TFA:Obama's America is Canada

And McCain's America is Mussolini's Italy. "National Greatness" and all that.

Obama is, policy-wise, a typical big-government "liberal". Canada is more "liberal" than the United States, so of course Obama's plan for America looks more like Canada than does the status quo.

Barak HUSSIEN Obama might even allow FRENCH SPEAKING PEOPLE to flourish in the US! This could lead to exactly the kind of CHAOS we see in QUEBEC and PARIS, and just at the moment when troubles in NEW ORLEANS might allow us to WIPE THEM OUT FOR GOOD.

Filipino kid: You are American?
Tourist: No, I'm a Canadian. It's like an American, but without the gun.
KITH FTW

Hahaha, no offence but Obama's ideal is far from what Canada is.

Every year, many of the most talented, dynamic and enterprising individuals flock to America in order to escape the stagnation and limitations imposed on them by their government.

I'd like to say no. Look at actors for example. There is a film being made in Alberta right now about Passchendaele. The creators have gone far and wide to get the $20 million required. That's a massive budget for a Canadian project. Look at some of the crappiest movies in the States and they have massive. There just isn't a lot of money here to begin with. Look at Hollywood and it's multi-billion dollars. Look at the market of 300 million people vs 37 million people. There are reasons why we go to the States.

Mr. Obama is calling for a multilateral foreign policy and greater respect for international law. He wants to "talk" with America's enemies and he seeks to curtail much of the anti-American sentiment around the world. His suggestions resemble Canadian foreign policy. Canada is a staunch U.S. ally. Canadians are mostly proud of their role as "peacekeepers" in troubled areas. However, Canada is not a superpower. Also, Canadian "peacekeeping" is possible mostly within a larger context in which America bears the brunt of keeping North America safe and free. Canadians can be "doves" because they are protected by American "hawks."

It's great that Canada is a respected country around the world. You know, people actually like Canada. Also this BS about keeping North America free and safe is just stupid. I feel less safe going to America these days because of all the crap the US government has done. Thankfully the Canadian government actually has some integrity and isn't super corrupt since the Tories actually need to convince the other parties to work with them.

Plus our high standard of living is great to boot.

Canadian Canuck:Canadians can be "doves" because they are protected by American "hawks."

American hawks haven't been "defending" any body for decades, they've just been gallivanting around the world starting fights with any one that looks at Old Glory the wrong way.

There's no paper in DC that makes me facepalm quite like the Washington Times.

As a Canadian I don't know whether to be insulted or amused.

as long as he can spell influential, i'm ok with that

WARNING! Link goes to an editorial by Moonies!

I'm annoyed by these threads that just open up partisan warfare between Republicans/Democrats and Conservatives/Liberals.

There's really no meat here to chew into; it's just a pretense for poo-flinging.

*sigh*

I don't want any American coming up here and blowing our budget.

I view deficits as deferred taxes (which they are) and highly unfair ones at that. They tax the future.

No wonder abortion is so damn popular...who wants their kid to be stuck with massive tax hikes to pay for an idiotic past.

I find it amusing that Canada is becoming more like America used to be - fiscally responsible and prosperous while America goes down the path Canada used to take of giant deficits and the resulting damage to the currency and the economy.

I'm looking forward to Obama taking the reigns. He can't screw things up so bad that they're irreversible, and it'll sure remind people why low taxes and small government is a good thing.

/PS shut up, those of you who say b-b-b-b-b-but BUSH, cause I'm not his biggest fan. I didn't elect him, and don't vote for any other RINOs

a excellent?

Given the spectacular collection of jackasses that Canadian political parties keep selecting to lead them, I would have no significant problems with Obama as a Prime Minister.

PirateFreedom:I find it amusing that Canada is becoming more like America used to be - fiscally responsible and prosperous while America goes down the path Canada used to take of giant deficits and the resulting damage to the currency and the economy.

If you guys were to go easier on the gun regulations and lower your taxes (say, get rid of provincial income taxes) I bet you'd get a lot of immigrants.

/Hell, if you did that I'd even learn to say things like "sooorry" and "abooat"

Smellvin:PirateFreedom:I find it amusing that Canada is becoming more like America used to be - fiscally responsible and prosperous while America goes down the path Canada used to take of giant deficits and the resulting damage to the currency and the economy.

