We expect our elected leaders to be patriotic, to wear flag pins on their lapels.

Could someone please explain to media idiots the difference between "patriotism" and "pandering?"

I'd prefer some of this

* Cap the farm subsidies for Fortune 500 companies. (Dec 2007)
* End tax breaks for companies that send jobs overseas. (Aug 2007)
* Hold corporations responsible for pensions & work conditions. (Aug 2007)
* Tax incentives for corporate responsibility. (Jun 2004)
* Close tax loopholes for US companies relocating abroad. (Jun 2004)
* REAL USA Plan: Reward companies that create domestic jobs. (Jun 2004)
* Voted YES on repealing tax subsidy for companies which move US jobs offshore. (Mar 2005)
* Voted NO on reforming bankruptcy to include means-testing & restrictions. (Mar 2005)

over

This
* More deductible expensing of equipment investments. (Feb 2008)
* Cut corporate income taxes to keep jobs here. (Jan 2008)
* People worry about corporations unduly influencing elections. (Sep 2007)
* Voted NO on repealing tax subsidy for companies which move US jobs offshore. (Mar 2005)
* Voted YES on reforming bankruptcy to include means-testing & restrictions. (Mar 2005)
* Voted YES on restricting rules on personal bankruptcy. (Jul 2001)
* Rated 61% by the US COC, indicating a mixed business voting record. (Dec 2003)

Party Boy

And how does any of that relate to taxation of expatriates?

Taxed at the current capital gains rate? LOL

Yes, %15 will stop them.

FAIL

ZAZ:And how does any of that relate to taxation of expatriates?

of corporate entities, as they're legally a citizen of the state in which they're incorporated - except when they're classified as a citizen in the state where they do most of their business, or their head office.

Say what you want about rich people, but their money is incredibly patriotic.

#4. Confiscation of all property of emigrants and rebels.

Meh. All the 'big money' asshats can find ways around this little bit of legislation. it'll just be time consuming and moderately expensive but they could still transfer assets out of the country easily.

You and I are still screwed tho.

The power elite in the US could care less about the well being of America. They're the biggest traitors of all. They'd rather spend millions of dollars on changing the laws through legalized bribery than put those millions into the country's economy. Sending jobs over seas is treason, plain and simple.

Get a dual citizenship elsewhere, move your assets out bit by bit to your other home, once your stuff/money is in country II, suddenly move them to an inaccessible place, and renounce your US citizenship.

Granted, you won't be able to ever come back, but a lot of ex-pats don't. There are countries that will not extradite you to the US for a tax issue.

GurneyHalleck:The power elite in the US could care less about the well being of America. They're the biggest traitors of all. They'd rather spend millions of dollars on changing the laws through legalized bribery than put those millions into the country's economy. Sending jobs over seas is treason, plain and simple.

well...no. 'They' aren't doing it to screw over the country. It's just that businesses are always looking to save money and increase profits. shipping jobs overseas accomplishes much of that, at least in the short term.

What we need to do is understand the behavior of businesses and write laws/regulations with that understanding in mind.

Party Boy:I'd prefer some of this

How much of that is pandering to get the Democrat nomination? His position on FISA has made me question every single policy he has promoted during the primary. He took my trust and smashed it, that dickface.

Still better than McCain, but not deserving of my vote anymore :(

Weaver95:well...no. 'They' aren't doing it to screw over the country. It's just that businesses are always looking to save money and increase profits. shipping jobs overseas accomplishes much of that, at least in the short term.

What we need to do is understand the behavior of businesses and write laws/regulations with that understanding in mind.

First and foremost, selling your country out to better a corporation should be included in the definition of treason.

Ceph:...the Democrat nomination?

Ignore list, meet Ceph. Ceph, meet my ignore list.

erewhon:Granted, you won't be able to ever come back, but a lot of ex-pats don't. There are countries that will not extradite you to the US for a tax issue.


Quite a few countries, and a number of banking institutions, cooperate with US authorities on financial matters, especially as regards identifying, tracking, freezing, and seizing assets.

Occam's Chainsaw:First and foremost, selling your country out to better a corporation should be included in the definition of treason.

how is cutting labor costs 'selling out your country'? That's the part I don't get....

Devin172:Quite a few countries, and a number of banking institutions, cooperate with US authorities on financial matters, especially as regards identifying, tracking, freezing, and seizing assets.

This is why country #2 in the equation is the Cayman Islands.

