I cannot reconcile the existence of hell with the concept of a God that is kind, just, and loving.

If hell exists, God is evil. In which case we're all going to hell unless we do evil in his name. Which leads to suffering in hell being a badge of pride, as we took the difficult right over the easy wrong.

Meh, I'll conquer the place.

That headline is hot.

Cool.

Saborlas: Meh, I'll conquer the place.

Here at last we shall be free; the Almighty hath not made here for his envy, will not drive us hence. Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, to reign is worth ambition, though in Hell: Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven.

Jeebus, what a tortured headline.

Subby's headline is porno for pyros.

Ok, so hell is a human construct, but the rest of your silly crap isnt??? For farks sake people.

What a hoser.

If Satan didn't exist, he would have had to be invented.

Oh, wait. That's God. Never mind, carry on.

Supernatural creation myths held true by a majority of the human race.

Pass the bottle.

You bet your sweet ass he approves!

/Should been the Boobies

BEHOLD now is the time for ruthless persecution of the Christians!!!

Show them no mercy!!

Make them know that our knowledge is superior to their beliefs!!!

KILL KILL KILL!!!

Hell is not knowing God. God is love of all people. I'm Catholic.

FTFA: Brayshaw's arguments have academic support, according to Mary Ann Beavis, head of the department of religion and culture at the University of Saskatchewan.

And you guys didn't catch this either?

Fark is slippin'

Dear Jerk: Hell is not knowing God. God is love of all people. I'm Catholic.

This, although I always thought Hell as a lack of love of All.

Bah, Hell is for children.

I thought hell was for children.

Gifted Many Few: Bah, Hell is for children.

I demand a retraction of my post.

Religion is all made up, so of course Satan is all made up.

Why the fark is this douche getting a whole newspaper article, with no experts like professors, archaeologists, etc., being consulted?

The Gehenna thing is common knowledge. I am not so sure about the direct connection from Tartarus from Hell. He seems to be ignoring the Coptic church's influences.

Psychiatrists espouse to never tell someone their invisible friends don't exist.

Saborlas: I cannot reconcile the existence of hell with the concept of a God that is kind, just, and loving.

If hell exists, God is evil. In which case we're all going to hell unless we do evil in his name. Which leads to suffering in hell being a badge of pride, as we took the difficult right over the easy wrong.

Meh, I'll conquer the place.

Here's what the Catechism of the Catholic Church (new window) says:
This state of definitive self-exclusion from communion with God and the blessed is called "hell."

Thus Hell, at least in Catholic belief, is eternal separation from God. The point isn't fire and torture, but eternal banishment from God's presence. While popular imagery from the likes of Dante draws on classical and Norse mythology, Catholic teaching is very clear on the point.

Dear Jerk: Hell is not knowing God. God is love of all people. I'm Catholic.

I'm hetero.

Yea but how does this relate to Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy? Surly with hell disproven, what hope do we have of their existence, perhaps of gods. O well, guess ima get back to watching terminator 2, need to brush up for the apocalypse. Maybe later i will play some AD&D now that it is okay.

Practically all of modern Christendom's (read: pseudo-Christian) views of hell are based directly on Dante's "Inferno," and not on actual scripture. Folks that have done the research without letting doctrinal preconceptions color their results inevitably come to the conclusion that there's no "hell" in the fire/brimstone sense, and that "hell" as was understood by Bible writers was actually transliterations from the terms used for simple gravesites as a collective. "Hell" wasn't a state of eternal torment, it was a person dead and buried, and that was that.

IOW, Saborlas is right: a loving god won't torment his creation infinitely for a finite lifespan's worth of sins. The god of Christianity doesn't. The god of Christendom, OTOH, well, that's another story. ;-)


One that really gets under rabid fundies' skins is this: according to scripture, Jesus spent three days in hell.

Say what you may about religion but you certainly can't knock it for it's variety.

Personally, I cater to the Price Rite of religion.

OddOne: IOW, Saborlas is right: a loving god won't torment his creation infinitely for a finite lifespan's worth of sins. The god of Christianity doesn't. The god of Christendom, OTOH, well, that's another story. ;-)


One that really gets under rabid fundies' skins is this: according to scripture, Jesus spent three days in hell.

Let me guess, their reaction is denial.

Burn14Me: Yea but how does this relate to Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy? Surly with hell disproven, what hope do we have of their existence, perhaps of gods. O well, guess ima get back to watching terminator 2, need to brush up for the apocalypse. Maybe later i will play some AD&D now that it is okay.

AMC you heathen?

Vote No on 8. Yes on 2.

The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

/and like that *poof* he's gone

OddOne: Practically all of modern Christendom's (read: pseudo-Christian) views of hell are based directly on Dante's "Inferno," and not on actual scripture. Folks that have done the research without letting doctrinal preconceptions color their results inevitably come to the conclusion that there's no "hell" in the fire/brimstone sense, and that "hell" as was understood by Bible writers was actually transliterations from the terms used for simple gravesites as a collective. "Hell" wasn't a state of eternal torment, it was a person dead and buried, and that was that.

IOW, Saborlas is right: a loving god won't torment his creation infinitely for a finite lifespan's worth of sins. The god of Christianity doesn't. The god of Christendom, OTOH, well, that's another story. ;-)


One that really gets under rabid fundies' skins is this: according to scripture, Jesus spent three days in hell.

