It certainly is amusing having a nominee for POTUS that is so senile he has lost the ability to filter his speech.

He just says whatever damn thing pops into his head. I'm really looking forward to the Mccain/Obama debates.

quickdraw: He just says whatever damn thing pops into his head. I'm really looking forward to the Mccain/Obama debates.

Obama: "Our economy doesn't need a gas tax holiday it needs..."

McCain: "PANCAKES!"

Zionism (the newfangled evangelical Christian kind) is the everyman's radical position in America. I live in the South, and I can rattle off a list of half a dozen people, including family, that want to go to war beside Israel in order to speed up the end times.

I had one person compare radical Islam to Sauron. Srsly.

I don't understand why the media was nonstop OMG!! WRIGHT IS THE DEBIL!!!112! for saying some truths that make people uncomfortable, but this guy's insane rantings are given a pass.

I remember crooks and liars making a big deal about Haggee as soon as he endorsed McCain, because the guy's nuttier than a fruitcake.

I wonder if race has anything to do with it...

Why don't these people go back to handling poisonous snakes?
It'd be harmless amusement for the rest of us, and there'd eventually be less of them.

submitter: Unfortunately Hagee "supports" Isreal becuase he's hoping its destruction will kick off Armageddon

subby, if you are trying to compare John Hagee to Jeremiah Wright, you're doing it wrong. John McCain didn't sit in his church for over twenty years and wasn't married and baptized by John Hagee. You're straining too hard. Go back, watch some more MSNBC and get the talking points down.

sepuku2: subby, if you are trying to compare John Hagee to Jeremiah Wright, you're doing it wrong. John McCain didn't sit in his church for over twenty years and wasn't married and baptized by John Hagee.

True, but Wright didn't say that homosexuals were responsible for hurricanes.

If you were to make a formula, proximity to crazy X amount of crazy= problems for candidate, Hagee would STILL be a bigger problem for McCain.

Or should be.

what_now: If you were to make a formula, proximity to crazy X amount of crazy= problems for candidate, Hagee would STILL be a bigger problem for McCain.

Exactly. If McCain stood for one single minute to accept an endorsement and a photo op with a hobo convinced that reverse vampire UFOs were running the New World Order, it would be worse than Jeremiah Wright.

Oh, and this thread isn't about Jeremiah Wright. It's about Hagee's zionism, which is quite worthy of its own conversation.

see what happens is the antichrist gains control and for 3.5 yrs everything is good. then everything turns to hell for 3.5 years the armies of good and evil fight in the valley of Armageddon. then Jesus comes down from the sky and kills everyone and the Earth dies by fire and a new Jerusalem is born that will last forever. and all the people who love Jesus live there with him and walk on streets of gold forever.

this is what John wrote while trippin balls on Patmos.
some say the local flora might have been involved.
some say he was abducted by aliens and shown the future then released.
Some say the angels revealed it to him.
ymmv

hillbillypharmacist: Oh, and this thread isn't about Jeremiah Wright. It's about Hagee's zionism, which is quite worthy of its own conversation.

Well if thats the case then you can go to every other baptist or evangelical church in America and get the same sermon on any given Sunday. All I have to do is turn the TV set to TBN or some other Christian network any time of day and hear this stuff. It's common enough.

Look at the You Tubes

hillbillypharmacist: Oh, and this thread isn't about Jeremiah Wright. It's about Hagee's zionism, which is quite worthy of its own conversation.

Certainly. If people were quick to point out the weakness in the analogy between Hagee and Wright, they should similarly avoid the comparative red-herrings as a rhetorical device.

The big question for me is, why does anybody give a shiat what Hagee or Wright have to say... they are not running for President, nor have they been mentioned for any cabinet or advisory positions, as far as I know.

So aside from meaningless partisan "gotchas" and trying to assign guilt by association, why should anyone care what these crack pots say?

keylock71: So aside from meaningless partisan "gotchas" and trying to assign guilt by association, why should anyone care what these crack pots say?

I wouldn't have, before Bush. But Bush has taken advice on how to run this country, from people who think homosexuals control the weather. So you'll excuse me if I'm cautious.

sepuku2: Well if thats the case then you can go to every other baptist or evangelical church in America and get the same sermon on any given Sunday. All I have to do is turn the TV set to TBN or some other Christian network any time of day and hear this stuff. It's common enough.

Exactly. Zionism is the everyman's radical position, just like I said.

