In the course of human history ownership of sovereignty most often belonged to a small group of people, more often than not passed through some form of hereditary institutionalized hierarchy. People tend to forget that, with the age of the nation state, a peculiar phenomenon related to sovereignty vis-a-vis people happened; a revolutionary concept that sovereignty belonged to the people manifested out of a peculiar and unique time of increased power of the middle classes, demands for self determination, etc. etc. Ideas (albeit imperfect) of equality swept around in an era of faltering empires.

This concept of sovereignty belonging to you, is very new, very important to the ideological constructions of our nation (US) and is very, very fragile. When the TFA says

"Davos man" is an epithet coined by the conservative scholar Samuel Huntington to describe the very specific type that attends the conference. These are people who, as Huntington wrote, "have little need for national loyalty, view national boundaries as obstacles that thankfully are vanishing, and see national governments as residues from the past whose only useful function is to facilitate the elite's global operations."
...
Rothkopf's credible, if not especially original argument in "Superclass" is that over the past several decades a "global elite" has emerged whose connections to each other have become more significant than their ties to their home nations and governments. They schmooze regularly at conferences like Davos, go to the same schools, serve together on corporate and nonprofit boards, and above all do business with each other constantly -- to the point that they have become a kind of culture in themselves, a "class without a country," as Rothkopf puts it.

It is not a unique argument. Its more global than in the past, but the idea is largely old and well-worn. When he say's "Milton Friedman" he means neo-liberal economic policies, meaning [this]. Make no mistake, here in the US, the middle class is constricting[1], and it saddens me to see people denounce the nationstate without a similar and, more importantly, proportional reverence to their own ownership of sovereignty. The idea that sovereignty belongs to the people, rather than some small group of people who are more familiar with each other as compared to the people they live with is new, precious, and fragile. In the words of the author, these are people who know more people whilst walking through the "Davos party" than from "walking across the village green in the town we live in." The idea that sovereignty belongs to the people is very special, very unique, and it shouldn't be taken for granted. Ever.

I read on the Internet it's actually CFR and the Bilderbergers. And also Steve Jobs.

I thought it was the Illuminati and Opus Dei?

Do they meet tri-annually at a secret country mansion in Colorado known as "The Meadows?"

/I crave KFC fortnightly.

Dudes don't forget the lizard people

How could you hate the Colonel?

AzDownboy: How could you hate the Colonel?

Oh, I hated the Colonel with his wee, beady eyes, and that smug look on his face! "Oh, you're gonna buy my chicken! Ohhhhh!"

God I hate conspiracy theorists. . .

I'm gonna go cry myself to sleep on me 'uge pillah.

That sound you just heard was Alex Jones touching himself to this article.

/card carrying member of the NWO.

Part of the Nation article
It's impossible to understand why Democratic Party leaders collaborated with Republicans to establish NAFTA unless reference is made to cross-border class interests. There was no compelling economic or political reason for Bill Clinton to make NAFTA a priority in his first year as President. In economic terms, nothing was broken that needed fixing. Politically, NAFTA and the WTO that followed traded away the interests of the Democratic Party's blue-collar electoral base while creating a bonanza for Republican constituencies on Wall Street and in red-state agribusiness.

But Clinton was more Davos than Democrat. Tutored by financier Robert Rubin, a prodigious fundraiser who became his Treasury Secretary, Clinton embraced a reactionary, pre-New Deal vision of a global future in which corporate investors were unregulated and the social contract was history. Indeed, in all three countries it was the leaders of the political parties that had historically claimed to represent ordinary people--the Democrats' Clinton, the Liberal Party's Jean Chrétien and the Institutional Revolutionary Party's Salinas--who delivered NAFTA to their global corporate clients, undercutting their own constituencies. "NAFTA happened," said the then-chairman of American Express, "because of the drive Bill Clinton gave it. He stood up against his two prime constituents, labor and environment, to drive it home over their dead bodies."

