(A) Amazing to see a young Steve Vai, nowhere near his current guitar prowess

(B) Frank clearly 'owns' him in this battle of the guitar gods

/nothing but the best for my dog

BEST STUFF EVAR (new window)

Jean-Luc Ponty, starting at 3:10. will make you cry, it is so good!

Enjoyed seeing Frank Zappa at the Hammersmith Odeon in London back in the 80s. Good concert in spite of the hash smoking.

We got Zappa and John Waters, think Baltimore is 2 for 2.

Hey good guy, get on the bus . . . where I stole the margarine! Thank god for you tube as ZFT hasn't released shiat for video in ages, and I would buy it. There are so many concerts they need to put out . . .

fark steve vai

What video are you guys watching? I know it's all a matter of individual taste but Steve is smoother with more variety and even stops Franks cig from burning the guitar. Not my favorite players either one but Frank is kinda clunky as usual.

thesubliminalman: What video are you guys watching? I know it's all a matter of individual taste but Steve is smoother with more variety and even stops Franks cig from burning the guitar. Not my favorite players either one but Frank is kinda clunky as usual.

That. I like some Zappa but a lot of Frank's playing here is just jerking off.

/all those in favor, say 'aye'. all those unimpressed, say 'meh'.

Meh

Steve's tone sucks ass here so Zappa wins by default.

thesubliminalman: What video are you guys watching? I know it's all a matter of individual taste but Steve is smoother with more variety and even stops Franks cig from burning the guitar. Not my favorite players either one but Frank is kinda clunky as usual.

Well put; I agree. Although, they ARE two of my favorite players.

I spent last night listening to Zappa and it had been a while, so hearing the guitar come in on Packard Goose or the controlled insanity of the track Apostrophe was so nostalgic for a time when I would be virtually comatose through recreational something...

But now I am hearing it how FZ himself heard it; straight, sardonic and somewhat old.

/was at Hammersmith Odeon too, 1984 for Them Or Us, two shows in one day and ahd to wait four years after that to see him on the Guitar tour, then that was it...

Happy Frankin' Birthday, Mr. Zappa.
Here's another good one, The Illinois Enema Bandit (new window)

I always heard that Frank had Steve around to play the stuff that he couldn't. I don't think Frank had any delusions about being the world's greatest guitarist. But I still love to hear him play.

rocinante721: Jean-Luc Ponty, starting at 3:10.

That is great. Ruth always makes me smile, too. His wailing in The Gumbo Variations probably makes it my favorite Zappa song. Saw him and Stanley Clarke a couple of years ago, and he's still got it. If you want to check out another very talented violinist, check out Mads Tolling (new window). He was touring with Stanley the year before the tour with Jean-Luc. Incredible chops.

GUITAR BATTLE? (new window)

Zappa was all right but Vai's guitar sounded terrible; like it was going through a rock tumber.

2wheeljunkie: I always heard that Frank had Steve around to play the stuff that he couldn't. I don't think Frank had any delusions about being the world's greatest guitarist. But I still love to hear him play.

You are correct. Frank would not touch a guitar unless he needed a a dub immediatly in the studio or while on tour. He would start playing 6 weeks prior to touring to get his calouses built up. He much more enjoyed writing music than playing.

Looks like Jack Butler got his head cut.

Here's to you, inventor of the guitar cigarette holder.

If they had traded guitars and setups right before the "duel", you would have actually heard what Vai was playing, and realized that even then he was far and away one of the premier guitarists around. Not to take anything from Zappa, but if you think he spanked Vai in this clip, you don't understand the instrument very well.

jiaxiaobo

That. I like some Zappa but a lot of Frank's playing here is just jerking off.

Agreed,but it is still more interesting musically and enjoyable to hear than a lot of modern music today.

H31N0US: If they had traded guitars and setups right before the "duel", you would have actually heard what Vai was playing, and realized that even then he was far and away one of the premier guitarists around. Not to take anything from Zappa, but if you think he spanked Vai in this clip, you don't understand the instrument very well.

That's like saying Yngwie Malmsteen is a "better" guitar player than Neil Young. What does "better" mean?

Technical ability? Speed? Number and complexity of scales and modes used? No question Vai wins hands down.

But I'd rather listen to Zappa in all of his clunkiness any day of the week, just as I prefer sloppy, repetitive Neil Young to a virtuoso like Malmsteen

Not to take anything away from Vai - what he did in his role in that era of Zappa's bands was perfect. And he is awesome in the ZappaPlaysZappa video

priestrape.....I agree with you 100%

I personally love FZ's guitar playing simply because he did not do the typical "build to a crescendo" style soloing every other guitar player does. He uses notes that others don't. He also uses the guitar in very inventive ways. (Listen to "Stucco Homes" from "Shut Up And Play Your Guitar" sometimes).

Vai (and Satriani) sound like guitar masterbationists to me. Take away the whammy bars and they got nothing to play. I can't stand either one of them.

rocinante721: BEST STUFF EVAR (new window)

Jean-Luc Ponty, starting at 3:10. will make you cry, it is so good!

That was pretty epic. Thank you.

I wonder sometimes if Steve Vai held back at all when playing with Zappa...knowing full well he'd have to transcribe every farking note he played with him.

Seems to me a good enough reason to hang back once in a while!

Saw Frank in Burlington at Memorial Auditorium on the '88 tour. The band was incredible and he was awesome to behold.