If you guys were to go easier on the gun regulations and lower your taxes (say, get rid of provincial income taxes) I bet you'd get a lot of immigrants.

/Hell, if you did that I'd even learn to say things like "sooorry" and "abooat"

Get the Western Separatists riled up and you could have pretty much that.

Mr. Canuck Obama might be happier moving...I are a veteran.

Wait?

You mean our beer and Whiskey is going to get better?

great!

Churchill2004: Question: why'd you get rid of your Rothbard-esque declaration in your profile?

I would gladly trade stephen harper for obama.

Harper is a petulant spoiled brat who never grew up.
Obama's welcome in Canada any time, far as I'm concerned.

He's to the USA what Trudeau was to Canada.

Smellvin:Churchill2004: Question: why'd you get rid of your Rothbard-esque declaration in your profile?

Just decided I didn't want to end up with people picking it apart instead of discussing the topic at hand. My views haven't really changed. I'm still very much a Rothbardian libertarian at heart, but I'm also a gradualist who believes in using broad political coalitions to get things done. So I'm more than capable of proffering Constitutionalist or minarchist arguments since a) I consider those fellow-traveling ideologies to be ones I have common cause with and b) those are a hell of a lot easier to sell to the 99.99% of the population that wouldn't even consider a philosophy this is, technically, anarchist.

Churchill2004:Just decided I didn't want to end up with people picking it apart instead of discussing the topic at hand.

Pfft. This is Fark; no one discusses the "topic at hand."

Example:


/BOOB THREAD!

FTFA: Despite Mr. Obama's Christian discourse, his social policies also resemble Canada's liberal policies

Despite Rev. Moon's Christian discourse, his religion is entirely divorced from Christianity and is pure batshiat-craziness. On the other hand, Sen. Obama's Christian discourse is FAR MORE in line with what mainstream Christians in the United States believe and practice, and that includes most evangelicals as well. (new window)

Smellvin:Pfft. This is Fark; no one discusses the "topic at hand.

True, but even most Farkers get a bit incredulous when I explain the ultimate implications of self-ownership and non-aggression, that it's hard to have a serious conversation about it.

Smellvin:BOOB THREAD!



BOOB THREAD!

Canadian Canuck:Hahaha, no offence but Obama's ideal is far from what Canada is.

Every year, many of the most talented, dynamic and enterprising individuals flock to America in order to escape the stagnation and limitations imposed on them by their government.

I'd like to say no. Look at actors for example. There is a film being made in Alberta right now about Passchendaele. The creators have gone far and wide to get the $20 million required. That's a massive budget for a Canadian project. Look at some of the crappiest movies in the States and they have massive. There just isn't a lot of money here to begin with. Look at Hollywood and it's multi-billion dollars. Look at the market of 300 million people vs 37 million people. There are reasons why we go to the States.

Not to mention that the "brain drain" was mostly in the 80's and early 90's during rampant government cut backs in spending (from the federal government) in things like healthcare. I read quite recently that the doctor flow over the last few years has actually been a net increase in Canada's favour with far more doctors (Canadian) leaving their practices in the US to come back to Canada then new doctors going to the US. And there is plenty of very active research in Canada with plenty of top notch universities doing cutting edge research, it just depends on the field. I don't think anyone has done and accurate study more recently to even see if the brain drain is still occuring, or whether it has largely slowed and perhaps stopped. Hell in my experience there are plenty of foreign researchers in the biological sciences coming to Canada to get faculty positions, and these are top notch leaders in their field.

The Tony Danzas:Given the spectacular collection of jackasses that Canadian political parties keep selecting to lead them, I would have no significant problems with Obama as a Prime Minister.

I like Obama, I would love to have a vibrant Canadian politician who is actually charismatic. I also like many of Obamas goals and policies; however, his plans for implementation are typically very conservative by Canadian standards. As usual the Washington Times is pretty full of fail. Looks like they just want to slander him as a dirty "socialist" really.

Smellvin:If you guys were to go easier on the gun regulations and lower your taxes (say, get rid of provincial income taxes) I bet you'd get a lot of immigrants.

