hmm. on one hand, i'm sure there are instances where congressmen could move on to be lobbyists for good causes.

on the other hand, i'm also sure phil gramm is not some type of aberration, and that a lot of congressmen move on to be the worst kinds of lobbyists.

i think this is probably a good idea. if they want to express their support for a cause, they can help fund a PAC or candidate like the rest of us.

Nice idea. It'll never happen. Where there's a will for funny business, there's a way.

It's quite reflective of business, actually. How many of you know (or ARE) people who left a company only to come back a month later as more highly paid consultant?

Talk about rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.

Look, if you want to reduce the number and influence of lobbyists, there's only one real way to do that: reduce the size, scope, power, and influence of the Federal Government by returning as many areas of control to states, cities, counties, and local governments as possible. The goal of a lobbyist is to get government to use its power to favor their client. If there are no more favors to be had, the problem will be solved in short order. Everything else is honkbagging.

Of course, this is a Democrat we're talking about. Of course he thinks we can regulate our way out of the problem.

At first blush, I really like this. But, there is something to be said for the experience and connections a former Congressman can use for lobbying, and not all lobbying is per se evil.

Nabb1:But, there is something to be said for the experience and connections a former Congressman can use for lobbying, and not all lobbying is per se evil.

Examples?

Bonkthat_Again:Nabb1:But, there is something to be said for the experience and connections a former Congressman can use for lobbying, and not all lobbying is per se evil.

Examples?

I guess it depends on your political bent. People lobby on behalf of environmental groups, and people lobby on behalf of business groups. Just about any cause you can think of, you can hire a lobbyist in DC. I've worked with lobbyists on workers compensation reform at the state level. A lot of that gets into mundane matters that aren't very exciting to most people.

Nabb1:I guess it depends on your political bent. People lobby on behalf of environmental groups, and people lobby on behalf of business groups. Just about any cause you can think of, you can hire a lobbyist in DC. I've worked with lobbyists on workers compensation reform at the state level. A lot of that gets into mundane matters that aren't very exciting to most people.

I think it can be simplified. Do lobbyists exist for the benefit of all more so than the benefit of the few, or is it the other way around?

Just pulling a number out my ass...I'd say 90% of lobbyists exist for the benefit of the few.

Bonkthat_Again:I think it can be simplified. Do lobbyists exist for the benefit of all more so than the benefit of the few, or is it the other way around?

Just pulling a number out my ass...I'd say 90% of lobbyists exist for the benefit of the few.

But, the fact is that most lobbying involves mundane affairs that require specialized knowledge and a professional lobbyist knows his or her way around the right channels to get to the person you need to get to. So, you get people who are experts at connections getting people who are knowledgable on an issue to the right legislators. Of course, that's how it is supposed to work. The reality is obviously more sleazy, and there is certainly need for reform.

Works for me.

Having people with Congressional experience lobbying is useful because they know what the hell they're doing. You know how people think Congress is slow now? Just wait until it takes three times as long for members to get information.

I'm not a big Franken fan, but if he keeps this kind of stuff up I may change my mind- I might even watch the Stuart Smalley movie again.

No. Nevermind. I'll never watch that movie again.

MasterThief:Look, if you want to reduce the number and influence of lobbyists, there's only one real way to do that: reduce the size, scope, power, and influence of the Federal Government by returning as many areas of control to states, cities, counties, and local governments as possible.

Look, if you want to reduce auto accidents, there's only one real way to do that: reduce the number of roads.

Baby+bathwater -> [ ]

And it's Billy Taupin coming down the stretch, loving his momma for the win!

Diogenes:How many of you know (or ARE) people who left a company only to come back a month later as more highly paid consultant?

*raises hand*

Best move ever.

Imperialism:Having people with Congressional experience lobbying is useful because they know what the hell they're doing. You know how people think Congress is slow now? Just wait until it takes three times as long for members to get information.


Ha thats funny. They could have their staff research things independent of lobbies they may actually get a different view of an issue. Plus this doesnt eliminate lobbying but it does prevent a$$hats like MD's own Congressman Wynn from quiting after losing the primary so he can work for a lobby firm and cost the taxpayers millions with special elections.

Al Franken is a tool. Scratch that. Al Franken is a glans, foreskin, shaft, scro, grapes, taint, bunghole and hemhi.

He is the whole package.

Bonkthat_Again:Just pulling a number out my ass...I'd say 90% of lobbyists exist for the benefit of the few.

