You pay the rent, I pay the utilities, I get to keep my dog and Friday is 'naked day'.

"Show us on the doll where Israel touched you."

The relationship is very simple: Israel can spy on us and steal military secrets and in return, we get to supply them with state of the art weapons no questions asked. Additionally, in return for our outstanding obsequiousness, we get to butt out and STFU on everything yet still get embroiled in the chaos. It's really quite a rewarding relationship.

So they want Bush to give Obama lessons in Neoconservatism 101? This should be entertaining.

SherKhan: The relationship is very simple: Israel can spy on us and steal military secrets and in return, we get to supply them with state of the art weapons no questions asked. Additionally, in return for our outstanding obsequiousness, we get to butt out and STFU on everything yet still get embroiled in the chaos. It's really quite a rewarding relationship.

Don't forget that they get to sink an American ship, killing 34 sailors, and just say "Oh, we had no idea it was an American ship" even though every account of the day says that Israeli planes had been surveilling it for hours.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

"You see, a pimp's love is very different from that of a square."

Hey Isreal: FARK YOU! This is my country, not yours, so STFU and GTFO.

I'm tired of seeing the US bend over for these assholes.
Any country that refuses to recognize the rights of a people to exist after they displaced them and interred them into a giant concentration camp for the last 60 years doesn't have a leg to stand on when the sympathetic arab nations refuse to acknowledge Israel's right to exist as a form of quid pro quo.

And we saw what happened when an Israeli leader was seriously for peace and granting the Palestinian their right to exist as a self governing entity. Ya, that worked out real well.

SherKhan: It's really quite a rewarding relationship.

It is for the politicians who rely on the pro-Israel Christian conservative and Jewish votes in order to get elected.

But, I don't think Bush can pronounce "eschatology."

jake_lex: Don't forget that they get to sink an American ship, killing 34 sailors, and just say "Oh, we had no idea it was an American ship" even though every account of the day says that Israeli planes had been surveilling it for hours.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

Wow, seriously?

We entered WWI when the germans killed 128 american citizens. I'm surprised we just gave Israel a pass on this.

On a different note, I certainly hope that Obama was lying to get elected when he professed his support of Israel.

The Country of Peace™ is going to miss its good friend Bush, eh?

absoluteparanoia: On a different note, I certainly hope that Obama was lying to get elected when he professed his support of Israel.

He's got an extremely powerful Israel lobby to contend with and another election to win.

You will not see a US President do anything other than support and arm Israel this decade, and probably the next. At least.

absoluteparanoia: On a different note, I certainly hope that Obama was lying to get elected when he professed his support of Israel.

I think it was pretty clear that he was. I think it's okay to be honest with ourselves now and admit that most of what he said to appeal to the religious crowds was all entirely bullshiat. Personally, I'm more than okay with that.

I still don't get why we support Israel unquestioningly.

The Jews were treated really badly in Europe for a long time, culminating in a holocaust. So we take land from people living there and say "Hooray! A place for the Jews!"

Then the people who live there are angry because their land got taken and we're like "Well, they're Jews. Remember the HOLOCAUST? Yeah, they get the land."

And to this day we have problems because of it.

What does Israel have that we need so badly that we're jeopardizing security to get it?

The Icelander: I still don't get why we support Israel unquestioningly.

The Jews were treated really badly in Europe for a long time, culminating in a holocaust. So we take land from people living there and say "Hooray! A place for the Jews!"

Then the people who live there are angry because their land got taken and we're like "Well, they're Jews. Remember the HOLOCAUST? Yeah, they get the land."

And to this day we have problems because of it.

What does Israel have that we need so badly that we're jeopardizing security to get it?

By asking those questions, you are an anti-Semite and as bad as Hitler. That is also the answer to those questions.

Jamespoon: I think it was pretty clear that he was. I think it's okay to be honest with ourselves now and admit that most of what he said to appeal to the religious crowds was all entirely bullshiat. Personally, I'm more than okay with that.

Me too. I think that he will publicly support israel (photo ops and whatnot) but when it comes to Congress passing resolutions supporting the lastest Israeli debacle, I anticipate the sound of crickets coming from the white house.

Jamespoon: I think it was pretty clear that he was. I think it's okay to be honest with ourselves now and admit that most of what he said to appeal to the religious crowds was all entirely bullshiat. Personally, I'm more than okay with that.

He hasn't been to church once since he was elected.

That makes me very happy.

Jamespoon: It is for the politicians who rely on the pro-Israel Christian conservative and Jewish votes in order to get elected.

Florida is why the embargo on Cuba will never be lifted and why Israel will never be allowed to sink or swim on their own.

They should get Lieberman to do it. I hear he has a lot of pull with the incoming administration.

The Icelander: He hasn't been to church once since he was elected.

That makes me very happy.

Was he attending before he was elected? After the Wright 'fiasco' I never really thought to look into it.

Either way, there have only been 3 sundays since he was elected. I'm certain that he's been very very busy since the, and that the secret service has advised him to avoid such public gatherings (for his own saftey).

