submitter: For about three one-hundredths of the cost of the US bail-out, 95% of the HIV cases in Africa could be halted and the epidemic controlled

That is the biggest lie I have heard in a while. You can throw all the money at it you want but that isn't preventing them from having unprotected sex.

Are they out of 12 year old girls already?

chemical_angel: Are they out of 12 year old girls already?

Not according to my stock boy.

sullyman: That is the biggest lie I have heard in a while. You can throw all the money at it you want but that isn't preventing them from having unprotected sex

Exactly. HIV spreads when people have unprotected sex. Throwing more of our money at corrupt African governments isn't going to affect that in the least.

sullyman: You can throw all the money at it you want but that isn't preventing them from having unprotected sex.

but if they don't have any means to have protected sex because no one bought contraceptives or educated them, then they really don't have a chance, do they?

sullyman: That is the biggest lie I have heard in a while. You can throw all the money at it you want but that isn't preventing them from having unprotected sex.

The biggest reason why AIDs has spread in Africa as quickly as it has is because there is a lack of education through out the populace on ways to prevent the spread of the disease. In fact incorrect information has become more widespread than good information through the people. $7 Billion would go a long way toward educating everybody and dismissing rumor mongering and conspiracy theories.

sullyman: submitter: For about three one-hundredths of the cost of the US bail-out, 95% of the HIV cases in Africa could be halted and the epidemic controlled

That is the biggest lie I have heard in a while. You can throw all the money at it you want but that isn't preventing them from having unprotected sex.

Then there's also the bizarre fact that many African men enjoy Dry Sex. No, not dry-humping. A dry pussy.

Prostitutes in Africa have been known to shove crazy conconctions up their twats in order to absorb as much moisture as possible for their clients, which massively increases the chance of vaginal tearing and bleeding.

Even if they do use condoms, the added friction makes it much more likely that the condom will tear and fail.

Sgt Otter: A dry pussy.


moving to africa

sullyman: submitter: For about three one-hundredths of the cost of the US bail-out, 95% of the HIV cases in Africa could be halted and the epidemic controlled

That is the biggest lie I have heard in a while. You can throw all the money at it you want but that isn't preventing them from having unprotected sex.

I suppose we could just nuke all of Africa for that amount of money. Technically that would make the headline accurate.

burndtdan: sullyman: You can throw all the money at it you want but that isn't preventing them from having unprotected sex.

but if they don't have any means to have protected sex because no one bought contraceptives or educated them, then they really don't have a chance, do they?

Sure it would help somewhat. I was referring to the lie that spending that kind of money automatically means you will have a 95% reduction. You could educate everyone in the country and you will still end up with a shiatload of now educated people having unprotected sex. Education and availability of contraception is no guarantee anyone will act on it. Help, yes. Continent wide acceptance, no friggin way.

burndtdan: but if they don't have any means to have protected sex because no one bought contraceptives or educated them, then they really don't have a chance, do they?

Damn, another Fark crypto-racist. Sorry, but just because they're Africans doesn't mean they can't 1) stop having unprotected sex, or at least stop having sex with so many partners, and 2) educate themselves. They're not children who need to be coddled, they're farking full grown adults whose problems are of their own making.

sullyman: burndtdan: sullyman: You can throw all the money at it you want but that isn't preventing them from having unprotected sex.

but if they don't have any means to have protected sex because no one bought contraceptives or educated them, then they really don't have a chance, do they?

Sure it would help somewhat. I was referring to the lie that spending that kind of money automatically means you will have a 95% reduction. You could educate everyone in the country and you will still end up with a shiatload of now educated people having unprotected sex. Education and availability of contraception is no guarantee anyone will act on it. Help, yes. Continent wide acceptance, no friggin way.

i think you're prescribing to them the mentality of an american to the situation. i would imagine their thought process is a little different considering the disease is wiping them out in epidemic proportions.