Given our current population we are getting tons of immigrants. If I remember correctly last year we were the only G8 nation with an increase in the population growth rate and it was mostly thanks to immigration. Income taxes aren't a barrier to new immigrants, it is the amount of liquid wealth we expect you to have to immigrate here. And the gun regulation issues aren't going to phase immigrants at all, except possibly some Americans, and they aren't going to want to move here anyway. Most immigrants aren't going to give a shiat about gun control laws because it isn't an issue for them like it is for Americans. And, I believe gun ownership per capita is actually higher in Canada then in the US, we just get all legislative about handguns for the most part and require you to get a permit to be able to purchase long guns. Big deal. It isn't overly difficult for me to legally own a rifle or shotgun here in Canada and I can get a Restricted permit if I really want to own a hand gun. Thats a little more difficult but not impossible.

GIS Canadian boobs.

Who knew?

Doesn't Canada have a higher average IQ than the US? Don't they also have a higher standard of living? Didn't they have both of those BEFORE the dollar plummeted?

FTFA:

"Americans have repeatedly demonstrated that they prefer individualism and freedom rather than the failing Canadian model of collectivism and comfort."

If the Canadian model is "failing" and the America model is "succeeding" please pass the fail.

The article has a good point. Elite Canadian professionals tend to go to the US, but they often return after a few years with horror stories about how private medical insurance prevented them from helping their patients, and how private insurance is more restrictive than a Canadian government would ever dream of becoming. It is also right that Canada is much better for poor people and the middle class to live in, for health and education. After all, the article doesn't mention it, but we do have a steady stream of lower and middle class Americans trying to immigrate here. The second paragraph is pretty much spot on.

The last time I heard, though, Obama was proposing government subsidies should go to private insurance companies. That is not how Canadian health care works (OHIP, for example, is a government insurance). Endorsing corporate control over individual health is the polar opposite of socialist policy (which would be widening treatments for every individual to access...Canada has only somewhat-socialist health care). So the article makes a good point, that Obama sounds like Canada, but really he is following the American tradition of doing things. Obama should be careful to check his speeches and make sure he doesn't sound like a Canadian stereotype, n'est-ce pas?

This article seems to think that becoming more like Canada would be bad for our economy. Of course the US has more economic and diplomatic influence than Canada. Canada has only about 10% of the population of the United States. The US spends something like half of the global military budget. By our sheer size and military spending we have more influence. However, at 10% of the population of the US Canada is a member of the G7 democracies (leaving Russia out as they're not a true member of the industrial democracies). They have a thriving economy. Their dollar is now as strong as ours. They have a balanced budget.

The article says we have more freedom in the US at the same time criticizing Canada for giving gay people more rights than does the US.

The article talks about a brain drain of Canadians coming to the US. Well, yes, again, we are a larger economy due to our sheer size, so we are going to pull people in from the smaller, but pretty much equally developed, economy to the north. If the US economy keeps going to shiat while the Canadian economy and dollar are on the rise, we might start to see a reversal of movement of skilled labor across the border.

What has been the Repbulican mantra for more than a quarter century: Don't Tax and Spend Heavily. Just because we have a lower overall tax rate than Canada does not mean that we don't have Big Govt. The difference is deficit spending. How did the Iraq War get paid for? Medicare Drug Benefit? No Child Left Behind?

A ballooning national deficit. Who is holding all the T-Bills? The Chinese.

Look at California. 15 billion dollar deficit hole during the "fiscal restraint" of the Arnold Admin. You can't raise taxes to do anything in California. All spending is done through bond measure. Please don't tell me about Obama being a tax and spend liberal. Only one administration in the last 28 years has even bothered to try and fix the budget, and that was a Democratic one.

And I love how the Right keeps saying that Obama wants nationalized health care like in Canada and Europe. He does not. No one is talking about nationalizing hospitals or doctors. The talk is of providing national health insurance coverage. Health insurance is completely different than the state taking over hospitals and other businesses/organizations that provide actual health care services. I've also heard no talk of nationalizing or making illegal current health insurance providers. As far as I can tell, the talk is just of creating a parallel public health insurance program.