But different fews. All of these "special interests" are indeed special -- to someone. "My" lobbyist at the NRA is no different from "your" lobbyist at the Brady Campaign. And yes, if I happen to own a widget manufacturer and Congress regulates the manufacture and sale of widgets, I damn sure do want someone down in Washington making sure my voice is heard, even if the whole widget industry only employs a few thousand people. Nabb's right. Franken is trying to "fix" the inevitable result of years of accretion of power by the federal government by increasing the power of the federal government at the expense of the Constitution. Just as, to be bipartisan about it, Messrs. McCain and Feingold did with their horrible law.

hillbillypharmacist:Look, if you want to reduce auto accidents, there's only one real way to do that: reduce the number of roads.

Baby+bathwater -> [ ]

Man, some of you will say anything to push the power to limit freedoms as far away from the individual as possible. It's mind boggling.

danlpoon:Al Franken is a tool. Scratch that. Al Franken is a glans, foreskin, shaft, scro, grapes, taint, bunghole and hemhi.

He is the whole package.

You just hate life in general don't you.

How would it be constitutional? You can't make it a condition to be an elected federal representative so what's left?

While I like the idea, I don't see how it would hold up in court.

sarcastrophe:Man, some of you will say anything to push the power to limit freedoms as far away from the individual as possible. It's mind boggling.

Pointing out a facile argument = putting my boot on the neck of the populace?

danlpoon:Al Franken is a tool. Scratch that. Al Franken is a glans, foreskin, shaft, scro, grapes, taint, bunghole and hemhi.

He is the whole package.

There's no hate like troll hate.

hillbillypharmacist:Pointing out a facile argument = putting my boot on the neck of the populace?

Your specific facile argument... yes. The further away you push government from the people, the less the individual has a say on that government limiting their freedoms.

MasterThief:Talk about rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.

Look, if you want to reduce the number and influence of lobbyists, there's only one real way to do that: reduce the size, scope, power, and influence of the Federal Government by returning as many areas of control to states, cities, counties, and local governments as possible. The goal of a lobbyist is to get government to use its power to favor their client. If there are no more favors to be had, the problem will be solved in short order. Everything else is honkbagging.

Of course, this is a Democrat we're talking about. Of course he thinks we can regulate our way out of the problem.

Anarchy and lawlessness FTW! regulation is stupid! Everybody should be able to do whatever they want! Free Market! Invisible Hand!

sarcastrophe:Your specific facile argument... yes. The further away you push government from the people, the less the individual has a say on that government limiting their freedoms.

What the bejesus are you even talking about, Beavis? I'm not taking a policy stance. I'm pointing out that the idea that the only way to combat lobbying is to reduce overall federal power is pretty silly.

Good or bad, lobbyists are unnecessary. If I vote for Jim because I think Jim has a good base in reality, and I think his views and ideas would be good for the town/state/country. I know it's gotten overwhelming, but I should be able to count on my representative using his or her own judgment to make the important decisions.

MasterThief:Talk about rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.

Look, if you want to reduce the number and influence of lobbyists, there's only one real way to do that: reduce the size, scope, power, and influence of the Federal Government by returning as many areas of control to states, cities, counties, and local governments as possible. The goal of a lobbyist is to get government to use its power to favor their client. If there are no more favors to be had, the problem will be solved in short order. Everything else is honkbagging.

Of course, this is a Democrat we're talking about. Of course he thinks we can regulate our way out of the problem.

You think lobbyists don't work at those levels? When I used to design cell sites, we used to use lobbyists to get our sites zoned and permitted at the local level.

Al Franken is a typical liberal douchenozzle who never met a law he didn't like.

This is a limit on free speech and you commies are gobbling it up like free samples of tofurkey at New Leaf Market.

I like Al Franken's ads. Sure as hell beat Coleman's... his wife yells at him to take out the garbage in one, and that somehow shows (in the fake, staged back alley where the trash can is) that Norm is against special interest, except the special interest of a nagging wife.

For the record, I'm friends with Al Franken's daughter, Thomasin

I guess UNICEF and the Girl Scouts are evil because they employ ex-legislators.

STOP UNICEF NOW!!!!

Go ahead. Elect a guy who names his kid Thomasin Franken. I dare you.

danlpoon:Al Franken is a typical liberal douchenozzle who never met a law he didn't like.

This is a limit on free speech and you commies are gobbling it up like free samples of tofurkey at New Leaf Market.

