The anesthesiologist?

His license lapsed in January? Did they mean "lapsed", as in some previous January, or "will lapse", as in some future one?

That's a fairly significant conjugation.

Actually, I'm surprised the doc got a swig in before the woman put him in a deathlock screaming "GIMME THAT FARKING BOURBON!!!"

/one person's drink is another person's anesthetic.

Or maybe this guy...

Call my father down here and if I'm drunker than him I'll quit.

that would have been a hell of a simulpost!

Oh come on, it's not that hard to do an epidural. I have a kit sitting in my car right now.

/just jokes, folks.
//although I do have an epidural kit in my car
///when society collapses and you need a spinal tap, you'll be begging for me
////will tap for bourbon

...and proceeded to lie on the table.

I think I'd rather have the booze than an epidural... Actually, any Mr. Science Farkers know if you can do that? Seems like it's pretty late in the game for it to be harmful to the kid if you're already in labor and you don't get absolutely plastered. Just, y'know, take the edge off...

Why is it that when doctors pull this kind of stunt, they don't lose their license for good? It seems like in most occupations where the safety of the public is at risk, you lose your license for puling a stunt like this.

The Dr. that delivered my son was plastered.
Cocksucker gave my ex the worlds worst C-section scar, and left her hospitalized for 2 weeks after the procedure.
The nurses all knew he was drunk, but did nothing to intervene.

Fortunately my son was born healthy.

remember everyone, Drs. are god's gift to the world, Don't ever second quess them or question their authortie!

Brisketeer: Why is it that when doctors pull this kind of stunt, they don't lose their license for good? It seems like in most occupations where the safety of the public is at risk, you lose your license for puling a stunt like this.

Americans with Disability Act.
Alcoholism is a disability. Therefore if he is getting treatment he can practice.
/hey, it works for every other field. Why not medicine?

HystericalParoxysm: I think I'd rather have the booze than an epidural... Actually, any Mr. Science Farkers know if you can do that? Seems like it's pretty late in the game for it to be harmful to the kid if you're already in labor and you don't get absolutely plastered. Just, y'know, take the edge off...

In terms of embryonic development, there's little at that point. However, it's basically the same as giving your newborn a slug of liquor in its bottle, since until it has been disconnected, your alcohol is its alcohol. If you're cool with that, then yeah, no problem.

Dinty Moore's Law: The Dr. that delivered my son was plastered.
Cocksucker gave my ex the worlds worst C-section scar, and left her hospitalized for 2 weeks after the procedure.
The nurses all knew he was drunk, but did nothing to intervene.

Fortunately my son was born healthy.

Uh, why didn't you stop the Doctor???

Feltonl: remember everyone, Drs. are god's gift to the world, Don't ever second quess them or question their authortie!

At least he didn't go to the University of Kentucky (If cauterized uteruses are taboo at your office, it's NSFW)

Andralynn: Dinty Moore's Law: The Dr. that delivered my son was plastered.
Cocksucker gave my ex the worlds worst C-section scar, and left her hospitalized for 2 weeks after the procedure.
The nurses all knew he was drunk, but did nothing to intervene.

Fortunately my son was born healthy.

Uh, why didn't you stop the Doctor???

this

HystericalParoxysm: I think I'd rather have the booze than an epidural... Actually, any Mr. Science Farkers know if you can do that? Seems like it's pretty late in the game for it to be harmful to the kid if you're already in labor and you don't get absolutely plastered. Just, y'know, take the edge off...

Ina May Gaskin - one of the leaders of modern midwifery - used to have her labouring patients to drink some wine, coolers, or mixed drinks to help relax. I've always thought a glass of red wine at the onset of labour would be nice.

Dark, rich beer is also considered great to help a mother's milk come in.

/Pregnant farkettes, read Ina May's Guide to Childbirth for an eye-opener.

Drinking alcohol right before the baby is born is not bad ...oh wait... you meant for the mother. Of course that would be wrong.

MidnightSkulker:
/Pregnant farkettes, read Ina May's Guide to Childbirth for an eye-opener.


Thanks for the link - looks interesting. :)

Dinty Moore's Law: The Dr. that delivered my son was plastered.
Cocksucker gave my ex the worlds worst C-section scar, and left her hospitalized for 2 weeks after the procedure.
The nurses all knew he was drunk, but did nothing to intervene.

