The subby is obviously a communist.

How is someone "against health care"? Is that like being "against employment"?

well, pancakes and cheesecake could go together, maybe that's the connection. either that our sour seething bitterness

Against abortion rights? Doesn't he just want the states to make the decision on their own? I say good, make it a grass roots campaign. People are too complacent, they want everything handed to them on a silver platter. Time we got off our asses and fought for what we want.

I heard he eats babies too.

Tat'dGreaser: Against abortion rights? Doesn't he just want the states to make the decision on their own? I say good, make it a grass roots campaign. People are too complacent, they want everything handed to them on a silver platter. Time we got off our asses and fought for what we want.

Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering... federalism leads to complacency...?

Viking_Kitty:
How is someone "against health care"? Is that like being "against employment"?

Against health care for those who can't pay for it. My taxes don't buy you shiny a new car, why should they buy you a shiny new "heart bypass" or whatever. Pay cash or GTFO. I can't wait for Mcain to end this Medicaid/free hospitals for illegals nonsense once and for all.

Tat'dGreaser: Against abortion rights? Doesn't he just want the states to make the decision on their own?

Fascinatingly, they (and their parties) are on exactly opposite positions on Federalism regarding guns.

Obama is also for states' rights in assissted suicide or medical marijuana, where McCain is dead-set-against, so I lean toward the 3-of-4, over the 1-of-4.

That's like cutting off your nose to spite your face.
(Always liked that expression.)

Gonna grab some popcorn brb.

Maybe a hundred. Make it one hundred. We've been in South Korea, we've been in Japan for sixty years. We've been in South Korea for fifty years or so. That'd be fine with me as long as Americans are not being injured or harmed or wounded or killed. Then it's fine with me. I would hope it would be fine with you if we maintain a presence in a very volatile part of the world where Al Qaeda is training, recruiting, equipping and motivating people every single day. -- John McCain

Massive levels of fail there, subtard.

After looking over the site, I've concluded two things:

1. They're not Democrats, and never were.
2. There's no way they would have ever voted for Obama.

Smells more like Republicans running scared to me.

GIS for "cutting your nose to spite your face"

we are a coalition of millions

LOL, no.

soy_bomb: Maybe a hundred. Make it one hundred. We've been in South Korea, we've been in Japan for sixty years. We've been in South Korea for fifty years or so. That'd be fine with me as long as Americans are not being injured or harmed or wounded or killed. Then it's fine with me. I would hope it would be fine with you if we maintain a presence in a very volatile part of the world where Al Qaeda is training, recruiting, equipping and motivating people every single day. -- John McCain

Massive levels of fail there, subtard.

I bolded the catch. Maybe you can tell us the difference between Iraq and Korea/Japan. Maybe.

Certainly, there couldn't be any component of people that simply are disillusioned with Barrack Obama, not that couldn't be it. Maybe they don't trust him as much as they trusted Hillary, even though I'm not sure I trust Hillary as far as I would want to. The idea that these people would go as far as to vote for John McCain is kind of absurd, there are other options and while they may not make a difference in this election, they certainly would in the next.

Vote third party - it is change you can see.

Aside from the obvious Post Inducing Headline I think it just shows that for many, bitterness trumps principle, Hillary did run on a completely different platform than McCain. I'm sure McCain's not going to complain about picking up the votes, but really, it's kind of sad that they're being so loud about it.

Also proves the problem with Identity Politics; you get too wrapped up in having "The First Woman President" instead of The Person with the right policy idea's and you should realize you've got a 50/50 chance of a real hard fall. (As we've seen)

I'm voting for McCain so I didn't really have a horse in the Democrat primaries, but I can't help chortling just a bit when I think about how Hillary basically just assumed she'd be walking into the post. Everyone knew her Senate race was a setup for this, so yea, a littla wha wha whaaaaa sound plays in my head every time I think about her losing.

/Not sad in the least that she made enough enemies that a 2012 run will be damn near impossible even if Obama loses this time around.

PC LOAD LETTER: I bolded the catch. Maybe you can tell us the difference between Iraq and Korea/Japan. Maybe.

Uh, religion, race, geography, national currency, main industries, etc. The list is very long. What they have in common? Democrats voted for us to be in each.