I guess democracy doesn't include voting with your feet.

Weaver95:how is cutting labor costs 'selling out your country'? That's the part I don't get....

It's not, unless your labor decision would singularly and directly be a detriment to national security. So were Wal-Mart to suddenly lay off every single employee, treason (as the result is the destruction of the US economy). They close one store in Bumblefark, AK, they're fine.

Devin172:
Quite a few countries, and a number of banking institutions, cooperate with US authorities on financial matters, especially as regards identifying, tracking, freezing, and seizing assets.

Yeah, which is why I said "move them to an inaccessible place". There are countries which do NOT cooperate. Grant you, if you're Bill Gates they're going to be after you a bit more actively than, say, me.

Dual citizenships are handy to have anyway, if it wouldn't cost me my job, I'd have one.

So, uhm, sell everything, move all your money to Monaco or something, move to Monaco or another country, renounce your citizenship from outside the US.

Weaver95:What we need to do is understand the behavior of businesses and write laws/regulations with that understanding in mind.

-That would require economic literacy on the part of our elected officials, something that's sorely lacking in both major presidential candidates and in the legislature at large.

Rats fleeing my sinking ship? It's more likely than you think.

Meanwhile, Kellogg Brown & Root are avoiding paying U.S. taxes on their war profits from Iraq:

Link (new window)

Man, are Americans suckers or what?

And yet, when we libertarians say things like "You're not allowed to own property, you merely rent it from the government," people laugh at us.

Occam's ChainsawSo were Wal-Mart to suddenly lay off every single employee, treason (as the result is the destruction of the US economy). They close one store in Bumblefark, AK, they're fine.

So how large and successful does a business have to be before layoffs become treason in your eyes?

How utterly fascist. "YOUR MONEY AND PROPERTY BELONG TO THE FATHERLAND!"

Maybe this is an attempt to reduce tax evasion via offshore havens? Price WaterhouseCoopers makes a LOT of money looking for loopholes in the tax codes of G8 countries.

Even for an option piece in the Chicago Sun-Times, this article seems to be leaving out a lot of important information. I think the author is being a little hysterical, but there isn't enough factual information in the article to be sure.

I dunno...if they make it illegal to do what you want with your money, seems like it would make a businessman more likely to just jump over to the dark side, and illegally do as he pleases with his illegal profits.

The war on drugs produces a plethora of opportunity, once you get past that "respect for the law" thing.

FarkingFarkers:Rats Smart people fleeing my sinking ship? It's more likely than you think.

FTFY

Occam's Chainsaw:Weaver95:how is cutting labor costs 'selling out your country'? That's the part I don't get....

It's not, unless your labor decision would singularly and directly be a detriment to national security. So were Wal-Mart to suddenly lay off every single employee, treason (as the result is the destruction of the US economy). They close one store in Bumblefark, AK, they're fine.

This is all sorts of stupid.

Party Boy:I'd prefer some of this

* Cap the farm subsidies for Fortune 500 companies. (Dec 2007)
* End tax breaks for companies that send jobs overseas. (Aug 2007)
* Voted YES on repealing tax subsidy for companies which move US jobs offshore. (Mar 2005)
(Mar 2005)



I had an interesting discussion with a tax law professor, who worked with Bill Clinton and is a supporter of Obama. He had no idea what tax breaks existed for exporting jobs overseas. He researched the issue after Clinton originally proclaimed he would end it and could find nothing substantive.

Can I just renounce my citizenship now, while I am still young and broke, and then just live here as an illegal alien? Seems like things would actually be better for me.

Goddess of Atheism:And yet, when we libertarians say things like "You're not allowed to own property, you merely rent it from the government," people laugh at us.




No, we have many other reasons to laugh at you.

/Subby
//wonders how Fark Independants™ think we're going to pay off the chimp's middle east quagmires

Non story.

As erewhon said, dual citizenship is easy.

Another circumvention is to move your assets into trusts. Another is to move custodianship to international banks.

Any CFP or CPA can do these things. It's called wealth management because the wealthy can pay other people to handle the details.

Wealthy Businessmen are given free rides in america.

If your rich it would have been wise to export your current to Euro...

Blaxabbath:Can I just renounce my citizenship now, while I am still young and broke, and then just live here as an illegal alien? Seems like things would actually be better for me.

The best part is, if they catch you you'll just be deported to Arizona.

