eqtworld: The biggest fark up of this whole thing is that gas is expensive.

I get the whole "Let's invade your country and take your shiat" thing, really I do, but we forgot the most important part. WE WERE SUPPOSED TO TAKE THEIR shiat. What country invades another country, WINS, suffers 1/100th the casualty rate of the other country and still manages to lose a trillion dollars (or the equivalent) in the process?

That is not how you play the game. Gas should be 50cents a gallon. Did the Native Americans get rich during the California gold rush of the 1840s? No, they did not. We killed them and took their shiat, THAT is the way the game is played.

Your attitude is certainly pragmatic, but I hope you're not saying that you morally approve of such conduct.

I think what he's getting at is not only was the war morally wrong, we didn't even GAIN anything out of it.

eqtworld:

what he said.

whether war is morally wrong (in all cases) is a subject for debate. lots of right wing people believe in plunder wars like iraq, but they could at least farking pull it off. that's both immoral and FAIL.

TheCid: I think what he's getting at is not only was the war morally wrong, we didn't even GAIN anything out of it.

Yeah, no shiat. 100,000 civilians, 4,000 troops, a trillion dollars, we look like asses in front of the rest of the world, and what do we have to show for it? $4 a gallon gas.

Way to go, Bush.

TheCid

I think what he's getting at is not only was the war morally wrong, we didn't even GAIN anything out of it.

What do you mean "we," Mr. non-stockholder-in-oil-companies?

TheCid: I think what he's getting at is not only was the war morally wrong, we didn't even GAIN anything out of it.

Speak for yourself. I feel like I've "gained" about 10 pounds every time Jabba the Exxon guy sticks his dick up my ass at the gas pump.



It wouldn't be so bad if he was at least good looking :(

oldebayer: TheCid

I think what he's getting at is not only was the war morally wrong, we didn't even GAIN anything out of it.

What do you mean "we," Mr. non-stockholder-in-oil-companies?

Yup. The people who were supposed to profit did just fine. You and I were not in the equation.

Subby had too much kool aid today.

Yes, that's right, we're going to have a military presence and an ally in the Middle East again... Like the one we had before Jimmy Carter screwed the whole region over in the late 70s.

people have said it in various ways here but ill say it again

I'd rather be duped by Obama and have 4 years of the sameoldsameold than have McCain and KNOW we are getting the sameold

its like a david blaine trick.....id rather have him do a really cool trick I didn't see coming rather than be the mcccain masked magician and spoil the fun for everyon

Every time a reader leaves Daily Kos for Think Progress, it raises the average IQ of both websites.

This is just like a certain non-permanent base we've been leasing from Cuba for over 100 years.

randomjsa: Yes, that's right, we're going to have a military presence and an ally in the Middle East again... Like the one we had before Jimmy Carter screwed the whole region over in the late 70s.

That's funny, I seem to remember that we did have an ally in the Middle East for most of the 80s, until George Bush didn't rein him in when he was hinting at invading Kuwait. We all know how that worked out.

runningwiz: This is just like a certain non-permanent base we've been leasing from Cuba for over 100 years.

Mr. Castro never cashed a single check.

But but but.... Bush's friends sure farking scored :/

Those bases are just there to make sure they have enough freedom!

There's no way they're there to ensure that America and American interests control the economy and the courts in Iraq (and therefore the country) for the foreseeable future. No way.

/sarcasm off

If there's a clearer illustration of the evil that is "nation building" at the point of a gun, I can't think of it.

let me rephrase that

when you have your tit caught in the ringer, you want the good cop over the bad cop

in the same way that people say OBAMA OSAMA...hes a turrist

or he's a homo....hes a sinner

mcccain is representing the people who have been sodomising us for 8 years. he has a TON of work to do and he bears Bush's load.

we want...not-bush. and the new horse in town is that change. even hilary is better than bush.

people are dmb and will assosiate mccain with bush...that is inevitable.

obama just has to keep mccains arm twisted. because mccain has to backpeddal AND THEN move forward

he has to answer questions about how he ISNT a bush

so that's time wasted

/26 and interested in politics for the 1st time. I'm a pretty negative and cynical person....it may be ignorant or naive, but he is putting hope in a dark empty hole...i have no hope for humanity and even if I'm a fool for beliving there can be change, I'm willing to be fooled.

So all the US needs to do now to finish transforming Iraq in to a more violent version of Saudi Arabia is to install an oppressive dictatorship. Perhaps then all the Saudi terrorists will have some competition.

randomjsa: Yes, that's right, we're going to have a military presence and an ally in the Middle East again... Like the one we had before Jimmy Carter screwed the whole region over in the late 70s.

????WTF? Carter was about 100 times better as President than GW. Of course, so was every other president we ever had.

Ally? The Shah? That's sorta like a tapeworm for weight loss.

3_Butt_Cheeks: Subby had too much kool aid today.

0/10. You've been trolling for about a week now and already you're phoning it in.

eqtworld: I am just saying they farked up no matter how you look at it. We have all the drawbacks of going to war (death, financial loss etc..), and none of the benefits of wining one

I've felt this for quite a while now - can any of these bastards be held accountable? Will they?

These are just the attacks by Iraqis to keep us from getting their oil since 2007.

I'm sorry for Mr. Bush and his oil gang, but its just another failed Bush oil deal.


