Open carry is largely a reaction to the very restrictive concealed carry laws. By the way, my guess is that if this young lady is ever in a very dangerous situation she would really welcome these open carry guys help.

If I was in a room with ten other people and was told that one of them was carrying a gun I'd feel more comfortable if the weapon was worn openly instead of being concealed.

Second Amendment questions aside," says Springwood, a professor at Illinois Wesleyan University, "the real debate seems to me a cultural and social one: Do we want a society in which it is an unconscious emblem of everyday life that folks move about with 'portable killing machines' strapped to their bodies?" Why yes we do, they are called automobiles.

I guess Rebbecca would prefer using dumb looks for self protection.

I guess toting an exposed gun is easier than packing tube socks into your underwear and cheaper than buying a Hummer/F-250

The 'Self-protection' as means to justify an openly hostile appearance is the lamest sh*t I've ever heard come out of a well-armed individual. Protection from whom?

40yoVirgin: I guess toting an exposed gun is easier than packing tube socks into your underwear and cheaper than buying a Hummer/F-250

So my friend who has to tow a horse trailer with her F-350 is trying to make up for her small penis?

Oh I'm sorry, you're just an idiot.

thamike: The 'Self-protection' as means to justify an openly hostile appearance is the lamest sh*t I've ever heard come out of a well-armed individual. Protection from whom?

Other armed idiots who disregard laws and the safety of others. That's who.

Tat'dGreaser: So my friend who has to tow a horse trailer with her F-350 is trying to make up for her small penis?

No, but people who have no reason for them are. Lame rebuttal.

Oh my God, subby. They're letting females write editorials now?

I would hazard a guess to say those areas allowing open-carry are very, very safe places.

GaryPDX: Other armed idiots who disregard laws and the safety of others. That's who.

Oh come on. I can understand it if you're a truck driver, work in security, or live/work in hell on earth. Any other private citizen who openly displays firearms does it to feel like a badass, which is perfectly justifiable. Fine. Look like Mad Max if it gets you off. But let's not kid ourselves here. Anybody who is actually afraid to venture outside without being armed to the teeth is exactly the type of person who shouldn't be doing it.

GaryPDX: Other armed idiots who disregard laws and the safety of others. That's who.

No kidding. If I have to replace one more shot out car window, I'm gonna start bringing a gatling gun with me to the mall.

thamike: Tat'dGreaser: So my friend who has to tow a horse trailer with her F-350 is trying to make up for her small penis?

No, but people who have no reason for them are. Lame rebuttal.

The Hummer argument I understand but an F250? WTF? People who think that people who own guns are trying to make up for something, I'll never understand.

Arthur Jumbles: If I was in a room with ten other people and was told that one of them was carrying a gun I'd feel more comfortable if the weapon was worn openly instead of being concealed.

Ditto.

And it is in the constitution. Until an amendment is passed, it's legal for them to do so.

Tat'dGreaser: People who think that people who own guns are trying to make up for something, I'll never understand.

Not people who own guns, but gun-nuts are definitely trying to make up for something. When you think about it, aren't we ALL doing something to make up for something at certain times? If people would admit that they were, a lot of the anger would probably dissipate.

thamike: Not people who own guns, but gun-nuts are definitely trying to make up for something. When you think about it, aren't we ALL doing something to make up for something at certain times? If people would admit that they were, a lot of the anger would probably dissipate.

Well what bothers me is some people's definition of a "gun-nut" is pretty much a blanket statement. My father has carried guns almost every day for the majority of his adult life and he is a well adjusted man. He came from the south side of Chicago so he knows that being a tough guy doesn't get you out of every bad situation.

The F250 comment just struck me as retarded. The Hummer one can be argued but not the truck one. Some people need trucks.

she seems rather arrogant and ignorant

hockeyfarker: Oh my God, subby. They're letting females write editorials now?

Doesn't she realize those cookies aren't going to bake themselves?

Tat'dGreaser: Some people need trucks.

Yeah, but it didn't seem like that's who he was referring to. Nobody should be criticized if they actually use their utility vehicle for utility.

thamike: Tat'dGreaser: Some people need trucks.

Yeah, but it didn't seem like that's who he was referring to. Nobody should be criticized if they actually use their utility vehicle for utility.

Ok, I agree. It just struck me as uncalled for. The majority of people who have trucks use them, hummers not so much.

Just take away her right to write articles such as this one and see how she likes it.

Tat'dGreaser: My father has carried guns almost every day for the majority of his adult life and he is a well adjusted man

Ditto here. He's technically a Federal LEO (Bureau of Prisons, so he's never walking the streets on duty), so he was permitted to carry under that, but he's an advocate of CHL and even Vermont carry- where no license is required.

He looks at is as not "carrying a portable killing machine" but rather a statement to the effect of "I'm capable and willing to defend myself, my loved ones, and in extreme scenarios those around me." Which is perfectly reasonable.