ItHurtsWhenIDoThis: Damn, another Fark crypto-racist. Sorry, but just because they're Africans doesn't mean they can't 1) stop having unprotected sex, or at least stop having sex with so many partners, and 2) educate themselves. They're not children who need to be coddled, they're farking full grown adults whose problems are of their own making.

they can stop having unprotected sex without having access to prophylactics? they can educate themselves without anyone around that knows better?

that's amazing.

sullyman: Sure it would help somewhat. I was referring to the lie that spending that kind of money automatically means you will have a 95% reduction. You could educate everyone in the country and you will still end up with a shiatload of now educated people having unprotected sex. Education and availability of contraception is no guarantee anyone will act on it. Help, yes. Continent wide acceptance, no friggin way.

You are flirting with the perfect solution fallacy, and the submitter does not suggest that it would be a perfect solution.

burndtdan: i think you're prescribing to them the mentality of an american to the situation. i would imagine their thought process is a little different considering the disease is wiping them out in epidemic proportions.

From what I have read, I am giving them much more credit than they deserve when it comes to their mentality about this and their willingness to use condoms to protect themselves and their partners.

The problem with education has never been that the right information isn't available. It's that wrong information is available in greater quantities from people- friend, relatives, neighbors, elders, etc. - who are (often with good reason) much more trusted than the central government and international agencies.

ninjakirby: sullyman: submitter: For about three one-hundredths of the cost of the US bail-out, 95% of the HIV cases in Africa could be halted and the epidemic controlled

That is the biggest lie I have heard in a while. You can throw all the money at it you want but that isn't preventing them from having unprotected sex.

I suppose we could just nuke all of Africa for that amount of money. Technically that would make the headline accurate.

lol

ItHurtsWhenIDoThis: Damn, another Fark crypto-racist. Sorry, but just because they're Africans doesn't mean they can't 1) stop having unprotected sex, or at least stop having sex with so many partners, and 2) educate themselves. They're not children who need to be coddled, they're farking full grown adults whose problems are of their own making.

Attempts to educate people in Africa about protected sex has had to fight against superstitions and rumors. One popular myth they have to fight against is that condoms make you impotent. It is not that they are incapable of being educated, it is that there are not enough resources being invested to fight against the spread of AIDs through education.

burndtdan: they can stop having unprotected sex without having access to prophylactics?

yes

How much would it cost to make the virus more deadly so that the problem solves itself ?

Code_Archeologist: You are flirting with the perfect solution fallacy, and the submitter does not suggest that it would be a perfect solution.

Like hell I am. How many bajillions have we spent in the U.S. in the last 25 years to educate people about the dangers of AIDS? A shiatload. How much has that reduced the incidence of HIV? 95%? Not even in the same ballpark. Just the claim that any disease can be reduced through education and availability of contraception, is utter bullshiat and should be called out for being a lie. We can help, and should, but lets not milk people out of a ton of cash with false claims and promises.

Mordant: How much would it cost to make the virus more deadly so that the problem solves itself ?

How exactly would you genetically engineer all the viruses already out there?

Well that doesn't sound like too terrible a cost on bullets, but machetes never run out of ammo.

Megain: burndtdan: they can stop having unprotected sex without having access to prophylactics?

yes

ah, good idea then, we should teach them abstinence only.

cause any theory that relies on people to just stop having sex works out great.

sullyman: Like hell I am. How many bajillions have we spent in the U.S. in the last 25 years to educate people about the dangers of AIDS?

not that much actually.

let me put this into perspective for you. you know what president has spent the most on it?



and you know how world-renowned he is for his humanitarian streak.

sullyman: Code_Archeologist: You are flirting with the perfect solution fallacy, and the submitter does not suggest that it would be a perfect solution.

