You either have the current system or conscription.

Decide.

They did this in WWII as well. I had a teacher in high school who was a drill sargeant in the army. He told us that it wasn't uncommon for mentally retarded young men to be drafted & sent into combat.

Support our Dupes

Now with Flagpin:

"They're awards, Mother. From Army! The seal is for marksmanship, and the gorilla is for Sand Racing."

The army needs ditch diggers too.

Someone's been reading Time Magazine. Prozac warriors. "If we can't kill them for days, we'll kill'em in a daze."

woops...



"They're awards, Mother. From Army! The seal is for marksmanship, and the gorilla is for Sand Racing."

Bathia_Mapes: They did this in WWII as well.

The US military regularly prescribes amphetamines to soldiers and pilots. They've done that for a long time.

And I'll bet that's not even close to scraping the bottom of the barrel...

NewportBarGuy: You either have the current system or conscription.

Decide.

One could argue that conscription would be the better model by far. A wider cross-section of the national talent pool would be represented in the armed forces.

Plus, maybe we wouldn't fight ridiculous, pointless wars started under false pretenses if more people were in the military or had a family member serving.

Cagey B: One could argue that conscription would be the better model by far. A wider cross-section of the national talent pool would be represented in the armed forces.

Plus, maybe we wouldn't fight ridiculous, pointless wars started under false pretenses if more people were in the military or had a family member serving.

That is my contention.

This article from The Onion was ahead of its time.

Sun God: The US military regularly prescribes amphetamines to soldiers and pilots. They've done that for a long time.

Um, no.

/nuff said

Oh, yes sir. Bit me right in the but-tocks.

They said it was a million dollar wound, but the army must keep that money 'cause I still ain't seen a nickel of it.

cute

Cagey B: NewportBarGuy: You either have the current system or conscription.

Decide.

One could argue that conscription would be the better model by far. A wider cross-section of the national talent pool would be represented in the armed forces.

Plus, maybe we wouldn't fight ridiculous, pointless wars started under false pretenses if more people were in the military or had a family member serving.

Vietnam? But then, the war protesters didn't exactly accomplish much...


I'm of two minds regarding the draft. First off, it's immoral and unconstitutional (13th amendment prohibits "involuntary servitude"); but on the other hand it would put higher stakes on the wars.

I'd be all in favor of conscripting every politician that votes for a war, though. 80 year old geezer? Go polish guns and shine shoes in the barracks.

If the war's worth fighting, they'll go along with it; if they're not willing to put themselves in harm's way the war is clearly not that important.

NewportBarGuy,Cagey B

Limit the Pentagon to only recruiting troops from families ABOVE a certain income level and I'll be there wouldn't be a war for a hundred years.

I used to know a Green Beret. Biggest insult to the military possible: a momma's boy, alcoholic, totally whipped by his ex-wife (that left him twice before, both times having been caught cheating on him), and I think a closet homosexual (making his problems with his ex-wife even more troubling). And when his problems screwed him up horribly (hit rock bottom a few times), the army pretended to clean him up.

Not saying the army is full of incompetent morons, but they seem to have a bad filter on who's an acceptable soldier and who isn't.

In every organization, in every Army the world round, you will find people like him. Newsweek has really got a handful of straw on this one. Is it news? Well, kinda yes but much more no.

doglover: Limit the Pentagon to only recruiting troops from families ABOVE a certain income level and I'll be there wouldn't be a war for a hundred years.

You'd be very, very wrong. Joe Kennedy lost his favorite son.

It has nothing to do with income level and everything to do with hubris, as a country.

We can't fix everything with military engagement and we need to learn that right now. Good luck selling that fact.

I know I met a few cav scouts in training while I was in basic at Knox that were...um.... well, I like the adjective "Gumpian".

On the other hand, from a Darwinist perspective shouldn't we be for this ?

Hey, whatta ya' know... They really did take Forrest Gump.