/oldest son turns 27 today
//gotta stop Farking and give him a call

this was a nice change from all the black metal i usually listen to.

/looooove hot rats and ship arriving too late.

Still Itchy: I wonder sometimes if Steve Vai held back at all when playing with Zappa...knowing full well he'd have to transcribe every farking note he played with him.

Seems to me a good enough reason to hang back once in a while!

That's doubtful - he seems to have welcomed any and all challenges, and probably knew his own playing with even more familiarity than Zappa's.

Is it an 8 minute guitar duel? Yeesh. Zappadan deserveth a "real" song!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owVF97pZFFs



He shouted down the block...

jiaxiaobo: I like some Zappa but a lot of Frank's playing here is just jerking off.

I'm under the impression that "jerking off" is what Steve Vai's career is based on.

It seems what Frank has that Vai lacks is soul. Maybe Vai shouldn't have gone to the crossroads.

MN2: jiaxiaobo: I like some Zappa but a lot of Frank's playing here is just jerking off.

I'm under the impression that "jerking off" is what Steve Vai's career is based on.

It seems what Frank has that Vai lacks is soul. Maybe Vai shouldn't have gone to the crossroads.

Yeah, you idiots. That's why Zappa HANDED VAI HIS CAREER, because he was so bad. That's why Zappa LOVED Vai, because he sucked so bad, you stonking stupid cockswunt.

Let's review: Zappa hired an unknown Vai because he had a superb ear for musicians, and you jealous fu(ks hate him because you don't have an ear. You only know you're too goddamn stupid and ignorant to actually LISTEN to the music rather than be a good little contrarian.

rocinante721: BEST STUFF EVAR (new window)

That had to be one of the best concerts in rock history. Here is the solo from Montana:
Zappa in his prime (new window)

aquanaut:

Thank god for you tube as ZFT hasn't released shiat for video in ages, and I would buy it.

Did you buy The Torture Never Stops? It was released this year.

Marla Singer's Laundry

Well said. I think that a lot of the guitarists that hate Vai are jealous of his seemingly effortless virtuousity.

chickyraptor: Did you buy The Torture Never Stops? It was released this year.

I know, but there are SO MANY other video releases they should put out . . . I don't understand why they are sitting on this stuff. The man has been dead for 15 years. And I am not trying to be negative, I would BUY all of the releases, I don't want bootlegs, I want the ZFT to put this stuff out. Remember how Frank made Beat The Boots- he would have HATED youtube. Even if the quality is not that great, the ZFT should be on it WAY more than they are. I want to own this stuff, not have to look for it on youtube.

Among the "shredders" that I listen to, Steve Vai has the most heart & soul in His playing. I humbly submit that as a bonus He adds a touch of humor that makes Him one of My favorite super guit-players.

zappaisfrank: I personally love FZ's guitar playing simply because he did not do the typical "build to a crescendo" style soloing every other guitar player does. He uses notes that others don't. He also uses the guitar in very inventive ways. (Listen to "Stucco Homes" from "Shut Up And Play Your Guitar" sometimes).

Vai (and Satriani) sound like guitar masterbationists to me. Take away the whammy bars and they got nothing to play. I can't stand either one of them.

wow that is some fine trolling there... if not, I question if yo have ever touched a guitar and or have functional ears

used to like frank until i realized he was just one hell of a whiney biatch - gdamn that guy was negative -

Generally enjoy FZ's playing and Vai's contribution to the band during that period. But this was uninspired playing from both of them... sort of baseline Anastasio

Don't know anything about vai or zappa. That song does not make me want to learn more; what a wank fest.

wow, that clip is my first exposure and realization to Zappa's ability... i had no idea. I always assumed people liked him because he was a weirdo.

kungfu jesus with a side of lime: zappaisfrank: I personally love FZ's guitar playing simply because he did not do the typical "build to a crescendo" style soloing every other guitar player does. He uses notes that others don't. He also uses the guitar in very inventive ways. (Listen to "Stucco Homes" from "Shut Up And Play Your Guitar" sometimes).

Vai (and Satriani) sound like guitar masterbationists to me. Take away the whammy bars and they got nothing to play. I can't stand either one of them.

wow that is some fine trolling there... if not, I question if yo have ever touched a guitar and or have functional ears

No troll,I hear fine and I've played guitar for 30 years.

Vai does nothing for me. Some people think he's a genius, I find him tedious to listen to. Different strokes. He's a lot of technical virtuosity but little soul.

meh

For what it's worth, (which probably isn't much) I agree with zappaisfrank.

Yea, Vai is an incredible guitarist and I would love to have his degree of skill, but like several other otherwise great guitarists, he suffers from John McLaughlin disease. Which is to say that just because you have the stamina and ability to play "biddly-meedly-moodly-diddy-bwee-bwaaaaaang *insert whammy dive here*" at mach 5 for 87 minutes, doesn't mean you should.

tabula_rasta: Generally enjoy FZ's playing and Vai's contribution to the band during that period. But this was uninspired playing from both of them... sort of baseline Anastasio

Don't compare Zappa to that hack in Phish, ever. Not funny.

Ok, listen to the guitar solo on "Pojama People" and tell me that does not sound like a Phish song.

\Phish fan in 1989
\\can't stand them now
\\\HUGE FZ fan. Too young to see the Burlington show at the time, forever saddened