2007
387. January 10 - Up to 50 Iraqi militants armed with RPG-7 as well as light and medium weapons ambushed a large force of the Oil Protection Force, whom were transporting security equipment. Sources indicated that more than 20 of the Oil Protection Force personnel were killed and more than 20 injured.
388. January 11 - An oil pipeline of the Northern Oil Company was sabotaged and breached near Kirkuk and the oil spill set ablaze.
389. January 21 - Insurgents assaulted guards protecting an oil facility, seized their weapons and vehicles and set an oil well on fire in the town of Dibs.
390. January 22 - An oil technician - an employee of the Northern Oil Company Ltd - was shot to death in the northern city of Mosul.
391. January 23 - A roadside IED detonated near a minibus carrying workers of the Northern Oil Company Ltd while travelling to the oil-refinery city of Baiji, 112 miles north of Baghdad. There were no casualties.
392.February 11 - Gunmen killed Lieutenant Colonel Jamal Mohammad, the chief of serious crimes office of the Oil Protection Force at Bayji and wounded two of his guards. Reports claimed that two of the attackers were also killed.
393. February 12 - Insurgents placed two IEDs on a well of the Northern Oil Company near Kirkut. The explosions destroyed the well and set the oil ablaze.
394. February 13 - Insurgents attacked and destroyed a road tanker with of the National Guard on the highway near Al Buwarah. The driver was killed and a passenger wounded.
395. February 19 - Iraqi insurgents deployed a suicide bomber in a road tanker north of Baghdad.
396. February 20 - Six people were killed and 105 injured after a suicide IED detonated his device in a fuel tanker in the town of At Taji, north of Baghdad.
397. February 23 - A VBIED incorporated into a road fuel tanker exploded in a market in the town of Buhayrat al Habbaniyah in the province of Anba. The explosion killed 40 people and injured 64.
398. February 25 - Two labourers of an oil company were killed and one wounded by a roadside bomb in Kirkuk.
399. February 27 - A convoy of four road tankers carrying oil products was stopped shortly after it left the Bayji refinery by Iraqi militants. The militants shot and killed the drivers and burned the vehicles and the cargo.
400. March 25 - Insurgents killed Ali Amin, director of a gas company, near his house in a drive-by shooting in Mosul.
401. March 26 - A roadside IED destroyed a fuel tanker killing the vehicle crew.
402. March 26 - Insurgents detonated an IED beneath an oil pipeline near Bayji. The attack started an oil fire that burned for several hours before it could be extinguished.
403. April 1 - Insurgents attacked a road tanker contracted to carry fuel to the US military. The incident occurred near a fertilizer factory in the middle of the Muhafazat Salah ad Din province. The vehicle was destroyed in the ensuing fire and both the driver and guard was injured.
404. April 4 - Fuel outlet guard shot dead, Insurgents attacked a petrol station in al Kut, 100 miles southeast of Baghdad, killing one guard and wounding another.
405. April 5 - Insurgents ruptured an oil pipeline with an IED near the border with Kuwait, cutting off supplies from surrounding fields to storage tanks in Basra. The attack occurred just north of Safwan on a pipeline operated by the South Oil Company. The explosion started a major fire which took several hours to extinguish.
406. April 5 - A road tanker supplying coalition forces with fuel was attacked near al-Rayashia in Bayji city with a roadside IED which destroyed the tanker and killed the driver and escort.
407. April 6 - Insurgents detonated an IED under an oil pipeline in southern Kirkut which carries oil from Kirkuk to the Baiji refineries, starting a major fire. The incident occurred near the main road linking Kirkuk to the district of al-Huweija.
408. April 9 - An oil protection guard was killed in a IED attack north of Basra. Two Iraqi soldiers were also killed in the same attack.
409. April 10 - Militants wounded seven employees working in the North Oil Company when they attacked their vehicle.
410. April 14 - A convoy of road tankers from Iran was ambushed and the drivers, five Iranians and one Iraqi, were abducted near the town of Qada' Khanaqin. The following day an Iraqi National Guard patrol found the bodies of the drivers.
411. April 14 - A road tanker supplying fuel to coalition forces near Hadithah was destroyed by a roadside IED. The driver and escort were killed.
412. April 15 - A roadside IED destroyed a fuel tanker supplying fuel to the coalition forces. The incident occurred on the highway near the Japanese bridge in the al-Saklaweya region. The driver and escort was killed in the attack.
413. April 15 - A vehicle of the Oil Ministry was attacked by insurgents in al-Tamah quarter but the passengers escaped.
414. April 15 - Insurgents attacked an Iraqi military base in Mosul with VBIEDs constructed from hijacked fuel tankers. Six Iraqi soldiers were killed in the attack.
415. April 17 - One person was killed and four others were wounded when a suicide bomber detonated his IED that was incorporated into a fuel tanker near an Iraqi army base in the city of Mosul.
416. April 19 - An insurgent suicide VBIED bomber rammed his car into a fuel tanker, killing 10 people and wounding 21 in the southern Jadidah district of Baghdad.
417. April 24 - A suicide VBIED, constructed from a hi-jacked fuel tanker, was detonated on the outskirts of ar-Ramadi City killing six people and wounding another 25.
418. April 29 - An oil pipeline was ruptured near al-Musayyib, about 30 miles south of Baghdad, sending up a large plume of black smoke. The pipeline carries oil from Daura refinery in Baghdad to al- Musayyib power station.
419. April 29 - Insurgents abducted in Bayji the commander of the Facilities Protection Service (FPS) of the Bayji refinery and his driver.
420. April 29 - A large group of insurgents travelling in about 30 vehicles attacked a convoy of 16 fuel tankers and kidnapped the drivers and escorts on a main road near the city of Samarra. The vehicles and their loads were were set alight and destroyed.
421. April 30 - A stolen fuel tanker laden with explosives and chlorine gas was detonated by a suicide bomber near a restaurant west of ar-Ramadi, killing six people and wounding 10 more.
422. May 2 - Suspected Sunni insurgents hijacked four fuel tanker near al-Fallujah, 40 miles west of Baghdad. The insurgents killed the four drivers and took the tankers wither cargo intact.
423. May 4 - Armed insurgents attacked a convoy of 51 fuel tankers and set them on fire on the highway between Bayji and Samarra. The tankers were loaded with oil products from the country's main refinery complex in Bayji and were reported to be on their way to Ramadi west of Baghdad. The two cities are on the route between the refineries and the Turkish borders. The fate of the divers is currently not known.
424. May 4 - A roadside IED detonated as a road tanker was passing, wounding the driver and setting the vehicle on fire in Mosul. The vehicle and its load were destroyed.
425. May 7 - Four Iraqi insurgents were arrested after Iraqi troops found a large IED planted under an oil pipeline in northern Iraq that carries crude oil to Turkey. About 350 kilograms of TNT were discovered under a stretch of the pipeline in the al-Kasak area, some 80 kilometres west of Mosul. The explosives were removed and safely destroyed.