(the actor who played the young Forrest Gump... In fairness, he sounds (new window) like a pretty sharp guy.)

step 1: Offer 2 strike felons (non-sex crimes or murderers) a removal of 1 strike from their records upon completion of a 6 year military commitment and at 1/4 pay (full veterans benefits remain). At the end of their terms if they still have time on their sentence, it can be commuted and have their remaining strike waived if they re-enlist. Their first enlistment period would be in prisoner only units, from boot camp through deployment. Any violation of the military code of justice (or whatever it's proper term is)would result in automatic imprisonment as a 3rd strike and they would be returned to prison.

Step 2:?
Step 3: Mass Profit?

you have to be very dumb to serve the military.

/just saying

Tard wars!

L. Heimdall: I know I met a few cav scouts in training while I was in basic at Knox that were...um.... well, I like the adjective "Gumpian".

Ad carceres a calce revocari, gumpinstein.

What was that? You met who, doing what now?

homerdrew415: step 1: Offer 2 strike felons (non-sex crimes or murderers) a removal of 1 strike from their records upon completion of a 6 year military commitment and at 1/4 pay (full veterans benefits remain). At the end of their terms if they still have time on their sentence, it can be commuted and have their remaining strike waived if they re-enlist. Their first enlistment period would be in prisoner only units, from boot camp through deployment. Any violation of the military code of justice (or whatever it's proper term is)would result in automatic imprisonment as a 3rd strike and they would be returned to prison.

Oh, awesome idea! We should also start using prisoners in medical studies!

Do they let you take all your medication in the army? I mean, lots of it? What if you need your prozac when your in Liberia...?
If you go funny from lack of meds on the field its.. uh... bad.
/brain functions
//the stopped

Devil Slide Wolf: you have to be very dumb to serve the military.

/just sayingtrolling

NewportBarGuy [TotalFark] Quote 2008-06-22 04:19:48 AM
You either have the current system or conscription.

Decide.


This is not a binary equation. Your cute attempt to make it one trivializes things.

This man was failed several times. First when they falsely admitted him into the military service, secondly when they didn't drum him out in training, thirdly when they gave him medical treatment for his 'condition' (and failed to remove him from service despite the fact that he was unfit) and fourthly because they sent his incompetent ass into action.

tonesskin: homerdrew415: step 1: Offer 2 strike felons (non-sex crimes or murderers) a removal of 1 strike from their records upon completion of a 6 year military commitment and at 1/4 pay (full veterans benefits remain). At the end of their terms if they still have time on their sentence, it can be commuted and have their remaining strike waived if they re-enlist. Their first enlistment period would be in prisoner only units, from boot camp through deployment. Any violation of the military code of justice (or whatever it's proper term is)would result in automatic imprisonment as a 3rd strike and they would be returned to prison.

Oh, awesome idea! We should also start using prisoners in medical studies!

Well we already do that now so what's the difference?

Devil Slide Wolf: you have to be very dumb to serve the military.

/just saying

Today? Definitely. In the past? Not so much. It used to be one of the best career paths available, and some of the veterans alive today (the ones from wars over 30 years ago) still get taken very good care of by the military- financially and medically.

Some fell through the cracks or have suffered from the modern cutbacks on veteran care, but for a long time serving in the military really was a smart thing to do financially. Now?
You'd be lucky to pay for college via 2 or 3 years (whatever the claim is) of military service.

It's quite shameful what the various budget cuts have done to the actual people serving in the military- while at the same time they turn around and pump even more money into private contractors.

It's at the point now where it's outright stupid to join the military.

homerdrew415 - step 1: Offer 2 strike felons (non-sex crimes or murderers) a removal of 1 strike from their records upon completion of a 6 year military commitment and at 1/4 pay (full veterans benefits remain). At the end of their terms if they still have time on their sentence, it can be commuted and have their remaining strike waived if they re-enlist. Their first enlistment period would be in prisoner only units, from boot camp through deployment. Any violation of the military code of justice (or whatever it's proper term is)would result in automatic imprisonment as a 3rd strike and they would be returned to prison.

Step 2:?
Step 3: Mass Profit?

Doesn't think your idea is very original...

but approves nonetheless.

You do realize that police departments across the nation screen people OUT for scoring too high on intelligence tests.

This is old news.

I never claimed originality, but dammit our prison system sucks and the Army needs recruits. The Navy & the Air Force are having no problem filling their quotas.

log_jammin: Devil Slide Wolf: you have to be very dumb to serve the military.

