The cardinal warns that Britain shows signs of degenerating into a country free of morals, because of its rejection of traditional values and its new emphasis on the rights of the individual.

Our earth is degenerate in these latter days. There are signs that the world is speedily coming to an end. Bribery and corruption are common. ~ ca. 2800 BC, Assyrian clay tablet.

Glad to see he's with the times. Nothing like good old conservative fear of change to keep things in line.

In before the "pearls before swine" defense. Calling that shiat right now. I'm guessing it'll be either Sam or Corpus who pulls that one.

Good. Now fix the lack of privacy, bad teeth, and horrid food issues and you'll be all set.

If only. Here in the USofA, the voice of faith groups seems to be the loudest and most obnoxious, and therefore most heard.

What a change, going to school in cambridge in the mid 80s is the one place I found a lot of religion in school.

"...the voice of faith groups is marginalised."

he says that like it's a bad thing.

And England has low crime and is rather pleasant to live in from everyone I hear.

Umm...good?

submitter: hostile to Christian morals and values

Has he been burned at the stake...lately?

Can someone tell me what a "Christian moral and value" is which is not also independently a secular value? And then try to tell me why its good?

So, you're saying we should all look up to our British forefathers?

Is secularism anything like speculumism?

Sounds good to me.

The voice of faith groups is marginalised, said Cardinal O'Connor in this interview carried out at his palace, published in a major newspaper, and widely commented upon elsewhere.

in which religious belief is viewed as 'a private eccentricity' and the voice of faith groups is marginalised.


What's wrong with that? Sound like the way it should be.

Awesome. Let's snag a few decent cooks and start a Fark restaurant over there. Actually edible food would sell like hotcakes!

If the people at large are no longer taking your message seriously, the answer is not to blame them. If the people are turning against religion, you will not turn them back by ranting against human rights and individualism of all things.

I know he can't conceive of it, but this is a good thing. The natural rise of atheism is an indicator of societal health, as in other nations where 'organic atheism' (i.e. not enforced by the state) consistently coincides with high standard of living indicies.

The developed, western nations of the world are the best off. They are also as a rule the least religious of all nations in which citizens are free to choose what to believe. This is no coincidence. Religion is a refuge from the cruel barbarism many face in less developed nations. Many seek refuge in religious extremism specifically, which of course further worsens conditions, which drives more to religion and so on.

Whatever other problems Britain may face at the moment, conditions are at least improving in one respect. That's cause for celebration. Now how about taking down those CCTV cameras.....

Zamboro: Religion is a refuge from the cruel barbarism many face in less developed nations.

You can't make this statement while simultaneously supporting Humanism as a means of reaching people. It at least needs a qualifier.

And that's why I love England. Food is awesome too.

The bullshiat meme about english food sucking is just that, bullshiat. English breakfast? Awesome. Meat pies? Awesome. Thick, oily, burning hot chips covered in salt and soaked with malt vinegar? Awesome. Beef stew? Awesome. Shepherd's pie? Awesome.

In particular, the cardinal highlights the Church's opposition to liberal laws on abortion and homosexuality, its defence of faith schools and its support for marriage.

Poor cardinal, he can't even impose his religion on others!

Yet the British are doing everything in their power to kiss Muslim ass. Go fugure.

If only.

God forbid.

/lulz

"in which religious belief is viewed as 'a private eccentricity' and the voice of faith groups is marginalised"

Not seeing a problem here.


/P.S., anyone who assumes that only the religious are/can be moral can kindly EABOD and DIAF

Benevolent Misanthrope: If only. Here in the USofA, the voice of faith groups seems to be the loudest and most obnoxious, and therefore most heard.

The vocal minority.

I don't know about England, but I am optimistic that we in the states are evolving away from the need for religion.

The current administration set the process back a bit, one of the more onerous things they're guilty of.

ninjakirby: The cardinal warns that Britain shows signs of degenerating into a country free of morals, because of its rejection of traditional values and its new emphasis on the rights of the individual.

Our earth is degenerate in these latter days. There are signs that the world is speedily coming to an end. Bribery and corruption are common. ~ ca. 2800 BC, Assyrian clay tablet.

Glad to see he's with the times. Nothing like good old conservative fear of change to keep things in line.

Thread over, everybody go home.

/no seriously, if we all leave maybe Bevets and Skinnyhead won't show up

GOOD.

Ninjakirby: "You can't make this statement while simultaneously supporting Humanism as a means of reaching people. It at least needs a qualifier."

I'm ambivalent about Humanism, I've told GilRuiz1 as much. I'm as confused as you are as to why people feel the need for it but if I were to guess, I'd say it's the community building aspect of the church that humanists want to salvage and make use of...?

RemyDuron: And that's why I love England. Food is awesome too.

The bullshiat meme about english food sucking is just that, bullshiat. English breakfast? Awesome. Meat pies? Awesome. Thick, oily, burning hot chips covered in salt and soaked with malt vinegar? Awesome. Beef stew? Awesome. Shepherd's pie? Awesome.

