonTaylor: Harry Truman fought a war to a stalemate, abused the constitution more than any President in history, and left office as the most unpopular President of all time. Now, history actually looks upon his service pretty well.

I remember as a kid seeing the one man show starring James Whitmore in "Give em Hell Harry". It made an impression on me. So you're right. History, time and reflection has a way of changing memories of someone. Bush is reviled right now, but only time will tell.

Carter signed off on the expansion of legalizing Congressional bribery, and that's what I'll remember him for. That and the rabbit.

We should do like the Greeks did and put anyone leaving office on trial for their crimes.

SangamonTaylor: My life has been great over the past 8 years so fark all of y'all. Sure, the economy is in the crapper now, but we had more successive months of economic growth under BushII than ever. Anyone who is surprised by (or unprepared for) the recent economic downturn is either an idiot or has had their head up their arse for the past couple years...the signs were on the wall long ago. As far as the Iraq war goes, time will tell.

Harry Truman fought a war to a stalemate, abused the constitution more than any President in history, and left office as the most unpopular President of all time. Now, history actually looks upon his service pretty well.



LOL

Unless W goes on a crusade to save the world and right what he did wrong instead of retiring to Dallas, I doubt it. Even then, it will be rough. Hoover did a lot of good things before and after he was president, but everyone still thinks of him as the Depression president.

Carter's presidency still sucks, but he as a person looks better. He did a lot of good things after his presidency, like Habitat for Humanity and election monitoring, which remain in the news and overshadow his bad economy, gas crisis & the hostage crisis which most Americans under 30 don't even remember. Bush I looks like a giant compared to Bush II.

I think what will work against W is the feeling a lot of people have that he'll be getting away from his Presidency scot-free. With Nixon, the fact that he was well on the track to impeachment and resigned kind of worked in his favor later, I think. It gave this feeling that he'd been punished for what he did, in some way, even if he didn't actually go to jail. Bush, on the other hand, did things in his Presidency that make what Nixon did look wimpy (I mean, authorizing torture vs. authorizing wiretaps, come on now) and he'll finish his term with no serious effort in Congress to impeach him.

So, given that, I think there'll be this feeling that he has to be punished afterwards, by the judgment of history.

Probably. It was funny to go back after Reagan and Ford died and read all nasty stuff that had been written about them. There will probably be something similar when Carter and Clinton die. Time has a way of washing away the gloss of hatreds and jealousies that inevitably comes with politics.

I already like him more, and he's not even gone.

He Was a Crook, by Hunter S. Thompson

MEMO FROM THE NATIONAL AFFAIRS DESK DATE: MAY 1, 1994 FROM: DR. HUNTER S. THOMPSON SUBJECT: THE DEATH OF RICHARD NIXON: NOTES ON THE PASSING OF AN AMERICAN MONSTER.... HE WAS A LIAR AND A QUITTER, AND HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN BURIED AT SEA.... BUT HE WAS, AFTER ALL, THE PRESIDENT.

Only if he pulls a Carter. If he goes all altruistic, and starts brokering international diplomacy, building houses for the homeless, and winning Nobel Peace Prizes, MAYBE people won't loathe him QUITE so much.

In other words: Ain't gonna happen. Why would he start giving a shiat about improving anything NOW? He'll do what every Republican ex-president does: Play golf and suck up a pension until his inevitable welcome death results in a flatly-read 45-second line-item on the evening news.

Goodbye, failure. Thanks for leaving behind the biggest mess in recorded history.

SangamonTaylor: My life has been great over the past 8 years so fark all of y'all. Sure, the economy is in the crapper now, but we had more successive months of economic growth under BushII than ever. Anyone who is surprised by (or unprepared for) the recent economic downturn is either an idiot or has had their head up their arse for the past couple years...the signs were on the wall long ago. As far as the Iraq war goes, time will tell.

Harry Truman fought a war to a stalemate, abused the constitution more than any President in history, and left office as the most unpopular President of all time. Now, history actually looks upon his service pretty well.

First, Truman's goal in Korea was status quo, so "Mission Accomplished" as they say. The invasion of the North was entirely MacArthur's doing. Acheson and Kennan predicted that Red China would never allow an American army in the north. I recommend Halberstam's "Coldest Winter" for your edification.

As for his constitutional violations, are you really suggesting that the Steel Seizure case is on a par with warrantless wiretaps and the indefinite detention of American citizens? My My My, someone has a hifalutin view of a president impeding upon the implied powers of congress.

I predict that he'll be the first ex-president in a long long time who doesn't make a dime on the post-whitehouse speaking tour circuit.

Has the way Nixon and Carter are viewed changed because of Bush? If we had an idea of a terrible president before, that definition has now been changed to something far worse, making those guys look better by comparison.

