Can we sell Michigan to Canada for -$2,000,000,000?

In all fairness, he hasn't graduated from evil genius school just yet... damn, interns.

The overhaul of Michigan's political structure contained in a proposed constitutional amendment targeted for the November election was designed to allow Democrats control of all branches of state government and the redistricting process, according to a presentation that surfaced today.

The Democrat Party is always trying to disenfranchise people or rig the process. They fear a fair election when there is a chance they will actually have to compete with people who lack resources.

It must be fun to be legal when your gang is part of THE gang that decides the law.

Suicidal Writer: The Democrat Party is always trying to disenfranchise people or rig the process. They fear a fair election when there is a chance they will actually have to compete with people who lack resources.

The Republicans have used similar tactics here in Pennsylvania. The more things change, yadda yadda.

I am just shocked...SHOCKED I tell ya!

Weaver95: The Republicans have used similar tactics here in Pennsylvania. The more things change, yadda yadda.

Which makes the problem worse. Such things have come to be expected out of Republicans. "But Republicans do it also" is not a valid excuse...unless the goal is to top the Republicans in the political sub-fields of corruption, ineptitude, and groupthink. Of course, neither The Democrat Party nor The Republican Party is really the problem: the American Voter is.

Suicidal Writer: Weaver95: The Republicans have used similar tactics here in Pennsylvania. The more things change, yadda yadda.

Which makes the problem worse. Such things have come to be expected out of Republicans. "But Republicans do it also" is not a valid excuse...unless the goal is to top the Republicans in the political sub-fields of corruption, ineptitude, and groupthink. Of course, neither The Democrat Party nor The Republican Party is really the problem: the American Voter is.

I absolutely agree.

Suicidal Writer: Such things have come to be expected out of Republicans.

And yet you grant Republicans the courtesy of using their correct name - a courtesy which you do not extend to members of the "Democrat party."

/The particular Democrats involved in this incident are evil, stupid, or both.

Not surprised. Doesn't make it any better.

I'm looking forward to seeing how someone manages to blame this on Fox News.

/Personally thinks they're all crooks, its just who gets caught any given week.

BMulligan: Suicidal Writer: Such things have come to be expected out of Republicans.

And yet you grant Republicans the courtesy of using their correct name - a courtesy which you do not extend to members of the "Democrat party."

It's expected from the Republics.

Lithanus

I'm looking forward to seeing how someone manages to blame this as the top story for a month on Fox News.

Fixed for accuracy.

Michigan State Senate Independents^TM suck.

FTA: The documents were located on a UAW Web site by an intern working on a research project for the Midland-based free market think tank, the Mackinac Center, said center official Patrick Wright.

Why do I find the origin of this PowerPoint presentation questionable since it was allegedly found by some intern at a "free market think tank?"

Meet Mackinac Center Labor Research Intern Jim Vote, the man who found the goods.

Need to attend the Tom Delay school of power consolidation. Worked in Texas.

The two party system is only dragging our election out into a lengthy fiasco when the winner was practically declared weeks ago. Its a waste of time and money.

If Michigan does not want to play a role in simplifying the system then fark em. They are not a state that will matter when Obama wins the election.

Remember, it's only okay to be "independent" when you're...

*Sigh* when will Democrats learn that they simply will never be as good as playing dirty as Republicans? Clinton was okay, but come on, Dems ain't had shiat on the Reps since Nixon.

RemyDuron: *Sigh* when will Democrats learn that they simply will never be as good as playing dirty as Republicans? Clinton was okay, but come on, Dems ain't had shiat on the Reps since Nixon.

They do, but they don't try hard enough. Republicans can only win through dirty tactics so they have more practice.

Hideously Gigantic Smurf: Remember, it's only okay to be "independent" when you're...

Oh I am so stealing that.

Here. Steal this one in return.

All other things being equal, the party in power in a given state will be more corrupt than the party not in power. Thus, the Republicans are more corrupt in Texas, and the Dems are more corrupt in California.

And of course both sides try to scrounge every electoral advantage they can, regardless of which one's in power. And both work together to keep third parties down.

If I lived in Michigan, I'd be getting out there doing something about it. Let me know if you hear about the Democrats in Washington state pulling a stunt like this (honestly, I wouldn't be surprised).

Kuta 2008-07-18 07:05:05 PM
RemyDuron: *Sigh* when will Democrats learn that they simply will never be as good as playing dirty as Republicans? Clinton was okay, but come on, Dems ain't had shiat on the Reps since Nixon.

They do, but they don't try hard enough. Republicans can only win through dirty tactics so they have more practice.

If by "dirty tactics" you mean "revealing the truth about their opponents," then that's very true, and may there be more of it.

What's funny (not funny haha but funny peculiar) is that I earlier lampooned both sides. The [f]right wing will say they want nobody to vote (because high voter turnout, especially with the motivated turn to the left, does not favor them) and the left wingers will be convincing anyone either to vote for Obama, or to see how those independent choices (translation: Barr) is as good a vote for Reagan a Conservative will be getting (which is at least based on historical fact, not just a voiced concern-troll-opinion).

Waddaya know. I was correct again!

BMulligan: And yet you grant Republicans the courtesy of using their correct name - a courtesy which you do not extend to members of the "Democrat party."

but it's so fun trolling the pedants by calling it the democrat party


/democrat
//troll
///lulz before party

Lehk: but it's so fun trolling the pedants by calling it the democrat party

I've never understood the appeal of intentionally making oneself look like an idiot on the internet. I have one twisted sense of humor, but I still can't quite conceive how it is funny to post something idiotic, and get called an idiot for it. It's the internet equivalent of "made you look", which hasn't been funny since the third grade.

