Um, an opinion piece by someone other than an editor is not and editorial, dumbmitter.

Campaign Econ is certainly understandable. Gas prices are ruining vacation plans and killing businesses. Many Americans have lost or are about to lose their homes to foreclosure or in distress sales. The federal government may not be talking about it much yet, but inflation plagues the country. The weak dollar is altering our everyday calculations. For many, this is not a happy summer.

I could give two craps about the whole rule that a recession requires two quarters of negative growth to be "official." The dollar is shiat, gay prices are through the roof, and we're going through a housing crisis.

If it's not a recession, and it's not a depression, is there at least some term we can use to describe how farked everyone feels?

Bloody William:gay prices are through the roof

Exactly! You used to get two bears and a worked out gym bunny for the price of a twink in today's market.

equilibrium:Bloody William:gay prices are through the roof

Exactly! You used to get two bears and a worked out gym bunny for the price of a twink in today's market.

Damn, I tossed you a typo and you SPIKED that mother.

FTA:She recently spoke at a meeting hosted by the Mercatus Center and the Texas Public Policy Foundation, which is chaired by Wendy Gramm, wife of Phil Gramm.

No bias there.

Let them eat cake!

This is the same woman who claims 1933 wasn't so bad in another book and that four more years of laissez-faire would've solved all our problems.

But she's kinda hot, so it balances out.

It's a tough summer for everybody with food and gas prices going up. Especially gas prices. Farking unbelievable it's up a $1.32 from a year ago (where I am). Sooner or later a constantly increasing gas price is gonna take some major tolls that people are not going to like.

Some people need gas to do things like go to school and work after all.

The truth hurts.

Im not a whiner! It is just that it isnt faaaiir. I dont deserve to be threated like this at all, I never did anything wrong!

TFA:Amity Shlaes is a senior fellow in economic history at the Council on Foreign Relations and the author of "The Forgotten Man." She recently spoke at a meeting hosted by the Mercatus Center and the Texas Public Policy Foundation, which is chaired by Wendy Gramm, wife of Phil Gramm.

I wonder what her speaking fee was...

Bloody William:Damn, I tossed you a typo and you SPIKED that mother.

I thought you were gradually going into "Idiocracy" talk.

Listen bro, the dollar is shiat, and the economy is gay, and gas prices are like farking retarded.

Yeah its a "mental recession." I'm sure once I snap out of it all of the damage done by regulatory incompetence and corruption will magically disappear.

Bloody William:Campaign Econ is certainly understandable. Gas prices are ruining vacation plans and killing businesses. Many Americans have lost or are about to lose their homes to foreclosure or in distress sales. The federal government may not be talking about it much yet, but inflation plagues the country. The weak dollar is altering our everyday calculations. For many, this is not a happy summer.

I could give two craps about the whole rule that a recession requires two quarters of negative growth to be "official." The dollar is shiat, gay prices are through the roof, and we're going through a housing crisis.

If it's not a recession, and it's not a depression, is there at least some term we can use to describe how farked everyone feels?

That is the funniest damn typo I think I've ever read.

/Phil Gramm is right.

Well, maybe YOUUUUU are, but I'MMMMMM not.

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:/Phil Gramm is right.

Really? I wonder if you'd be saying that if Reagan hadn't changed the CPI to exclude food and fuel... oh wait...

Login: Satan's Superfluous Nipple
Account created: 2008-06-07 23:49:32

Nevermind, I thought you might have been an honest participant in the discussion.

He's right that we aren't technically in a recession. But the growth rate of the economy is by far not the worst economic problem we are facing right now. Everyone thinks we are in a recession because to most people "recession" means "economy sucking". We could be in an actual recession and still have the economy in better shape than it is right now.

Phil Gramm pointing out that we are not in a recession is about as useful as if the stock market fell 18 percent in 3 days and someone said "Ha! It's not down 20 percent so we aren't in a bear market."

FTFA: Still, to liken the current moment to the Great Depression, or even the early 1980s, as Campaign Economists have, is to whine, just as Gramm said. During the Depression, people lost their homes even though they had borrowed only 10 percent of the purchase price. People losing their homes today frequently have borrowed 90 percent or more.

This ought to tell you something. Given the fact that the latest economic recovery we had was the FIRST in U.S. history in which the average middle-class family LOST wages, and gained no net jobs, most people haven't seen the good times. In MI, we never had a recovery at all. You damn right people are bitter. People have worked their ass off and those getting laid off of or bought out are taking shiatty underpaid jobs while food and gas costs are through the goddamn roof. Rich white pundit chick probably has little problem making ends meet herself while getting paid to bloviate. Add that to a war that we've borrowed out of ass of China to pay for, a completely incompetent health care system, and an Administration 75% of America is just waiting to go the fark away, and yeah, the rest of us aren't having any fun.

equilibrium:Satan's Superfluous Nipple:/Phil Gramm is right.

Really? I wonder if you'd be saying that if Reagan hadn't changed the CPI to exclude food and fuel... oh wait...

