Translation: as fuel efficiency inevitably increases and consumption decreases, both as a result of higher fuel prices, tax revenue will go down. Solution, make the tax-slaves pay a "congestion toll".

Sounds like another Federal tax scheme to me. Just like the Federal Sales Tax they keep trying to call the "Fair Tax".

No thanks. Let's give them less power instead of more, mmm'k?

Ron Apul Revere

It would be fairly simple to require all cars be fitted with Governmednt monitored GPS systems. Then imagine how safe we'd all be.

Marcus Aurelius: It would be fairly simple to require all cars be fitted with Governmednt monitored GPS systems. Then imagine how safe we'd all be.

That's not enough, cars should be equipped with internal cameras and microphones, but only until they perfect the thought tax.

tolling via RFID transponders that can track your every move and issue speeding tickets automatically

Strange, I find no mention of that in the article

If they want this to happen quickly, they should say that it is part of homeland security and will protect us from terrorists. And I am sure that they can figure out how to spin it that way.

But in return, drivers would pay tolls on highways around the country, under a "congestion-pricing" system. Tolls would rise in heavy traffic and drop in light traffic, in an effort to reduce congestion at peak times.

So not only do I get pissed off at getting stuck in a traffic jam, but I get PAY for the priviledge of being pissed off sitting in a traffic jam.

I think that government transponder is gonna get hacked. Or, as I like to put it, "those damn sunspots musta fried the satellite again".

This is the same crap they're trying to introduce here. Charge higher road use fees during peak hours. I guess my boss will be okay with me turning up to work three hours late? Or should I get up at five AM and get to work two hours early?

Weaver95: So not only do I get pissed off at getting stuck in a traffic jam, but I get PAY for the priviledge of being pissed off sitting in a traffic jam.

Well yeah, you should pack your self into the Proletarian People Propeller and stop jamming up my highways anyway. Enjoy the smell.

tolling via RFID transponders that can track your every move and issue speeding tickets automatically

Strange, I find no mention of that in the article

The French do this with old fashoned toll booth roads. When you leave the autoroute they punch your ticket and work out your average speed.

"I think we should step it down in time, as these new revenue sources go on line, and see it go away," Peters said.

Translation: We're going to draw out the process of putting in these "new revenue sources" so long that for a long time both the gas tax and the toll roads will exist, and then people will just forget to demand the gas tax to disappear.

Sometimes, it's really awesome to not drive.

/public transportation and a pair of good boots FTW!

Saborlas: Sometimes, it's really awesome to not drive.

/public transportation and a pair of good boots FTW!

wait'll they start putting RFID tags into your boots.

Weaver95: wait'll they start putting RFID tags into your boots.

only so they can fine you for not using enough gas.

Of course, a Hillary Clinton administration would work as quickly as possible to dismantle any such Thumb Over U.S. Citizens (tm), wouldn't it?

Militant Moderate: Weaver95: wait'll they start putting RFID tags into your boots.

only so they can fine you for not using enough gas.

Nah - it's 'for the terrorists'. See, they tag your boots and log your activites for the week. Then they can start zoning areas as 'safe', 'unsafe', 'morally questionable' or whatnot. Anyone who shows up as being logged into a questionable area then gets stopped and searched.

RFID tags and oracle databases would make law enforcement SO much easier.....Oh, don't complain. It's forthechildrenwarondrugsterroristsglobalwarming.

Sometimes, it really sucks to live in the sticks. I HAVE to drive, it's just that simple. If I want a gallon of milk, it's a 20 minute drive. They are thinking of doing this in the UK, (at least according to Jeremy Clarkson). Like most things, the idea is good, tax you based upon the amount of driving you do and when and where you do it. The rest of it is bad, you drive over the limit, a ticket is in your mailbox, you don't stop at a stop sign, ticket. There are better ways of doing these sorts of things, I don't see why the gas tax is bad though, it basically does all this already.

zz9: tolling via RFID transponders that can track your every move and issue speeding tickets automatically
The French do this with old fashoned toll booth roads. When you leave the autoroute they punch your ticket and work out your average speed.