And don't forgot that they have pretty much adopted Indian curries wholesale. My GF is a brit, her and her parents came her a few years ago and I love eating at their place.

Zamboro: I'm as confused as you are as to why people feel the need for it but if I were to guess, I'd say it's the community building aspect of the church that humanists want to salvage and make use of...?

Possibly, but that doesn't explain why some perform baptisms, and other rituals. In either case, I doubt you think Humanism "is a refuge from the cruel barbarism many face in less developed nations."

Not saying your point is wrong, just that it isn't pointy enough.

ninjakirby: "Possibly, but that doesn't explain why some perform baptisms, and other rituals. In either case, I doubt you think Humanism "is a refuge from the cruel barbarism many face in less developed nations."

Well so long as we're being frank I think the "imitate Christianity" approach of American Humanism is a deliberate ploy to siphon off fence-sitting deists who still identify as Christians by making the transition as seamless and easy as possible.

Zamboro: Well so long as we're being frank

I like to be frank and earnest. Frank in one city, Earnest in another. Just don't tell my wives.

ninjakirby: The cardinal warns that Britain shows signs of degenerating into a country free of morals, because of its rejection of traditional values and its new emphasis on the rights of the individual.

WHAT!?

"Anti-individualism" is a traditional value!?

Individuals shouldn't have rights as such,
only the society/state/church body has rights?

How Marxist of them.

Kittypie070: ninjakirby: The cardinal warns that Britain shows signs of degenerating into a country free of morals, because of its rejection of traditional values and its new emphasis on the rights of the individual.

WHAT!?

"Anti-individualism" is a traditional value!?

Individuals shouldn't have rights as such,
only the society/state/church body has rights?

How Marxist of them.

I would like to point out that rejection of traditional values does not mean free from morals.

RemyDuron: And that's why I love England. Food is awesome too.

The bullshiat meme about english food sucking is just that, bullshiat. English breakfast? Awesome. Meat pies? Awesome. Thick, oily, burning hot chips covered in salt and soaked with malt vinegar? Awesome. Beef stew? Awesome. Shepherd's pie? Awesome.

All of that is wonderful about once a month, but I couldn't imagine living on it.

/Also Cornish pasties and roast veg FTW.

The rise of secularism has made Britain "a liberal society, hostile to Christian morals and values, in which religious belief is viewed as 'a private eccentricity' and the voice of faith groups is marginalised"

Does anyone else fail to see a problem here?

Gangway Fathead: RemyDuron: And that's why I love England. Food is awesome too.

The bullshiat meme about english food sucking is just that, bullshiat. English breakfast? Awesome. Meat pies? Awesome. Thick, oily, burning hot chips covered in salt and soaked with malt vinegar? Awesome. Beef stew? Awesome. Shepherd's pie? Awesome.

All of that is wonderful about once a month, but I couldn't imagine living on it.

/Also Cornish pasties and roast veg FTW.

I'd be quite a bit fatter if I lived in Britain. I mean, maybe I wouldn't have pie and chips every day, but a few times a week at least. And then there are kababs, gyros, curry . . .

PC LOAD LETTER: And England has low crime

o rly?

ninjakirby: Zamboro: Well so long as we're being frank

I like to be frank and earnest. Frank in one city, Earnest in another. Just don't tell my wives.

That must be important.

McManus_brothers: I know you're probably a troll, but that image is completely inaccurate when it comes to the Big Bang theory and most theories of abiogenesis.

MickCollins: PC LOAD LETTER: And England has low crime

o rly?

Compared to the US? Ya rly.

RemyDuron: I'd be quite a bit fatter if I lived in Britain. I mean, maybe I wouldn't have pie and chips every day, but a few times a week at least. And then there are kababs, gyros, curry . . .

Dude - we got plenty of fine fattening food right here in 'murrrrica.

RemyDuron: McManus_brothers: I know you're probably a troll, but that image is completely inaccurate when it comes to the Big Bang theory and most theories of abiogenesis.

Eh let it go, it's just as wild a straw man as the theist version.

MickCollins: PC LOAD LETTER: And England has low crime

o rly?

Have you ever been to Atlanta, Detroit or Washington DC? Note my hometown too. Murders may be low, but rape's the same.

RemyDuron: McManus_brothers: I know you're probably a troll, but that image is completely inaccurate when it comes to the Big Bang theory and most theories of abiogenesis.

But it still makes more sense than the alternative I suspect he believes.

Wow, I must have stumbled into the wrong thread. I was looking for the Pagan Conspirary to eat babies and turn children gay meeting. Not the Atheist Conspiracy to turn everyone into godless socialists meeting.

And yet there's so many Isms floating around in here. Individualism, Secular Humanism, Deism. Still having trouble deciding on a name, huh? Might want to postpone that experiment to give Otters the ability to speak until you work that out.