Thrag: Lehk: but it's so fun trolling the pedants by calling it the democrat party

I've never understood the appeal of intentionally making oneself look like an idiot on the internet. I have one twisted sense of humor, but I still can't quite conceive how it is funny to post something idiotic, and get called an idiot for it. It's the internet equivalent of "made you look", which hasn't been funny since the third grade.

it only affects the raeg hounds who bother to freak out over stupid shiat like that, and they seem to be more and more comming these days on the interbutts

Uh, pot to kettle...

after RTFA, and RTFT, I find no evidence whatever that anyone read the article in any depth or viewed the slide show. If they had, they would find that some 30+ years of nearly 100% GOP domination over Michigan politics, contrived via exactly the kind of tactics the nefarious democrats were contemplating/analyzing, according to the PP presentation.

In other words, the very tactics republican political strategists have so prominently employed to give us our current supremely competent honest and diligent national leadership, have been the rule in Michigan (and Oh, and Fl, and AZ, and...) for a good while now and as such have successfully biased the entire un democratic process to Replican favor. The powerpoint is about Michigan Dems turning the tables and doing legal and maybe even ethical things to reverse that process.

The basic issues are that gaming any system is possible, the GOP/young republicans (rove reed abramoff norquist) figured that out in the eighties, and have been applying it ever since, coming in to their own in the early mid nineties. The dems are starting, belatedly, to think that turn-about might be fair play. Oooo scary.

Ironically, many of the pillars in the program they are considering are critically important to honest elections, among them amongst others, audit able voting trails and neutral apportionment of voting districts (anti-gerrymandering).

Based on my read of the PP, the considered options would level a presently unfairly uneven playing field.

Based on my read of the Freep article, it is an old school, biased, unvarnished attack on the party not of their choice.

WTF I know this is FARK, but cmon...

/morans

Urmuf Hamer: WTF I know this is FARK, but cmon...

/morans

But but but... Fark Independents! Didn't you see the picture?! ANYONE WHO DISAGREES WITH DEMS ARE REPUBLICANS!@!!11!

jesmon421: Need to attend the Tom Delay school of power consolidation. Worked in Texas.

TBH, whichever party is in control gerrymanders Texas. The Democrats did it before the Republicans, and god knows who did it before them.

moothemagiccow: jesmon421: Need to attend the Tom Delay school of power consolidation. Worked in Texas.

TBH, whichever party is in control gerrymanders Texas. The Democrats did it before the Republicans, and god knows who did it before them.

The Whigs?

But the Democrat party has such a long and illustrious history of machine politics. They're just living up to the legacy of Daley, Tweed, and Long.

jjorsett: Kuta 2008-07-18 07:05:05 PM
RemyDuron: *Sigh* when will Democrats learn that they simply will never be as good as playing dirty as Republicans? Clinton was okay, but come on, Dems ain't had shiat on the Reps since Nixon.

They do, but they don't try hard enough. Republicans can only win through dirty tactics so they have more practice.

If by "dirty tactics" you mean "revealing the truth about their opponents," then that's very true, and may there be more of it.

Nah, dirty tactics like misleading would be voters, handing out registration forms that will be rejected, questionable results via Diebold. Not to mention the morally questionable but not illegal actions like fearmongering about foreigners, twisting religion to their purposes, and trying to appeal to the lowest common denominator.

And the Democrats do it too, they just don't do it as well. Maybe 50 years ago, but from the 70s on the Republicans have gotten dirty tricks down pat.

Basically, to praphrase Ira Glass from This American Life, the main difference between the Democrats and Republicans when it comes to vote fraud is scale, organization, and effectiveness. The Republicans have a lot more of all of those.

Ed Willy: moothemagiccow: jesmon421: Need to attend the Tom Delay school of power consolidation. Worked in Texas.

TBH, whichever party is in control gerrymanders Texas. The Democrats did it before the Republicans, and god knows who did it before them.

The Whigs?

We don't wear wigs in Texas. too hot.

eqtworld: I can't think of anything to say without at least partly using a cliche.

cunning plan, fail, it's a trap...that kind of thing

Your dog wants you to think your cunning FAIL trap all the way through?

But isn't the American government supposed to be under democratic control? Like, the hands of the people and...
Wait, wait a minute here...
SHENANAGINS! and not the resturant with the cheese sticks and the cooky stuff on the walls niether.

You know, Geroge Carlin said it best over here (new window)

Democrats, taking the moral and political high ground, defend this action by pointing out "bbb..b.but but, republican hate", "republicans do this better", "FOX NEWS!!!".

"Change" I can believe in.

Schwarzenegger stole the governor's seat because Ken Lay stole 17 billion dollars from California during the energy crisis and Bush inaugurated a Republican. I'm not saying whether or not I support the farkwad, but he did steal the election and was placed here by Bush. The wording may sound horrible, but not one iota of it is untrue.

dasqoot: Schwarzenegger stole the governor's seat because Ken Lay stole 17 billion dollars from California during the energy crisis and Bush inaugurated a Republican. I'm not saying whether or not I support the farkwad, but he did steal the election and was placed here by Bush. The wording may sound horrible, but not one iota of it is untrue.

Actually, Grey Davis, Democratic Presidential Hopeful, was a corrupt and incompetent twat.

http://www.reformmichigangovernmentnow.com/TheProposal.aspx

Seems like some good ideas...but I can easily see how with the right political influence you could completely guy the other side out of state gov't using "bipartisan" panels.

dasqoot: Schwarzenegger stole the governor's seat because Ken Lay stole 17 billion dollars from California during the energy crisis and Bush inaugurated a Republican. I'm not saying whether or not I support the farkwad, but he did steal the election and was placed here by Bush. The wording may sound horrible, but not one iota of it is untrue.



You mean republicans are stealing seats by holding elections and kicking out the incompetent farkwads running the state. Why, that's highway robbery.