Login: Satan's Superfluous Nipple
Account created: 2008-06-07 23:49:32

Nevermind, I thought you might have been an honest participant in the discussion.

What the hell does the fact that my account is new have anything to do with anything? I've been reading Fark for years, I've just never felt the need to have a user ID since I normally don't get get into most of these discussions until they are a couple hundred posts in.

Oh I see, you're from Arkansas. That explains everything.

Now on to the honest discussion.
Yes the economy is not the greatest. Yes the dollar sucks. No we are not in a recession.
The only reason everyone keeps whining about recession is because it's a presidential election year. I'll bet that if BHO is elected, that word will disappear from the news.

/I use BHO because it annoys people.

Good god, there are a lot of whiners here. I've been dealing with $8 gas for years in Europe. I've survived.

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:What the hell does the fact that my account is new have anything to do with anything? I've been reading Fark for years, I've just never felt the need to have a user ID since I normally don't get get into most of these discussions until they are a couple hundred posts in.

You posted a fairly controversial comment without support in a political thread. Your account is very new. It's a hotly contested election year. I'm sorry, but the probability of you being a troll is still pretty high.

Oh I see, you're from Arkansas. That explains everything.

Not quite the same thing and you didn't read my profile very carefully.

equilibrium:Satan's Superfluous Nipple:What the hell does the fact that my account is new have anything to do with anything? I've been reading Fark for years, I've just never felt the need to have a user ID since I normally don't get get into most of these discussions until they are a couple hundred posts in.

You posted a fairly controversial comment without support in a political thread. Your account is very new. It's a hotly contested election year. I'm sorry, but the probability of you being a troll is still pretty high.

Oh I see, you're from Arkansas. That explains everything.

Not quite the same thing and you didn't read my profile very carefully.

I was just making a generality. Trust me, I don't have the energy or creativeness (is that a word) to be a troll.

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:Yes the economy is not the greatest. Yes the dollar sucks. No we are not in a recession.

We may not be in a recession but when you consider the financial position of the majority of Americans, it's asinine to say that everyone is just a bunch of whiners.

Consider the situation where the economy grows by a meager 1% but that growth was limited to the holdings of only 5% of the US population. The financial position of the majority of Americans can fall while still showing sufficient growth in GDP to not strictly be in a recession.

We're approaching a gilded age stratification of wealth in this nation and the economy does not grow evenly. To tell the majority of Americans that they are whiners when they are seeing a very real erosion of both their purchasing power and their savings is clearly not taking a realistic view of the situation.

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:I was just making a generality. Trust me, I don't have the energy or creativeness (is that a word) to be a troll.

The word you were looking for was "creativity".

equilibrium:We're approaching a gilded age stratification of wealth in this nation and the economy does not grow evenly. To tell the majority of Americans that they are whiners when they are seeing a very real erosion of both their purchasing power and their savings is clearly not taking a realistic view of the situation.

What we really need is a "Number of Idiots Standing In Line for a $600 Phone" economic metric.

sarcastrophe:What we really need is a "Number of Idiots Standing In Line for a $600 Phone" economic metric.

I just wish they'd paid in cash. I'd still think they were stupid but at least they would not have added to our staggering level of consumer debt.

Back on topic...

You are correct. The CPI is a bit hosed, but Gramm is somewhat correct as well. If consumer confidence is low (mental problem), it can help fuel a recession. That's even more true if you look at a realistic CPI number (real problem).

sarcastrophe:Back on topic...

You are correct. The CPI is a bit hosed, but Gramm is somewhat correct as well. If consumer confidence is low (mental problem), it can help fuel a recession. That's even more true if you look at a realistic CPI number (real problem).

That's what I think he is basically saying. Everyone keeps hearing recession so they are reducing their expenditures which is keeping growth down. The economy is still growing (1/2% I think).

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:That's what I think he is basically saying. Everyone keeps hearing recession so they are reducing their expenditures which is keeping growth down. The economy is still growing (1/2% I think).

Maybe, but if you ignore the cost of EVERYTHING going up because of fuel prices, you're not being very honest. A gallon of milk in HI is something like $9 right now.

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:The economy is still growing (1/2% I think).

How is that growth distributed and how does it compare with the changes in average family household budgets over the last year considering that gas has increased by something like 30% since this time last year?

I for one think that everyone is a bunch of whiners, and I look forward to one day running my own campaign, one in which I will have no chance of winning, but it will at least be memorable for the utter disdain which I will display towards the voters.

/Already working on my concession speech
//If I'm lucky, it will involve fisticuffs with whomever beats me in the election

naughtyrev:I for one think that everyone is a bunch of whiners, and I look forward to one day running my own campaign, one in which I will have no chance of winning, but it will at least be memorable for the utter disdain which I will display towards the voters.

/Already working on my concession speech
//If I'm lucky, it will involve fisticuffs with whomever beats me in the election

I'd vote for ya!