Man, are Americans suckers or what?

all day ones

Pillager:
//wonders how Fark Independants™ think we're going to pay off the chimp's middle east quagmires

Well your fark handle should handle it. Let me know when it gets to the fun parts.

Jeremy BatesNo, I laugh at you because you Objectivists are so busy fellating the Free Market(tm) that you forget that your poor ass is never actually going to ever benefit from the capitalism you so heartily espouse, and that you're merely a pawn to make rich men even richer by parroting the supposed virtues of "free trade."

I'm not an Objectivist; I'm a libertarian. And who said anything about free trade here? I'm saying it's asinine for the government to insist "If you want to move out of the country, you owe us tax on all your possessions, if you want to take them with you."

Your furniture, for example: you paid income tax when you first earned your money, then paid sales tax when you used that money to buy your home furnishings. Why should you pay yet another tax if you move out of country and take your furniture with you? Or if you don't have enough money to pay the tax, why should you be forced to leave your furniture behind?

Ceph:How much of that is pandering to get the Democrat nomination? His position on FISA has made me question every single policy he has promoted during the primary. He took my trust and smashed it, that dickface.

Still better than McCain, but not deserving of my vote anymore :(

I tried to submit this

Obama defends his FISA support -- then he reminds critics they don't have any other choices in this election, so take your BAAWWW and go home (0)

read it and weep

Pillager:wonders how Fark Independants™ think we're going to pay off the chimp's middle east quagmires

Fark Independants got us into this mess?

lelio:Fark Independants got us into this mess?

Yeah, you know, the ones too embarrassed to admit they voted for shrub twice...

sirgrim:Pillager:
//wonders how Fark Independants™ think we're going to pay off the chimp's middle east quagmires

Well your fark handle should handle it. Let me know when it gets to the fun parts.

Huh?





I never voted for the chimp & I sure as hell warned everyone that invading Iraq would be a colossally stupid mistake.

Pillager:sirgrim:Pillager:
//wonders how Fark Independants™ think we're going to pay off the chimp's middle east quagmires

Well your fark handle should handle it. Let me know when it gets to the fun parts.

Huh?

I never voted for the chimp & I sure as hell warned everyone that invading Iraq would be a colossally stupid mistake.

I was alluding to pillaging, and it's counterpart.

Pillager://wonders how Fark Independants™ think we're going to pay off the chimp's middle east quagmires

It will never be paid for. We'll start WWIII over oil, and just vaporize our creditors.

This is why...

"Deficits don't matter" - Dick Cheney

sirgrim:Pillager:sirgrim:Pillager:
//wonders how Fark Independants™ think we're going to pay off the chimp's middle east quagmires

Well your fark handle should handle it. Let me know when it gets to the fun parts.

Huh?

I never voted for the chimp & I sure as hell warned everyone that invading Iraq would be a colossally stupid mistake.

I was alluding to pillaging, and it's counterpart.

Carry on, good sir knight!

Wealthy businessman can probably take the hit. Us middle-class people that have been saving up for emigration are the ones that are going to be hurt.

How big of a pussy are you when you are rich (you're among the most priviledged people on earth) and you biatch and moan about having to pay taxes.

Give me a farking break. You cons never shut up about how this person whines or that person whines while your capitalist heros are the biggest crybabies in the world.

Bucky Katt:Even for an option piece in the Chicago Sun-Times, this article seems to be leaving out a lot of important information. I think the author is being a little hysterical, but there isn't enough factual information in the article to be sure.

He's having a hissy fit over something that's common sense, and that most countries do already. Deemed dispositions of capital assets when you leave the country isn't weird at all. Actually, I can't believe the US didn't have such a provision already. And it makes perfect sense. You're just paying taxes on the gains you've had on your assets. Think about it this way: it is just saying the normal exemption (that you don't pay the tax on capital gains until you dispose of the asset) doesn't apply where you're never going to dispose of the asset as a tax payer.

To summarize: this change means you have to pay tax now on the gains you have accrued, since you won't be paying taxes on the gains in the future.

I can't fathom why the author is up in arms about this. Even rich folk will look at this and go "Well, duh." And it's not like the capital gains tax is high. Or that it will ambush people --> if you're going to take a big hit because you won't realize a capital asset until next year, just wait a year on the citizenship issue.

/Seriously, this shouldn't matter much to anyone.

WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

I made a ton of money and they want me to pay taxes.

WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA