I have Adore in my car and listen to it all the time. What was wrong with it?

Gunny Highway: I have Adore in my car and listen to it all the time. What was wrong with it?

compared to Siamese Dreams, its quite the snooze fest


but at least its not an embarrassment *cough* ZWAN *cough *

HappyHarryHardOn: compared to Siamese Dreams, its quite the snooze fest

Yea I agree with that. It is hard to cut a better album than Siamese Dream though. Listening to Adore it becomes clear they (he) were trying to go in another direction. Pretty good album front to back.

Gunny Highway: HappyHarryHardOn: compared to Siamese Dreams, its quite the snooze fest

Yea I agree with that. It is hard to cut a better album than Siamese Dream though. Listening to Adore it becomes clear they (he) were trying to go in another direction. Pretty good album front to back.

And what made "Siamese" is the incredible interaction between the 2 guitarists, they make pretty complex layering... without sounding overly complex...

makes me think of thedude who wrote "Fargo Rock City" who said that Billy corgan made Siamese dreams rock like Dokken... I have no idea what it means, but it`s funny

HappyHarryHardOn: And what made "Siamese" is the incredible interaction between the 2 guitarists, they make pretty complex layering... without sounding overly complex...

I am kicking myself right now because I want to go back and listen to SD, I even owned 3 copies at one point, but they were all either lost or stolen. I am going to have to make a run to the record store and buy it again. That or see if a buddy has stolen the mp3s from somewhere.

Geek USA is one of my all time favorite songs. Luna and Space Boy are on some old sleep mixes of mine.

If you can find bootlegs of those songs from the Arising! tour, they rocked pretty well. It says a lot for a song when it can survive the transition from the concept album that Adore was to rock anthem. The crescendo in the live version of To Shelia is awesome.

I thought it was an ok/good album... it had its great moments... the other moments/songs... not so much...

/it's the only Pumpkins cd i have.
// yes, it's a rather dark album, but it has its spots of sunshine.

Oh my god, an artist cares about how his work was received. How pretentious.

Is this guy still around? I want my money back from Zeitgeist.
ONE good song. There are only 2.5 SP albums worth having, anyways.

/felt old hearing 1979 on the classic rock station in GTAIV

Torc
Oh my god, an artist cares about how his work was received. How pretentious.

Plenty of otherwise talented and celebrated artists have had certain albums of theirs panned by critics. Most, while I'm sure deep down think it's horseshiat, keep their mouth shut and don't whine like little biatches about it publicly.

I used to be big fan of SP and still like their older work a lot, but Billy can be real jackass.

To be fair, someone mentioned the 10 year anniversary to him and he responded to that. It's not like he personally called each of us and biatched that we didn't embrace the record enough.

smartypants: Plenty of otherwise talented and celebrated artists have had certain albums of theirs panned by critics. Most, while I'm sure deep down think it's horseshiat, keep their mouth shut and don't whine like little biatches about it publicly.

You'll have to point out the section in the article where he actually does that. He's just talking about the reaction, not whining about it or even criticizing it. The "OMG what a whiner" line is bullshiat, as if he shouldn't talk about an album on its 10th anniversary just because it was panned when it was released.

See, this is why I don't like him as a person(a) anymore.

With Pumpkins 1.0 he was an arrogant prick, but at least he stood by everything the band had done before.

With the interim period and Pumpkins 2.0, all he seems to do is trash his old bandmates and now old work too. fark off with that, all your old albums were great, SP2.0....not so much.

HappyHarryHardOn: And what made "Siamese" is the incredible interaction between the 2 guitarists, they make pretty complex layering... without sounding overly complex...

I would agree to a certain extent. I mean, that definitely was the best album to show how well Billy and James worked together on guitar.

However, Soma had 40 guitar tracks layered. 40 ... wow. I love that song, but after I realized it could never really be reproduced live, I was kind of disappointed about that.

Naturally, when I saw them live, Soma kicked my ass anyway.

Pretty sure this album was when the Pumpkins just went south.

Torc
You'll have to point out the section in the article where he actually does that. He's just talking about the reaction, not whining about it or even criticizing it. The "OMG what a whiner" line is bullshiat, as if he shouldn't talk about an album on its 10th anniversary just because it was panned when it was released.

I never said he couldn't talk about it, and I agree that overall it's fairly tame response.

Beginning of second paragraph: "The reaction at the time of the album's release, if memory serves me correctly, was overwhelming negative. It was a very naïve thing to try to do, to make an album that sounded little like the one before, and which spoke very openly about mourning and loss.