It's not considered aggressive or inappropriate for the police to carry. Why not peaceful citizens?

Tat'dGreaser: The F250 comment just struck me as retarded. The Hummer one can be argued but not the truck one. Some people need trucks.

I must have a small penis too. I have a F250 diesel. I also have 2 teenagers and do quite a bit of heavy lifting. I burn biodiesel too..like the smelly hippies. I have to really pay attention, these small cars are like speed bumps to me.

Tat'dGreaser: Well what bothers me is some people's definition of a "gun-nut" is pretty much a blanket statement.

Well in my definition, gun-nuts are the type of people who arm themselves at public NRA rallies outside of VTech the day after a mass-execution. Short of that, one is probably just an enthusiast. Or owner. Then again, by those qualifications, Phil Spector could be called an enthusiast. Turns out he was actually a nut. One never knows which way the blanket's gonna fall.

Churchill2004: It's not considered aggressive or inappropriate for the police to carry. Why not peaceful citizens?

Because, much like the police, one never knows how peaceful a citizen really is. Yet one might be more necessary to arm than the other, according to society's own measure. Isn't that why we have cops?

/just playing devil's advocate for the sake of conversation.

The only people with guns I worry about are the criminals and the cops.

Tat'dGreaser: So my friend who has to tow a horse trailer with her F-350 is trying to make up for her small penis?

Oh I'm sorry, you're just an idiot.

Wow.... somebody is a bit testy today.

thamike: Because, much like the police, one never knows how peaceful a citizen really is. Yet one might be more necessary to arm than the other, according to society's own measure. Isn't that why we have cops?

The original idea was that law enforcement officers really just directed citizens at necessary enforcement efforts. I think it's a shame we've lost that. Besides, police are no handgun Jedis. They're often poorly trained compared to a proficient civilian.

And, of course, the police can't be everywhere.

GaryPDX:

I must have a small penis too. I have a F250 diesel. I also have 2 teenagers and do quite a bit of heavy lifting. I burn biodiesel too..like the smelly hippies. I have to really pay attention, these small cars are like speed bumps to me.

I think all drivers should have to do a stint driving in Houston. Wanna see a combination of gun-nuts and people who crazily careen around the highway in giant monstrosities they don't need? Houston, Texas. It's an experience that shocks one's highway awareness and skill, toute-de-suite.

thamike: Churchill2004: It's not considered aggressive or inappropriate for the police to carry. Why not peaceful citizens?

Because, much like the police, one never knows how peaceful a citizen really is. Yet one might be more necessary to arm than the other, according to society's own measure. Isn't that why we have cops?

/just playing devil's advocate for the sake of conversation.

It takes 8-10 minutes for a cop to show up when I call. A LOT can happen in 8 minutes. I'd rather not be a victim.

Churchill2004: It's not considered aggressive or inappropriate for the police to carry. Why not peaceful citizens?

Exactly. He had a rough childhood and he knows that sometimes your fists may not be enough to protect yourself or your loved ones. There are some people out there who want to harm you and you may not be able to talk them out of it.

thamike: Well in my definition, gun-nuts are the type of people who arm themselves at public NRA rallies outside of VTech the day after a mass-execution. Short of that, one is probably just an enthusiast. Or owner. Then again, by those qualifications, Phil Spector could be called an enthusiast. Turns out he was actually a nut. One never knows which way the blanket's gonna fall.

I never heard of that one. Well being the "glass is half full" kind of guy, maybe they thought someone would want to be a copycat?

Also, a lot of us believe that the VT incident may have been stopped by one responsible gun owner. So there is that.

On that note, if I die in an incident like that and they remember me by releasing white balloons. I'm going to be pissed.

thamike: I think all drivers should have to do a stint driving in Houston. Wanna see a combination of gun-nuts and people who crazily careen around the highway in giant monstrosities they don't need? Houston, Texas. It's an experience that shocks one's highway awareness and skill, toute-de-suite.

I've been there a few times. Went shrimpin in the bay once. That was yummy!! Houston is a whole different planet,,:)

40yoVirgin: Wow.... somebody is a bit testy today.

I am, I apologize. Just keep the F250 comment out and I won't be so much next time. Lets have a rational discussion without the "you are making up for something" argument.

Ron Paul Revere: Churchill is correct. There is a double standard and no logical reason for it. In fact, there's a very logical reason (statistics) to believe that a (non criminal) private gun owner who's carrying is less likely to pull it on you than a cop, and less likely to shoot you than a cop

To be (somewhat) fair, most shoot-outs cops get involved in are because they're enforcing bad laws in bad ways- being uniformed highway robbers or doing no-knock drug prohibition raids. These aren't activities that normal, peaceful citizens engage in. Because they know it's wrong to violently intrude on what people do in their own home or demand money from them.

well this thread will go well.

Ron Paul Revere: Pro tip: The guy who's openly displaying a gun isn't likely to use it to rob a liquor store or shoot you. It's the criminals who don't show their weapon until they've snuck up on you that you have to worry about.