I used to at least appreciate your posts. You've gotten overly bitter, man. Can't be healthy.

danlpoon:I guess UNICEF and the Girl Scouts are evil because they employ ex-legislators.

STOP UNICEF NOW!!!!

UNICEF and the Girl Scouts are lobbying groups?

LOWER TAXES ON COOKIES!

Spanky_McFarksalot:How would it be constitutional? You can't make it a condition to be an elected federal representative so what's left?

While I like the idea, I don't see how it would hold up in court.

Maybe a contract, limiting employment after one finishes with service in Congress?

/just spitballing

hillbillypharmacist:What the bejesus are you even talking about, Beavis? I'm not taking a policy stance. I'm pointing out that the idea that the only way to combat lobbying is to reduce overall federal power is pretty silly.

Putting the power back to the states is an effective (probably the most effective) way to combat federal lobbyists. You can put all the rules in place that you'd like, but lobbyists will find ways around them. That's what they do.

Instead, if you keep this massive amount of power at the federal level, lobbyists essentially can sway all states at the same time. The bonus side effect for the government is that the individuals have less say in the matter.

I need that angry faced guy clapping gif...

/bravo Franken

danlpoon:Al Franken is a tool. Scratch that. Al Franken is a glans, foreskin, shaft, scro, grapes, taint, bunghole and hemhi.

FTFY

MasterThief/sarcastrophe:

Not trying to be mean, but do you honestly think pushing more decisions to the states/cities, you will reduce the lobbyist influence? Maybe in the short term, at least until firms can hire more lobbyists to hit more territories. Is that what you want, more lobbyists?

danlpoon:He is the whole package.

We agree, but in a completely different meaning and for completely opposite reasons.


While there is a valid point about legislators using their experience with Congress to aid lobbying, what this does is prevent current legislators from going along with lobbyists on the promise of a future, better paying job in the firm at retirement.

I used to at least appreciate your posts. You've gotten overly bitter, man. Can't be healthy.


I only have a few minutes. I had to get right to it. I'm meeting my wife for lunch at 11:30. I didn't have time to introduce any nuance.

I know. The product suffers. I'm doing the best I can with limited resources. A "Franken" thread? C'mon. I don't have much to work with, here.

UNICEF and the Girl Scouts are lobbying groups?


Absolutely. Two of the strongest.

Atticus Funk:Maybe a contract, limiting employment after one finishes with service in Congress?

But what if they refused to sign? They can't be a congresscritter, even if they are elected, because this law says so?

I just don't see any circumstance where they make it mandatory.

Wouldn't this have to be an amendment to the constitution?

This would have to be a ban on them becoming PAID lobbyists. At that point they aren't engaged in free speech but instead a specialized form of advertising.

This would leave them free to come back to lobby on behalf of causes they actually support, and not be a violation of free speech.

Eddie got it!!!!!

danlpoon:Go ahead. Elect a guy who names his kid Thomasin Franken. I dare you.

If we elect him, then the chances of her being on TV increases. We need more hot Jewish girls on TV.

SkaGoblin:Not trying to be mean, but do you honestly think pushing more decisions to the states/cities, you will reduce the lobbyist influence? Maybe in the short term, at least until firms can hire more lobbyists to hit more territories. Is that what you want, more lobbyists?

I want more accountability. The lobbyists themselves aren't bad, but the federal government as a whole is less accountable to the individual. Therefore, they should have less power.

Al must have come to the conclusion that former congresspeople are too effective to be lobbyist?
What about the current congresspeople being too effected by lobbyist Al? What about holding them to the promises they made to get elected?
What about the freedom to choose your career Al?

Stupid Al, a stupid and unnecessary law you are proposing there.

Then again, maybe this law would change the rules on lobbyists? That could be a way around it. Not sure if they can out-right ban an occupation from becoming a lobbyist, but that might have a better chance of holding up in court.

That's not how this works. It's the aides who vacillate between lobbying and working for congressmen. It's ideal because it's mostly invisible; the congressman has all of the limelight, his or her aides work in the shadows(unless they do something really stupid). It's these people that need to be prevented from mixing policy work with lobbying.

Billy Tauzin and his $2 million a year pharma lobbying contract are not amused by Franken's shenanigans.

Gramm is a lobbyist? No surprise. Just as sleazy on the Dem. side : Ron Dellums, with clients such as Phillip Morris.
So yes, these post congress folk should just retire on their congress salary for life that they voted for them selves.
/Want to fix soc sec? Put congress on the same plan as the rest of us.