A year later, in November 1994, enough angry Democratic voters stayed away from the polls to give the Republicans control of the House. Since then, many working-class Americans, feeling abandoned by the Democrats, have responded to the Republican definition of class struggle as a fight over gun control, school prayer and abortion. The Democrats have still not recovered.

Bill Clinton, Osama bin Laden and the pope are part of a new global power elite which runs the world.

Sounds like the setup for the worst "Three guys walk into a bar" joke out there...

RemyDuron: God I hate conspiracy theorists. . .

Oh. I see. You lurve people like Donald Rumsfeld and George W. Bush and Dick Cheney who tell you the truth huh? I mean, they wouldn't LIE to little ol' you would they? Certainly not Very Important People like that...being dishonest? With the very citizens they supposedly serve?

You believe those guys?

Eh, this isn't your run of the mill David Icke style kook. This is the kind of stuff you have to watch out for and...

nevermind most of you jackasses aren't even paying attention to me.

Fark it. See you guys in the work camps.

fernt: Oh. I see. You lurve people like Donald Rumsfeld and George W. Bush and Dick Cheney who tell you the truth huh? I mean, they wouldn't LIE to little ol' you would they? Certainly not Very Important People like that...being dishonest? With the very citizens they supposedly serve?

No, I like facts. Facts like "The Bush administration is inept and corrupt, but that doesn't mean they're behind 9/11, Katrina, and my socks mysteriously vanishing despite me buying a new pair every farking month".

duh!

/obligatory

Am I the only one who thinks "Party Boy" is the single most mis-named Farker in history?

I get the feeling he has never even been to a party.

Mom, I find it troubling you refer to the Weekly World News AS..."the paper." "The paper" contains facts.

I thought everyone knew this?

/used to watch Alex Jones a lot.

IXI Jim IXI: Bill Clinton, Osama bin Laden and the pope are part of a new global power elite which runs the world.

Sounds like the setup for the worst "Three guys walk into a bar" joke out there...

I'll take a crack at this:

A rich man is dying of cancer. He invites Clinton, bin Laden and the Pope to have a drink and says to them "I'm going to break the rule that says you can't take it with you. I'm giving you each 2 million dollars and before they close my coffin put the money in." They agree, and a few weeks later after his funeral they meet again at the same bar. The Pope says "I have a confession to make. You know, I've always wanted to build a home for the orphans. I put $1 million in the coffin and kept $1 million for the orphans." bid Laden looks down, and says "I have to confess as well - I've always wanted to by my wives new veils. I bought 72 veils for $1 million and put the rest in the coffin." Clinton looks with disgust at both of them and says "I'm shocked and disgusted with the both of you; I put my personal check for $2 million in that coffin."

This is just a clever ploy by Major League Baseball to distract people from the REAL dark truth that they are clearly an evil cabal bent on world domination.

I was voted most likely to take over the world in high school, so I'm really getting a kick out of my death ray.

Walker: I thought everyone knew this?

/used to watch Alex Jones a lot.

Someone here just turned me onto his world of crazy and whenever I need a good laugh, off I go...

If only I had a +1 to give submitter.

smooshie: fernt: Oh. I see. You lurve people like Donald Rumsfeld and George W. Bush and Dick Cheney who tell you the truth huh? I mean, they wouldn't LIE to little ol' you would they? Certainly not Very Important People like that...being dishonest? With the very citizens they supposedly serve?

No, I like facts. Facts like "The Bush administration is inept and corrupt, but that doesn't mean they're behind 9/11, Katrina, and my socks mysteriously vanishing despite me buying a new pair every farking month".

Actually, If anyone here rea the article it doesn't blame anyone for any managed global catastrophes. Instead, it talks about a new international elite that has more power than the rest of the 6billion people in the world. There wasn't any conspiracy theories in it like Katrina levies or Tower 7. There was a well reasoned arguement that incredibly wealthy people can affect millions of peoples lives through their use of wealth, influence and connections. I never read once that Bush and Osama had a three way with hillary and birthed an Alien Anti-Christ.

