Penis.

The Bastard: I think there's a lot more going on here than just abstinence only, donchu think?

Says you, ya bastard!

HAHAHAHA!

submitter: "I know it will be hard."

Oh, yes. Yes it will.

Heh. Everyone I ever met from Iowa was a complete perv.

When I was at St. Xavier (all male Jesuit high-school in Cincinnati), our sister schools used to be filled with females like this. They were very conservative, religious, and took it in the ass and gave head endlessly, yet still claimed to be virgins. I'm always suspicious of these so-called virgins. Often it's like men who have non-homosexual sex with other dudes.

Subby -- +1

I did a lot of things before I started considering myself anything other than a virgin.

and the rates for teen pregnancy in Iowa are?

The Bastard: I think there's a lot more going on here than just abstinence only, donchu think?

Is Haley a boy or a girl?

*checks the article*

I practiced abstinence for 18 years.
Not by choice, mind you....

I don't understand what abstinence 'eduction' means? Isn't it just saying "don't have sex"? When else is there to it.?

"I know it will be hard."

That's what she said.

Penn & Teller

Leiterfluid: "I know it will be hard."

That's what she said.

damn you, you beat me to it! hahahah, i applaud you though.

\stupidest phrase ever
\\and yet hillarious if the circumstances are right

Heroic Poser: I practiced abstinence for 18 years.
Not by choice, mind you....

Bah, I never had to practice abstinence.

/naturally gifted at it

+5 subby yar

DamnYankees: I don't understand what abstinence 'eduction' means? Isn't it just saying "don't have sex"? When else is there to it.?

It's basically another well-meaning program hijacked by fundamentalist Christians. Abstinence is, by any definition, the best way not to get sexual diseases and not to get pregnant, and for many people a good sexual lifestyle.

But right-wingers decided to take abstinence education and retool it into propaganda "education" that attempts to get people to live by the Bible, i.e., don't have sex before marriage. They try to back up this idea with "scientific" evidence which is often faulty. One Christian abstinence educator once claimed that sex is "at its absolute best when done after marriage" (paraphrase). Right-wingers also attempt to discredit any means of safe sex by claiming condoms don't work, sexual diseases can be passed on in ways not even God could accomplish, and basically scaring the bejeesus out of youngsters about sex.

In other words, Christian sex education is like intelligent design: it's less like education about the topic and more like a retarded, baseless attack what that topic disagrees with.

Methinks that someone needs to explain to her that girl-on-girl action is sex.

TFA: Eccles said the lessons steer clear of morality, instead focusing on the consequences of premarital sex: disease, teen pregnancy and regret.

The philosophy that has been in place for 7 years has resulted in record numbers of STD infections, so the solution is more abstinence only education?

YOU AREN'T BEING ABSTINENT HARD ENOUGH!

The philosophy that has been in place for 7 years has resulted in record numbers of STD infections, so the solution is more abstinence only education?

YOU AREN'T BEING ABSTINENT HARD ENOUGH!

Disease

that chick couldn't get laid with a hundred dollar bill hanging out of her zipper

So when did we decide to establish the 1984-esque Junior Anti-Sex League?

It's a well-known fact that one of the prime reasons for marriages failing is sexual difficulties...and there are a lot of marriages out there that are still together, but unhappy, due to sexual difficulties. (See: The Sex-Starved Marriage (pops) by Michelle Weiner-Davis. Been there, done that!) By indoctrinating kids against sex so heavily, aren't we encouraging the development of sexual hang-ups that will hurt their later marriages and relationships?

those fundamentalist Christians should know that Abstinence is only 99.9% effective. stop lying to your sons and daughters and tell them they can still get knocked up. sex in the ear is still the safest way.

SilentStrider: and the rates for teen pregnancy in Iowa are?

They're 16th in the nation.

They can claim anything they want. The facts say they are wrong. Teen pregnancy rates are now increasing under the "abstinence-only" education rule, after years of declining when comprehensive sex education was taught.



And dubya lies about it (new window)
The stats are in there if you read (new window)

The United States has the highest teen pregnancy rate in the western world, despite the fact that our teens are not more sexually active than Swedish teens, or Canadian teens, or British teens.