It's exactly as crazy as what you'd hear in a barbershop in Palestine. Just because it's 'regular white folks' doesn't make it any less stupid or dangerous.

sepuku2: subby, if you are trying to compare John Hagee to Jeremiah Wright, you're doing it wrong. John McCain didn't sit in his church for over twenty years and wasn't married and baptized by John Hagee. You're straining too hard. Go back, watch some more MSNBC and get the talking points down.

I think actively seeking the public endorsement is far more serious than passively sitting in a church.

I think all of this makes a fine argument for taxing churches like regular businesses.

hillbillypharmacist: It's exactly as crazy as what you'd hear in a barbershop in Palestine. Just because it's 'regular white folks' doesn't make it any less stupid or dangerous.

I like that analogy. Palestinian barbershop heh!

keylock71: So aside from meaningless partisan "gotchas" and trying to assign guilt by association, why should anyone care what these crack pots say?

Usually I don't care what pastors say as long as they are not preaching ideas that are harmful to their parishioners. That being said, Armageddon fetishism is a harmful idea. It teaches exclusion, hate, and ultimately excuses violence against the "unchosen" as the will of God or the fulfillment of prophesy.

So yeah... I will hold a candidate's pastor against them if that pastor preaches about how the world is going to end soon, and that the blood of the unbelievers will run in the streets.

How does Hagee get to fund settlements when the expanding settlements is in contravention to US policy?

Evangelicals raise $8.5 m. for Jewish state
"America must never pressure Israel to give up land. It must never pressure her to divide Jerusalem. Turning Jerusalem over to the Palestinians is tantamount to giving it to the Taliban," he said.

American evangelist John Hagee on Sunday announced donations of $6 million to a number of Israeli causes and declared that Israel must remain in control of all of Jerusalem.
---------
to
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(March 2008)[Rice] criticized Israel for failing to halt construction on settlements in the West Bank and plans to build in East Jerusalem neighbourhoods.

(Jan 2008) Rice placed the issue of settlement activity in the West Bank and east Jerusalem at center stage, telling The Jerusalem Post that "Har Homa is a settlement the United States has opposed from the very beginning."

(Dec 2007) Condoleezza Rice criticised Israel on Friday for planning to build new homes on occupied land in the Jerusalem area -- a move Palestinians say could wreck a peace process Rice helped launch last week in Washington.

(May 2007) Jerusalem's city council plans to build three new Jewish settlements on land it occupied in 1967, in contravention of international law

this goes on and on, really.
(1990) Israel Retracts Pledge to U.S On East Jerusalem Housing

Diogenes: I think actively seeking the public endorsement is far more serious than passively sitting in a church.

For crying out loud. I'm not even going to touch that little bit of wisdom. Excuse me. I've got to go draw some bacterial cultures from a deranged Hep C patient.

Classy

According to John Hagee, devastating consequences await those who violate God's word...God, he says, may already have sent hurricane Katrina to punish the U-S for its role in helping Israel remove Jewish settlers from the Gaza strip.

I want to ask Washington a question. Is there a connection between the 9,000 Jewish refugees being forcibly removed from their homes in the Gaza Strip now living in tents and the thousands of Americans who have been expelled from their homes by this tremendous work of nature? Is there a connection there? If you've got a better answer, I'd like to hear it.

sepuku2: Diogenes: I think actively seeking the public endorsement is far more serious than passively sitting in a church.

For crying out loud. I'm not even going to touch that little bit of wisdom. Excuse me. I've got to go draw some bacterial cultures from a deranged Hep C patient.

It's a perfectly cromulent argument. While you, apparently, have none.

Diogenes: It's a perfectly cromulent argument. While you, apparently, have none.

Yes and a noble spirit embiggens the smallest man.

what_now: Bush has taken advice on how to run this country, from people who think homosexuals control the weather

That's ridiculous. If teh gheys controlled the weather, it would be sunny and 75 everywhere all the time so they could wear their little short-shorts. These crackpots need to think their positions through a little better.

Oops.

The rapture can't come soon enough for these nitwits. I will be soooo happy when they are zipped away to leave the rest of us in peace.

mofroe: what_now: Bush has taken advice on how to run this country, from people who think homosexuals control the weather

That's ridiculous. If teh gheys controlled the weather, it would be sunny and 75 everywhere all the time so they could wear their little short-shorts. These crackpots need to think their positions through a little better.

And rainbows wouldn't be such a whimsical novelty.

Subby, take another pass through Revelations. If the destruction of Israel kicked off Armageddon, then Hagee would want to destroy it, not support it.

sepuku2: submitter: Unfortunately Hagee "supports" Isreal becuase he's hoping its destruction will kick off Armageddon

subby, if you are trying to compare John Hagee to Jeremiah Wright, you're doing it wrong. John McCain didn't sit in his church for over twenty years and wasn't married and baptized by John Hagee. You're straining too hard. Go back, watch some more MSNBC and get the talking points down.