/just sayingtrolling

Um, no. He's really not. Joining the military today- or really any time in this decade, if not any time since Vietnam- is a decision borne out of either stupidity, desperation, or delusion.

There is no longer anything honorable about serving in the military.

I had a soldier that was very similar to the case in Newsweek. I did everything to get this soldier treated and kept from deployment. His father was a full-bird, and didn't want to see his son fail in the military.

The two things I had to deal with were getting the soldier the proper treatment for when he left the army, and keeping him out of combat situations. I put him in company admin to keep him from going outside the "wire". He finaly got some treatment, but it wasn't enough to keep him up to speed with his peers. He was finally discharged. The Army recruiting system let this poor guy in,"passes" basic training, then it's the combaqt or line units that have to deal with him. He's the kind of guy that would have put his fellow soldiers in danger, not just himself.

Cyber_Junk: NewportBarGuy [TotalFark] Quote 2008-06-22 04:19:48 AM
You either have the current system or conscription.

Decide.


This is not a binary equation. Your cute attempt to make it one trivializes things.

This man was failed several times. First when they falsely admitted him into the military service, secondly when they didn't drum him out in training, thirdly when they gave him medical treatment for his 'condition' (and failed to remove him from service despite the fact that he was unfit) and fourthly because they sent his incompetent ass into action.

Not even close. I hate the current system of waivers and BS. I find it funny that those that mock the draft army revel in their accomplishments.

Happy medium, please. 2 years in the Army, USAID, Peace Corps or 4H.

There we go, problem solved.

Devil Slide Wolf: you have to be very dumb to serve the military.

/just saying

man. go slap yourself.
There are plenty of very intelligent people who serve in the military. There are plenty of valid reasons to serve. anyone who says that only "very dumb" people serve, is obviously dumb themselves.

There was a mash episode on this. The one where the injured guy said that he had been babysitting this retarded guy since basic. He was being sent home because of his wounds and this retarded guy couldn't survivie in the army, but another buddy took over the job of babysitting him.

Dire: Tard wars!

hehe

Devil Slide Wolf: you have to be very dumb to serve the military.

/just saying

5/10

homerdrew415: I never claimed originality, but dammit our prison system sucks and the Army needs recruits. The Navy & the Air Force are having no problem filling their quotas.

It's worth noting that in extended occupation scenarios, the Army (and National Guard, disturbingly) people are the ones who are at risk. The Air Force and Navy are more useful in outright war. Let's face it, right now our AF and Navy are sitting outside Iraq and Afghanistan launching missiles and bombs. They're basically safe. It's the Iraqi Police Army that's in harm's way.

Not to mention that it's arguable that in modern warfare (real warfare, not this extended occuption bullshiat) a country focused on self-defense doesn't actually need an army unless it has hostile neighbors. Despite what delusional idiots will tell you about Mexico, America has no need for ground forces- unless it intends to conquer territory.

TheCid: There is no longer anything honorable about serving in the military.

I don't even know why I bother reading any threads that have to do with the military. They're only feeding grounds for trolls.

Are those... live rounds?

Devil Slide Wolf: you have to be very dumb to serve the military.

Perhaps it's not the career move it was 20 or 30 years ago but it is up to the individual and what they do with the experience. I was in the USN for 8 years ('89-'97) working as an aviation meteorologist (AG). I have to admit that if it wasn't for the experience I don't think I would have finished college or gone on to have a successful career in IT.

\btw; if you're trolling, which I suspect you are, it was a weak effort

TheCid: log_jammin: Devil Slide Wolf: you have to be very dumb to serve the military.

/just sayingtrolling

Um, no. He's really not. Joining the military today- or really any time in this decade, if not any time since Vietnam- is a decision borne out of either stupidity, desperation, or delusion.

There is no longer anything honorable about serving in the military.

Do you really have such a narrow vision, or are you trying to start a little flame war?

Nescio quid dicas: Um, no.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/org/news/2002/021222-gopills01.htm

Um, yes.

Burchill: Are those... live rounds?

Sometime you worry about the Private Pyle scenario with those few soldiers on the edge.