Since this headline will surely summon McPoontheUnitercrat, let's just get this out of the way.

Random Reality Check: Vote third party - it is change you can see.

Except that all it will do is pull votes away from one side or the other.

There are only 3 ways 3rd party voting does ANYTHING:

1) you vote people running in the 3rd party into lower offices. Build up a voting bloc in Congress. Then you get to the White House with known Congressional support

2) you elect a candidate so charismatic, so uniting, that both parties will vote with him. In this country, with our politics, I think the type of charisma needed would be along the lines of certain Austrian nationals.

3) One or both of the parties splits in half and one part appeals to a broader group. Yeah, I'll just wait for that one to happen.

so 3rd party: sounds great, but the last truly viable 3rd party we had were the Republicans in the late 1850s. Even the Populists didn't succeed.

Obama will definitely have to be a man of change. As a Senator of my fine state, he voted "present" more often than not. Way to support... - uh, I guess that anyone can hold a political office even if they can't hold an opinion in their head.
/sarcasm on
Yeah democracy!
/sarcasm off

soy_bomb: Uh, religion, race, geography, national currency, main industries, etc. The list is very long. What they have in common? Democrats voted for us to be in each.

Ummm...FAIL. The main difference relevant to this discussion is the host country WAS NOT TRYING TO KILL US EVERY DAY in Korea and Japan after we occupied it.

PC LOAD LETTER: Ummm...FAIL. The main difference relevant to this discussion is the host country WAS NOT TRYING TO KILL US EVERY DAY in Korea and Japan after we occupied it.

They are on constant alert in Korea for an attack from the North and well we nuked Japan. We are still in Kosovo and Bosnia ya know.

PC LOAD LETTER: soy_bomb: Uh, religion, race, geography, national currency, main industries, etc. The list is very long. What they have in common? Democrats voted for us to be in each.

Ummm...FAIL. The main difference relevant to this discussion is the host country WAS NOT TRYING TO KILL US EVERY DAY in Korea and Japan after we occupied it.

Yea, actually they were. Maybe not to the degree, but to say there were no insurgencies after those victories is to ignore history.


What is it about Arabs that makes you think they are incapable of forming a peaceful and inclusive form of government, or do you just think less of them than any other nationality?

PC LOAD LETTER: Ummm...FAIL. The main difference relevant to this discussion is the host country WAS NOT TRYING TO KILL US EVERY DAY in Korea and Japan after we occupied it.

Nice use of CAPS. That made your point all the more telling.

CanisNoir: PC LOAD LETTER: soy_bomb: Uh, religion, race, geography, national currency, main industries, etc. The list is very long. What they have in common? Democrats voted for us to be in each.

Ummm...FAIL. The main difference relevant to this discussion is the host country WAS NOT TRYING TO KILL US EVERY DAY in Korea and Japan after we occupied it.

Yea, actually they were. Maybe not to the degree, but to say there were no insurgencies after those victories is to ignore history.


What is it about Arabs that makes you think they are incapable of forming a peaceful and inclusive form of government, or do you just think less of them than any other nationality?

Still trying to hook people with that? You're not very clever.

pkellmey: Obama will definitely have to be a man of change. As a Senator of my fine state, he voted "present" more often than not.

"More often than not" actually means "more than 50%", even if it has become a generic phrase.

Barack Obama voted "present" on less than 5% of Illinois Senate votes in his tenure. Which is less than the average Illinois State Senator over those years.

They were willing to vote for a woman, but not someone who's uppity.

Viking_Kitty: How is someone "against health care"? Is that like being "against employment"?

The same way somebody is "pro-abortion".

HotWingConspiracy: What is it about Arabs that makes you think they are incapable of forming a peaceful and inclusive form of government, or do you just think less of them than any other nationality?

Still trying to hook people with that? You're not very clever.

It's a fair question to those who insist this action will fail. Why are you so certian it will fail now when we've succeeded in the past? (And in light of recent progress)

/Nyquil's kickin in so I'm not very awake, but I do have my clever moments.

PC LOAD LETTER: soy_bomb: Uh, religion, race, geography, national currency, main industries, etc. The list is very long. What they have in common? Democrats voted for us to be in each.