426. May 12 - A suicide VBIED, constructed from a road tanker, detonated at a police checkpoint on a bridges in a Shi'ite area south of Baghdad, killing 22 people and wounding 60.
427. May 14 - Insurgents abducted nine people from a mini-bus on their way to work at the Bayji oil refinery.
428. May 17 - Three fuel tanker drivers were killed after they were attacked on a road between Mosul and Kirkuk.
429. May 18 - An engineer of the Northern Oil Company was wounded along with two other civilians in a bombing targeting his residence in Kirkuk.
430. May 19 - A roadiside IED in Hawijah wounded four oil employees who were driving past as it detonated.
431. May 20 - A suicide VBIED constructed from a hijacked road tanker killed at least two police officers near a checkpoint outside an open market in ar-Ramadi. Nine other nine officers were wounded. Police opened fire on the vehcile as it approached the checkpoint but the bomber still managed to initiate the device.
432. May 20 - Militants attacked the Oil Protection Force (OPF) patrol while others detonated an IED under an oil pipeline in a complex attack near Kirkuk. The attack targeted a patrol of the 1st Infrastructure Brigade (Oil Protection) during the early hours of 20 May near the village of al-Safra on the Kirkuk-Baiji highway, (65 km) southwest of Kirkuk. Whilst engaged in an exchange of SAF, a second insurgent group placed an explosive charge under the pipeline which detonated, rupturing it over a 2m segment.
433. May 20 - Insurgents ruptured an oil by-products pipeline on fire when they detonated an IED beneath it in the village of Safra, 65 km (40 miles) southwest of Kirkuk. The pipeline is utilized by the Northern Oil Company Ltd.
434. May 21 - Insurgents sabotaged a disused oil well in northern Iraq early in the morning, causing a significant fire. The well is owned by the Northern Oil Company Ltd. An IED attached to to the well functioned at about 04:00hrs LT in the Hanjira area, about 25 kilometres (12 miles) northwest of Kirkuk.
435. May 28 - Three soldiers of the Oil Protection Force (OPF) guarding an oil pipeline in Kirkuk were injured.
436. June 1 - An unconfirmed number of security personnel from the Oil Protection Force (OPF) were ambushed and kidnapped by insurgents on the main road to the south-west of Kirkuk.
437. June 4 - A roadside IED detonated while a road tanker was passing it in centre (financial district) of western Mosul. The tanker caught fire and was destroyed and the driver was injured.
438. June 4 - One civilian was killed and another wounded when a guard assigned to protect oil establishments in Kut opened fire on masses of people gathered in front of a new petrol station.
439. June 5 - A fuel tanker was damaged beyond repair and a fuel retail outlet damaged near the US Forward Operating Base at al-Mahmudiyah. An IED, estimated to incorporate about 5Kg of explosives, detonated in the cab of the vehicle.
440. June 5 - Insurgents attacked an oil pipeline near Bayji.The device ruptured the pipeline, setting fire to the resulatant oil spill.
441. June 9 - A suicide vehicle constructed using a road tanker detonated at an Iraqi army checkpoint outside in the town of al-Iskandariyah, killing at least Iraqi 13 soldiers.
442. June 11 - Ten people died in an explosion after a fuel tanker loaded with gasoline, was deliberately crashed into the Tikrit police command, destroying its two-storey building.
443. June 16 - Three men belonging from the Oil Protection Force (OPF)were wounded when a roadside IED detonated near their patrol vehicle on the Riadh-Kirkuk road.
444. June 20 - Insurgents attacked and ruptured a domestic gas pipeline that feeds power stations in northern Iraq.
445. June 21 - A suicide truck constructed from a oil tanker was detonated south Kirkuk, killing 12 people and wounding 70, including policemen and local politicians.
446. June 22 - In southern Baghdad, US soldiers on a routine patrol searched a suspicious fuel tanker and discovered it had been converted into a VBIED. The explosive charge consisted of 14 x 155 mm artillery shells.
447. June 23 - Two officers of the Oil protection Force (OPF), assigned to protect oil pipelines were wounded during an attack on their post 25 miles west of Kirkuk.
448. June 25 - Fifteen people were killed when a suicide bomber ploughed a VBIED constructed from a fuel tanker into the police headquarters of the northern Iraqi town of Bayji. Another 50 people, mostly civilians, were wounded in the attack.
449. June 29 - An IED detonated under an oil pipeline in the al-Mowehlah area of Abu Haswah south of Baghdad, spilling crude oil and sparking a large fire.
450. July 1 - Insurgents attacked a fuel outlet with multiple IED's which resulted in total destruction. The incident occurred in the small Sunni town of Tall al Mishayah, north of Baghdad. There were no casualties.
451. July 1 - in Kirkuk, an Iraqi soldier assigned to bolster local Oil Protection Force (OPF) personnel was fatally shot by insurgents.
452. July 1 - Coalition forces neutralised an IED that had been intended to sabotage an oil pipeline southwest of Kirkuk.
453. July 3 - Insurgents hijacked four oil tanker trucks that were carrying gasoline to Baghdad on the highway north of Hilla.
454. July 6 - Insurgents detonated a roadside IED near an Iraqi Oil Protection Force (OPF) patrol vehicle near Kirkuk, killing one soldier and injuring another three, including an officer.
455. July 11 - Oil Protection Force (OPF) guards clashed with smugglers and confiscated four tankers full of crude oil near a pipeline connecting the Luhais and Rumaylah North oil fields (50 km west of Basrah). There were no casualties in the incident.
456. July 11 - A coast guard was wounded during clashes with armed oil smugglers in the Shatt Al-Arab waterway near the port of Abu Al-Khasib (20 km south east of Basrah).
457. July 12 - In Mosul, the body of an Oil Protection Force (OPF) guard was found on 12 July. Yassin Mohasen Aayed, was killed by gunmen in al-Jesr al-Khames in western Mosul.
458. July 14 - An Iraqi oil tanker was destroyed during a US airstrike in the Shiite area of al-Ubaidi in east Baghdad.
459. July 17 - Just outside the northern town of Bayji, a Turkish truck driver died when a roadside IED targeted his vehicle. The vehicle was destroyed in the ensuing fire.
460. July 18 - In al-Latifiya insurgents hijacked a convoy of three tanker trucks carrying crude oil to the ad-Daura refinery. They killed the drivers took the vehicles wither cargo.
461. July 23 - three employees of Iraqi Oil Ministry were killed and another injured in a small-arms attack on their vehicle in Baghdad.
462. September 18 - Iraq's northern oil export pipeline to Turkey was badly damaged in a sabotage attack.
463. October 19 - insurgents blew up a pipeline near Kirkuk that carried oil to the Bayji refinery.
464. Nov. 11 - An explosion damaged a pipeline near the northern city of Kirkuk.
465. Dec. 7 - An oil pipeline was bombed near Al-Fatah, 75 miles west of Kirkuk.
2008
466. Jan. 7 - An explosion at a fuel storage tank caused a huge blaze at the Bayji refinery, injuring at least 36 workers.
467. Feb 10 - A car bomb exploded at a power station in Mosul, killing four civilians and causing power outages.
468. Feb. 11 - An explosion struck a gas pipeline transporting unrefined gas from Kirkuk to the Bayji refinery.
469. March 27 - Gunmen blew up an oil pipeline in Zubair area west of Basra.
Iraq Pipeline Watch is now being updated only sporadically and may not be a complete log of attacks. Feel free to send information about attacks to i­nfo­sgaio­rg.