If he's doing it deliberately? More power to him. This psuedo-religious oligarchy needs to end.

Diogenes: "Show us on the doll where Israel touched you."

That is probably going to be it for the thread.

very busy since the election.

I don't know how I missed an entire word.

The Icelander: The Jews were treated really badly in Europe for a long time, culminating in a holocaust. So we take land from people living there and say "Hooray! A place for the Jews!"

Then the people who live there are angry because their land got taken and we're like "Well, they're Jews. Remember the HOLOCAUST? Yeah, they get the land."

I've always wondered why -- and perhaps this is wild ignorance -- they didn't give them European land, considering it was European Jews who were hurt and killed in the Holocaust. I know the whole "holy land" thing... but it still doesn't make sense that they'd just throw these people there and say "here you go, take this. There are just some random Arabs using it, anyway."

I've never seen a very good explanation behind the creation of Israel aside from "holy land" stuff that I just don't buy because Hitler had nothing to do with the holy land.

serpent_sky: I've never seen a very good explanation behind the creation of Israel aside from "holy land" stuff that I just don't buy because Hitler had nothing to do with the holy land.

Just think of all the problems that would be solved if we gave Israel a five mile wide strip along the U.S.-Mexican border as their new Holy Land.

Snarfangel: Just think of all the problems that would be solved if we gave Israel a five mile wide strip along the U.S.-Mexican border as their new Holy Land.

Plus they now have Manhattan, can't we just give them citizen ship there?

The whole mess is a colossal clusterfark. You don't decide to create a land for the Jews in a place where they are hated more than during WWII, and then give them permission to relegate the inhabitants to ghettos.

Don't forget the nukes they "don't have." Wink, wink.

Snarfangel:

Just think of all the problems that would be solved if we gave Israel a five mile wide strip along the U.S.-Mexican border as their new Holy Land.

You have probably just blown the minds of about 15 different types of crazies, racists, and even some intelligent people. ^_^

serpent_sky: Snarfangel:

Just think of all the problems that would be solved if we gave Israel a five mile wide strip along the U.S.-Mexican border as their new Holy Land.

You have probably just blown the minds of about 15 different types of crazies, racists, and even some intelligent people. ^_^

Let's stir up the pot. I say we give Israel the entire southern border (maybe a mile or two thick) and let them defend both sides.

We could solve the immigration problem and the middle east problem in one fell swoop.

absoluteparanoia:

one fell [swell] swoop.

Fell means cruel, evil, deadly;
Swell, if you'll allow leave, Smedley,
Is a sweeter set of letters
That fits your fix all the better.

they just don't want to lose the cuddling and pillow talk.

Oy vey.

SherKhan: The relationship is very simple: Israel can spy on us and steal military secrets and in return, we get to supply them with state of the art weapons no questions asked. Additionally, in return for our outstanding obsequiousness, we get to butt out and STFU on everything yet still get embroiled in the chaos. It's really quite a rewarding relationship.



It is a rewarding relationship. Two points:

We give them cash, they turn around and spend that cash on US military hardware. That way we keep jobs in the military sector and we dont have to worry about the whole "OH MY GOD GOVERNMENT HANDOUTS !!11!!" people. Hell we give Egypt more financial aid than Israel! True we give more military dollars to Israel (and therefore a total higher sum) than Eqypt but as a stated before most of those dollars come back to us in the form of supply orders.

Now I know few believe that there are actually people out there that want to hurt us. However giving them another target to hate then just us is just sound military and PR strategy.

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Now I know few believe that there are actually people out there that want to hurt us. However giving them another target to hate then just us is just sound military and PR strategy.

We could work on making them not hate us...

serpent_sky: I've never seen a very good explanation behind the creation of Israel aside from "holy land" stuff that I just don't buy because Hitler had nothing to do with the holy land.

I believe the people living there sided with Hitler and they were conquered by the allies during WW2... There weren't many people living on the land at the time, the Jews wanted the land, and needed to be placed somewhere so it seemed like the best spot at the time. They just didn't know about the whole mortal enemies thing the Jews had going with the natives.

absoluteparanoia: Snarfangel: Just think of all the problems that would be solved if we gave Israel a five mile wide strip along the U.S.-Mexican border as their new Holy Land.

Plus they now have Manhattan, can't we just give them citizen ship there?

The whole mess is a colossal clusterfark. You don't decide to create a land for the Jews in a place where they are hated more than during WWII, and then give them permission to relegate the inhabitants to ghettos.

Why Manhattan? Brooklyn is the Jewiest borough in the city - more Jews per square mile than anywhere else in the world. Oy!

To be fair, the Jewish state was created as a result of over a century of antisemitism in Europe (besides the obvious holocaust there were also pogroms in Russia, civil backlash against granting citizenship to Jews) pushing thousands of Jews out with nowhere to go. It was already a huge movement by the time the British took over the region - they had no choice but to give it legitimacy. I'm would imagine that if the Europeans weren't such huge dicks in the first place, the Jews would have been perfectly happy to stay where they were and continued to look at the the Zionists as nutcases who believed in unicorns and fairies.