And I laugh when the right goes on about how families should make important health care decisions instead of the government. Families don't make those decisions now or under Republican plans; corporations through health insurance companies make decisions about what services Americans can and cannot have based on how much the corporations are willing to pay.

I pay for my health insurance now both through my employer paying money to a private company instead of to me to pay my insurance. It matters very little to me if that payment of money goes to a private health insurance company or to a national health insurance policy as long as I have health insurance that covers what I need.

I know at least one old friend who took advantage of his wife's Canadian citizenship to be more entrepreneurial. See, their son was born with a fairly serious chronic condition. The advice in the US was, pretty much always, to goldbrick in a boring government job... it was the only way to keep good insurance. In Hamilton, without that worry over his head, he was free to try a small business he had wanted. He might lose some money, but his kid wouldn't die for him trying.

Yeah, Obama would like us to be a little more like Canada. Also, a little more like France, Sweden, the UK, Australia, Japan, Ireland... and, well, pretty much any other place in the world you'd really choose to live if you had a choice.

Is this the boob thread?

has the writer of this ever been to Canada?

Canadian health care works on a triage system, if you need care tomorrow, then you'll get it tomorrow. If you can wait 3 months then the ppl that need it sooner'll be treated ahead of you. I fail to see a problem with this.

Toronto currently holds the title of most multicultural city in the world - that rather implies that immigrants are going there in larger numbers from all over the world.

The canadian political system (while far from perfect) encourages, and often requires, cooperation between different political factions. Thus progress is made while pissing off the fewest number of people.

While American military spending does play a large part in keeping canada safe, I think the Canadain strategy of not pissing other countries off is fairly successful in detering invasions, attacks, etc.

Also, I would have pegged Ontario or BC as the most liberal province. But that's just my impression.

You know, I don't mind Canada. I've always enjoyed my time there, except when I was driving, or when I was in Quebec. Other then that, I got no problems with this.

Ok, now that I got that outta the way:

Smellvin:Churchill2004:Just decided I didn't want to end up with people picking it apart instead of discussing the topic at hand.

Pfft. This is Fark; no one discusses the "topic at hand."

Example:


/BOOB THREAD!

That's a excellent set of boobs.

The Tony Danzas:Given the spectacular collection of jackasses that Canadian political parties keep selecting to lead them, I would have no significant problems with Obama as a Prime Minister.

You know, I like PM Harper, but from time to time, I find myself wishing Dion were PM just for the hilarity of Dion-Bush press conferences. Heck, Dion might even feel good about his English after a presser with the President.

That article was mostly gastrointestinal waste.

Yeah, seriously that was weak. I'm a talented young professional (comp sci), and you know what? The brain drain just isn't in the picture any more. None of my friends or classmates gave the US much of a thought. We've all grown up on a public health care system - to the point where we just don't think about it.

As long as I live here, I'll have the care I need available - that's a luxury the US can't provide to me no matter how hard it tries. I can't get denied for pre-existing conditions, I won't come out of the hospital rolling in debt.

Heck, planning this summer's vacation, I thought it would be nice to go through New York and Vermont and Maine on the way home. Not only do I have to bring along my birth certificate to get in and out, I have to suddenly worry about what could happen to me on the other side of the border. Accidents on motorcycles tend not to be a "walk it off" affair. How much money will OHIP give to whatever hospital scoops me up? What about my coverage from the supplemental insurance at my job? What if I need to recover for a long time - can I get my ass shipped back home? Will the hospital start suckling on my bank account immediately, or does the insurance start picking up the bill from day one? Hell, what if I'm brought in unconscious - what the heck do they do with me then? I could've lost my wallet in the crash. How long does a for-profit hospital keep an unconscious Canuck in a hospital bed when they can't find his insurance? Hell, they might not even figure out I'm Canadian.

And all of the above aren't even questions out in Halifax. When I'm out there, all I'll be worried about is the lobster.


So that article annoyed me. I'm not overtaxed, not while there's still a large federal deficit to be paid off. You do know that debts must be repaid eventually, don't you? My health care isn't inefficient - it's guaranteed, and that's a weight off my shoulders so large I don't even like thinking about it. It doesn't matter how much I pay, an American plan can't give me that comfort. And I don't feel compelled to move to America for its "leave the poor behind" dynamism. I'm a social creature, and the society I live in affects me. Meeting healthy, happy people when I walk downtown leaves me better off. Seeing people suffering does the opposite. I can't just "keep my eyes on the prize" and keep looking for that next tax-free bonus cheque or tax sheltered investment.