I don't think that he embellishes anything after this point in his blog entry, I'm sure that's all factual and honest. But those two sentences, especially given his history, seem pretty suspicious to me, since it starts off immediately with pointing out the negative reaction to it. If the first thing that comes to his mind is the "overwhelming negative" response, then obviously he's still stirring about. And WTF is so "naïve" about going in a different direction (both sonically and emotionally)? Is this a supposed to be a snarky "oh silly me?"

By starting it off in such a way, a probably geniune take on the album, and his feelings during the making of it, come off like he's hurt and trying to come up with an explanation for it all.

/Mentioning D'arcy's negative opinion on the album doesn't help either.

HappyHarryHardOn:

And what made "Siamese" is the incredible interaction between the 2 guitarists, they make pretty complex layering... without sounding overly complex...

Corgan played pretty much everything bar the drums on Siamese Dream.

Billy can be as much of a hooting dickhole as he wants to be.

I'll always love this album;

"It was a very naïve thing to try to do, to make an album that sounded little like the one before, and which spoke very openly about mourning and loss."

This guy is so full of shiat i can smell it from here.

Considering the musical environment at the time: Limp Bizkit, Eminem and the Spice Girls...this record sure does suck!

C'mon, I saw 2 pumpkins shows 2 years apart and D'arcy was fall-down farked up each time, who would care what she thinks.

Also, did you *try* listening to James' solo record? Country horrible

/glad Jimmy got over the jab

IIRC, Adore was supposed to be a solo album but they had a record contract to fulfill.

I'm still hoping for a Machina I/II box set where Corgan gets rid of all that wretched distortion.

/II > I, times eleventy

They jumped the shark after Gish. Everything else was masturbatory crapola.

1979 (new window)

one of my fav albums!

carmody: They jumped the shark after Gish. Everything else was masturbatory crapola.

God, even the mainstream-loathing jerkoffs at Pitchfork disagree with you. Siamese Dream was a much stronger album than Gish, but we'll put that aside for a second. What part of Gish wasn't masturbatory? It was full of ham-fisted lyrics ("I am one/as you are three/try to find messiah/in your trinity", "as your things come undone / see you are the only one"), superfluous, flashy guitar solos, 90s-psychedelic album art...

The whole appeal of Smashing Pumpkins was that they weren't nihilistic, self-pitying losers who awkwardly wore hand-me-down flannel and awkwardly played hand-me-down guitars. They were a balls-out, larger-than-life rock band with a cult-like following. That was the point, man.

TomServo0: I'm still hoping for a Machina I/II box set where Corgan gets rid of all that wretched distortion.

Yeah, what was the deal with some of that cheap-sounding distortion on Machina (e.g., "Heavy Metal Machine," which was a crappy song anyways)? Did they trade in all of their good effects pedals for the distortion on a budget-model combo amp?

Gish is a fun listen, but I still prefer Siamese Dream.

They peaked with Siamese Dream, but Mellon Collie was still good.

Adore was okay.

Only liked half the songs on Machina. The Machina 2 stuff was superior and, better yet, free.

Zwan was pretty bland. Corgan's solo album wasn't good. Zeitgeist was full of fail.

WTH does infinitively worse mean? Infinitely worse I'd understand.... someone please educate me, cause I've got to be missing something.

I was a huge Smashing Pumpkins fan, but I was immensely disappointed with Mellon Collie. My ex bought me Adore, and I listened to it once, but his voice was horrendous, it sounds like cats meowing, and I refused to listen to it ever again. Honestly, his cat-like voice was like scratching nails on a chalkboard, I physically couldn't listen to that album.

I/They don't have no function. I don't understand what they mean, and I could really give a fark.

Pillager: Billy can be as much of a hooting dickhole as he wants to be.

I'll always love this album;

Me too.

When Adore came out, I hated it. Absolutely hated it. Refused to listen to it for the longest time.

Then about two years ago, I randomly listened to it... and played the damn thing on repeat for about 2 or 3 weeks straight. It's now one of my favorites.

Oops...sorry. My bold tag got goofed.

carmody: Wasted Pixels, I admire your argument but I still disagree. The only reason Gish is better than the rest is that it was the shortest, and also I wasn't sick of listening to Billy C's cartoony whimper yet when it came out.

All Corgan's lyrics are pretentious bullshiat and/or hippy-dippy pseudo-poetry. By the time the uber-bloated Mellon Collie and the Two Discs of Garbage came out, the band was a laughingstock. I saw them in '94 and walked out halfway through the show because they were putting me to sleep. A total joke.

Sorry to all you who were 12 years old when you first heard "Bullet with Butterfly Wings" and thought it was awesome. It wasn't.

Oh, you're just trolling. Nevermind, then.