Yeah, I love bringing all that up to some of the fundies that seem to have never even opened a bible. Then, I tell them to be ashamed that I know more of their dogma than they do. Because, seriously. While I don't hate Christians, or spiritual people in general, I just get really irritated by the ignorance some of these "Christians" spout. Also, I'm pretty sure that the bible doesn't mention the rapture as God "beaming people up to heaven". My understanding is that it just says the faithful will go to heaven. Which means they'll die. Which points more to genocide than, you know, people just disappearing.

thisispete: Thus Hell, at least in Catholic belief, is eternal separation from God. The point isn't fire and torture, but eternal banishment from God's presence

I don't see him around here anywhere, so I can't exactly see this as a good *OR* bad thing.

/plate is hot

From the articles and papers I've read over the years from different sources, "God" is just a coglomeration of a number of pagan deities anyway. Hell, at one time he even had a wife by his side.

Saborlas: I cannot reconcile the existence of hell with the concept of a God that is kind, just, and loving.

If hell exists, God is evil. In which case we're all going to hell unless we do evil in his name. Which leads to suffering in hell being a badge of pride, as we took the difficult right over the easy wrong.

Meh, I'll conquer the place.



Congratulations. You are the first person to ever make me want to leave a thread before reading anything but the Boobies. I'm sure some one, somewhere, has told you all sorts of perfectly logical things about God. I'm sure you have your reasons. I'm sure you think I am evil or helping the elderly and spreading the word of forgiveness. I really hope that one day you come around. good luck taking over though, as I understand the place is too hot most of the year and too hot the rest of the year. I hope you have a nice life, because if you hold such beliefs dear as you claim, then thats all you have coming. God pity your soul. Just know that God loves you despite all your sins and it is never too late.

/thanks for not being condescending of our beliefs.
//Impressed with the over-all lack of flaming (as a whole) in this thread

Well this is actually interesting to me: a guy with an ordinary blue-collar job has written a 500-page book on a profound philosophical topic. Also, he is shedding some of the obvious unreason of the Bronze Age cult beliefs we have inherited.

This is pretty neat. I'm sorry if this has made some of his friends unhappy.

tonguedepressor: Burn14Me: Yea but how does this relate to Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy? Surly with hell disproven, what hope do we have of their existence, perhaps of gods. O well, guess ima get back to watching terminator 2, need to brush up for the apocalypse. Maybe later i will play some AD&D now that it is okay.

AMC you heathen?

youbetcha!

Where do they get the fuel for all the fires? Why did God lease out the space to Satan? Was he banished there and just made the best of it? If eternal life is the ultimate personal goal of Christians, why do they bestow it on their enemies?

//Milton says he just found it, but Milton is fanfic.

hyperspacemonkey
Why the fark is this douche getting a whole newspaper article, with no experts like professors, archaeologists, etc., being consulted?


I took the article more to be about the fact that he's an evangelical Christian. He's not out there trying to disprove God, he seems to be going more for a reformation of Christianity.

Which is probably why he got the equivalent of an excommunication from his church. Reform is the enemy of orthodoxy and all that.

Hozark
Saborlas:
If hell exists, God is evil. In which case we're all going to hell unless we do evil in his name. Which leads to suffering in hell being a badge of pride, as we took the difficult right over the easy wrong.

Meh, I'll conquer the place.


Congratulations. You are the first person to ever make me want to leave a thread before reading anything but the Boobies.

I hope you have a nice life, because if you hold such beliefs dear as you claim, then thats all you have coming. God pity your soul. Just know that God loves you despite all your sins and it is never too late.

That's weird. I thought his post was kind of a sarcastic, subtle dig at nihilism, not Christianity.

mom_dropped_me: Hell, at one time he even had a wife by his side.

And now all he has is a baby mama.



/hotlinked? Of course

yelmrog: Hozark
Saborlas:
If hell exists, God is evil. In which case we're all going to hell unless we do evil in his name. Which leads to suffering in hell being a badge of pride, as we took the difficult right over the easy wrong.

Meh, I'll conquer the place.


Congratulations. You are the first person to ever make me want to leave a thread before reading anything but the Boobies.

I hope you have a nice life, because if you hold such beliefs dear as you claim, then thats all you have coming. God pity your soul. Just know that God loves you despite all your sins and it is never too late.

That's weird. I thought his post was kind of a sarcastic, subtle dig at nihilism, not Christianity.

Same here, maybe I'm tired, but it really didn't strike me as a dig at Xtianity.

/Ramen

Hozark:

Why are you so sensitive? Is your hold on faith so tenuous? He was just clowning around, there's no need to get a crucifix up your butt about it.

From TFA:

"...eventually they told me I was not allowed to talk to my friends in the congregation about these findings..."

Pretty much sums it all up, doesn't it? "Pastors & leaders" stating that he should not repeat what he discovered to anyone in the congregation? Wouldn't wanna spook the herd...

This headline hurt my head

colatf: Hozark:

Why are you so sensitive? Is your hold on faith so tenuous? He was just clowning around, there's no need to get a crucifix up your butt about it.

So is that a quote or do you just love you some italics?

colatf: there's no need to get a crucifix up your butt about it.

Some people are into that.

InternationalShoe: colatf: Hozark:

Why are you so sensitive? Is your hold on faith so tenuous? He was just clowning around, there's no need to get a crucifix up your butt about it.

So is that a quote or do you just love you some italics?

I messed up my html. I tried to comment, but flood protection stopped me, and I gave up.

colatf: I messed up my html. I tried to comment about it, but flood protection stopped me, and I gave up.

FTFM. I picked the wrong week to stop main-veining communion wine.