http://www.iags.org/iraqpipelinewatch.htm


They will never let us take their oil. It won't happen

tryptik: eqtworld: I am just saying they farked up no matter how you look at it. We have all the drawbacks of going to war (death, financial loss etc..), and none of the benefits of wining one

I've felt this for quite a while now - can any of these bastards be held accountable? Will they?

Yes, they can but, no, they won't.

These are just the attacks by Iraqis to keep us from getting their oil since 2007.

I'm sorry for Mr. Bush and his oil gang, but its just another failed Bush oil deal.


2007
387. January 10 - Up to 50 Iraqi militants armed with RPG-7 as well as light and medium weapons ambushed a large force of the Oil Protection Force, whom were transporting security equipment. Sources indicated that more than 20 of the Oil Protection Force personnel were killed and more than 20 injured.
388. January 11 - An oil pipeline of the Northern Oil Company was sabotaged and breached near Kirkuk and the oil spill set ablaze.
389. January 21 - Insurgents assaulted guards protecting an oil facility, seized their weapons and vehicles and set an oil well on fire in the town of Dibs.
390. January 22 - An oil technician - an employee of the Northern Oil Company Ltd - was shot to death in the northern city of Mosul.
391. January 23 - A roadside IED detonated near a minibus carrying workers of the Northern Oil Company Ltd while travelling to the oil-refinery city of Baiji, 112 miles north of Baghdad. There were no casualties.
392.February 11 - Gunmen killed Lieutenant Colonel Jamal Mohammad, the chief of serious crimes office of the Oil Protection Force at Bayji and wounded two of his guards. Reports claimed that two of the attackers were also killed.
393. February 12 - Insurgents placed two IEDs on a well of the Northern Oil Company near Kirkut. The explosions destroyed the well and set the oil ablaze.
394. February 13 - Insurgents attacked and destroyed a road tanker with of the National Guard on the highway near Al Buwarah. The driver was killed and a passenger wounded.
395. February 19 - Iraqi insurgents deployed a suicide bomber in a road tanker north of Baghdad.
396. February 20 - Six people were killed and 105 injured after a suicide IED detonated his device in a fuel tanker in the town of At Taji, north of Baghdad.
397. February 23 - A VBIED incorporated into a road fuel tanker exploded in a market in the town of Buhayrat al Habbaniyah in the province of Anba. The explosion killed 40 people and injured 64.
398. February 25 - Two labourers of an oil company were killed and one wounded by a roadside bomb in Kirkuk.
399. February 27 - A convoy of four road tankers carrying oil products was stopped shortly after it left the Bayji refinery by Iraqi militants. The militants shot and killed the drivers and burned the vehicles and the cargo.
400. March 25 - Insurgents killed Ali Amin, director of a gas company, near his house in a drive-by shooting in Mosul.
401. March 26 - A roadside IED destroyed a fuel tanker killing the vehicle crew.
402. March 26 - Insurgents detonated an IED beneath an oil pipeline near Bayji. The attack started an oil fire that burned for several hours before it could be extinguished.
403. April 1 - Insurgents attacked a road tanker contracted to carry fuel to the US military. The incident occurred near a fertilizer factory in the middle of the Muhafazat Salah ad Din province. The vehicle was destroyed in the ensuing fire and both the driver and guard was injured.
404. April 4 - Fuel outlet guard shot dead, Insurgents attacked a petrol station in al Kut, 100 miles southeast of Baghdad, killing one guard and wounding another.
405. April 5 - Insurgents ruptured an oil pipeline with an IED near the border with Kuwait, cutting off supplies from surrounding fields to storage tanks in Basra. The attack occurred just north of Safwan on a pipeline operated by the South Oil Company. The explosion started a major fire which took several hours to extinguish.
406. April 5 - A road tanker supplying coalition forces with fuel was attacked near al-Rayashia in Bayji city with a roadside IED which destroyed the tanker and killed the driver and escort.
407. April 6 - Insurgents detonated an IED under an oil pipeline in southern Kirkut which carries oil from Kirkuk to the Baiji refineries, starting a major fire. The incident occurred near the main road linking Kirkuk to the district of al-Huweija.
408. April 9 - An oil protection guard was killed in a IED attack north of Basra. Two Iraqi soldiers were also killed in the same attack.
409. April 10 - Militants wounded seven employees working in the North Oil Company when they attacked their vehicle.
410. April 14 - A convoy of road tankers from Iran was ambushed and the drivers, five Iranians and one Iraqi, were abducted near the town of Qada' Khanaqin. The following day an Iraqi National Guard patrol found the bodies of the drivers.
411. April 14 - A road tanker supplying fuel to coalition forces near Hadithah was destroyed by a roadside IED. The driver and escort were killed.
412. April 15 - A roadside IED destroyed a fuel tanker supplying fuel to the coalition forces. The incident occurred on the highway near the Japanese bridge in the al-Saklaweya region. The driver and escort was killed in the attack.
413. April 15 - A vehicle of the Oil Ministry was attacked by insurgents in al-Tamah quarter but the passengers escaped.
414. April 15 - Insurgents attacked an Iraqi military base in Mosul with VBIEDs constructed from hijacked fuel tankers. Six Iraqi soldiers were killed in the attack.
415. April 17 - One person was killed and four others were wounded when a suicide bomber detonated his IED that was incorporated into a fuel tanker near an Iraqi army base in the city of Mosul.
416. April 19 - An insurgent suicide VBIED bomber rammed his car into a fuel tanker, killing 10 people and wounding 21 in the southern Jadidah district of Baghdad.
417. April 24 - A suicide VBIED, constructed from a hi-jacked fuel tanker, was detonated on the outskirts of ar-Ramadi City killing six people and wounding another 25.
418. April 29 - An oil pipeline was ruptured near al-Musayyib, about 30 miles south of Baghdad, sending up a large plume of black smoke. The pipeline carries oil from Daura refinery in Baghdad to al- Musayyib power station.
419. April 29 - Insurgents abducted in Bayji the commander of the Facilities Protection Service (FPS) of the Bayji refinery and his driver.
420. April 29 - A large group of insurgents travelling in about 30 vehicles attacked a convoy of 16 fuel tankers and kidnapped the drivers and escorts on a main road near the city of Samarra. The vehicles and their loads were were set alight and destroyed.
421. April 30 - A stolen fuel tanker laden with explosives and chlorine gas was detonated by a suicide bomber near a restaurant west of ar-Ramadi, killing six people and wounding 10 more.
422. May 2 - Suspected Sunni insurgents hijacked four fuel tanker near al-Fallujah, 40 miles west of Baghdad. The insurgents killed the four drivers and took the tankers wither cargo intact.
423. May 4 - Armed insurgents attacked a convoy of 51 fuel tankers and set them on fire on the highway between Bayji and Samarra. The tankers were loaded with oil products from the country's main refinery complex in Bayji and were reported to be on their way to Ramadi west of Baghdad. The two cities are on the route between the refineries and the Turkish borders. The fate of the divers is currently not known.
424. May 4 - A roadside IED detonated as a road tanker was passing, wounding the driver and setting the vehicle on fire in Mosul. The vehicle and its load were destroyed.