I like the song Ava Adore. Only song from that album I'm familiar with. My buddy, who's a pumpkins fan, shed some light on why it was different... that the band really was only a collaboration between Jimmy Chaimberlain and Billy Corgan, and Billy would rerecord parts recorded by D'Arcy and James for the albums, so much that their participation in the band had pretty much become just the touring guys. So they leave, and Billy says nothing but dickhole comments about them afterwards.

It's a shame. I always thought D'Arcy was pretty and had a bit of a crush on her.

I bought Zeitgeiste and love it from track 5 (Tarantula) all through track 9 (Bring the Light) but the rest of the album is fail, and they really really needed someone better doing the audio engineering because it sounded a bit thin with the vocals.

Just imagine if you combined Trent Reznor with Billy Corgan. That would be an unholy duo of awesomeness.

The only problem with Adore is that it was made by a band that used to be known for it's powerful alt-rock guitar sound. It came after the double CD, and the hype that led up to it, even thanks to quotes from Mr. Corgan, was that it was going to be a rocking return to the Siamese Dream era.

And instead we get a CD full of quiet keyboard-centric songs.

It's not that the songs are bad (there are actually some really good tracks on Adore), it's just that it was made by what we thought was the Smashing Pumpkins, not the Billy Corgan Keyboard Sideproject. It's like if Van Halen finally got all the original guys back together and writing a bunch of Jack Johnson songs.

Master of the Flying Guillotine: Yeah, what was the deal with some of that cheap-sounding distortion on Machina (e.g., "Heavy Metal Machine," which was a crappy song anyways)? Did they trade in all of their good effects pedals for the distortion on a budget-model combo amp?

That abortion of a song was when Billy traded in the guitars for dicking around in Pro Tools.

I am a HUGE Pumpkinhead, but I refuse to buy "Zeitgeist" just because I know all the songs are too damn happy-sounding. I'll take "Adore" and Billy's ultra-depresso attitude anyday!

Besides, you gotta consider the fact that "Adore" was made after Billy a) got divorced b) fired Jimmy and c) lost his mother to cancer. I'd make a album like that too if I had gone through that.

/Loves "Adore".

Gunny Highway: HappyHarryHardOn: And what made "Siamese" is the incredible interaction between the 2 guitarists, they make pretty complex layering... without sounding overly complex...

I am kicking myself right now because I want to go back and listen to SD, I even owned 3 copies at one point, but they were all either lost or stolen. I am going to have to make a run to the record store and buy it again. That or see if a buddy has stolen the mp3s from somewhere.

Geek USA is one of my all time favorite songs. Luna and Space Boy are on some old sleep mixes of mine.

Lots (200+) of bootlegs here, I assume it's all legit:
http://www.archive.org/browse.php?field=/metadata/bandWithMP3s&collection=etree

rufus g: Lots (200+) of bootlegs here, I assume it's all legit:
http://www.archive.org/browse.php?field=/metadata/bandWithMP3s&collection=etree

Thanks man. Good looks.

What negative press? I don't think I've ever read a wholly negative review of Adore.

It was a pretty good album, even if it did have about five tracks too many; that's still better than Mellon Collie, which had one whole CD too many, and sounded mostly like demos with a handful of finished tracks strewn into the mix.

/the handful of finished tracks were great, though

MikoSquiz: which had one whole CD too many

which was that?

Sorry Billy, but Adore blew and so did that freakin' Zwan crap. I really liked Siamese Dream and Mellon Collie, I even liked Pisces Iscariot, but the best of the Pumpkins is right here...

I still find the record more listenable beginning-to-end than Mellon Collie.

I used to love everything by the Smashing Pumpkins. Now I only really liAdore and still like bits ake nd pieces of everything else. The old live versions of Adore songs are fantastic, Tear especially.

I can't explain what happened to that post. What I meant to say is now I only really like adore as a whole and still like bits and pieces of everything else.

STARLA.
This

Just listened to Mellon Collie again, still enjoy that. Adore grew on me over time, thanks to a few strong tracks. Been a while, guess its time to give it another go.

I liked Adore.. but definitely not at the top of my list.

I think the more impressive but often overlooked skill of Billy's is his ability to create (or at least draft) amazing music videos. The Pumpkins easily have some of the best videos I've ever seen.

Though Zwan was a weak era for videos (I still liked the music, not as Pumpkins music, but as it's own experimental thing).

Tarantula was an awesome video too by the way. Look up some of the fan created alternatives to the official video-awesome.

starla, drown, the aeroplane flies high, porcelina of the vast oceans, marquis in spades, obscured, hummer.

those are what i consider the gems of the smashing pumpkins.