Fortunately my son was born healthy.

Really sorry to hear that. Hopefully some of it can be repaired with plastic surgery. The scars that my mom has are one of the many reasons I will not be having children myself. She has a 20 inch scar horizontal for me and a second one perpendicular to that one from my brother.

To be honest I found the comments more interesting to read than the article! Good job guys :-)

I know you're mad, Dinty Moore's Law, but your link won't make the mods happy

unavailable for comment

Andralynn:

Uh, why didn't you stop the Doctor???

Didn't see him 'til after the surgery.

A day of hormonal, pregnant women from dusk til dawn...

...I ain't saying its right...Just that I understand.

/I've had family Christmas like this that...found my dad and brother in law hiding out in the basement with a bottle of scotch. But then we weren't birthin' no babies, Ms. Scarlet.

That's how you get em pregnant, not how you pop the bun out of the oven.


/really people, doesn't anyone study anymore?

Rats, I was hoping for an article to validate my secret wish to give birth drunk and high.

SO much cheaper than those narcos they give you at the hospital. Plus I know I won't be having any reactions.

Not to be a wanker, but I would think it would be bad for a woman who is going to be bleeding from childbirth to drink alcohol, which is a blood thinner.

/is about to start drinking

Samsaran: Why is pregnancy so damned complicated? Years ago, I delivered a baby while the woman was in the backseat of her car, all alone, the baby was crowning and only kept in place by her panties. I knew if I put in a call for Paramedics that the infant would be in distress before they got there, so I ripped the panties off and in less than five minutes I had a handful of screaming new born. It was winter so I wrapped the, now steaming, infant in my $800.00 Camels Hair jacket. This kid would be about 25 now.

It is true that 90% of pregnancies are uncomplicated and are basically little more than a messy game of "Catch". However, society has decided that a 10% complication rate which can lead to a 2-3% maternal/fetal mortality rate is unacceptable, and the means necessary to keep that number down is what leads to elevated rates of C-Sections, and the ACOG still recommending that deliveries be done in hospitals. Like anything else, it's easy to get to a "pretty good" rate of success, but it's costly to get to perfection, or at least as close as possible.

Samsaran: This Doctor, this human being, is suffering from a debilitating illness. However, alcoholism, while a life destroying addiction, does NOT insulate the sufferer from responsibility for his actions carried out under the influence of alcohol. This man needs to obtain treatment of some kind, medical treatment, AA, therapy ... whatever works for him. Without it he will surely die and perhaps, God forbid, take an innocent with him.

/hopes he gets the help he needs

Well, to hear the yoyo's at AA, personal responsibility goes out the window if you're an alkie. You're powerless & all that. That's why so many people are recovering addicts. Cause you're no longer responsible for ANYTHING.

I hate recovering addicts with all my heart.

/I'm a recovered addict myself. Recovered. With an "ed".

Samsaran: Gyrfalcon: You're powerless & all that. That's why so many people are recovering addicts

You misunderstand the concept of "powerlessness". You are only powerless over alcohol meaning you cannot drink even causally. AA is all about personal responsibility, note the 4th, 5th, 8th and 9th steps.

Addicts are indeed powerless in the sense that for a true alcoholic, complete abstinence is the only way to remain sober. Distinguish this from "problem drinkers" who screw up when they drink but lack the physical problem of addiction. This is not an AA thing. It has been recognized since the time of Galen, 2500 years ago, that a small minority of drinkers have a physical reaction to alcohol that renders them unable to simply stop.

F.O. Bill?

Approves!

I wonder how many pregnancies are started with booze compared to those ended with booze.

Samsaran: Why is pregnancy so damned complicated? Years ago, I delivered a baby while the woman was in the backseat of her car, all alone, the baby was crowning and only kept in place by her panties. I knew if I put in a call for Paramedics that the infant would be in distress before they got there, so I ripped the panties off and in less than five minutes I had a handful of screaming new born. It was winter so I wrapped the, now steaming, infant in my $800.00 Camels Hair jacket. This kid would be about 25 now.

Money. Doctors make money convincing women that they need help to do something natural. I'm Canadian, so medicine isn't AS financially-based as it is in the US, but there's still good money in being an OB. With over 95% of women birthing their babies in hospitals, they've got a huge demand.