Why? Because we don't educate about birth control in sex education classes, we don't discuss it at home, we don't give teens good access to it, and we don't advertise it in our media. Other countries do, and they are rewarded with low rates of teen pregnancy and teen abortions.
(new window)

Just let them do what all Christian abstinence-oriented teens do: anal.

Why is virginity so over-rated in these abstinence-only groups? My wife and I certainly weren't virgins when we started going out, and neither did we give a shiat about it to begin with. Must have been something do do with me drifting away from my religious upbringing when I started to realize that organized religion is mainly full of shiat.

As for the "people prefer to marry virgins" argument touted about in my Catholic school days (and probably most other Chriatian-based groups for that matter), I call bullshiat. I had sex with both virgin and non-virgin women. Didn't make any difference when it comes to in-bed performance. Of course, your mileage may vary. Personally, I would have rather been with someone with experience than a virgin who has no clue what the fark they are doing.

My kids are going to learn about birth control whether the school wants them to or not. If the schools won't teach safe sex, then its up to the parents.

FTFA: The group trains teachers, maps out lesson plans and provides classroom speakers, including teenagers who have pledged to say no to sex until they have said "I do."

But gay men and lesbians can't get married in Iowa.

I'm all for abstinence and celibacy if that is what you want to do. Hey, its your body, and no one should disrupt your plans for it. Everybody has their own trip.

Erbo: By indoctrinating kids against sex so heavily, aren't we encouraging the development of sexual hang-ups that will hurt their later marriages and relationships?

It seems that there's always something or other that gets a fundie's knickers in a twist.

Fundie: I want America to be the greatest nation in the world!

Dude: Okay, then let's give equal rights to all...

Fundie: No, don't give it to women or homosexuals or non-Christians. Only to traditional families!

Dude: Um...okay? So a traditional family, with a traditional school and...

Fundie: What? They teach lesbianism and evolution there! My kids must be home-schooled!

Dude: Okay, okay, fine. So we need to keep these families together from day one. I hear strong sexual relations...

Fundie: No sex before marriage!

Dude: Er...all right. Then we need comprehensive sexual education...

Fundie: Abstinence only! Anything else is of the devil!

Dude: Chill out. But that means a rise in premarital sex if we do that, so we'll see a rise in abortions...

Fundie: Do you dare speak of the modern day Holocaust?

Dude: Motherf...

Fundie: Clean up your language! You are not allowed to say that on television!

Dude: ...I need a drink...

Fundie: No alcohol!

Dude: You make me want to put a bullet through your brain!

Fundie: You want a gun? I got plenty in my grandfather's arsenal...

Oh, and this:

Sex Infections Found in Quarter of Teenage Girls
Nearly half the African-Americans in the study of teenagers ages 14 to 19 were infected (^)

I analyzed a bunch of the federally-funded abstinence-only programs for a grad school class, and so much of what they taught was either demonstrably wrong or opinion stated as fact. My personal favorite was one curricula that had a handout with a giant thermometer printed on it. At the base of the thermometer was "Holding Hands," and each marking was a progressively more intimate act up to "Sexual Intercourse" at the top. The warning at the bottom of the page was "Once the temperature starts to rise, it won't stop!" (or something to that effect).

I can just imagine some uber-Christian teenage couple giving in to the temptation to hold hands, and then saying "Oh well, now that we've started down the slippery slope, we might as well fark each other." I mean, WTF? Do the people who write these things have so little self-control that once they feel the first hint of temptation, they'll just go all to hell? Sounds like YOUR problem, buster, not mine.

kteela: Heh. Everyone I ever met from Iowa was a complete perv.

Iowan.

/Complete perv
//My wife will back me on this.

I have a good friend who lives in Iowa, and she constantly tells me about how many of her friends are getting pregnant. Real effective over there.

Astronymous: I have a good friend who lives in Iowa, and she constantly tells me about how many of her friends are getting pregnant. Real effective over there.

thanks for the anecdotal evidence... very helpful.

Why not tell kids: "abstinence is the way to go, but if you do have sex, use a condom"?

That's what my private CHRISTIAN high school taught.........

the abstinence program at our school was ugly girls

DamnYankees: I don't understand what abstinence 'eduction' means? Isn't it just saying "don't have sex"? When else is there to it.?