425. May 7 - Four Iraqi insurgents were arrested after Iraqi troops found a large IED planted under an oil pipeline in northern Iraq that carries crude oil to Turkey. About 350 kilograms of TNT were discovered under a stretch of the pipeline in the al-Kasak area, some 80 kilometres west of Mosul. The explosives were removed and safely destroyed.
426. May 12 - A suicide VBIED, constructed from a road tanker, detonated at a police checkpoint on a bridges in a Shi'ite area south of Baghdad, killing 22 people and wounding 60.
427. May 14 - Insurgents abducted nine people from a mini-bus on their way to work at the Bayji oil refinery.
428. May 17 - Three fuel tanker drivers were killed after they were attacked on a road between Mosul and Kirkuk.
429. May 18 - An engineer of the Northern Oil Company was wounded along with two other civilians in a bombing targeting his residence in Kirkuk.
430. May 19 - A roadiside IED in Hawijah wounded four oil employees who were driving past as it detonated.
431. May 20 - A suicide VBIED constructed from a hijacked road tanker killed at least two police officers near a checkpoint outside an open market in ar-Ramadi. Nine other nine officers were wounded. Police opened fire on the vehcile as it approached the checkpoint but the bomber still managed to initiate the device.
432. May 20 - Militants attacked the Oil Protection Force (OPF) patrol while others detonated an IED under an oil pipeline in a complex attack near Kirkuk. The attack targeted a patrol of the 1st Infrastructure Brigade (Oil Protection) during the early hours of 20 May near the village of al-Safra on the Kirkuk-Baiji highway, (65 km) southwest of Kirkuk. Whilst engaged in an exchange of SAF, a second insurgent group placed an explosive charge under the pipeline which detonated, rupturing it over a 2m segment.
433. May 20 - Insurgents ruptured an oil by-products pipeline on fire when they detonated an IED beneath it in the village of Safra, 65 km (40 miles) southwest of Kirkuk. The pipeline is utilized by the Northern Oil Company Ltd.
434. May 21 - Insurgents sabotaged a disused oil well in northern Iraq early in the morning, causing a significant fire. The well is owned by the Northern Oil Company Ltd. An IED attached to to the well functioned at about 04:00hrs LT in the Hanjira area, about 25 kilometres (12 miles) northwest of Kirkuk.
435. May 28 - Three soldiers of the Oil Protection Force (OPF) guarding an oil pipeline in Kirkuk were injured.
436. June 1 - An unconfirmed number of security personnel from the Oil Protection Force (OPF) were ambushed and kidnapped by insurgents on the main road to the south-west of Kirkuk.
437. June 4 - A roadside IED detonated while a road tanker was passing it in centre (financial district) of western Mosul. The tanker caught fire and was destroyed and the driver was injured.
438. June 4 - One civilian was killed and another wounded when a guard assigned to protect oil establishments in Kut opened fire on masses of people gathered in front of a new petrol station.
439. June 5 - A fuel tanker was damaged beyond repair and a fuel retail outlet damaged near the US Forward Operating Base at al-Mahmudiyah. An IED, estimated to incorporate about 5Kg of explosives, detonated in the cab of the vehicle.
440. June 5 - Insurgents attacked an oil pipeline near Bayji.The device ruptured the pipeline, setting fire to the resulatant oil spill.
441. June 9 - A suicide vehicle constructed using a road tanker detonated at an Iraqi army checkpoint outside in the town of al-Iskandariyah, killing at least Iraqi 13 soldiers.
442. June 11 - Ten people died in an explosion after a fuel tanker loaded with gasoline, was deliberately crashed into the Tikrit police command, destroying its two-storey building.
443. June 16 - Three men belonging from the Oil Protection Force (OPF)were wounded when a roadside IED detonated near their patrol vehicle on the Riadh-Kirkuk road.
444. June 20 - Insurgents attacked and ruptured a domestic gas pipeline that feeds power stations in northern Iraq.
445. June 21 - A suicide truck constructed from a oil tanker was detonated south Kirkuk, killing 12 people and wounding 70, including policemen and local politicians.
446. June 22 - In southern Baghdad, US soldiers on a routine patrol searched a suspicious fuel tanker and discovered it had been converted into a VBIED. The explosive charge consisted of 14 x 155 mm artillery shells.
447. June 23 - Two officers of the Oil protection Force (OPF), assigned to protect oil pipelines were wounded during an attack on their post 25 miles west of Kirkuk.
448. June 25 - Fifteen people were killed when a suicide bomber ploughed a VBIED constructed from a fuel tanker into the police headquarters of the northern Iraqi town of Bayji. Another 50 people, mostly civilians, were wounded in the attack.
449. June 29 - An IED detonated under an oil pipeline in the al-Mowehlah area of Abu Haswah south of Baghdad, spilling crude oil and sparking a large fire.
450. July 1 - Insurgents attacked a fuel outlet with multiple IED's which resulted in total destruction. The incident occurred in the small Sunni town of Tall al Mishayah, north of Baghdad. There were no casualties.
451. July 1 - in Kirkuk, an Iraqi soldier assigned to bolster local Oil Protection Force (OPF) personnel was fatally shot by insurgents.
452. July 1 - Coalition forces neutralised an IED that had been intended to sabotage an oil pipeline southwest of Kirkuk.
453. July 3 - Insurgents hijacked four oil tanker trucks that were carrying gasoline to Baghdad on the highway north of Hilla.
454. July 6 - Insurgents detonated a roadside IED near an Iraqi Oil Protection Force (OPF) patrol vehicle near Kirkuk, killing one soldier and injuring another three, including an officer.
455. July 11 - Oil Protection Force (OPF) guards clashed with smugglers and confiscated four tankers full of crude oil near a pipeline connecting the Luhais and Rumaylah North oil fields (50 km west of Basrah). There were no casualties in the incident.
456. July 11 - A coast guard was wounded during clashes with armed oil smugglers in the Shatt Al-Arab waterway near the port of Abu Al-Khasib (20 km south east of Basrah).
457. July 12 - In Mosul, the body of an Oil Protection Force (OPF) guard was found on 12 July. Yassin Mohasen Aayed, was killed by gunmen in al-Jesr al-Khames in western Mosul.
458. July 14 - An Iraqi oil tanker was destroyed during a US airstrike in the Shiite area of al-Ubaidi in east Baghdad.
459. July 17 - Just outside the northern town of Bayji, a Turkish truck driver died when a roadside IED targeted his vehicle. The vehicle was destroyed in the ensuing fire.
460. July 18 - In al-Latifiya insurgents hijacked a convoy of three tanker trucks carrying crude oil to the ad-Daura refinery. They killed the drivers took the vehicles wither cargo.
461. July 23 - three employees of Iraqi Oil Ministry were killed and another injured in a small-arms attack on their vehicle in Baghdad.
462. September 18 - Iraq's northern oil export pipeline to Turkey was badly damaged in a sabotage attack.
463. October 19 - insurgents blew up a pipeline near Kirkuk that carried oil to the Bayji refinery.
464. Nov. 11 - An explosion damaged a pipeline near the northern city of Kirkuk.
465. Dec. 7 - An oil pipeline was bombed near Al-Fatah, 75 miles west of Kirkuk.
2008
466. Jan. 7 - An explosion at a fuel storage tank caused a huge blaze at the Bayji refinery, injuring at least 36 workers.
467. Feb 10 - A car bomb exploded at a power station in Mosul, killing four civilians and causing power outages.
468. Feb. 11 - An explosion struck a gas pipeline transporting unrefined gas from Kirkuk to the Bayji refinery.
469. March 27 - Gunmen blew up an oil pipeline in Zubair area west of Basra.
Iraq Pipeline Watch is now being updated only sporadically and may not be a complete log of attacks. Feel free to send information about attacks to in­fo­sg­a­i­org.