Either way, Obama was foolish not to pound "nation of whiners" home all of yesterday, and he better start mentioning it today. They wouldn't give you a pass on it, Barack, so hang it around their neck and don't let them breathe. Did McCain give you daylight during Bittergate? Fark no!

naughtyrev:I for one think that everyone is a bunch of whiners, and I look forward to one day running my own campaign, one in which I will have no chance of winning, but it will at least be memorable for the utter disdain which I will display towards the voters.

/Already working on my concession speech
//If I'm lucky, it will involve fisticuffs with whomever beats me in the election

So long as you don't pull off each others clothes and start making out.
Can I go to the cocession party? I'll bring beer.

robsul82:Either way, Obama was foolish not to pound "nation of whiners" home all of yesterday, and he better start mentioning it today. They wouldn't give you a pass on it, Barack, so hang it around their neck and don't let them breathe. Did McCain give you daylight during Bittergate? Fark no!

No, he just says we're stupid because we don't speak Spanish.

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:No, he just says we're stupid because we don't speak Spanish.

That's not what he said and you know it. Why lie?

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:robsul82:Either way, Obama was foolish not to pound "nation of whiners" home all of yesterday, and he better start mentioning it today. They wouldn't give you a pass on it, Barack, so hang it around their neck and don't let them breathe. Did McCain give you daylight during Bittergate? Fark no!

No, he just says we're stupid because we don't speak Spanish.

Absolutely untrue, you lying fark.

equilibrium:Satan's Superfluous Nipple:No, he just says we're stupid because we don't speak Spanish.

That's not what he said and you know it. Why lie?

It's not lying, it's taking things out of context. Kinda like that "100 year war" thing that everyone on the left was bleating about.
BHO basically said that instead of worrying what language is spoken in the US we should learn to speak languages for other countries.

/maybe I could be a troll
//I think I can, I think I can

naughtyrev:I for one think that everyone is a bunch of whiners, and I look forward to one day running my own campaign, one in which I will have no chance of winning, but it will at least be memorable for the utter disdain which I will display towards the voters.

/Already working on my concession speech
//If I'm lucky, it will involve fisticuffs with whomever beats me in the election

So long as you don't pull off each others clothes and start making out.
Can I go to the cocession party? I'll bring beer.

Trust me, there will be no such pleasantries as making out...and it will probably be an open bar illegally using the funds I've raised.

naughtyrev:Trust me, there will be no such pleasantries as making out...and it will probably be an open bar illegally using the funds I've raised.

Can I be a campaign manager or something?

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:Now on to the honest discussion.
Yes the economy is not the greatest. Yes the dollar sucks. No we are not in a recession.
The only reason everyone keeps whining about recession is because it's a presidential election year. I'll bet that if BHO is elected, that word will disappear from the news.

/I use BHO because it annoys people.

"Welcome" to Fark.

/Ignore

Satan's Superfluous Nipple:It's not lying, it's taking things out of context.

Ah, so it isn't lying, its just purposeful misrepresentation of what you know to be the truth.

Welcome to Fark, you'll fit right in.

I'm reminded of Jack Welsh on The Colbert Report a few years ago crowing about how outsourcing was a great thing for American business. While he may or may not have had a valid point, his delivery made it sound like he was completely oblivious to the "human" part of "human capital". The idea that a strategy that is good for business might not be good for the worker never occurred to him. Phil Gramm did the same thing. He may have a valid point about the effect of consumer confidence on the economy, but the way he said it made it sound like anyone who is suffering right now is a stupid loser who deserves whatever they get. Considering the role he played in getting us into this mess and his refusal to apologize, it's no wonder people are upset.

Obama needs to capitalize on this. A nice campaign ad would include this comment, the 'Bomb-bomb-bomb-Iran' comment, the 'Sunni-Shi'ite' confusion, and the 'Iraqi marketplace' confusion.

Satan's Superfluous Nipple
Paranoia about the media is a poor replacement for actual logic. One could even accuse you of whining. (This is assuming you're actually a conservative who arrives at his point of view through honest consideration, and is willing to consider that liberals also do that. i.e. not a troll.)

"During the Depression, people lost their homes even though they had borrowed only 10 percent of the purchase price. People losing their homes today frequently have borrowed 90 percent or more."

So? Sounds fallacious to me--every home loan is a bigger percentage of the price of the inflated prices of real estate.

It's also true that Americans are saving dick all, living on credit cards (which didn't exist in the Great Depression); and have been supporting the economy and their grossly inflated lifestyles, cars and homes, on their home equity, which has gone South after the collapse of the subprime bubble, the credit market and now housing and employment.

People always start crying recession before the "economic definition" applies. The economic definition is crap.

What I've learned about the US economy.

They say "The market can go nowhere but up." means "The market is going down."

They say "Americans workers are lazy and unproductive." means "Layoffs are around the corner."

They say "There's no recession and you're all a bunch of doo-doo heads." means "The recession has already hit the people on Main Street and it will soon be hitting our capital on Wall Street, so we're running scared."

But she is right about the pandering SOBs running for office. She'd be right about that if the economy was going gang-busters, though, so it has nothing to do with economics, the economy, or the real world. It's just politics.

That's right. And if you all clap reeeeal hard, gas prices will go back under 4 bucks a gallon.