Ummm...FAIL. The main difference relevant to this discussion is the host country WAS NOT TRYING TO KILL US EVERY DAY in Korea and Japan after we occupied it.

Neither are the majority of Iraqis. Bailing for political expediency and leaving those to whom we promised a better tomorrow subject to the tyranny of a few psychos is not what America stands for. Unfortunately, it's what Democrats believe in.

Tat'dGreaser: They are on constant alert in Korea for an attack from the North and well we nuked Japan. We are still in Kosovo and Bosnia ya know.

Korea: The north invaded
Iraq: we invaded on false pretext

Japan: They bombed Pearl Harbor, invaded the Philippines and most of Asia, so we pushed them back, forced peace with nukes and then occupied
Iraq: we invaded on false pretext

CanisNoir: Yea, actually they were. Maybe not to the degree, but to say there were no insurgencies after those victories is to ignore history.

There were no insurgencies after those victories. My dad was in Osaka 1946-48. There were no farking insurgencies as you can plainly see .

What is it about Arabs that makes you think they are incapable of forming a peaceful and inclusive form of government, or do you just think less of them than any other nationality?

Nice strawman. Do you know the history of Iraq, Sunnis, Shiites and the interaction between Arabs and the West? No. You don't.

soy_bomb: Nice use of CAPS. That made your point all the more telling.

I have to speak slowly and loudly for some people.

PC LOAD LETTER: Korea: The north invaded
Iraq: we invaded on false pretext

Japan: They bombed Pearl Harbor, invaded the Philippines and most of Asia, so we pushed them back, forced peace with nukes and then occupied
Iraq: we invaded on false pretext

Ok, I just think that the reasons we are they shouldn't matter anymore. People don't seem to think about the global consequences of an immediate withdrawl of American troops from Iraq. It sucks, we farked it up and now we have to fix it. Its irresponsible of us to not.

Obama is not going to pull troops out of Iraq, I guarantee that.

OttoDog: Neither are the majority of Iraqis. Bailing for political expediency and leaving those to whom we promised a better tomorrow subject to the tyranny of a few psychos is not what America stands for. Unfortunately, it's what Democrats believe in.

I never said the majority were. I said the host country was. Meaning: you are in the country and some people in that country are killing you every single day.

There is no time when we can leave and they won't fall victim to the tyrranny of a few psychos. At some point, you say "I have done all I can". Have we? I dunno, but I don't want to waste our troops' safety to find out. We need them for real problems.

Tat'dGreaser: Ok, I just think that the reasons we are they shouldn't matter anymore. People don't seem to think about the global consequences of an immediate withdrawl of American troops from Iraq. It sucks, we farked it up and now we have to fix it. Its irresponsible of us to not.

We can't fix it. It is impossible. Iraqis need to fix it internally. We just opened up Pandora's box. Only they can close it. No, I don't know the answer. I do know that staying is not it.

Obama is not going to pull troops out of Iraq, I guarantee that.

We have more of a chance than with McCain. We have our military tied up there. It's bad strategy. We have to get out somehow. Will O'bama do it? No farking clue. Will McCain do it? Not a chance.

So again, I hope Obama gets us out. We need the money free, the troops available and the country on the right track again

Bailing on Iraq would be the moral equivalent of dumping some chick you accidentally knocked up at a drunken party. Poor planning might've led to unintended consequences, but the obligation is to at least stick around until she can take care of herself, not kick her to the curb cause she's cramping your style or costing you a buch of jack. You broke it, you fix it. Doing the right thing usually involves sweat & expense.

The Democratic solution seems to be more Chappaquiddick-esque.

PC LOAD LETTER:
Korea: The north invaded
Iraq: we invaded on false pretext

I'm not going to threadjack, but we did not invade under false pretext. You can look in the thread from yesterday to see the exact UN resolutions he violated that constituted his violation of the Cease Fire Agreement.

CanisNoir: Yea, actually they were. Maybe not to the degree, but to say there were no insurgencies after those victories is to ignore history.

There were no insurgencies after those victories. My dad was in Osaka 1946-48. There were no farking insurgencies as you can plainly see .

Naming a single location out of the entire theater does not constitute absolute proof, but as I mentioned, the Nyquil is kicking in and I need sleep more than I need to research this factoid.

