wonky?

Stop with this "indie" crap. It's meaningless now that independent artists have access to the same equipment as professionals.

musicky: Stop with this "indie" crap. It's meaningless now that independent artists have access to the same equipment as professionals.

It's always been more about distribution than about production.

For weird combinations of musical tastes, I prefer Volbeat.

Everything from Elvis Presley to Napalm Death .. hail: Johnny Cash, Little Richard, Jerry Lee Lewis, Chuck Berry, Fats Domino, Ramones, Social Distortion, Motörhead, Black Sabbath, Dio, Megadeth, Metallica, Manic Street Preachers, Iron Maiden and bla bla bla bla...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volbeat

Credentials:

No other Danish heavy rock band than Volbeat has been able to get to position 18 at the Danish Top 100 for CD sales in over 10 years. This happened right after their concert at the Roskilde Festival 2006. They have passed bands like Madonna, Pink Floyd, KoЯn, Eminem, Guns N' Roses, The Black Eyed Peas, Keane, Franz Ferdinand, Coldplay and Kashmir on the Top 100 list, just to name a few.

/Wikipedia told me so, it must be true!

This shiat seems just as indie as the other indie rock. I just hate the pretentiousness of that kinda music, it's for bonafied geeky pussies, what happened to rock that actually ROCKED?

British music media is always trying to come up with new musical genres to talk about. It's not quite as amusing as the hundreds of subgenres of metal but close.

I should probably articulate my post above on "indie" before someone takes it the wrong way. The term's been applied to everyone from Daniel Johnston to Modest Mouse. For every truly independent artist to whom it's been applied (not to say that they are inherently better than mainstream acts) there's a dozen slick, polished folk-rock acts that are signed to major labels and not independent from anything by any stretch of the imagination, but retain the name anyway. Give a white kid an acoustic guitar, a glowing, verbose Pitchfork review, and lessons on how to sing through his nose, and the I word will be all over him like twang on a banjo, regardless of who he's working for. "Indie" has been devalued to the point of irrelevancy, but it's a moot point anyway, because the distribution method of music shouldn't influence the listener's opinion or classification of said music. If your favorite obscure artist suddenly gets a TV appearance or a contract, there's a huge backlash from the portion of his or her fanbase who care too much about what their friends think of their music's "cred". I have seen this happen to more talented (and untalented) musicians than I care to count, most of whom sacrificed little more than a half-inch square of cover space for one more little logo.

Terms like indie cause bands, labels, and entire subcultures to collapse under the weight of their own elitism and insecurities. Not only does it fail as a subculture and as a community, it's also worthless as a descriptor of musical style. If someone talks to me about a band I've never heard and I say, "Well, what do they play?" and they say "progressive rock" or "hardcore punk" or "synthpop" I can get a pretty good idea of what I'm in for. Even more helpful would be a description like "they're a power trio but with this really funky, weird bass player" or "this guy who plays the Polymoog and sounds like a robot".

But what's "indie"? It supposedly tells you that the artist(s) in question hasn't received a particular amount of critical attention or support from the music industry, and as explained above, it can't even do that right. But it's also completely useless in describing a sound. Is it the indie that plays an acoustic guitar in a coffeehouse? Is it the indie that mixes classic rock and pop influences with nostalgic Casio keyboard and Game Boy sounds? Is it the indie that relies on charm and quaintness of an untrained voice or an out-of-tune guitar? The garage band down the street that's practicing Boulevard of Broken Dreams for a high school talent show isn't going to be all over MTV anytime soon; are they indie? That drunk guy at the bar on karaoke night who made up dirty lyrics to Just The Way You Are is pretty underground too.

My point is that I can't believe that such a culture and so many stigmata have sprung up around such a vague misnomer. It's like a musical variation of that "skub/antiskub" Perry Bible Fellowship comic, which I am NOT POSTING because I'll be a happy man if I never ever ever see it ever again ever.