No, *you're* doing it wrong. You want to blame Obama because of what his minister said. That's the talking point that Rush gave you. Have you noticed it contradicts Rush's other talking point that Obama isn't really Christian?

You might just think about the talking points you're given, how they fit with each other (including that MSNBC puts out talking points--that's called defensive projection).

Keep in mind that 1) what Hagee said is much, much more dangerous than anything Wright has ever said, and 2) McCain hasn't distanced himself from Hagee.

Try to understand that people aren't trashing McCain for what his minister said; they're trashing him for what he said.

Go listen to Rush again and find out how you're supposed to answer that.

The problem with idiots like Hagee is they are more than willing to work for the destruction of the United States as long as they believe Jesus will come home and keep them from physical death.

homosexuals control the weather

Its another fabulous day in South Beach! Lets go to our correspondent Rod in West Hollywood. Rod?

sepuku2: subby, if you are trying to compare John Hagee to Jeremiah Wright

fail

hillbillypharmacist: Zionism (the newfangled evangelical Christian kind) is the everyman's radical position in America. I live in the South, and I can rattle off a list of half a dozen people, including family, that want to go to war beside Israel in order to speed up the end times.

I had one person compare radical Islam to Sauron. Srsly.

Ironically a lot of these people feel betrayed by the current President's middle east peace efforts because they believe that only when Israel returns to its full bibilical borders can the "tribulations" start (said troubles to included 144,000 jews mass-converting to Christianity and all the rest of them being done away with in a horrific manner)

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHH!

keylock71: why should anyone care what these crack pots say?

especially enough to attend and support the "church" one of them led for 20 years?

sepuku2: Well if thats the case then you can go to every other baptist or evangelical church in America and get the same sermon on any given Sunday. All I have to do is turn the TV set to TBN or some other Christian network any time of day and hear this stuff. It's common enough.

Not in the civilized states. In AK, sure. But I only see your crazy preachers on late night/early morning public access.

And usually its them screaming and jumping for you to donate.

Stupid Floppy Clownshoes: mofroe: what_now: Bush has taken advice on how to run this country, from people who think homosexuals control the weather

That's ridiculous. If teh gheys controlled the weather, it would be sunny and 75 everywhere all the time so they could wear their little short-shorts. These crackpots need to think their positions through a little better.

And rainbows wouldn't be such a whimsical novelty.

exactly. Can you imagine taking advice from these people??

One candidate went to a church, and found Jesus Christ as his personal savior. The other candidate went to a church with the explicit purpose of gaining a political endorsement.

Which of these candidates do you think the Republicans are casting their lot with?

The end of "times" will come in 2150 when we enter the age of aquariums, Jesus will be with us until then because he is a representation of Pisces.

absoluteparanoia: epuku2: Well if thats the case then you can go to every other baptist or evangelical church in America and get the same sermon on any given Sunday. All I have to do is turn the TV set to TBN or some other Christian network any time of day and hear this stuff. It's common enough.

Not in the civilized states. In AK, sure. But I only see your crazy preachers on late night/early morning public access.

Dude, I live in Boston and I have about 4 channels of this. It's AWESOME. Sometimes, when the talking heads on MTP annoy me on Sunday mornings, I'll turn in to them.

sepuku2: John McCain didn't sit in his church for over twenty years and wasn't married and baptized by John Hagee.

I know, right? That means that he is associated with a religious figure that is a bigot and a crazy for purely political reasons. How is that not worse?

When Nationalism, Religion, and Politics mix, a dangerous concoction emerges.

It ends up with people dying needlessly for stupid reasons.

what_now: I don't understand why the media was nonstop OMG!! WRIGHT IS THE DEBIL!!!112! for saying some truths that make people uncomfortable, but this guy's insane rantings are given a pass.

I remember crooks and liars making a big deal about Haggee as soon as he endorsed McCain, because the guy's nuttier than a fruitcake.

I wonder if race has anything to do with it...

Wright is just as much of a ranter as those fellows (though the content is different). The difference isn't race. It's that Democrats are embarrassed by it but Republicans actually agree with it, or at least want to take advantage of those who do.

haha that should be Aquarius

Yup....he's a winner.

Bull Schmitt: Which of these candidates do you think the Republicans are casting their lot with?

Garbage, sir. Unadulterated garbage.

Israel will be destroyed in order to destroy the antichrist but the souls will fly to heaven so all is well hallelujah.

Headso: haha that should be Aquarius

Someone watched Zeitgeist?