http://www.iags.org/iraqpipelinewatch.htm


They will never let us take their oil. It won't happen

So what happens to these bases when Mr. Obama brings our troops back home?

/he said he will bring them back, did he? did'nt he?

Edsel: randomjsa: Yes, that's right, we're going to have a military presence and an ally in the Middle East again... Like the one we had before Jimmy Carter screwed the whole region over in the late 70s.

That's funny, I seem to remember that we did have an ally in the Middle East for most of the 80s, until George Bush didn't rein him in when he was hinting at invading Kuwait. We all know how that worked out.

Oh are you going to bring up that "Saddam was our Ally" thing? Please do. I do so love this topic.

Iran was our ally but when fundamentalists started to take over Jimmy Carter put pressure on the Shah of Iran not to do anything about it. The Shah listened and this resulted in his narrow escape from Iran as it was taken over by a fundamentalist terrorist organization and American's being taken hostage for 444 days.

Iran became an enemy of the United States after years of being a staunch ally and one of the greatest sponsors of terrorism in the world, all thanks to the actions of Jimmy Carter.

In the 80s, there was a war between Iran and Iraq and due to Jimmy Carter's mistakes we had to support Saddam Hussein to prevent fundamentalist terrorists from ceasing control of another country.

Now rewind: If we had supported Iran, no Ayatollah, no war between Iran/Iraq, no support of a brutal dictator, no first Gulf War, no current Gulf War. You don't like the current situation in the middle east? Good, then lay the blame where it belongs... At the feet of Jimmy Carter.

Jacobin: These are just the attacks by Iraqis to keep us from getting their oil since 2007.

I'm sorry for Mr. Bush and his oil gang, but its just another failed Bush oil deal.


2007
387. January 10 - Up to 50 Iraqi militants armed with RPG-7 as well as light and medium weapons ambushed a large force of the Oil Protection Force, whom were transporting security equipment. Sources indicated that more than 20 of the Oil Protection Force personnel were killed and more than 20 injured.
388. January 11 - An oil pipeline of the Northern Oil Company was sabotaged and breached near Kirkuk and the oil spill set ablaze.
389. January 21 - Insurgents assaulted guards protecting an oil facility, seized their weapons and vehicles and set an oil well on fire in the town of Dibs.
390. January 22 - An oil technician - an employee of the Northern Oil Company Ltd - was shot to death in the northern city of Mosul.
391. January 23 - A roadside IED detonated near a minibus carrying workers of the Northern Oil Company Ltd while travelling to the oil-refinery city of Baiji, 112 miles north of Baghdad. There were no casualties.
392.February 11 - Gunmen killed Lieutenant Colonel Jamal Mohammad, the chief of serious crimes office of the Oil Protection Force at Bayji and wounded two of his guards. Reports claimed that two of the attackers were also killed.
393. February 12 - Insurgents placed two IEDs on a well of the Northern Oil Company near Kirkut. The explosions destroyed the well and set the oil ablaze.
394. February 13 - Insurgents attacked and destroyed a road tanker with of the National Guard on the highway near Al Buwarah. The driver was killed and a passenger wounded.
395. February 19 - Iraqi insurgents deployed a suicide bomber in a road tanker north of Baghdad.
396. February 20 - Six people were killed and 105 injured after a suicide IED detonated his device in a fuel tanker in the town of At Taji, north of Baghdad.
397. February 23 - A VBIED incorporated into a road fuel tanker exploded in a market in the town of Buhayrat al Habbaniyah in the province of Anba. The explosion killed 40 people and injured 64.
398. February 25 - Two labourers of an oil company were killed and one wounded by a roadside bomb in Kirkuk.
399. February 27 - A convoy of four road tankers carrying oil products was stopped shortly after it left the Bayji refinery by Iraqi militants. The militants shot and killed the drivers and burned the vehicles and the cargo.
400. March 25 - Insurgents killed Ali Amin, director of a gas company, near his house in a drive-by shooting in Mosul.
401. March 26 - A roadside IED destroyed a fuel tanker killing the vehicle crew.
402. March 26 - Insurgents detonated an IED beneath an oil pipeline near Bayji. The attack started an oil fire that burned for several hours before it could be extinguished.
403. April 1 - Insurgents attacked a road tanker contracted to carry fuel to the US military. The incident occurred near a fertilizer factory in the middle of the Muhafazat Salah ad Din province. The vehicle was destroyed in the ensuing fire and both the driver and guard was injured.
404. April 4 - Fuel outlet guard shot dead, Insurgents attacked a petrol station in al Kut, 100 miles southeast of Baghdad, killing one guard and wounding another.
405. April 5 - Insurgents ruptured an oil pipeline with an IED near the border with Kuwait, cutting off supplies from surrounding fields to storage tanks in Basra. The attack occurred just north of Safwan on a pipeline operated by the South Oil Company. The explosion started a major fire which took several hours to extinguish.
406. April 5 - A road tanker supplying coalition forces with fuel was attacked near al-Rayashia in Bayji city with a roadside IED which destroyed the tanker and killed the driver and escort.
407. April 6 - Insurgents detonated an IED under an oil pipeline in southern Kirkut which carries oil from Kirkuk to the Baiji refineries, starting a major fire. The incident occurred near the main road linking Kirkuk to the district of al-Huweija.
408. April 9 - An oil p ...