Ever.

spanish flea: British music media is always trying to come up with new musical genres to talk about. It's not quite as amusing as the hundreds of subgenres of metal but close.

Don't forget the one hundred and freaking ninety or so genre listings currently in the Electronic Music Guide (new window)
WARNING: WILL MAKE YOU ANGRY, GIDDY AND/OR PHYSICALLY ILL

Personally, I categorize my metal into harsh vocals, clean vocals, and industrial.
I categorize my electronic stuff into two categories: stuff that goes OOB-CH-OOB-CH-OOB-CH-OOB-CH and stuff that doesn't. Then I throw away the former because it's all monotonous bullshiat. I know my way around the metal subenres but for the life of me I cannot tell any practical difference between house and trance.

And I should also note that "wonky pop" is essentially what bands like They Might Be Giants and Sparks have been doing since before the "wonky pop" musicians were even farking born. The difference is that this time around these bands will be able to take advantage of wonderful technological innovations like the loudness war and apathetic listeners who don't appreciate the music they don't pay for.

Music genres are a joke. Ask five different people what genre a band is, and you'll get at least 3 or 4 different answers.

Stop with this "indie" crap. It's meaningless now that independent artists have access to the same equipment recording contracts as professionals.

FIFY, wtf does that have to do with anything?

"Indie rock" has become like "alternative" was in the 90s. Boring music that lacks creativity and thus becomes cookie-cutter music. The thing is, what can you call indie music today that actually IS indie? I guess that's where wonky pop comes in...

I guess it's just a big cycle, "new wave" "alternative" "avant garde" "indie", terms to describe music that grows in popularity and is creative, and then gets popular and is condensed.

TheRaven77: Stop with this "indie" crap. It's meaningless now that independent artists have access to the same equipment recording contracts as professionals.

FIFY, wtf does that have to do with anything?

Read my second post before you fly off the handle.

TheJoe03
It got old and is some cases generic, much like what the music that passes for "indie" is becoming.

/yes, I listened to many of the same bands you listened to, but then I moved on. and sonmetimes I even *gasp* even put on one of those records.
//The profile for user RockIsDead can explain it to you better than I can, because I'm too busy being pretentious, according to you.

musicky
my fault for not RTFT. I read your posts and I agree with you.

Why are styles classified as genres? It doesn't make sense. The genre name doesn't fit with many of them, and the term genre doesn't fit to begin with.

I've always called the newer bands that I listen to indie because that's what best fit them. Over the last couple years, this has changed so much. I saw Man Man for the first time at a nightclub in New Haven with 50 or so people there, maybe 10-20 were fans. I last saw them at the Bowery Ballroom in a sold out show. They toured with Modest Mouse. However, they are signed to ANTI-.

It's just that - "indie" is the new "alternative".

musicky:
I categorize my electronic stuff into two categories: stuff that goes OOB-CH-OOB-CH-OOB-CH-OOB-CH and stuff that doesn't. Then I throw away the former because it's all monotonous bullshiat. I know my way around the metal subenres but for the life of me I cannot tell any practical difference between house and trance.

There are metal subgenres? All metal sound the same to me
/I'm special too

Personally, I prefer listening to hard-emo-death-polka.

Chute the Moon: Personally, I prefer listening to hard-emo-death-polka.

you are a jerk/poser for listening to that... Have you ever heard of a band called Captain Driveway... it is the band that my neighbor is forcing his two kids (5 - 9) to be in. There early stuff is better, but you might want to check them out.

/I really dislike music snobs
//except when it comes to buckethead

isaaczeke: Music genres are a joke. Ask five different people what genre a band is, and you'll get at least 3 or 4 different answers.

This is very true. It also makes shopping in record stores a huge hassle. Go into any big record store, and I guarantee you'll find

Derek and the Dominoes (blues) under Rock/Pop
Stevie Ray Vaughn (blues) under Rock/Pop
Mississippi Sheiks (country) under Blues
Leadbelly (folk) under Blues

I'm not normally one to play the race card, but seriously now...