Like hell I am. How many bajillions have we spent in the U.S. in the last 25 years to educate people about the dangers of AIDS? A shiatload. How much has that reduced the incidence of HIV? 95%? Not even in the same ballpark. Just the claim that any disease can be reduced through education and availability of contraception, is utter bullshiat and should be called out for being a lie. We can help, and should, but lets not milk people out of a ton of cash with false claims and promises.


Now you're not just flirting with the perfect solution fallacy, you're well onto second base. Education and contraceptive availability are not a perfect solutions. Neither are they the only solutions. They are however, useful tools to address a rather complex, entrenched problem, imperfect as they may be. Just because they are imperfect and only part of a solution does not mean they should be completely discounted as tools.

burndtdan: they can stop having unprotected sex without having access to prophylactics? they can educate themselves without anyone around that knows better? that's amazing.

Yes it is! 1) You don't NEED to have sex with HIV infected prostitutes, it's just a WANT. Stop doing that. 2) Africans already know better.

But then again, you're a crypto-racist and just consider them children so you'll create any excuse you need to treat them like helpless infants.

sullyman: How much has that reduced the incidence of HIV? 95%? Not even in the same ballpark. Just the claim that any disease can be reduced through education and availability of contraception, is utter bullshiat and should be called out for being a lie. We can help, and should, but lets not milk people out of a ton of cash with false claims and promises.

Before the CDC began spending money for free condoms and education the number of new AIDs cases every year in United States was increasing by 50% annually. Since those programs began the number of new AIDs cases each year has changed from a peak of 90,000 new cases in 1993 to just under 40,000 new cases in 2006. And we have only spend $720 Million a year on prevention and education.

burndtdan: but if they don't have any means to have protected sex because no one bought contraceptives or educated them, then they really don't have a chance, do they?


I dunno, I bet I could solve every problem in Africa for less than $21 billion.

How much does napalm cost nowadays?
=Smidge=

Damnhippyfreak: Now you're not just flirting with the perfect solution fallacy, you're well onto second base. Education and contraceptive availability are not a perfect solutions. Neither are they the only solutions. They are however, useful tools to address a rather complex, entrenched problem, imperfect as they may be. Just because they are imperfect and only part of a solution does not mean they should be completely discounted as tools.

You are missing my point and I am right. My beef was with the statement that this will reduce HIV cases by 95%. That is complete bullshiat and everyone knows it. I have said a number of times now, that I support helping with these steps, only am saying that the claim is completely untrue and unobtainable. Our own HIV cases in the US is a perfect example of how wrong it is. I don't discount their usefulness only the 95% reduction claim.

Wow...I didn't realize nuclear bombs were so cheap these days.

Beware international male bi-sexual flight attendants...

//that is all
///carry on

burndtdan: Megain: burndtdan: they can stop having unprotected sex without having access to prophylactics?

yes

ah, good idea then, we should teach them abstinence only.

cause any theory that relies on people to just stop having sex works out great.

Yeah. Especially when it involves communicable diseases that can kill millions.

/Reagan told me so

Code_Archeologist: Before the CDC began spending money for free condoms and education the number of new AIDs cases every year in United States was increasing by 50% annually. Since those programs began the number of new AIDs cases each year has changed from a peak of 90,000 new cases in 1993 to just under 40,000 new cases in 2006. And we have only spend $720 Million a year on prevention and education.

Of course it grew by 50% initially. That is not hard to do when you start at 0. But despite the 1 billion ads and programs and free condoms and everything else, our reduction is around 50% over the last 15 years. That is a far cry from 95%.

I live in America. I don't fark strange snatch. I don't visit Africa. Why do I care?

/this I say to the idiots who, for the past 8 years, have been telling the BushAdmin to get out of other peoples' affairs

thalidomide new and improved: this I say to the idiots who, for the past 8 years, have been telling the BushAdmin to get out of other peoples' affairs

Right, because AIDS relief is the same thing as wiretapping.

spamdog: thalidomide new and improved: this I say to the idiots who, for the past 8 years, have been telling the BushAdmin to get out of other peoples' affairs

Right, because AIDS relief is the same thing as wiretapping.