Also, C-sections and inductions are better for the doctor's schedule. There's days (i.e. December 24th) where inductions spike, and I'm doubting it's because lots of women are in serious medical need of an induction on that one day.

Intervention leads to intervention.
Pitocin -> distress -> C-section.
Epidural -> slow labour -> pitocin -> distress -> C-section.

Those aren't 'rules' but just common occurences. I had an epidural with my son, and birthed in hospital (with a midwife.) His heartbeat dropped with each contractions, which is *normal* considering my cervix was squishing his head - but a lot of doctors will call that an emergency then do a c-section.

A c-section takes less than an hour. Natural labour has no time limit. Doctors don't like unpredictability.

There definitely are women who need help with pregnancy and childbirth, and for those it is awesome that the help is available to ensure they/their babies make it. BUT the vast majority of women need no interventions whatsoever. Certainly, epidurals are nice and should be offered, but they should be offered with the explicit understanding that an epidural makes you much more likely to end up with a c-section.

Midwives have lower C-section and complication rates than OBs (that's just in the 'low risk' groups, since midwives do not take high risk patients) which definitely shows that there's something wrong with a medical approach to a naturally healthy condition.

Check out The Business of Being Born (available free on many sites - just google it.)

/Canadians - Midwifery is paid by the province in Ontario, Quebec, and BC.

I delivered my sister's baby in her bathtub. As soon as we knew she was in labor, we called the doctor. Doctor told us she was probably dehydrated and to get her into a bath. Fifteen minutes later, I was catching a baby.

I sure could have used a drink at that point.

SAvoodoo: Andralynn: Dinty Moore's Law: The Dr. that delivered my son was plastered.
Cocksucker gave my ex the worlds worst C-section scar, and left her hospitalized for 2 weeks after the procedure.
The nurses all knew he was drunk, but did nothing to intervene.

Fortunately my son was born healthy.

Uh, why didn't you stop the Doctor???

this

Not all hospitals will let Dad be there for the C section. I was told I'll be booted if it's an emergency C. But let them try.

On the plus side we have a great OB and even if he's out, the hospital's a good one, much loved by all. And if someone shows up drunk they're goin out the sixth floor window.

/itg

MidnightSkulker: Intervention leads to intervention.
Pitocin -> distress -> C-section.
Epidural -> slow labour -> pitocin -> distress -> C-section.

After three contractions, my water broke at 8:22 on a Thursday night. I called the doc, got the husband home, took a quick shower because I hadn't had one since sleeping under huge blankets all day and cooking dinner, and the cousin-in-law drove us to the hospital. I made sure I had a dozen towels just in case, to preserve his car's interior.

I felt no contractions whatsoever all night, and it was decided that if I didn't kick it into gear myself by 6, I'd be getting pitocin. So when they checked my blood pressure at 4, I got up and tried walking up and down corridors to "get things going" and nothing happened. They started the drip at about six. I don't remember when I started noticing it, but I vaguely think they cranked it up because by about 11 I was having crazy huge contractions, 90 seconds contraction, 30 second recovery. They adjusted the drip, but I don't remember much of the day. Doc arrived around 6ish (coincidentally after office hours) and she encouraged different positions when she stopped in. Around 9ish, the necessity of a c section started coming up. I think the phrasing was that "Okay, she's getting a little stressed. If she doesn't come out in the next couple pushes...." So yeah. I pushed harder than I ever thought I could, and she came out. Voila!

But I can't help thinking that the pitocin drip was directly related to the relation between my labor progress vs. the time between my doctor's office close time and the time my doc wanted to get home to her family.

st.theresa: MidnightSkulker: Intervention leads to intervention.
Pitocin -> distress -> C-section.
Epidural -> slow labour -> pitocin -> distress -> C-section.

After three contractions, my water broke at 8:22 on a Thursday night. I called the doc, got the husband home, took a quick shower because I hadn't had one since sleeping under huge blankets all day and cooking dinner, and the cousin-in-law drove us to the hospital. I made sure I had a dozen towels just in case, to preserve his car's interior.