Not surprising. Indie rock is just pop that didn't make it.

What was it? Oh yeah, that's it. "Talking about music is like dancing about architecture."

Leadbelly (folk) under Blues
Perfect example of some of the fine lines. Is it blues, is it folk, is it both ('roots' music)? The structure of his songs are blues, but played in a folk style. I have a later Leadbelly 78 that's more blues than anything (forgot the exact song ATM).

allmusic lists him as the genre as folk, and his style as blues.

and then there's Jazz music played with a blues song structure...

TheRaven77: I've always called the newer bands that I listen to indie because that's what best fit them.
Indie is a pretty catch-all term, so describing them as indie is not very helpful. Any who at least knows what they're talking about can probably deduce what they sound like if you describe the genre...

Generally, I just describe what the band sounds like.

TheRaven77: Perfect example of some of the fine lines. Is it blues, is it folk, is it both ('roots' music)? The structure of his songs are blues, but played in a folk style. I have a later Leadbelly 78 that's more blues than anything (forgot the exact song ATM).

I don't think that's a strong enough argument to justify putting him in the Blues section. A ton of Hank Williams' songs were blues-based, but you never see him anywhere but the Country bin. By the way, I'm going to guess your 78 is Bourgeois Blues; am I right?

and then there's Jazz music played with a blues song structure...

And rock music with a blues structure... and country, bluegrass, skiffle, soul, r&b... But that doesn't make Duke, Zeppelin, Jimmie Rodgers, Krauss, the Quarrymen, Ray and Chuck blues artists.

Isn't it really the evolution of music? Traditional music lead to folk then to blues. jazz evolved from blues and has gone in a million directions and the same w/ rock and/or roll. When punk first turned up it embodied the same spirit as rock in the 50's and that's still happens today. But the elusive "non-conform-a-fish" is ever harder to find in the vast ocean of music. When nonconforming becomes popular how do you go against the grain? Punk hardly means what it used to. I always thought indie described bands that were on INDEPENDENT labels, and now it's become this "sound". I tend to go by the philosophy that the moment you try to label art you lose what it's all about in the first place. Of course much of today's music can hardly be called art...if a band comes w/ a label what can you expect but regurgitation.

/BUCKETHEAD SUCKS!!!!
//...not

From TFA:

"the 2008 tour by veteran punks the UK Subs, complete with lead singer Charlie Harper, now 64 and still dutifully belting out Stranglehold and CID for anyone tough enough to brave the smell of the gents."

"Will you still need me?
will you still feed me?
When I'm Sixty Four?"

I just can't get my head around a 64 year old punk rocker. What,
does he have a walker covered in bumper stickers? Do old ladies
with blue mohawks throw their Depends at him?

/British Pop is by turns weird and wonderful....

MikeXpop: Go into any big record store, and I guarantee you'll find

Derek and the Dominoes (blues) under Rock/Pop
Stevie Ray Vaughn (blues) under Rock/Pop
Mississippi Sheiks (country) under Blues
Leadbelly (folk) under Blues

I'm not normally one to play the race card, but seriously now...

There's a reason for that - the store places artists in the genre most customers will go looking for them, not necessarily what they are strictly. For example, in the store I recently worked at, Foo Fighters, the most generic hard rock band around, went under Alternative instead of Rock, because that's where people think they go. At the same time, we put freaky stuff like Piper at the Gates of Dawn and Jefferson Airplace under Rock, because once again, that's where someone will go looking for it.

We had problems with Ryan Adams of course, but ended up putting all his albums under (another perhaps meaningless genre) Alternative Country, as that's where people went when they were looking for his stuff, even his indie/rock albums.

Sometimes I'd put Massive Attack's Mezzanine in the Alt section, feeling it was better there than under Downbeat, but it always ended up back in Downbeat cause no one could find it.

Musicky , you sir are worthy of your handle, and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter. Thank you for articulating just about everything that I have been trying to express about "indie" music...