They discussed putting something similar in Mass but I think it broke on the rock of them still trying to get people to switch to using the transponders thus decreasing toll booth congestion. What few people switched would just defect en mass if they started to issue speeding tickets based on the transponders.

/Good thing too, I was getting worried.
//And I lurves my Fast Lane and driving past the half mile toll line.

They did something similar in NH. There are two main tolls on 95 and drive at the speed limit they should be an hour or so apart. People who used ez pass and made it through both tolls in under 45 minutes got ticketed.

Weaver95: So not only do I get pissed off at getting stuck in a traffic jam, but I get PAY for the priviledge of being pissed off sitting in a traffic jam.

I think that government transponder is gonna get hacked. Or, as I like to put it, "those damn sunspots musta fried the satellite again".

I wouldn't be sure about any sort of success about hacking this thing. I'd be willing to bet that any loss of signal from one of these would be the equivalent of driving without proper tags or insurance now. As soon as they notice that you no longer put out the signal, you get a warning letter, and if the problem is not rectified quickly, you will face massive fines and a suspension of driving privileges. If they find it was hacked, and not an accident you might face jail time.

But that's just my comma sodden tin foil hat speaking.

This is the type of stunt I'd expect from Brown's Britain.

Marcus Aurelius: "Fair Tax"



/Yes, I know you were arguing against the FairTax.
//Doesn't matter, the FairTaxers are going to come out of the woodworks, now.

Would someone find the part of the article mentioning "track your every move and issue speeding tickets automatically" please?

Let's see, benefits of the Federal Government off the top of my head:

Secure our national energy future, via any means possible, so they can tax us on energy consumption.

Protect us from harm by sending us to get killed in foreign countries

Create and protect monopolies that ensure essential services are priced above the pain point (FDA, AMA, ADA, WTFA...)

Print money that's backed by their remaining credibility.

I'm sure I must be missing more stuff...

andrewagill: the FairTaxers are going to come out of the woodworks, now.

Oh, yeah, implement fair taxes, that's what I missed.

Theres a reason highways have peak congestion times. PEOPLE HAVE TO GET TO farkING WORK. Maybe if they used some money to build public transportation people wouldn't need to drive during peak hours but the simple fact is for most Americans, public transit is not a viable option. So they must drive.

Spoofing is going to be an entire cottage industry. They're already having problems with cloned modems on my damn cable.

Saborlas: Sometimes, it's really awesome to not drive.

/public transportation and a pair of good boots FTW!

THIS THIS A THOUSAND TIMES THIS

Postal Penguin: Theres a reason highways have peak congestion times. PEOPLE HAVE TO GET TO farkING WORK. Maybe if they used some money to build public transportation people wouldn't need to drive during peak hours but the simple fact is for most Americans, public transit is not a viable option. So they must drive.

No shiat. This another tax on the working motherfarker. Fukk this whore country. If motherfarkers have to pay $6-7 bucks to cross 520 EVERY GODDAMN WORK DAY?

I'm glad they keep those capital gains taxes down, cause to raise them would be unfair. Surely there are those like me that are pretty close to rioting, right?

wwffan7385: Saborlas: Sometimes, it's really awesome to not drive.

/public transportation and a pair of good boots FTW!

THIS THIS A THOUSAND TIMES THIS

I agree, and I don't even own a car, but most people can't use public transport, which is why we need to expand it on a European level.

Wait... FLOATING bridge?!

Resin33: Wait... FLOATING bridge?!

Big concrete pontoons or whatever. it is pretty neat.

boomaze: wwffan7385: Saborlas: Sometimes, it's really awesome to not drive.

/public transportation and a pair of good boots FTW!