I predict that W will end his days living in Sangamon Taylor's basement, being waited on hand and foot by his most loyal and adoring fan.

Bill_Wick's_Friend: I predict that he'll be the first ex-president in a long long time who doesn't make a dime on the post-whitehouse speaking tour circuit.

I will bet you real good money you are wrong, big time. He will still make a fortune.

Well, on Bush's watch, the US has had not one but two recessions, one of which threats to bankrupt the country and go into a depression. Somehow, I suspect that everyone intelligent will still spit on Dubya every time they see him in the street 20 years from now.

Well, George W. has been so bad that he's made me long for the glory days of his dad's thoroughly mediocre Presidency.

BritneysSpeculum
As for his constitutional violations, are you really suggesting that the Steel Seizure case is on a par with warrantless wiretaps and the indefinite detention of American citizens? My My My, someone has a hifalutin view of a president impeding upon the implied powers of congress.

A couple weeks back I talked to a Republican face-to-face who really was still espousing the view that "if you haven't done anything wrong, then what are you worried about?" with regards to warrantless wiretaps. Those nutjobs are still out there in great numbers.

MaxxLarge: Goodbye, failure. Thanks for leaving behind the biggest mess in recorded history.

Sounds like someone doesn't know much about history.

I'm actually facinated to see what history thinks of Bush II. I don't regard him as the failure most people do, but most people like hyperbole. I suppose many people rank him a 0 out of 10. I think more around 3 or 4 out of 10. Which is bad.

The only problem is he didn't do anything obviously great. Nixon did a lot of really big, beneficial things as well as some big, destructive things.

Bush's claim to legacy is mostly "he kept America safe." Which he did. But that's sort of seen as his job. Its one of those things that you don't get credit for, but get all the crap in the world if you fail at it.

However, Bush was really the first president who was documented by this modern media... so he'll be judged by a very different method than pretty much all past presidents.

The only people who invoke the "Let history judge me" defense know
damn well how history will judge them.....

Worst president since Grant, or maybe even James Polk.

Maybe the worst president ever.

downstairs: Bush's claim to legacy is mostly "he kept America safe." Which he did. But that's sort of seen as his job. Its one of those things that you don't get credit for, but get all the crap in the world if you fail at it.

This line reminded me of that Chris Rock routine about going to prison.

"Well I haven't gone to prison."
"You ain't supposed to go to prison you low-expectations motherfarker."

We'll see how history judges Bush. Personally I think he will be judged poorly. If the rule was just automatically doubling their approval ratings over time, in 10 years Clinton will be hailed as a god among men with 122% approval.

I think this is more the effect of people forgetting things, and the way memory tends to grow fonder over time.

As the tag says, Not farkin' likely.

But...in 20 years we'll all have fond memories of when that scamp George W. Bush finally packed up his shiat and went away. So we got that going for us. Which is nice.

/Gunga, Gunga-galunga.

downstairs: Bush's claim to legacy is mostly "he kept America safe." Which he did. But that's sort of seen as his job. Its one of those things that you don't get credit for, but get all the crap in the world if you fail at it.

Yeah...other than the 9/11 thing and the anthrax thing and the shoebomber and countless attacks against Americans abroad. He totally kept us safe.

SangamonTaylor: the recent economic downturn is either an idiot or has had their head up their arse for the past couple years...the signs were on the wall long ago. As far as the Iraq war goes, time will tell.

And, amazingly, the Bush Administration still seemed completely unprepared and totally without a reasonable plan and instead went in to scare freak-out mode to institute a power grab with no real foresight. Even when the signs were on the wall for years, like you said.

As for time will tell in Iraq...the only people that say that nonsense are the revisionists that will talk about how the evil dictator Saddam was taken from power to save the Iraqis while glossing over every other failure surrounding the war.

Harry Truman fought a war to a stalemate, abused the constitution more than any President in history, and left office as the most unpopular President of all time. Now, history actually looks upon his service pretty well.

This is just funniness.

You're getting more hilarious with each passing week, my friend.

twobux: No, because Carter was an idiot in 1980, and he's remembered as that idiot today. And he confirms it every time he opens his mouth.

not to mention that nobody in Atlanta will every forget how he tried to literally bulldoze neighborhoods and parks, using 'eminent domain', in order to build his ego palace presidential library and a highway that went straight to it. He's a two face liar who conspired with the Atlanta City government to try to ruin our neighborhoods and destroy what we had built. We sued, and sued, and protested for years, and WON. He didn't get 5% of what he was trying to get.

Jimmy Carter, you can kiss my ass. Long Live Druid Hills.

prick.

Nabb1: Even Nixon later found redemption during Clinton's presidency when people realized the value of his foreign policy insight and savvy.