Nice strawman. Do you know the history of Iraq, Sunnis, Shiites and the interaction between Arabs and the West? No. You don't.

Actually I do; are you familiar with the history of Europe, how about the Greek City States? Just because groups have been at odds in the past doesn't mean they are cursed to remain violently at odds with each other for eternity - so again I ask, why is it you think they will fail when others have succeeded, especially given the recent progress? Or are you just so sold upon the idea that the war was "illegal and wrong" and "Bush is evil" that no good could ever possibly come out of it?


I have to speak slowly and loudly for some people.

Cuz I'm hopped up on Nyquil and tired, the snark is eeking out of me. You're typing, so you can neither speak loudly or slowly for people - just make big letters.

OttoDog: Bailing on Iraq would be the moral equivalent of dumping some chick you accidentally knocked up at a drunken party. Poor planning might've led to unintended consequences, but the obligation is to at least stick around until she can take care of herself, not kick her to the curb cause she's cramping your style or costing you a buch of jack. You broke it, you fix it. Doing the right thing usually involves sweat & expense.

Going with your analogy, at what point does the baby turn 18 should be able to fend for itself? At what point is it acceptable to you for the US to say that we've done enough, it's time for the Iraqis to take care of themselves?

It is my sincere hope that any Democrat (or anyone else for that matter) who votes for McCain have draft aged children that they're not too attached to.

Sounds good to me.

/runs off

CanisNoir: I'm not going to threadjack, but we did not invade under false pretext. You can look in the thread from yesterday to see the exact UN resolutions he violated that constituted his violation of the Cease Fire Agreement.

Oh, I thought it was because of the WMDs. Oh wait, no, I thought it was because we wanted a regime change. Oh wait, no, I thought it was because we wanted to make Iraq safe for democracy. Oh, wait, no...


Naming a single location out of the entire theater does not constitute absolute proof, but as I mentioned, the Nyquil is kicking in and I need sleep more than I need to research this factoid.

Did you read the link? That's more research from military sources than you will ever need. My dad's experience was anecdotal, but he was in military intel, so he had a pretty good view of what was going on.

Actually I do; are you familiar with the history of Europe, how about the Greek City States? Just because groups have been at odds in the past doesn't mean they are cursed to remain violently at odds with each other for eternity - so again I ask, why is it you think they will fail when others have succeeded, especially given the recent progress? Or are you just so sold upon the idea that the war was "illegal and wrong" and "Bush is evil" that no good could ever possibly come out of it?

I am Greek, so yeah. But we aren't in Greece. We are in Iraq, which is not Greece, nor has the same problems as the Greeks have or had. Bush and his supporters are tards. The Dems aren't too bright either. The war was a moronically stupid about face from our real goal: stopping Al Qaeda and bringing Bin Laden to justice and working with nations around the world to crack down on terrorist groups. We didn't do that. The thing we are doing now is not really working out too well. Iraq will fall within 5 years of us leaving. We cannot stay forever. You decide which is more important.

Cuz I'm hopped up on Nyquil and tired, the snark is eeking out of me. You're typing, so you can neither speak loudly or slowly for people - just make big letters.

Take some LSD and you can hear typed text, I have heard.

Actually, come to think of it, someone should hack a text2speech app to actually shout and speak slowly when it hits caps. That would be pretty damn funny.

PC LOAD LETTER: We can't fix it. It is impossible. Iraqis need to fix it internally. We just opened up Pandora's box. Only they can close it. No, I don't know the answer. I do know that staying is not it.

I just can not agree with that attitude. Iraqis want to fix it but they need help. We leave and it will be worse then the bloodiest day in Iraq so far.

We have more of a chance than with McCain. We have our military tied up there. It's bad strategy. We have to get out somehow. Will O'bama do it? No farking clue. Will McCain do it? Not a chance.