You just won the moronic post of the thread award. Well done!

The most interesting words I saw in that article were "not a treaty".

randomjsa: Edsel: randomjsa: Yes, that's right, we're going to have a military presence and an ally in the Middle East again... Like the one we had before Jimmy Carter screwed the whole region over in the late 70s.

That's funny, I seem to remember that we did have an ally in the Middle East for most of the 80s, until George Bush didn't rein him in when he was hinting at invading Kuwait. We all know how that worked out.

Oh are you going to bring up that "Saddam was our Ally" thing? Please do. I do so love this topic.

Iran was our ally but when fundamentalists started to take over Jimmy Carter put pressure on the Shah of Iran not to do anything about it. The Shah listened and this resulted in his narrow escape from Iran as it was taken over by a fundamentalist terrorist organization and American's being taken hostage for 444 days.

Iran became an enemy of the United States after years of being a staunch ally and one of the greatest sponsors of terrorism in the world, all thanks to the actions of Jimmy Carter.

In the 80s, there was a war between Iran and Iraq and due to Jimmy Carter's mistakes we had to support Saddam Hussein to prevent fundamentalist terrorists from ceasing control of another country.

Now rewind: If we had supported Iran, no Ayatollah, no war between Iran/Iraq, no support of a brutal dictator, no first Gulf War, no current Gulf War. You don't like the current situation in the middle east? Good, then lay the blame where it belongs... At the feet of Jimmy Carter.

Usually you just give a couple sentences of pure idiodicy put today you blessed us with so much more. Thank you.

put=but

eqtworld: Gas should be 50cents a gallon.

randomjsa you seem to have a very different memory of history than I.
I remember the Shah ran a very oppressive regime. that's why the people rose up against him.

In 1975 he abolished the the multi-party system of government so that he could rule through a one-party state under the Rastakhiz (Resurrection) Party in autocratic fashion. All Iranians were pressured to join in. The Shah's own words on its justification was; "We must straighten out Iranians' ranks. To do so, we divide them into two categories: those who believe in Monarchy, the constitution and the Six Bahman Revolution and those who don't... A person who does not enter the new political party and does not believe in the three cardinal principles will have only two choices. He is either an individual who belongs to an illegal organization, or is related to the outlawed Tudeh Party, or in other words a traitor. Such an individual belongs to an Iranian prison, or if he desires he can leave the country tomorrow, without even paying exit fees; he can go anywhere he likes, because he is not Iranian, he has no nation, and his activities are illegal and punishable according to the law".[20] In addition, the Shah had decreed that all Iranian citizens and the few remaining political parties must become part of Rastakhiz.[21]

really guys blaming the Shah's overthrow on Carter is stretching it.

3_Butt_Cheeks: You just won the moronic post of the thread award. Well done!

You just won the moronic post of the thread award. Well done!

/most original too!

Hobodeluxe: really guys blaming the Shah's overthrow on Carter is stretching it.

Why not? They think Reagan defeated Communism...

randomjsa: Iran was our ally but when fundamentalists started to take over Jimmy Carter put pressure on the Shah of Iran not to do anything about it. The Shah listened and this resulted in his narrow escape from Iran as it was taken over by a fundamentalist terrorist organization and American's being taken hostage for 444 days.

You fail utterly and completely. The Iranian revolution had been picking up steam since the 60s and was an inevitable event due to the Shah's harsh internal politics. It had broad-based support from students and religious leaders. There were demonstrations in the streets that involved millions of citizens. Millions.

That's what I get for feeding a troll.

whidbey: Hobodeluxe: really guys blaming the Shah's overthrow on Carter is stretching it.

Why not? They think Reagan defeated Communism...

They think Reagan is a saint and Carter is the Antichrist. All the ills of today's world can be pinned on Carter in the mind of a right-winger.

Korovyov: The most interesting words I saw in that article were "not a treaty".

That is correct - it's "not a treaty".

The Bush administration yesterday advanced a new argument for why it does not require congressional approval to strike a long-term security agreement with Iraq, stating that Congress had already endorsed such an initiative through its 2002 resolution authorizing the use of force against Saddam Hussein."

{*cough*}

Subby: We're just going to pay them rent so we can stay there and protect our oil

Ugh. No matter how much this doesnt happen. No matter that we're importing 3 million gallons per day for Operation Iraqi Freedom. No matter that oil was $33 a barrel before the Iraq war, and the impacts of the war on oil prices. No matter that the US (and int'l) oil companies were lobbying hard to reduce sanctions before the war in order to get it out on a fungible market. No matter that Iraq's oil production is still at a heavily sanctioned nations pre-war levels, despite the money/blood hemorrhage

Somehow hindsight bias keeps creeping in. Wasn't this war supposed to lower our gas prices as people were howling in 2001-2003 about high gas prices?

Enjoy the 1988 memories.

Hey speaking of treaties looks like we joined the imperial fascists club ^{(^)}

Jacobin: These are just the attacks by Iraqis to keep us from getting their oil since 2007.

I'm sorry for Mr. Bush and his oil gang, but its just another failed Bush oil deal.