Much like stabbing someone is the same thing as helping them up off the ground.

thalidomide new and improved: /this I say to the idiots who, for the past 8 years, have been telling the BushAdmin to get out of other peoples' affairs

Not that this article is in any way political, but the point is that if the government really wanted to involve itself in the affairs of others, there are ways in which it would get much more bang for its buck.

sullyman:
You are missing my point and I am right. My beef was with the statement that this will reduce HIV cases by 95%. That is complete bullshiat and everyone knows it. I have said a number of times now, that I support helping with these steps, only am saying that the claim is completely untrue and unobtainable. Our own HIV cases in the US is a perfect example of how wrong it is. I don't discount their usefulness only the 95% reduction claim.

Whoops. Sorry. I was taking this statement of yours at face value. It does sound like you're completely rejecting any sort of education or program of contraception availability:

sullyman: Just the claim that any disease can be reduced through education and availability of contraception, is utter bullshiat and should be called out for being a lie.

sullyman

That is the biggest lie I have heard in a while.

You must have turned off your television and hidden in a cave during the last two years of election campaigning.

No one in this thread read the article, right?

ItHurtsWhenIDoThis: burndtdan: they can stop having unprotected sex without having access to prophylactics? they can educate themselves without anyone around that knows better? that's amazing.

Yes it is! 1) You don't NEED to have sex with HIV infected prostitutes, it's just a WANT. Stop doing that. 2) Africans already know better.

But then again, you're a crypto-racist and just consider them children so you'll create any excuse you need to treat them like helpless infants.


Be careful not to get stuck in a false dichotomy here. There is a middle ground between "helpless infants" who don't know anything and hyper-knowledgeable people who only lack the force of will. It's of course somewhere in the middle. Education and prophylactic distribution aren't perfect, but they are useful as part of a wider strategy.

P.S. Hint: this article is about a theoretical model, not a policy proposal. It's a theoretical model of an AIDS treatment regimen that nobody really thinks would work and that nobody is suggesting be put in place.

It's not about condoms and education, either.

Sgt Otter: Then there's also the bizarre fact that many African men enjoy Dry Sex. No, not dry-humping. A dry pussy.

Jesus Christ, if women were in charge, would they expect men to stick their dicks in a beehive so they could have that "ribbed for her pleasure" feeling?

Any guy who gets off on that should ask the woman to put sandpaper in their hooha.

AIDS is a self-cleaning oven. Africa is still in the high-temperature cleaning cycle. Thanks to the continent's lack of infrastructure, tribal cultures and rampant corruption, the mechanical interlock is engaged.

Churchill2004: The problem with education has never been that the right information isn't available. It's that wrong information is available in greater quantities from people- friend, relatives, neighbors, elders, etc. - who are (often with good reason) much more trusted than the central government and international agencies.

This. A disturbingly high number of Africans think that the white people telling them to use condoms is a plot by their former colonial overlords to control the African population. Or that AIDS is caused by a mix of old and new diseases, not HIV. Who are they going to believe, their family or an inanimate sign beside the road that was paid for by the guys who once took over their country?

/The outgoing PM of South Africa had an "I don't know" position on the cause of AIDS
//A missionary friend told me that the local media in Kenya also purports the idea that vaccines are a plot to kill babies

Dumbest idea ever. So the genocidal tribes of Africa would gain about half a year average life span(most die of hunger and war before aids ever kils them)GREAT way to spend our money.

thenateman: AIDS is a self-cleaning oven. Africa is still in the high-temperature cleaning cycle. Thanks to the continent's lack of infrastructure, tribal cultures and rampant corruption, the mechanical interlock is engaged.


You know who else talked about "cleaning" with ovens?

/couldn't resist

Snot Monster from Outer Space: No one in this thread read the article, right?

Of course not. This is fark!