KaponoFor3: Dudes don't forget the lizard people

or the reverse vampires

dhudd: I'll take a crack at this:

well...MY faith has been restored. ;)

Party Boy:

STFU
no one ever reads copied and pasted posts this long. Just provide the link and anyone who cares will read it. You hurt your own argument by existing.

GBTW

dhudd: I'll take a crack at this:

My turn.

Bill Clinton, Osama bin Laden and the pope are aboard a ship which begins to sink. Also aboard the ship are a dozen newly pledged nuns. The pope says, "The lifeboard can only hold 12 people. These young women can do a lot of good over the coming years. We have to save the nuns." Osama says, "fark the nuns!" Clinton says, "Do you think there's time?"

Sym_pathetic: .../i>

Thats not long. Don't be rude.

Party Boy- this is Fark, not your thesis presentation.

Party Boy: Thats not long. Don't be rude.

Yes it is. It is long. It is too long. Go away. I do not want green eggs and ham.

/Green eggs and ham did 9/11

smooshie: No, I like facts.

There are facts all over the place. Let me show you some of them:


FACT: 2001: Larry Silverstein makes $125 million down payment on WTC Complex valued at $3.2 billion, but Silverstein insures against terrorist attack for $7 billion.

FACT: EXEMPTION ALLOWED - Since 1978, the the WTC Twin Towers were allowed an exemption to New York City Building Codes.

FACT: EXEMPTION LIFTED - April 26, 2001, Larry Silverstein signs 99-year, $3.2 billion lease with the New York Port Authority, thereby "privatizing" the WTC Complex and statutorily lifting the prior WTC exemption. Deal closed on July 23, 2001.

FACT: City of New York orders study to deconstruct the Twin Towers, due to NYC code asbestos violations;
The orderly, planned demolition of a building is preceded by an engineering survey; surveys for asbestos and lead; the cutoff of electric, gas, water and sewer service; and many other precautions. A systematic survey and abatement program for asbestos is mandated by EPA under the Clean Air Act's National Emission Standards for Hazardous Air Pollutants program. The New York City Asbestos Control Law also requires a pre-demolition asbestos survey. Otherwise, demolition can lead to the uncontrolled release of asbestos particles into the air.

FACT: The Assembly Office of Research in California studies WTC deconstruction costs; finds construction costs could total $20 billion;

FACT: September 11th, 2001, 9/11 attacks occur;

FACT: 24 January, 2002, Vice-President Dick Cheney telephones Tom Daschle insisting no 9/11 inquiry be made;

FACT: 28 January, 2002, President Bush meets Sen. Tom Daschle for breakfast in White House; Bush requests Daschle, no 9/11 inquiry be made.

FACT: In the weekends prior to 9/11, the Twin Towers were shut down, evacuated and the power cut completely off. Employees complained such has never happened in their twenty years of working in the Twin Towers. Employees witnessed numerous foreign-looking workers carrying heavy bags of equipment into the Twin Towers;

FACT: Silverstein admits to blowing up WTC Bldg. 7 on PBS documentary, "America Rebuilds." Silverstein claims he discussed the demolition with the N.Y. Fire Dept., and the NYFD made the decision to "pull" WTC Building 7 - OPINION: Baloney. Fire departments don't blow up 47-story steel and concrete buildings.

FACT: Silverstein sues insurance companies; collects double-payments for "two separate terrorist attacks." Instead of losing $20 billion on the NYC-ordered deconstruction of the Twin Towers, Silverstein collects over $545 million on WTC Bldg. 7 alone - and it wasn't even struck by a plane. Silverstein's Gross Profit: Over $5 billion dollars!