2007
387. January 10 - Up to 50 Iraqi militants armed with RPG-7 as well as light and medium weapons ambushed a large force of the Oil Protection Force, whom were transporting security equipment. Sources indicated that more than 20 of the Oil Protection Force personnel were killed and more than 20 injured.
388. January 11 - An oil pipeline of the Northern Oil Company was sabotaged and breached near Kirkuk and the oil spill set ablaze.
389. January 21 - Insurgents assaulted guards protecting an oil facility, seized their weapons and vehicles and set an oil well on fire in the town of Dibs.
390. January 22 - An oil technician - an employee of the Northern Oil Company Ltd - was shot to death in the northern city of Mosul.
391. January 23 - A roadside IED detonated near a minibus carrying workers of the Northern Oil Company Ltd while travelling to the oil-refinery city of Baiji, 112 miles north of Baghdad. There were no casualties.
392.February 11 - Gunmen killed Lieutenant Colonel Jamal Mohammad, the chief of serious crimes office of the Oil Protection Force at Bayji and wounded two of his guards. Reports claimed that two of the attackers were also killed.
393. February 12 - Insurgents placed two IEDs on a well of the Northern Oil Company near Kirkut. The explosions destroyed the well and set the oil ablaze.
394. February 13 - Insurgents attacked and destroyed a road tanker with of the National Guard on the highway near Al Buwarah. The driver was killed and a passenger wounded.
395. February 19 - Iraqi insurgents deployed a suicide bomber in a road tanker north of Baghdad.
396. February 20 - Six people were killed and 105 injured after a suicide IED detonated his device in a fuel tanker in the town of At Taji, north of Baghdad.
397. February 23 - A VBIED incorporated into a road fuel tanker exploded in a market in the town of Buhayrat al Habbaniyah in the province of Anba. The explosion killed 40 people and injured 64.
398. February 25 - Two labourers of an oil company were killed and one wounded by a roadside bomb in Kirkuk.
399. February 27 - A convoy of four road tankers carrying oil products was stopped shortly after it left the Bayji refinery by Iraqi militants. The militants shot and killed the drivers and burned the vehicles and the cargo.
400. March 25 - Insurgents killed Ali Amin, director of a gas company, near his house in a drive-by shooting in Mosul.
401. March 26 - A roadside IED destroyed a fuel tanker killing the vehicle crew.
402. March 26 - Insurgents detonated an IED beneath an oil pipeline near Bayji. The attack started an oil fire that burned for several hours before it could be extinguished.
403. April 1 - Insurgents attacked a road tanker contracted to carry fuel to the US military. The incident occurred near a fertilizer factory in the middle of the Muhafazat Salah ad Din province. The vehicle was destroyed in the ensuing fire and both the driver and guard was injured.
404. April 4 - Fuel outlet guard shot dead, Insurgents attacked a petrol station in al Kut, 100 miles southeast of Baghdad, killing one guard and wounding another.
405. April 5 - Insurgents ruptured an oil pipeline with an IED near the border with Kuwait, cutting off supplies from surrounding fields to storage tanks in Basra. The attack occurred just north of Safwan on a pipeline operated by the South Oil Company. The explosion started a major fire which took several hours to extinguish.
406. April 5 - A road tanker supplying coalition forces with fuel was attacked near al-Rayashia in Bayji city with a roadside IED which destroyed the tanker and killed the driver and escort.
407. April 6 - Insurgents detonated an IED under an oil pipeline in southern Kirkut which carries oil from Kirkuk to the Baiji refineries, starting a major fire. The incident occurred near the main road linking Kirkuk to the district of al-Huweija.
408. April 9 - An oil protection guard was killed ...

america has become the evil empire..obama is obi wan

help me obi-wan you re my only hope

randomjsa: Yes, that's right, we're going to have a military presence and an ally in the Middle East again... Like the one we had before Jimmy Carter screwed the whole region over in the late 70s.

Say what?!

History lesson: we sent some CIA types into Iran -- including Kermit Roosevelt, grandson of T.R. -- to topple Iran's duly elected President Mossadegh. The dude was going to nationalize Iranian oil fields, and this we and various oil conglomerates could not abide.

So out with Mossadegh and in with the Shah. Who turned out to be a good pal of the U.S. but a jerk to his citizens. That festering resentment finally boiled over in 1979.

Moral: Don't go screwing with other countries' leadership like that unless you want to suffer some very painful consequences.

CP Jupiter: Don't go screwing with other countries' leadership like that...

Pfft, we totally have an awesome track record of messing around in the middle east.

/no wait.

CP Jupiter: Moral: Don't go screwing with other countries' leadership like that unless you want to suffer some very painful consequences.

Who actually suffers those "painful consequences?"

I've yet to see anyone thrown under the bus. Other than the American people, that is...

randomjsa: Iran became an enemy of the United States after years of being a staunch ally and one of the greatest sponsors of terrorism in the world, all thanks to the actions of Jimmy Carter.

HURRRR JIMMY CARTER

JIMMMUUUUH!

goodbomb: eqtworld:

what he said.

whether war is morally wrong (in all cases) is a subject for debate. lots of right wing people believe in plunder wars like iraq, but they could at least farking pull it off. that's both immoral and FAIL.

Debatable my cock. Murder is wrong, so war is wrong. War is guys having pissing contests on a state level.

DogS laughter: eqtworld: The biggest fark up of this whole thing is that gas is expensive.

I get the whole "Let's invade your country and take your shiat" thing, really I do, but we forgot the most important part. WE WERE SUPPOSED TO TAKE THEIR shiat. What country invades another country, WINS, suffers 1/100th the casualty rate of the other country and still manages to lose a trillion dollars (or the equivalent) in the process?

That is not how you play the game. Gas should be 50cents a gallon. Did the Native Americans get rich during the California gold rush of the 1840s? No, they did not. We killed them and took their shiat, THAT is the way the game is played.

Your attitude is certainly pragmatic, but I hope you're not saying that you morally approve of such conduct.

Not necessarily morally in the Biblical sense, but I tend to agree: If we're going to go in, kick ass and take scalps, we need to see some profit at the end of it all. Otherwise, why go?

Even when we occupied Germany and Japan after WWII, we got a lot of goodies afterwards: Permanent military bases, powerful global economy, and the right to rule most of the free world. We've been slipping since then.

/only half kidding.

moothemagiccow: goodbomb: eqtworld:

what he said.

whether war is morally wrong (in all cases) is a subject for debate. lots of right wing people believe in plunder wars like iraq, but they could at least farking pull it off. that's both immoral and FAIL.

Debatable my cock. Murder is wrong, so war is wrong. War is guys having pissing contests on a state level.

eqtworld: DogS laughter: Your attitude is certainly pragmatic, but I hope you're not saying that you morally approve of such conduct.

I am just saying they farked up no matter how you look at it. We have all the drawbacks of going to war (death, financial loss etc..), and none of the benefits of wining one

Agreed. I'm a fiscal Conservative (pay as you go) and a social liberal, ( it's none of your bisuness how many dildos I have) and I can't fully identify with either party. How we got to this point in foreign affairs, and our domestic, financial f#ck up, boggles my mind.

whidbey: CP Jupiter: Moral: Don't go screwing with other countries' leadership like that unless you want to suffer some very painful consequences.

Who actually suffers those "painful consequences?"

I've yet to see anyone thrown under the bus. Other than the American people, that is...

You just answered your own question.

/how'd those tire tracks get on my shirt?