THIS THIS A THOUSAND TIMES THIS

I agree, and I don't even own a car, but most people can't use public transport, which is why we need to expand it on a European level.

good luck finding the money for that.

wwffan7385: good luck finding the money for that.

We'll find the money for it or die off. I mean, sooner or later oil is gone. I see they found a shiatload of money to bomb a country and occupy it, and that isn't good investment at all.

Ron Paul Revere: boomaze: We'll find the money for it or die off. I mean, sooner or later oil is gone. I see they found a shiatload of money to bomb a country and occupy it, and that isn't good investment at all.

Nah, we'll move to nuclear power with electric cars that work like the buses in Seattle do (overhead power lines), only it will be with new ground-based technology that doesn't even require physical contact and won't shock people.

Right or left, we all agree that something needs to be done, like, NOW. It will take a long time. We need to start moving the infrastructure and going to nuke, solar, ect. NOW.

Also, they need to improve the tedchnology of the Seattle buses so the "feelers" that hit the power lines don't pop off. I get sick of sitting there waiting for a bus driver to go fix them. :)

Ron Paul Revere: boomaze: Right or left, we all agree that something needs to be done, like, NOW. It will take a long time. We need to start moving the infrastructure and going to nuke, solar, ect. NOW.

Better get on the horn to your environmentalist friends and let them know that newer nuclear technologies are safe and will make a good transitional power source. ;)


Oh, I try. I really do. Honestly, the thing is MOST people have been so programmed that they won't even listen when I tell them to look up pebble beds and stuff. If you do an informal pool of the people around you, you will find many, if not most, are so ignorant of nuclear power that they think a nuke plant would blow up in a mushroom cloud like a weapon. It is a psycological thing.

Nuke weapons == horrible destrcution, therefore Nuke power must be the same.

And you are right, in Seattle when i mention nukes people look like I want to rape the world. They will come around or die. Nature has a way.


boomaze: Also, they need to improve the tedchnology of the Seattle buses so the "feelers" that hit the power lines don't pop off. I get sick of sitting there waiting for a bus driver to go fix them. :)

Well, they are as old as the Seattle Center. Give 'em some slack.

True that.

If we're getting billed for sitting in a traffic jam, does that give us the legal right to shoot rubberneckers? How about cops, accident victims, EMTs...?

in Seattle when i mention nukes people look like I want to rape the world

thats funny seattlers would think that, considering they have 2 nuclear aircraft carriers both within 2 hours of the city.

/and they are all safe, i know, i lived on one for 4 years

Klippoklondike: in Seattle when i mention nukes people look like I want to rape the world

thats funny seattlers would think that, considering they have 2 nuclear aircraft carriers both within 2 hours of the city.

/and they are all safe, i know, i lived on one for 4 years

A lot of it has to do with the Hanford site, i think. Its all I hear about "just like they did at Hanford! Hey, get me another 27oz latte..."

Boomaze

i have never heard of the Hanford site...so i just googled it. That is certainly disheartening. However, nuclear power obviously wasn't to blame for that, it was the people in charge of the place. To have that much nuclear waste in one place...certainly sucks, but wouldnt have happened if a competent person were in charge.

Ron Paul Revere: boomaze: A lot of it has to do with the Hanford site, i think. Its all I hear about "just like they did at Hanford! Hey, get me another 27oz latte..."

You got it all wrong.

It's "I'd like a 24 oz. latte, quad shot, organic soy milk extra hot with 2 pumps of almond syrup. Oh, and one of those organic Odwalla granola bars, too."

Yeah, you must live and work downtown like me. Nice people, but goddamn it gets on your nerves, ya know? I mean, sometimes you just need to get a beer and a greasy burger at lunch. I'll be all hungover and just NEED something greasy for breakfast, and all I can find is a Ostrich ham bagel with fairtrade cranberry jam and avacado slice.


Klippoklondike

Plus it is a cold war nuke site. No comparison. try to explain that.