FACT: All surviving N.Y. firefighters, supervisors, bosses and chiefs were required to give their deposition as to what they did and saw on Sept. 11th, 2001. Those depositions are located and archived here: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/12/nyregion/12cnd-histories.html?ex=1281499200&en =58364cb529e7367e&ei=5089&partner=rssyahoo&emc=rss


I reviewed each of those depositions and created a webpage of their testimony which indicates they witnessed a demolition being conducted. This webpage is located here: http://www.investigate911.com/911firefighters.htm

FACT: According to numerous scientists, the laws of physics were not suspended on September 11th, 2001:

FACT: On September 11th, 2001, and the weekends preceding September 11th, President Bush's little brother, Marvin Bush, was on the board of the security company, Securacom, for the Twin Towers.

Manfred J. Hattan: dhudd: I'll take a crack at this:

My turn.

Bill Clinton, Osama bin Laden and the pope are aboard a ship which begins to sink. Also aboard the ship are a dozen newly pledged nuns. The pope says, "The lifeboard can only hold 12 people. These young women can do a lot of good over the coming years. We have to save the nuns." Osama says, "fark the nuns!" Clinton says, "Do you think there's time?"

Excelente!

RanDomino: ...

You'd think I posted Tolstoy. An MA thesis is roughly 100 pages or so. Thats a light post.

Sheesh.

There. Get butthurt over that, Fark Commandos

Party Boy--It's interesting stuff and pertains to the thread...keep posting.

Oh subby! Subby! Subby! Don't you know that the Orbital Mind Control Laser (OMCL) was blown by the US Airforce at the order of President Bush in an effort to give McCain a chance at winning the White House. Unfortunately that also is what allowed Obama to challenge Hillary. See Bill Clinton is in control of the super secret Leftist Illuminati and without the OMCL Hillary is losing the bid for president.

fernt

why does there have to be a conspiracy? "US policy caused blowback" is outrageous enough, and doesn't change what we should do. When you say "9/11 conspiracy zomg" everyone ignores you and thinks you and everyone associated with you is crazy.

As far as I can tell, the only reason for saying "9/11 conspiracy zomg" anymore is to absolve our foreign policy of any blame... so it makes sense that the truthers hooked up with Ron Paul's campaign; they're all insane ultra-nationalists.

No, it's an article from the Nation. Just post the link.

fernt: There are facts all over the place. Let me show you some of them:


FACT: 2001: Larry Silverstein makes $125 million down payment on WTC Complex valued at $3.2 billion, but Silverstein insures against terrorist attack for $7 billion.

FACT: EXEMPTION ALLOWED - Since 1978, the the WTC Twin Towers were allowed an exemption to New York City Building Codes.

FACT: EXEMPTION LIFTED - April 26, 2001, Larry Silverstein signs 99-year, $3.2 billion lease with the New York Port Authority, thereby "privatizing" the WTC Complex and statutorily lifting the prior WTC exemption. Deal closed on July 23, 2001.

FACT: City of New York orders study to deconstruct the Twin Towers, due to NYC code asbestos violations;
The orderly, planned demolition of a building is preceded by an engineering survey; surveys for asbestos and lead; the cutoff of electric, gas, water and sewer service; and many other precautions. A systematic survey and abatement program for asbestos is mandated by EPA under the Clean Air Act's National Emission Standards for Hazardous Air Pollutants program. The New York City Asbestos Control Law also requires a pre-demolition asbestos survey. Otherwise, demolition can lead to the uncontrolled release of asbestos particles into the air.

FACT: The Assembly Office of Research in California studies WTC deconstruction costs; finds construction costs could total $20 billion;

FACT: September 11th, 2001, 9/11 attacks occur;

FACT: 24 January, 2002, Vice-President Dick Cheney telephones Tom Daschle insisting no 9/11 inquiry be made;

FACT: 28 January, 2002, President Bush meets Sen. Tom Daschle for breakfast in White House; Bush requests Daschle, no 9/11 inquiry be made.