Snarfangel: Just think of all the problems that would be solved if we gave Israel a five mile wide strip along the U.S.-Mexican border as their new Holy Land.

In six months, they would be claiming everything up to Austin was their ancient homeland, recorded in Exodus II - Electric Bugaloo, as notarized by Moses.

The Stealth Hippopotamus:

It is a rewarding relationship. Two points:

I'll give you that it's a relationship but so was David Gest and Liza Minelli.

y'know, I've always wondered just why we do seem to give Israel a free pass on a lot of things. what do we get out of this deal?

Weaver95: y'know, I've always wondered just why we do seem to give Israel a free pass on a lot of things. what do we get out of this deal?

Do you want the practical answer or the philosophical one?

Practical - they are our lone staunch ally in the middle east and the Jewish lobby is very powerful in America.

Philosophical answer - they are a liberal democracy, and even if we disagree with some of their policies, we stand by their form of government.

DamnYankees: Weaver95: y'know, I've always wondered just why we do seem to give Israel a free pass on a lot of things. what do we get out of this deal?

Do you want the practical answer or the philosophical one?

Practical - they are our lone staunch ally in the middle east and the Jewish lobby is very powerful in America.

Philosophical answer - they are a liberal democracy, and even if we disagree with some of their policies, we stand by their form of government.

well...that's nice and all, but sometime I think we've completely screwed ourselves over in the middle east by our obvious and rock solid support of Israel. kinda hard to act as mediator when we're known friends with a bunch of uncompromising hard cases.

Weaver95: well...that's nice and all, but sometime I think we've completely screwed ourselves over in the middle east by our obvious and rock solid support of Israel. kinda hard to act as mediator when we're known friends with a bunch of uncompromising hard cases.

Well, you asked why we give them a free pass. You didn't ask me to defend it as a good idea.

OK, from what I got out of the article this "special relationship" it talks about seems to mean that we will promise to turn a blind eye to Israel's nuclear weapons, and not hold them to the same standards as everyone else when it comes to nuclear technology.

The questions is why the hell do we do this, and why are we surprised when the double standard pisses a lot of people off?

Aarontology: The questions is why the hell do we do this, and why are we surprised when the double standard pisses a lot of people off?

Congress gives billions of taxpayer dollars to Israel. In return, those sympathetic to Israel give millions of dollars to congressional campaigns.

It's like money-laundering by incompetents.

TheOther: Austin

welcome to my quotes of the week

TheOther: In six months, they would be claiming everything up to Austin was their ancient homeland, recorded in Exodus II - Electric Bugaloo, as notarized by Moses.

Keep Austin Kosher!!

Snarfangel: Aarontology: The questions is why the hell do we do this, and why are we surprised when the double standard pisses a lot of people off?

Congress gives billions of taxpayer dollars to Israel. In return, those sympathetic to Israel give millions of dollars to congressional campaigns.

It's like money-laundering by incompetents.

I really don't like it when people vote or donate based upon how a candidate's policies will affect another nation, simply because they have a shared heritage. At least when it's a primary motivating factor anyway. I've never even considered a candidates policies in regards to Ireland or Canada.

Also, I read a statistic somewhere that said if you took all the money we send to Israel every year, it equals out to about $20,000 dollars for every single Israeli citizen.

Aarontology: I really don't like it when people vote or donate based upon how a candidate's policies will affect another nation, simply because they have a shared heritage. At least when it's a primary motivating factor anyway. I've never even considered a candidates policies in regards to Ireland or Canada.

There are many people who say they would die in a war for Israel long before they would for the US, though they were citizens here and not there. I even asked a farker once why she doesn't just move to Israel then, and her response was simply "that's not how it works."

Facepalm.

Aarontology: I really don't like it when people vote or donate based upon how a candidate's policies will affect another nation, simply because they have a shared heritage. At least when it's a primary motivating factor anyway. I've never even considered a candidates policies in regards to Ireland or Canada.

Also, I read a statistic somewhere that said if you took all the money we send to Israel every year, it equals out to about $20,000 dollars for every single Israeli citizen.

Anti-semite.

Jamespoon: There are many people who say they would die in a war for Israel long before they would for the US, though they were citizens here and not there. I even asked a farker once why she doesn't just move to Israel then, and her response was simply "that's not how it works."

Many people in my high school believed this. My next door neighbor (who was then a 14 year old girl born in the US) said over dinner that she didn't care if American soldiers died but she cried whenever an IDF soldier was hurt.

My dad, a 60 year old, went off on her for that one.

Jamespoon: There are many people who say they would die in a war for Israel long before they would for the US, though they were citizens here and not there. I even asked a farker once why she doesn't just move to Israel then, and her response was simply "that's not how it works."

Facepalm.

An acquaintance of mine from college who was attempting to get into the FBI, once said that he wouldn't help someone who was spying for Israel, but wouldn't alert his superiors. He's now a member of the New Orleans Private Patrol which is basically a naighborhood rent a cop for rich folks in the Garden District.

DamnYankees: Anti-semite.

You're confusing me for Aprik0t or whatever his name is.