/Not inferior, not mediocre, not unhappy, not inefficient, not overtaxed
//Sorry for the rant, please don't take offense, thank you and good night

entropic_existence:I like Obama, I would love to have a vibrant Canadian politician who is actually charismatic. I also like many of Obamas goals and policies; however, his plans for implementation are typically very conservative by Canadian standards. As usual the Washington Times is pretty full of fail. Looks like they just want to slander him as a dirty "socialist" really.

I agree with you that his implementations are conservative by Canadian standards. I'm a Canadian lefty, which means I'm somewhere to the left of the US green party, while being just slightly left of center for Canadian politics (the Liberal Party). As sad as it seems, even our Conservative party is to the left of the US Democrats.

However, it would be nice to have an elegant speaker once in a while, rather than Harper's robot-like delivery.

It's like the writer wrote this for a homework assignment and made up a bunch of stuff because he was up late drinking.

It amazes me how the US media makes up shiat about Canada. A sentence like "Americans have repeatedly demonstrated that they prefer individualism and freedom rather than the failing Canadian model of collectivism and comfort." is so wrong that it makes me think of false-flag propaganda prior to an invasion.

NOTE TO AMERICANS: We are not a complacent collectivist nation. We are exactly like you, except that we have control over our government.

Plate of Crazy:You know, I like PM Harper, but from time to time, I find myself wishing Dion were PM just for the hilarity of Dion-Bush press conferences. Heck, Dion might even feel good about his English after a presser with the President.

You know, I don't like Dion or Harper, but a head to head between Dion and Bush would be a thing of beauty. Dion would have to keep asking his reps to be sure that Bush was actually speaking the same language as him.

If there were anything keeping me from voting for him before, it's gone now. Nothing would make me happier than America learning something from more successful countries. Now if we can get more powerful third parties like Canada and still manage to keep the Bill of Rights empowered, we're set for life.

Also, I for one welcome our sexy, large breasted, Canadian masters.

The comments on that page are hilarious garbage:

I live in Canada, and everything said here is true, and worse.

It's something like 90% of the people here that cannot find a family physician. There literally are NO doctors left. There is no disputing this fact.

The equipment is old, or does not exist. Many clinics do not have the machines that Americans take for granted, and have for years.

Any surgery, or any procedure requiring a specialist of any kind is scheduled a minimum 3-6 months out, some need to wait years.

A girlfriend of mine was told to wait in the emergency room while her water broke, because there was no one to help deliver her baby. She was in line with other mothers about to deliver.

A neighbor was told she couldn't have the knee surgery she needed for at least another year, because they didn't want to pay for the surgery more than once in her lifetime, and expected the procedure to last 10 years, and this woman was more elderly. Can you imagine this?

People aren't going to the US for help just because they can afford it. It is because they need it; want to stop the suffering, or simply do not want to die.

Canada keeps statistics on how many people die waiting for medical help in this country.

And the system is not completely free. I have to pay a percentage of my prescription drugs, just like in the US. I have a separate insurance, just like in the US. Dental and Vision require insurance, just like in the US.

That is just the health care system.

The taxes are insane and the majority of the money goes to the collapsed health care system and the propoganda machine, the public CBC. That is where the taxes go. There is no return on investment.

This is a pile of lies.

funmonger:This is a pile of lies.

Well, this one was true, for a limited extent of 'true': And the system is not completely free. I have to pay a percentage of my prescription drugs, just like in the US. I have a separate insurance, just like in the US. Dental and Vision require insurance, just like in the US.

The rest are crap. It honestly sounds like it was written by someone who has never been to Canada, and only read the occasional scare article.

Sweet, maybe hockey will become popular again.

Canada is the same as the US except the taxes are alot higher and you cant buy beer at the 7-11

Dear_Leader:Canada is the same as the US except the taxes are alot higher and you cant buy beer at the 7-11

You can in Quebec.