FACT: In the weekends prior to 9/11, the Twin Towers were shut down, evacuated and the power cut completely off. Employees complained such has never happened in their twenty years of working in the Twin Towers. Employees witnessed numerous foreign-looking workers carrying heavy bags of equipment into the Twin Towers;

FACT: Silverstein admits to blowing up WTC Bldg. 7 on PBS documentary, "America Rebuilds." Silverstein claims he discussed the demolition with the N.Y. Fire Dept., and the NYFD made the decision to "pull" WTC Building 7 - OPINION: Baloney. Fire departments don't blow up 47-story steel and concrete buildings.

FACT: Silverstein sues insurance companies; collects double-payments for "two separate terrorist attacks." Instead of losing $20 billion on the NYC-ordered deconstruction of the Twin Towers, Silverstein collects over $545 million on WTC Bldg. 7 alone - and it wasn't even struck by a plane. Silverstein's Gross Profit: Over $5 billion dollars!

FACT: All surviving N.Y. firefighters, supervisors, bosses and chiefs were required to give their deposition as to what they did and saw on Sept. 11th, 2001. Those depositions are located and archived here: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/12/nyregion/12cnd-histories.html?ex=1281499200&en =58364cb529e7367e&ei=5089&partner=rssyahoo&emc=rss


I reviewed each of those depositions and created a webpage of their testimony which indicates they witnessed a demolition being conducted. This webpage is located here: http://www.investigate911.com/911firefighters.htm

FACT: According to numerous scientists, the laws of physics were not suspended on September 11th, 2001:

FACT: On September 11th, 2001, and the weekends preceding September 11th, President Bush's little brother, Marvin Bush, was on the board of the security company, Securacom, for the Twin Towers.

FACT : A few inconsistencies doesn't make a conspiracy. See the moon landing loons.

FACT (THIS ONE IS DEFINITELY TRUE, AS IT IS IN CAPITAL LETTERS!!!) : Out of the thousands of people who would be involved, no videos of anyone admitting their role? No-one coming forth with evidence saying "I was involved"?

FACT : The Bush admin couldn't conspire to plant a few WMD's in Iraq. They completely botched Katrina (unless you believe in Karl's weather machine as well). And yet Chimpy was behind the most successful conspiracy and cover-up in history?

FACT : Your points make as much sense as those of creationists.

FACT : Here's an excellent site that goes through each and every Truther point and destroys them to pieces : Link

They've been doing this since the dawn of civilization.

RanDomino: fernt

why does there have to be a conspiracy? "US policy caused blowback" is outrageous enough, and doesn't change what we should do. When you say "9/11 conspiracy zomg" everyone ignores you and thinks you and everyone associated with you is crazy.

As far as I can tell, the only reason for saying "9/11 conspiracy zomg" anymore is to absolve our foreign policy of any blame... so it makes sense that the truthers hooked up with Ron Paul's campaign; they're all insane ultra-nationalists.

I want to make love to your logic while you watch.

noheadphones: Party Boy--It's interesting stuff and pertains to the thread...keep posting.

Thanks.

I'm going to finish something and come back. I wish us middle class Americans would see our common interests in this global market.

RanDomino: "US policy caused blowback" is outrageous enough,

What's outrageous about that? It's pretty obvious.

Although I see today where everyone is jumping on Obama's "spiritual advisor" guy for essentially saying that. It just happens to be the truth and isn't very surprising when you take into account what we've been doing in the Middle East for decades.

What's hard to believe is the official story of it (9/11 Commission Report). It's easily taken apart and Griffin has done a good job of it.

It probably not worth arguing about because it's gotten to the point of almost religious faith and belief. Those who simply cannot believe that elements within our military-industrial-defense complex would either help or just allow the attack to happen will choose to look the other way and label "truthers" as crazies. Those who have a little less faith in the lies our government pumps out on a daily basis look a little harder for the answers - which are still forthcoming.

I choose not to trust the Bush Administration.

fernt = palm slap