Not to mention Nixon signed the Clean Air and Clean Water acts, and created the EPA.

downstairs: Bush's claim to legacy is mostly "he kept America safe." Which he did. But that's sort of seen as his job. Its one of those things that you don't get credit for, but get all the crap in the world if you fail at it.

Really?

Because I thought we were talking about the guy who had terrorists attack United States soil on his watch.

The only other guys who qualify that I can think of are FDR and Madison. With Madison, the country was less than 40 years old, and FDR wasn't even the continental States. But let's say they're the same.

So if that's gonna be the benchmark, he was beaten by 41 out of 43 other contestants. Good jorb!

downstairs: Bush's claim to legacy is mostly "he kept America safe." Which he did. But that's sort of seen as his job. Its one of those things that you don't get credit for, but get all the crap in the world if you fail at it.

He kept America safe in the way a rock keeps tigers away.

downstairs: Bush's claim to legacy is mostly "he kept America safe." Which he did.

Yeah, except for that whole 9/11 thing

aden_nak: He Was a Crook, by Hunter S. Thompson

This article is winful in the extreme.

Carter is not remembered fondly AT ALL. The first Bush is remembered as JUST SORT OF OK SORT OF.

But the point is taken. Harry Truman was very unpopular but is now recognized to have been a good President. So you never know.

Time has been good to both Jimmy Carter and George H.W. Bush, as people think better of their presidencies years later.

However, Newsweek and U.S. New & World Report were pretty mean.

arkansas: Carter is not remembered fondly AT ALL. The first Bush is remembered as JUST SORT OF OK SORT OF.

But the point is taken. Harry Truman was very unpopular but is now recognized to have been a good President. So you never know.

How would you know? You're just a toothless yokel from Arkansas.

; ) _{check my profile}

I don't think he will go down in history as being one of the truly great presidents, like Washington, Lincoln or Reagan, but he won't be labeled as the worst president of all time.

BillCo: I don't think he will go down in history as being one of the truly great presidents, like Washington, Lincoln or Reagan, but he won't be labeled as the worst president of all time.

Without relying on the WH talking points, what achievement can Bush point to to elevate him above James Buchanan or Millard Fillmore? While I think that Carter was more a victim of circumstances, he can point to the start of deregulation and the appointment of Paul Volker as real accomplishments. Bush has nothing absent manipulation of events and history. He is unquestionably the most incompetent president we have had.

MaxxLarge: e'll do what every Republican ex-president does: Play golf and suck up a pension

Presidents don't get pensions (do they?)... its only 8 years of service.

That's why they do speaking engagements, etc.

They do get Secret Service for life, but that's not the same thing.

SangamonTaylor: My life has been great over the past 8 years so fark all of y'all. Sure, the economy is in the crapper now, but we had more successive months of economic growth under BushII than ever. Anyone who is surprised by (or unprepared for) the recent economic downturn is either an idiot or has had their head up their arse for the past couple years...the signs were on the wall long ago. As far as the Iraq war goes, time will tell.

...They were on the wall for me, the day Bush was elected, when my net worth fell by over 15%, the largest drop in one day I'd ever experienced. On the day he was inaugurated, it dropped another 15%. And my stocks and other stuff have all been devaluing ever since.

ekdikeo4: They were on the wall for me, the day Bush was elected, when my net worth fell by over 15%, the largest drop in one day I'd ever experienced. On the day he was inaugurated, it dropped another 15%. And my stocks and other stuff have all been devaluing ever since.

Dude, it might be time to sell.

absoluteparanoia: Presidents don't get pensions (do they?)... its only 8 years of service.

They do. From the Congressional Research Service:

Congress enacted the Former Presidents Act (FPA) in 1958 to provide former Presidents an annual lifetime pension, currently $191,300, and office allowances administered by the General Services Administration (GSA). The FPA, as amended, also provides former Presidents with travel funds and mailing privileges (3 U.S.C. 102 note). Secret Service protection for former Presidents is also authorized by statute. P.L. 110-161, the FY2008 Consolidated Appropriations Act, authorizes $2,478,000 in funding for former Presidents. The President's FY2009 budget requests $2,934,000 to provide former Presidents with pensions and office allowances.

More here if you are interested: Link

The Icelander: Nabb1: Even Nixon later found redemption during Clinton's presidency when people realized the value of his foreign policy insight and savvy.

Not to mention Nixon signed the Clean Air and Clean Water acts, and created the EPA.

And he deputized Elvis as a DEA agent.

BritneysSpeculum: Dude, it might be time to sell.

It's mostly options that I have, which my option price is much higher than the stock is. Has been for a very long time. But, if my previous employer stock value miraculously recovers, I'll go from being a nearly broke man to being a rich, rich man.