Klippoklondike

Plus it is a cold war nuke site. No comparison. try to explain that.

Touche'. And yeah, finding good greasy food in seattle is hard but possible. I liked the Rock Bottom restaurant. Good beer too.

Ron Paul Revere: boomaze: Yeah, you must live and work downtown like me. Nice people, but goddamn it gets on your nerves, ya know? I mean, sometimes you just need to get a beer and a greasy burger at lunch. I'll be all hungover and just NEED something greasy for breakfast, and all I can find is a Ostrich ham bagel with fairtrade cranberry jam and avacado slice.

Yeah, downtown/Queen Anne can be a biatch for finding decent greasy stuff in the morning, but you can't go wrong with Dick's or Kidd Valley for lunch (though those bastards take forever). Too bad neither of them serves beer.

Ever gone to Jalisco's Cantina just South of Key Arena? Their food is amazing, and they serve booze. ;)

Just finished a contract at Holland AMerica right by there :)

Love QA. There is a little place that is right in front of the Holland Am building that is greasy as an Ohio dinner could ever hope. I put on weight working there. Gravy fries, chicken fried steak, shiat I never thought i'd see DT. Forget the name.

The Ram is good too. Good beers, food better than I thought it would be. One in Kent too. You know, if you like, go to Kent for some crazy reason.

Ron Paul Revere: boomaze: Love QA. There is a little place that is right in front of the Holland Am building that is greasy as an Ohio dinner could ever hope. I put on weight working there. Gravy fries, chicken fried steak, shiat I never thought i'd see DT. Forget the name.

Wouldn't be The Shanty, would it?

Indeed. The Shanty.

boomaze: The Ram is good too. Good beers, food better than I thought it would be. One in Kent too. You know, if you like, go to Kent for some crazy reason.

My company is based out of Kent, but I rarely go down there. I'd probably go there if I were in the area though.

I lived in Kent for the first year here. Never again.

Or, we could just get off our asses and start building an effective train system in this country. Lets start with the southwest. Phoenix to San Diego, Las Vegas, Tucson would be a great start. I can never wrap my brain around how Japan and France have trains moving at 300mph and I yet I have to drive to Tucson.

The_OcO: Or, we could just get off our asses and start building an effective train system in this country. Lets start with the southwest. Phoenix to San Diego, Las Vegas, Tucson would be a great start. I can never wrap my brain around how Japan and France have trains moving at 300mph and I yet I have to drive to Tucson.

THIS

Ron Paul Revere
Resin33: Wait... FLOATING bridge?!

We've got not one, but TWO of 'em. ;)

three if you count the hood canal floating bridge.

/but who really wants to think about the peninsula anyways?

Ron Paul Revere: Ha. Great food. Can't believe I didn't remember it when discussing breakfast food in the area. I normally get a Denver omelette smothered in gravy. Om nom nom.

Fun fact: Before my dad died, he used to be in charge of an AA meeting they have there on Saturday nights. We even had the memorial service there because the staff liked him so much. Wierd.

Also try Patty's Eggnest in the Holman Road shopping center (with the ginormous QFC) in Greenwood, or Beth's on the West side of 99 just south of 65th. Both great breakfast places.

Thanks bro. I'm a fat hillbilly software engineer from WV, so the food out here is different. love the people, but some things you just miss. Most thing you don't though :)

The_OcO: Or, we could just get off our asses and start building an effective train system in this country. Lets start with the southwest. Phoenix to San Diego, Las Vegas, Tucson would be a great start. I can never wrap my brain around how Japan and France have trains moving at 300mph and I yet I have to drive to Tucson.

Don't make me go off on another Randoid rant about how we've become incapable of building a new rail system in this country.

Weaver95: Don't make me go off on another Randoid rant about how we've become incapable of building a new rail system in this country.

Rail system ala Zurich, OK. Rail system ala the NYC Subway & Septic Tube? I'll take "death to the environment first, Alex"