Well not with 14 year olds when you're 40. That would be Pedo-bear territory. You might want to check that.

They gave free condoms out at my school's guidance. For a crappy public school, no one ever got pregnant.

Abstinence-only education is like Communism. The intentions are noble, the theory sounds good, but it all falls apart when human nature comes into play - and especially so when implemented in a totalitarian fashion on people who don't individually consent to be controlled by it.

Funnily enough, now that I'm older and way past that American Pie "getting laid is everything" stage of life, I can actually see the value in abstinance. And it's easy to be suckered into thinking that the kids should be "banned" from having sex for their own good, which is what abstinence-only education really is: a prohibitionist mindset. And it basically fails for similar reasons that the prohibition and communism failed. Any theoretical social construction which goes against the grain of what a particular society wants, and indeed, what human nature desires, is bound to end up a steaming pile of fail.

OK, so I had what passes for high school sex ed in Iowa seven years ago. It was mainly fear tactics, and I was scared shiatless of sex (not wholly due to the sex ed, but it didn't help). I was a virgin until my sophomore year of college when I started going out with the guy I'm now married to (who, incidentally, went to the high school mentioned in the article), but I certainly didn't plan it that way. I was just plain scared shiatless: too many variables all seemingly ending in certain disaster.

I think now that it's like guns or knives or power tools- you've got to have a healthy respect and appropriate knowledge. If someone handed me an electric drill and told me, "If you use this drill, and it jumps out of your hand, it'll scar you for life! Don't strip out the screws, because doing that even once can ruin the drill. And if you even think of using it without safety glasses, even once, you're going to wind up blind!"

No one does this. They say, "Here, this is a drill. You push this button to turn it on, and this is how you screw things. Keep a good steady hand on it, and remember it takes practice. Make sure you're wearing glasses when you're doing this because if things go wrong, these will probably protect your eyes so you don't get hurt."

My sex ed experiences tended to be the former. Abstinence education seems that it can only be worse than what's already being offered.

A friend of mine recently drove through Iowa with his girlfriend on the way to visit some old friends where he used to live.

On the way through, they were so bored with the state that they apparently pulled into a rest area and had sex in his car.

"It was the only way to make the state even remotely interesting," he told me.

Abstinence only programs deny the ability of sexually-active minors to actually make informed consent. By not telling them the risks, safety measures, and teaching comprehensively, these idiots are putting kids at incredible risk, to say nothing of the correlation locally at the county level between higher abortion rates and abstinence-only sex-ed. Not telling your kids about the landmine field next door won't protect them from it.

Guma: the abstinence program at our school was ugly girls

Alcohol and/or paper bag over her head and yours. Or just doggy style.

Good. more poor little shiats who can donate their earnings to my government retirement fund.

Your Company's Computer Guy: kteela: Heh. Everyone I ever met from Iowa was a complete perv.

Iowan.

/Complete perv
//My wife will back me on this.

Pix or GTFO.

/Iowan
//Fairly serious perv

Melgania: Abstinence-only education is like Communism. The intentions are noble, the theory sounds good, but it all falls apart when human nature comes into play - and especially so when implemented in a totalitarian fashion on people who don't individually consent to be controlled by it.

Funnily enough, now that I'm older and way past that American Pie "getting laid is everything" stage of life, I can actually see the value in abstinance. And it's easy to be suckered into thinking that the kids should be "banned" from having sex for their own good, which is what abstinence-only education really is: a prohibitionist mindset. And it basically fails for similar reasons that the prohibition and communism failed. Any theoretical social construction which goes against the grain of what a particular society wants, and indeed, what human nature desires, is bound to end up a steaming pile of fail.

Ayup. It boggles the mind how many conservatives who believe unquestioningly in "the free market," free will, and the inability of government to plan social behavior think that they can reduce teen sex by telling them it's "cool" to wait until marriage, and withhold any embarassing talk about condoms and the pill.

fluffy2097: Good. more poor little shiats who can donate their earnings to my government retirement fund.

Teen pregnancy babies are more likely to drain the system than contribute to it. If the mother isn't responsible enough to care properly for a child, and the pregnancy "ruined her life," chances are little Dylan or Kristal aren't going to be the hope for America's future.