It's also the criminals who can sneak up on a presumed tough-guy who's already shown his cards. Not that I know the statistics of that sort of situation. The problem comes with cross-fire in gunfights between scared citizens and criminals. I'm positive that there are plenty of criminals who didn't deserve to get killed, as well as bystanders and misidentified people that have fallen victim to defensive gunfire.

<b>GaryPDX:</b> <i>I'd rather not be a victim.</i>

Calm down, <b>Gary</b>, nobody's out to get you. Really, it's going to be okay. I'm here. Afterwards we'll all go to the House of Pancakes and you can get extra strawberries on yours. It'll be great.

Personally, if I carried a gun, I wouldn't want anybody to be aware of it. First of all, it's a rude and aggressive act to openly display a firearm in an otherwise peaceful setting. Secondly, I want the element of surprise. That's why I'll never understand anybody, criminal or not, who'd want a nickel-plated handgun. I don't want that sh*t glinting in the moonlight, giving me away.

Churchill2004: To be (somewhat) fair, most shoot-outs cops get involved in are because they're enforcing bad laws in bad ways- being uniformed highway robbers or doing no-knock drug prohibition raids. These aren't activities that normal, peaceful citizens engage in. Because they know it's wrong to violently intrude on what people do in their own home or demand money from them.

Uh...WTH are you talking about?

thamike: Not that I know the statistics of that sort of situation

Not often. They generally won't risk messing with a person with a gun, even if it's being carried openly.

thamike: The problem comes with cross-fire in gunfights between scared citizens and criminals

No more dangerous than cross-fire in gunfights between criminals and police.

Most defensive gun uses, by the way, don't involve an actual discharge.

thamike: I'm positive that there are plenty of criminals who didn't deserve to get killed

If they're presenting what a reasonable person would conclude is a violent threat, I don't really care what they "deserve". A person defending themselves is not a judge imposing a sentence after careful deliberation.

thamike: as well as bystanders and misidentified people that have fallen victim to defensive gunfire

Can you show me when this has happened? Ever?

I can show you cases where people, often innocent bystanders, have been killed by armed men who mistook them for criminals. Except in all the cases I've ever read (several), the shooters were the police.

thamike: First of all, it's a rude and aggressive act to openly display a firearm in an otherwise peaceful setting

Then you'll be getting armed police officers out of schools, won't you?

wyltoknow: Uh...WTH are you talking about?

They go around handing out fines not because they're really improving safety, but because they know they'll get the money and most people won't go through the hassle of fighting it.

At least highway robbers didn't pretend to be doing it for our own good.

Ron Paul Revere: I'd guess they're suburbanites who love scaring the bejesus out of irrational liberals

Sounds like my mid-level gov't employee dad. Ironically enough, he's actually a die-hard radical libertarian whose attitude to his job is somewhat similar to Thomas Jefferson's attitude towards slavery.

Churchill2004: Can you show me when this has happened? Ever?

I can show you cases where people, often innocent bystanders, have been killed by armed men who mistook them for criminals. Except in all the cases I've ever read (several), the shooters were the police.

That's the situation I was talking about. People shooting someone who got the wrong house or family members that got in the way of each other during a burglary. Even store owners with poor aim. Sometimes drunken or high-as-balls friends. It happens. Sure, guns are inanimate objects, tools if you will. But that's kind of a rationalization. Guns aren't meant for anything other than shooting people. So yeah, they're inanimate objects, but they do serve a somewhat sinister purpose.



PISTOL WHIP!?......Mmmmm....Pistol-Whip...

Churchill2004: Then you'll be getting armed police officers out of schools, won't you?

No. They're police officers. Not diner or bar patrons.

wyltoknow: Uh...WTH are you talking about?

You get pulled over and searched. You just sold a car for cash. You happen to have a roach in the ashtray. You've got $10k on you. The cop can say "I think this is drug money" and you NEVER see it again. (They don't have to charge you with a crime to do this.)

Here's a case I found off the bat. (new window)

thamike: No. They're police officers. Not diner or bar patrons.

Sounds like a double standard. You'd let the cops carry but not a lawful citizen.

Ron Paul Revere: Did you miss the part where he said most of those incidents were police shootings?

You're going off of what you think happens. We're telling you what we know because we care enough about the issue to do some learnin'.

I wasn't disputing that, though I'm sure a case against it can be made. It's irrelevant to the point I was making.

thamike: Anybody who is actually afraid to venture outside without being armed to the teeth is exactly the type of person who shouldn't be doing it.

I agree completely. I used to live in a crappy neighborhood, too.

Ron Paul Revere: Pro tip: The guy who's openly displaying a gun isn't likely to use it to rob a liquor store or shoot you. It's the criminals who don't show their weapon until they've snuck up on you that you have to worry about.

And the little old lady driving her Caddy isn't likely to hit the wrong pedal and plow through a Farmer's Market, but that happens several times a year.