I felt no contractions whatsoever all night, and it was decided that if I didn't kick it into gear myself by 6, I'd be getting pitocin. So when they checked my blood pressure at 4, I got up and tried walking up and down corridors to "get things going" and nothing happened. They started the drip at about six. I don't remember when I started noticing it, but I vaguely think they cranked it up because by about 11 I was having crazy huge contractions, 90 seconds contraction, 30 second recovery. They adjusted the drip, but I don't remember much of the day. Doc arrived around 6ish (coincidentally after office hours) and she encouraged different positions when she stopped in. Around 9ish, the necessity of a c section started coming up. I think the phrasing was that "Okay, she's getting a little stressed. If she doesn't come out in the next couple pushes...." So yeah. I pushed harder than I ever thought I could, and she came out. Voila!

But I can't help thinking that the pitocin drip was directly related to the relation between my labor progress vs. the time between my doctor's office close time and the time my doc wanted to get home to her family.



I think you just described the next snickers commercial.

Not going anywhere for a while?

Friends don't let friends drill into their spines drunk.

I've had more epidurals than any mere woman.

Last time I went to the doctor to get an epidural, I said NO to the painkillers and valium, pulled my shirt up and said "Let's do this biatch!"
The doc stuck it in my vertebrae, delivered the meds and pulled out. I got out of there in minutes flat. If the doctor had been drunk I would have done the whole thing myself.

Dinty Moore's Law: Andralynn:

Uh, why didn't you stop the Doctor???

Didn't see him 'til after the surgery.

Why wouldn't you have been in the room for it?

I was there for the C-section for kiddo #1, and didn't let that little tyke out of my sight.

#2 was a home birth, and the midwives made sure I was part of the whole thing.

Glad I didn't miss any of it.

greyspace: I've had more epidurals than any mere woman.

Last time I went to the doctor to get an epidural, I said NO to the painkillers and valium, pulled my shirt up and said "Let's do this biatch!"
The doc stuck it in my vertebrae, delivered the meds and pulled out. I got out of there in minutes flat. If the doctor had been drunk I would have done the whole thing myself.

"What's your hobby?"

"I get epidurals."

"Cool, man, cool."

MidnightSkulker:
Intervention leads to intervention.
Pitocin -> distress -> C-section.
Epidural -> slow labour -> pitocin -> distress -> C-section.

Those aren't 'rules' but just common occurences. I had an epidural with my son, and birthed in hospital (with a midwife.) His heartbeat dropped with each contractions, which is *normal* considering my cervix was squishing his head - but a lot of doctors will call that an emergency then do a c-section.
... Certainly, epidurals are nice and should be offered, but they should be offered with the explicit understanding that an epidural makes you much more likely to end up with a c-section.


The statistics do not support your claims. Epidurals do not slow labor, and they do not increase the need for C sections. They do, however, make C sections safer if you do need one.

/anesthesia resident

Riffington: The statistics do not support your claims. Epidurals do not slow labor, and they do not increase the need for C sections. They do, however, make C sections safer if you do need one.

Actually, the statistics do support the claims, but they are often explained away as being correlated with other complications within the birth experience; one possible population that strongly links epiduals with increased c-sections is the "quality" of institution or practitioner.

Basically, if you decide to get an epidural because your labor is going poorly, you may be getting a c-section *because* your labor is going poorly, but the epidural didn't cause it. It's counterinutitive to me because with an epidural you can't move and alternative positioning should be extremely helpful with natural labor, so I don't feel comfortable that it's all just covariance or dependence.

Those factors disappear when you do good studies. With prospective randomized trials, there is no difference in C section rate or speed of labor.

Anim-Somuah, M, Smyth, R, Howell, C. Epidural versus non-epidural or no analgesia in labour. Cochrane Database Syst Rev 2005

AU Zhang J, Klebanoff MA, DerSimonian R Epidural analgesia in association with duration of labor and mode of delivery: a quantitative review. SO Am J Obstet Gynecol 1999 Apr;180(4):970-7.

Riffington, you rock! Thanks for the citations. (Anesthesiology attending; what program are you at?)

HystericalParoxysm 2008-09-07 05:39:36 PM
I think I'd rather have the booze than an epidural... Actually, any Mr. Science Farkers know if you can do that? Seems like it's pretty late in the game for it to be harmful to the kid if you're already in labor and you don't get absolutely plastered. Just, y'know, take the edge off...

One more comment on alcohol during labor: in the past ethyl alcohol has been given both orally and IV as a tocolytic, or drug to slow down or halt labor. So if you REALLY enjoy being in labor, drink up! You're going to be there a long time.