So again, I hope Obama gets us out. We need the money free, the troops available and the country on the right track again

I agree with this last statement but I just see leaving Iraq as a clusterfark will only hurt us even more down the road. I agree with McCain because at least he is realistic about it. No, its not going to be 100 years but it will be a long time. No, the levels of our troops being killed is not going to be that high for that long. Eventually (if we care enough to try) things WILL calm down. The people there are sick of this fighting and they want things to get better. We owe it to them to try and help since we stirred up the hornet's nest.

pkellmey: Obama will definitely have to be a man of change. As a Senator of my fine state, he voted "present" more often than not. Way to support... - uh, I guess that anyone can hold a political office even if they can't hold an opinion in their head.
/sarcasm on
Yeah democracy!
/sarcasm off

Congrats on not knowing what you're talking about.

I was listening to a Conservative talk show yesterday ("Wilkow Majority", but there was a guest host) and they had a female "Hillary Supporter For McCain" as the in-studio guest.

She spent the entire segment bashing the DNC, Pelosi and Dean and repeated the Hillaryis44 refrain that the Democrats stole the election from Hillary.

This somehow is her justification for voting for McCain, who couldn't be more of a diametrically opposite candidate from Hillary on every issue of consequence.

I never actually hear anyone describe why they are enthusiatically voting for McCain, just why Obama "must be stopped". This is never more true than with "Hillary supporter for McCain".

OttoDog: Bailing on Iraq would be the moral equivalent of dumping some chick you accidentally knocked up at a drunken party. Poor planning might've led to unintended consequences, but the obligation is to at least stick around until she can take care of herself, not kick her to the curb cause she's cramping your style or costing you a buch of jack. You broke it, you fix it. Doing the right thing usually involves sweat & expense.

The Democratic solution seems to be more Chappaquiddick-esque.

I dunno, dumping your ol lady is popular with guys like McCain, and Gingrich and so forth.

A better analogy would be - this other guy knocked up your wife but you still have to pay child support when you divorce her lying cheating ass.

this thread is full of armchair patriots


//go enlist since you care so much

How farking ridiculous. I'm sick of these Hillary voters pissed off and going to the other side. Obama and Hillary have more in common for the people than McCain. I really don't understand why you would flip flop like that. Most of my female friends/coworkers have said they are now switching to McCain because their farking candidate didn't win. Cry me a farking river. I say we should start a BIG campaign to really show that these people are hypocrits. Yeah, you can vote for anyone you want, but when you are bitter about something, the least smartest thing to do is vote for someone who doesn't see ANY of your views.

Here in Oklahoma, I understand (being in the bible belt), that whites indeed are a bit biased against blacks. Which is wrong, but hey, I can't change everyone's views. So, when I asked one of my coworkers what the real reason is, they don't know. It is racially motivated I know that. It's just a fact of life.

I think whites should shut up about blacks, and blacks should shut up about whites. Then MAYBE just maybe we can have some farking peace. Basically, from here on out, do not be racist, do not play the race card...and this goes for everyone.

/is white
//will DEFINITELY vote for Obama
///will be the 1st female president

Umm...You people are aware that all three of them are in favor of tax cuts, all three are against universal health care, all three are for 100 more years in Iraq...I guess only J SIDNEY McCain is against abortion rights, and I suppose he's the only one who sells golf bags, so subby got 2/5 right.

PC LOAD LETTER: Korea: The north invaded
Iraq: we invaded on false pretext

Japan: They bombed Pearl Harbor, invaded the Philippines and most of Asia, so we pushed them back, forced peace with nukes and then occupied
Iraq: we invaded on false pretext

A case can be made that we entered the war with Japan on a false pretext as well - the Flying Tigers, for one. Summing it up, some people believe we PUSHED Japan into declaring war.

North Koreans border patrols have shot at South Korean border patrols. I believe Americans have been killed on occasion in that manner, though that number is very low. Anyway, Korea was essentially a civil war - we should not have entered it either, but for out disdain of the spread of communism, not because we had any other vested interest (such as oil). We wanted to enforce democracy there too.

What does it matter? War is war. However these incidents started, we were/are there. We need to do what is right at this point and clean up as best we can. Has worked fairly well for Korea and Japan, other places, not so much. But all the lives we lost - our own as well as civilians - will be in vain unless we try to make Iraq safer for its citizens.

Does it suck we are there? Yes. But lets not piss on them the way we did to the Kurds in Gulf War I.

\Yay! The Americans are going to help us!
\\Hey, where are you going?
\\\*gas*
\\\\.... .... .... ....